Support NeoGAF

[Bojanglez]

I've said it before the best thing would be for some kind of open gaming consortium to work together to give gamers a viable (probably Linux based) alternative to kill off Windows, but you kind of need key players (Nvidia, AMD, Valve, Epic, EA, etc) to all be onboard and work together on things like drivers and anti-cheat etc. The good thing for all these is that they could create an open and competitive market and wouldn't be inhibited by the decisions of one megacorp.

 

[winjer]

Is this the extent of "removal/removed" or is it even possible to go deeper?

Checking for Recall say its "disabled" AND "removed".
Checking for Copilot do not even find it (not installed at all)

Try this:

Uninstall or Reinstall Copilot app in Windows 11 and Windows 10

This tutorial will show you different ways to uninstall or reinstall the Copilot app for your account or all users in Windows 10 and Windows 11. Experience Microsoft Copilot on Windows devices using the Copilot app! Copilot helps you get answers and inspiration from across the web, supports...

www.elevenforum.com

 

[Mithos]

Try this:

Uninstall or Reinstall Copilot app in Windows 11 and Windows 10

This tutorial will show you different ways to uninstall or reinstall the Copilot app for your account or all users in Windows 10 and Windows 11. Experience Microsoft Copilot on Windows devices using the Copilot app! Copilot helps you get answers and inspiration from across the web, supports...

www.elevenforum.com

Seems I'm personally set then. Until MS decides to mess with Windows again...

 

[winjer]

Microsoft Denies Using Gaming Copilot Gameplay Footage for AI Training

But ' uses screenshots to understand in-game events' Microsoft says its Gaming Copilot feature doesn't use your gameplay footage to train its AI, even though it does take screenshots while you play. Those images, the company explains, are only used to figure out what's happening in the game so Copilot can give you better answers or suggestions. According to Microsoft, the only data used for training comes from chats or voice talks you have directly with the Copilot assistant.

The issue started when a Resetera user looked at network traffic and noticed that Gaming Copilot seemed to send gameplay screenshots to Microsoft servers. They also pointed out that there's a privacy setting for model training based on text, which is turned on by default. That sparked concern among players, especially since the screenshots might include content from games still under NDA.

Microsoft told that these screenshots aren't stored or used to train AI models. They're only captured when you actually use the Copilot feature through the Game Bar, and they help the system understand what you're asking about in-game. The company added that Copilot's AI can learn from text or voice conversations, but only if you talk to it directly — not from the text seen in gameplay. The voice training option is off by default. It's still unclear whether the screenshots are processed locally or sent to the cloud for quick responses. Gaming Copilot is now available worldwide for players 18 and up, offering real-time gameplay tips like how to beat enemies or complete missions.

 

[pepeno]

Reminder that archinstall is now easier than installing Windows 11

Reminder that Linux is still shit for gaming and you need to spend hours upon hours just to play SOME of your favorite games because not all of them even work.
So kindly sit down and shut the fuck up.

 

[Bernkastel]

Reminder that Linux is still shit for gaming and you need to spend hours upon hours just to play SOME of your favorite games because not all of them even work.
So kindly sit down and shut the fuck up.

No it's not. Lutris, Heroic launcher and Steam with proton just work out of the box. You just have to download and play. All the configuring and behind the space stuff is done by the community.

 

[pepeno]

No it's not. Lutris, Heroic launcher and Steam with proton just work out of the box. You just have to download and play. All the configuring and behind the space stuff is done by the community.

I have steam deck and i know perfectly well how "out of the box" experience is. Aka it isn't.

Are you going to acknowledge that some games aren't working on linux or not ? Because everytime linux user comes out with his amazing idea to switch to linux they have trouble to acknowledge this simple fact LET ALONE that linux experience is not "out of the box".

First linux needs to figure out COMPLETELY compatibility then you can come out of woodwork and propose switch.

 

[nkarafo]

I wish more people would try to resist and hold on upgrading as much as they could.

Google "massgrave.dev", there is a way to easily get 3 more years of security updates in Windows 10 if you are paranoid about it.

Stay on Windows 10 (also debloat that one as well) as long as games and applications still support it. This is what Microsoft doesn't want you to do, which means it's the right thing to do.

 

[pepeno]

I wish more people would try to resist and hold on upgrading as much as they could.
Google "tsforge mas", there is a way to easily get 3 more years of security updates in Windows 10 if you are paranoid about it.
Stay on Windows 10 (also debloat that one as well) as long as games and applications still support it. This is what Microsoft doesn't want you to do, which means it's the right thing to do.

I don't understand Windows10 truthers either. Win11 is just updated windows 10 with a bit of new ui. You can degut it just the same as windows 10, you don't need ms account, you can uninstall stuff like onebox or copilot.

And there's HDR. Windows10 has shitty implementation of HDR that barely works. If you want HDR you need to switch to Win11.

 

[Bernkastel]

I have steam deck and i know perfectly well how "out of the box" experience is. Aka it isn't.

Are you going to acknowledge that some games aren't working on linux or not ? Because everytime linux user comes out with his amazing idea to switch to linux they have trouble to acknowledge this simple fact LET ALONE that linux experience is not "out of the box".

First linux needs to figure out COMPLETELY compatibility then you can come out of woodwork and propose switch.

Steam is as out of the box as it can be.
23k playable on Steam through Proton

And many more in Lutris and Heroic

 

[nemiroff]

alternative to kill off Windows,

If that's what people want, then I'm all for it, I don't much care for MS as a company, they can fuck of with their funding of Cankles McTaco Tits' ballroom and all. But the non-stop cycle of FUD, conspiracy theories, and misinformation is so tiring. Seriously, as a Linux pro myself, the agenda driven campaign is embarrassing. Some of the Linux community push arguments like propaganda from the ruskie FSB.

 

[pepeno]

Steam is as out of the box as it can be.
23k playable on Steam through Proton
And many more in Lutris and Heroic

Thanks that you just said that it is not "out of the box" and that ton of games aren't working.

 

[nkarafo]

I don't understand Windows10 truthers either. Win11 is just updated windows 10 with a bit of new ui. You can degut it just the same as windows 10, you don't need ms account, you can uninstall stuff like onebox or copilot.

And there's HDR. Windows10 has shitty implementation of HDR that barely works. If you want HDR you need to switch to Win11.

Because there is no reason (other maybe than HDR) to spend all the effort and research to change your OS when everything you need is working fine and you have already spent too much time achieving that.

My current Windows 10 setup is at it's peak, it's fast, stable, debloated to it's barebones and without having to juggle with too many third party fixes since it's default design is still not as retarded as Windows 11.

Why would i abandon a perfectly working OS just to fix another in order to use it for the same exact things? I will only do this when my current OS isn't able to do what i want it to do. And HDR is not one of those things, fortunately for me.

 

[Magister]

Steam is as out of the box as it can be.
23k playable on Steam through Proton

And many more in Lutris and Heroic

People fail to realize that 90% of PC games without anticheat work on Linux/Steam Deck even if some require extra steps. I had good luck so far as everything I threw at my Steam Deck works even if I sometimes have to follow extra steps.

 

[Bernkastel]

Thanks that you just said that it is not "out of the box" and that ton of games aren't working.

It has more games than any console platform. The community is not going to optimize the slop that releases everyday on Steam.

 

[DirtInUrEye]

I use Special K for HDR anyway. Once a blue moon a backwards multiplayer release comes out that doesn't have its own HDR implementation (most recently, ARC Raiders) and I just ignore it or pick it up deep discount much later.

I use Windows 11 at work and so I am perfectly aware of its unfavourable comparisons with Windows 10. Basically, I think W11 is absolutely fucking shite and I will never use it on my personal system.

 

[pepeno]

It has more games than any console platform. The community is not going to optimize the slop that releases everyday on Steam.

But the point isn't to change from console to linux but from windows to linux. Slop or not it is just worse system if you want games.
In fact the only way in which I see this changing is if Microsoft will move fully on ARM and by that cut off compatibility with most of games.

Another thing is if Linux would change core license and there would be only one linux from now on for everything. This would fix many issues of Linux not just for gaming but for daily use as well.

 

[Bernkastel]

But the point isn't to change from console to linux but from windows to linux. Slop or not it is just worse system if you want games.
In fact the only way in which I see this changing is if Microsoft will move fully on ARM and by that cut off compatibility with most of games.

Daily steam slop does not need to work. Almost everything works.

Linux is overall a much more overall a more superior experience than Windows.

Another thing is if Linux would change core license and there would be only one linux from now on for everything. This would fix many issues of Linux not just for gaming but for daily use as well.

LMAO you don't understand how Linux works do you?

No one optimizer for individual Linux distros.

People optimize their games for Vulkan in Linux. App developers target desktop environments like Wayland

Do I have to remind you that Linux can run in 512 MB RAM?

There are no issues to Linux being open source, never have been one. Linux libraries for apps way better than those in Windows.

 

[pepeno]

LMAO you don't understand how Linux works do you?
No one optimizer for individual Linux distros.
People optimize their games for Vulkan in Linux. App developers target desktop environments like Wayland
Do I have to remind you that Linux can run in 512 MB RAM?
There are no issues to Linux being open source, never have been one. Linux libraries for apps way better than those in Windows.

Seems like I hit the nail

 

[Bernkastel]

Seems like I hit the nail

Yeah yeah say Linux has issues due to it being open source and pat yourselves in the back. Come back when Windows 11 runs on 512 MB RAM.

Microsoft fanboys are something else.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Daily steam slop does not need to work. Almost everything works.

Linux is overall a much more overall a more superior experience than Windows.

No, it is not, and you keep saying Steam Steam Steam but there are gazillions of games outside Steam and the vast majority of them require extra tinkering.

 

[ResilientBanana]

The hard part is, you can go Linux if you want to shave 10-20fps off your gams. Bazzite, Arch and CachyOS have been benchmarked against windows and it's not ideal.

 

[nkarafo]

Microsoft fanboys are something else.

There's no such thing regarding Windows. XBOX stuff, sure but nobody is a fan of Windows. Everyone just tolerates it.

Linux fanboys on the other hand are like vegans.

We get it, Linux is better, more efficient, blah blah blah. But it's harder to use but most importantly, not as compatible with games, emulators, various programs, etc. For many users like me Windows is the only choice because of the later. I can learn to use Linux, i already use it in a VM, but if i abandon Windows, about 40% of my stuff won't work.

 

[Physiognomonics]

You just know that Microsoft will shoehorn Copilot into Magnus and have it hog the damn NPU.

Exactly what I was thinking. Why add so much die space with that NPU on a console when you have a much more potent hardware AI available on the RDNA5 GPU?

 

[Rossco EZ]

The Ultimate Windows Utility

Having Fun with Technology

christitus.com

GitHub - zoicware/RemoveWindowsAI: Force Remove Copilot, Recall and More in Windows 11

Force Remove Copilot, Recall and More in Windows 11 - zoicware/RemoveWindowsAI

github.com

GitHub - Raphire/Win11Debloat: A simple, lightweight PowerShell script to remove pre-installed apps, disable telemetry, as well as perform various other changes to customize, declutter and improve your Windows experience. Win11Debloat works for both

A simple, lightweight PowerShell script to remove pre-installed apps, disable telemetry, as well as perform various other changes to customize, declutter and improve your Windows experience. Win11D...

github.com

 

[balls of snow]

Fucking windows and their ai fetish. We have to go back to xp.

 

[Bernkastel]

There's no such thing regarding Windows. XBOX stuff, sure but nobody is a fan of Windows. Everyone just tolerates it.

Linux fanboys on the other hand are like vegans.

We get it, Linux is better, more efficient, blah blah blah. But it's harder to use but most importantly, not as compatible with games, emulators, various programs, etc. For many users like me Windows is the only choice because of the later. I can learn to use Linux, i already use it in a VM, but if i abandon Windows, about 40% of my stuff won't work.

Except for Xenia, most emulators do run on Linux and even work better than Windows.

 

[Bernkastel]

No, it is not, and you keep saying Steam Steam Steam but there are gazillions of games outside Steam and the vast majority of them require extra tinkering.

But I said "Lutris, Heroic and Proton/Steam". Maybe the Windows fanboy in you simplified it. All the launchers I mentioned work out of the box and don't require tinkering.

 

[rodrigolfp]

But I said "Lutris, Heroic and Proton/Steam". Maybe the Windows fanboy in you simplified it. All the launchers I mentioned work out of the box and don't require tinkering.

Lutris, Heroic and Proton/Wine are tinkering, genius. They are launchers and/or translation layers on top of the game where on Windows they are not necessary. Plus they require tinkering choosing the best Proton/Wine versions, DXVK, VK3D, etc...

 

[RoboFu]

Lutris, Heroic and Proton/Wine are tinkering, genius. They are launchers and/or translation layers on top of the game where on Windows they are not necessary.

proton/wine is automatic for steam games. why use that other crap?



the only downfall right now of linux steam focused distress is the kernel level anti cheat. valve is working on by creating devs an alternative.

windows is still mostly shit. Got to keep those old ass 32bit dlls for those big corporations that pay MS millions a year to keep their old ass systems going!

 

[rodrigolfp]

proton/wine is automatic for steam games. why use that other crap?

Do you need a drawing to understand when people are talking about outside Steam gaming on Linux??

 

[Bojanglez]

If that's what people want, then I'm all for it, I don't much care for MS as a company, they can fuck of with their funding of Cankles McTaco Tits' ballroom and all. But the non-stop cycle of FUD, conspiracy theories, and misinformation is so tiring. Seriously, as a Linux pro myself, the agenda driven campaign is embarrassing. Some of the Linux community push arguments like propaganda from the ruskie FSB.

I guess at least there is a purism about backing a philosophy over a corporate entity, even if sometimes mislaid or over the top. Let's not forget how MS themselves spread FUD for years about competitors because they were falling behind more innovative competitors. e.g. their Scroogled campaign against GMail and Google Docs.

To be fair as MS have pivoted towards focussing on their own services and less on Windows, they have become more open to supporting certain Linux initiatives, but I'm still skeptical of their motives.

 

[pudel]

proton/wine is automatic for steam games. why use that other crap?

Heroic launcher is not crap....its awesome....especially for my gog games. Really....can only recommend it. And if you use it with steams proton layer (which takes two clicks) than Heroic is basically nothing else than steam.

At the end this whole discussion just boils down to how much you hate windows already. If you are fine with windows direction of development....Ads, AI, cloud/online everything, subscriptions...than stick with it. I am super happy with linux, even despite the fact that not every game is playable, which is usually just a dev decision....and I am not sure if I even want to support devs who actively working against linux users.

 

[nkarafo]

Except for Xenia, most emulators do run on Linux and even work better than Windows.

Most you say... But not all?

What about drivers? Pretty sure Nvidia performs worse on Linux. So should i also buy a new card that likes Linux more?

I have a big 85 systems emulation setup that took me years to curate and perfect. I'm using a ton of emulators and RetroArch cores, because i wanted it to be like a database where every system has the option to run with multiple emulators and do accuracy comparisons. Everything is Windows versions. Even if every single emulator/core/frontend has a Linux version, it's still going to be a lot of work to convert this. I'm not going to do such a thing unless my Windows based machine grows legs and wants to kill me.

 

[Wolzard]

I'm watching Youtube tutorial for Bazzite with baked in Nvidia drivers. It was posted 2 months ago. Maybe things have improved.
I tried on my PC a long while back and games had all kinds of graphical glitches. So much awful that I gave up and reinstalled Win11.

They are improving, and the root cause of the problem has been discovered and a solution is being worked on. The problem is expected to be resolved around March of next year (estimated based on an average driver release, Proton release, vkd3d release, and beta testing time).

I really wish Nvidia could get their head out of their rear and get better drivers for Linux out.

I personally think Nvidia's drivers on Linux are very good. They always offer day-one support, all the features of their GPUs, and a control panel. AMD, which many value, has some sinister bugs, like desktop freezes depending on the kernel version. FSR4 wasn't supported for a while, and RDNA4's RT performance is well below par.

Because people have been using Linux to play games, they get the feeling that Nvidia isn't doing anything. AMD hasn't done anything either; all the effort comes from Valve.
And consequently, the performance loss on Nvidias was ultimately a Vulkan problem, as some functions were created (mainly by Valve) with AMD GPUs in mind.

 

[Wolzard]

Most you say... But not all?

What about drivers? Pretty sure Nvidia performs worse on Linux. So should i also buy a new card that likes Linux more?

I have a big 85 systems emulation setup that took me years to curate and perfect. I'm using a ton of emulators and RetroArch cores, because i wanted it to be like a database where every system has the option to run with multiple emulators and do accuracy comparisons. Everything is Windows versions. Even if every single emulator/core/frontend has a Linux version, it's still going to be a lot of work to convert this. I'm not going to do such a thing unless my Windows based machine grows legs and wants to kill me.

Emulation is primarily Linux, the main platform. Performance is higher and there are fewer errors.
RPCS3, for example, has a clear performance advantage on Linux and is prioritized more, since on Windows developers suffer a lot with the system.

 

[StereoVsn]

They are improving, and the root cause of the problem has been discovered and a solution is being worked on. The problem is expected to be resolved around March of next year (estimated based on an average driver release, Proton release, vkd3d release, and beta testing time).



I personally think Nvidia's drivers on Linux are very good. They always offer day-one support, all the features of their GPUs, and a control panel. AMD, which many value, has some sinister bugs, like desktop freezes depending on the kernel version. FSR4 wasn't supported for a while, and RDNA4's RT performance is well below par.

Because people have been using Linux to play games, they get the feeling that Nvidia isn't doing anything. AMD hasn't done anything either; all the effort comes from Valve.
And consequently, the performance loss on Nvidias was ultimately a Vulkan problem, as some functions were created (mainly by Valve) with AMD GPUs in mind.

That is good to hear, as I was always surprised that Nvidia gaming drivers have issues considering that vast majority of Nvidia AI workloads are on Linux.

So it sounds next spring would be a good time to once again try booting into Linux on my gaming PC.

I have a secondary one with a 3080 that my kids use with Steam BPM on downstairs TV. Seems like a perfect candidate!

 

[Pasta la Vista]

And this is why we will see some next gen "hardware" or "console" from MS. They can get their customers to actually pay for AI training. Genius.

 

[Bernkastel]

Most you say... But not all?

What about drivers? Pretty sure Nvidia performs worse on Linux. So should i also buy a new card that likes Linux more?

Nvidia driver support is not as good as Intel and AMD does not mean the performance is worse than Windows. Nvidia even supports Wayland now, and that's all I could ask for.

I have a big 85 systems emulation setup that took me years to curate and perfect. I'm using a ton of emulators and RetroArch cores, because i wanted it to be like a database where every system has the option to run with multiple emulators and do accuracy comparisons. Everything is Windows versions. Even if every single emulator/core/frontend has a Linux version, it's still going to be a lot of work to convert this. I'm not going to do such a thing unless my Windows based machine grows legs and wants to kill me.

Any more bluffing you are gonna do? Unless you are using Xenia for 360 emulation, emulators usually run better on Linux. Linux is the emulator machine, not Windows. And Xenia is honestly a shitty emulator anyway.

 

[Bernkastel]

Lutris, Heroic and Proton/Wine are tinkering, genius. They are launchers and/or translation layers on top of the game where on Windows they are not necessary. Plus they require tinkering choosing the best Proton/Wine versions, DXVK, VK3D, etc...

Umm no. Steam/Proton works out of the box.

Do you need a drawing to understand when people are talking about outside Steam gaming on Linux??

That's why I mentioned Lutris and Heroic Launcher. I don't know how you arrived at the conclusion. I use them to play certain GOG games and they work out of the box. Stuff like Heroic are just front ends for other PC launchers.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Umm no. Steam/Proton works out of the box.

That's why I mentioned Lutris and Heroic Launcher. I don't know how you arrived at the conclusion. I use them to play certain GOG games and they work out of the box. Stuff like Heroic are just front ends for other PC launchers.

You keep using "out if the box" and looks like you don't even know what it means. The last sentence shows it. Heroic and Lutris are not just front ends for other launchers but much more.

 

[nkarafo]

Any more bluffing you are gonna do?

Yeah, because i give a shit about convincing some random person on the internet.

 

[Bernkastel]

Yeah, because i give a shit about convincing some random person on the internet.

Looks much more left to bluff. Emulators do run better on Linux, it has been proven so many times.

You keep using "out if the box" and looks like you don't even know what it means. The last sentence shows it. Heroic and Lutris are not just front ends for other launchers but much more.

Yes they are community maintained versions of Proton/Steam but for all PC launchers. Heroic Launcher is as simple as it goes for being a front end for other launchers. If you want more customisation use Lutris.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Looks much more left to bluff. Emulators do run better on Linux, it has been proven so many times.

Yes they are community maintained versions of Proton/Steam but for all PC launchers. Heroic Launcher is as simple as it goes for being a front end for other launchers. If you want more customisation use Lutris.

Thanks anyway for the useless information about what I already said. And keep deflecting about what Heroic and Lutris can do and needs tinkering.

 

[nkarafo]

Emulators do run better on Linux, it has been proven so many times.

Good to know for when i'm forced to switch to Linux. Which is not yet.

Nvidia driver support is not as good as Intel and AMD does not mean the performance is worse than Windows.

 

[GymWolf]

The Ultimate Windows Utility

Having Fun with Technology

christitus.com

GitHub - zoicware/RemoveWindowsAI: Force Remove Copilot, Recall and More in Windows 11

Force Remove Copilot, Recall and More in Windows 11 - zoicware/RemoveWindowsAI

github.com

GitHub - Raphire/Win11Debloat: A simple, lightweight PowerShell script to remove pre-installed apps, disable telemetry, as well as perform various other changes to customize, declutter and improve your Windows experience. Win11Debloat works for both

A simple, lightweight PowerShell script to remove pre-installed apps, disable telemetry, as well as perform various other changes to customize, declutter and improve your Windows experience. Win11D...

github.com

How hard is to use this stuff for an absolute noob?

 

[Rossco EZ]

How hard is to use this stuff for an absolute noob?

It's really really easy, for the Chris Titus util you can check his channel or other YouTube videos if you want a walk through and the others are literally just copying and pasting the command into terminal and letting it run and finish.

 

[MHubert]

Heroic, Lutris and Steam is fine, but don't fall for all the sales pitches saying that everything works out of the box. If you switch from Windows to Linux, you will have to be prepared to click on stuff and it simply won't work for at variety of reasons - you WILL have to commit some effort to understand how Linux works with your hardware. That said, committing said effort can be worthwhile IMO.

 

[Wolzard]

Any more bluffing you are gonna do? Unless you are using Xenia for 360 emulation, emulators usually run better on Linux. Linux is the emulator machine, not Windows. And Xenia is honestly a shitty emulator anyway.

Xenia has a build for Linux since the beginning of this year, in the Canary versions. But even before that, it worked the same way as Windows using Wine.

 

[Bernkastel]

Thanks anyway for the useless information about what I already said. And keep deflecting about what Heroic and Lutris can do and needs tinkering.

You are the one trying to deflect. Heroic Launcher is the most simplest launchers. No one expects you to do any tinkering. Even in Lutris, I literally showed you images. I don't know why you are trying so hard to deflect that Lutris needs tinkering. These are out of the box experiences. Tinkkering is done by the community. Everything works with a click.

Good to know for when i'm forced to switch to Linux. Which is not yet.

Currently Windows 11 is forcing you to switch.