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[I collect VHS tapes]

Good points. I just have an abundance of cyncism when it comes to Microsoft doing what they say they will do these days. Like I said in my follow up, I think native BC is simply a must. Xbox on PC minus the Xbox games just isn't an Xbox. It is like leaving the soul of Xbox behind. I feel like that whenever the new Xbox is finally revealed, BC is going to be a big thing a lot of people will be honing in on. That and price, of course.

My suspicion is that their long-term goal is to transition fully into the PC world and focus on publishing games and making prebuilt PC

But to get there, you need this transitory period of time where you offer BC hardware

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Good points. I just have an abundance of cyncism when it comes to Microsoft doing what they say they will do these days. Like I said in my follow up, I think native BC is simply a must. Xbox on PC minus the Xbox games just isn't an Xbox. It is like leaving the soul of Xbox behind. I feel like that whenever the new Xbox is finally revealed, BC is going to be a big thing a lot of people will be honing in on. That and price, of course.

I would be super shocked if this next machine doesn't have native BC built into the chip and if not what was the point of developing this Magnus chip, why not pull all off the shelf parts?

 

[MisterXDTV]

I would be super shocked if this next machine doesn't have native BC built into the chip and if not what was the point of developing this Magnus chip, why not pull all off the shelf parts?

Magnus is an AMD product, has nothing to with MS anyway

You will find the same SoC in many other Mini-PCs

 

[Topher]

I would be super shocked if this next machine doesn't have native BC built into the chip and if not what was the point of developing this Magnus chip, why not pull all off the shelf parts?

Ok.....concensus is my concern is unwarranted.

 

[ChuckeRearmed]

Would be a neat PC.

 

[crazyriddler]

Magnus is an AMD product, has nothing to with MS anyway

You will find the same SoC in many other Mini-PCs

No, Magnus is a semi-custom chip, just like Scarlett was for Series X. It may include specific instructions for BC, as well as a GDDR memory bus with high bandwidth and a huge GPU for an SOC. These types of SOCs are never available outside the console market.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Ok.....concensus is my concern is unwarranted.

With MS/Xbox skepticism is good though as they have been known to fib a little

 

[viveks86]

You know the smart marketing move (if this thing is going to be expensive anyway) is to have to have it come with an Xbox branded, mouse, keyboard and controller. If the message is that this is the only machine you need for gaming and productivity, the messaging should start with what they give you in the box. The marketing is easy, here are your controls for productivity, and here is your controls for your leisure time. They will miss a great opportunity if they don't do this. Slam the message home immediately about what this device is and what it can do as opposed to just a console or just a standard PC.

Agree 100%.

It would be a bit strange if they officially advertise features to exit FSE, but then expect the user to go out and buy a mouse and keyboard if they suddenly decide to use battle.net, GoG... or excel. If you are pitching this as a do-it-all, then might as well make it convenient for the buyer. At least have an option to ship it with a couch friendly keyboard and mouse, if not part of a standard bundle.

 

[Sorcerer]

It's Microsoft who popularised it and their fanbase who accepted it and even defended it. They and there fanbase are absolutely to blame.

While it's true Sony and nintendo aren't forced to follow, but that's what happens when at the time one of the popular consoles(360) has made it acceptable to make money from online pay walls.

I remember when PSN was free and people were shitting on it and would rather pay and play on Xbox live. That was very telling. Imagine Microsoft actually having that kind of strength in that one area and still botching everything else to become number 3 over and over again.

 

[nowhat]

It's hard to imagine that the huge amounts of money Microsoft pays their marketing teams, that this could have been a simple mistake. They have to know what they are doing by now. Right?

*adjusts glasses* I was just making the "joke", that according to De Morgan's law, "NOT p AND NOT q" equals "NOT (p OR q)". Don't try to look to much into it.

 

[MisterXDTV]

I remember when PSN was free and people were shitting on it and would rather pay and play on Xbox live. That was very telling. Imagine Microsoft actually having that kind of strength in that one area and still botching everything else to become number 3 over and over again.

I remember these discussions very well during the PS3 era...

"It's free but it sucks, I'd rather pay and have the quality of Xbox LIVE"

When Sony did just that with PS4, it became bad for consumers....

Unreal

Now MS goes PC because Xbox is dead and free multiplayer is a big deal again

LOL

 

[Humdinger]

Microsoft absoltuley had a influence in popularising online pay walls. Nothing hilarious about it, they had a very popular console and had advantages over playstation during that gen that allow them to introduce that shitty practice.

Just a minor historical correction. MS charged for Xbox Live from the start. It was introduced in 2002, about halfway through the original Xbox era. They didn't wait until the 360 gen to do it. It was already in place by then.

 

[laynelane]

Steam isn't a monopoly. There are plenty of alternatives and people will choose the best one. Steam offers the best features and has the most robust games catalog because they nurtured PC gaming for the past 20 years.

The 30% cut is industry standard too. As well, depending on the amount of units sold for a title, Steam will decrease their cut.

Iirc, it was Epic who started the whole 'Steam bad for taking 30% cut' malarkey. Crazy that there's still people believing that to this day.

 

[Ainem Enamas]

I really hope they emphasize on power the nextgen

 

[digoutyoursoul]

copied it from somewhere else:

===

New marching orders are clearly in. They've seen the drop off in people investing in xbox by actually buying games so have told their mouthpieces that all games will definitely carry over to the next Xbox without xbox every having to confirm this so when it inevitably doesn't happen because publishers refuse to renegotiate the licenses Xbox will just deny they ever said it.
The exact same playbook as the rog ally, anybody still falling for this deserves what they get.

===

It is quite possible that the retro is the same as the x360 for the xbox one, with the aggravating factor of being another platform, the majority of publishers do not authorize this easily, as was the case with the xbox one retro.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Not just codes and invites

Hardware, accessories and even straight cash homie depending on how much influence they have

 

[Ar¢tos]

I really hope they emphasize on power the nextgen

It will eat monsters for breakfast that eat other monsters for breakfast while being beta tested in the future in this universe and, at least, 231 other parallel universes.

 

[adamsapple]

Well that certainly explains Ybarra's recent outbursts, he's not taking having all that access taken away well.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Well that certainly explains Ybarra's recent outbursts, he's not taking having all that access taken away well.

He was a huge part of passing that stuff out to creators and sites like Digital Foundry (and giving lots of stuff to his moderators of his Mixer channel)

 

[viveks86]

It will eat monsters for breakfast that eat other monsters for breakfast while being beta tested in the future in this universe and, at least, 231 other parallel universes.

And then crash because you looked at Excel the wrong way

 

[Ar¢tos]

And then crash because you looked at Excel the wrong way

Wait, will it run excel?
Will it have a full desktop mode?

 

[adamsapple]

He was a huge part of passing that stuff out to creators and sites like Digital Foundry (and giving lots of stuff to his moderators of his Mixer channel)

I think you described him as a jilted ex in another topic perfectly.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

Wait, will it run excel?
Will it have a full desktop mode?

Read the OP, yes it will.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I think you described him as a jilted ex in another topic perfectly.

I am not saying this is what happened but sure looks like it

Imagine leaving your dream job to go help facilitate a takeover and once completed instead of getting rewarded you are told to get the fuck out

Again, thats what seemed to have happened

 

[laynelane]

With MS/Xbox skepticism is good though as they have been known to fib a little

A teeny bit, every so often, here and there.

 

[Fafalada]

I would be super shocked if this next machine doesn't have native BC built into the chip and if not what was the point of developing this Magnus chip, why not pull all off the shelf parts?

If you're targeting a particular thermal/power-envelope, you can always do more with semi-custom than off-the shelf.
And the 'only' console-like element left in this thing is that it's a box with set thermal/power targets. If we take that away - we really should stop pretending this is anything other than a PC with an extra name-sticker. Then again MS did do that before - ie. Surface (but I don't think anyone wants hardware specs/price ratio that used to have...)

I still say that the real reason for 'BC on a chip' is some sort of authentication that allows them to masquerade any APU as a console in the future(including 3rd party boxes) and satisfies the license hounds that would refuse to have them the whole XBox library otherwise.
If all they are doing is support for few custom hw-extensions Series had (for easy compatibility), then we're not getting access to the full library at launch - I'll make a modem eating bet on that.

 

[Ar¢tos]

Read the OP, yes it will.

But how can it have a version of Windows de cluttered and optimised for gaming and at the same time have all the legacy stuff needed to run old programs and operate old devices?
And if it runs any program like any other pc it will also need security stuff/antivírus constantly running in the background.
It's literally just a pc with all the negatives of a pc then.

 

[Topher]

I am not saying this is what happened but sure looks like it

Imagine leaving your dream job to go help facilitate a takeover and once completed instead of getting rewarded you are told to get the fuck out

Again, thats what seemed to have happened

Can't say I blame him for being sour if that's what happened.

 

[Kacho]

But how can it have a version of Windows de cluttered and optimised for gaming and at the same time have all the legacy stuff needed to run old programs and operate old devices?
And if it runs any program like any other pc it will also need security stuff/antivírus constantly running in the background.
It's literally just a pc with all the negatives of a pc then.

No one knows. Everything is just speculation.

 

[viveks86]

Wait, will it run excel?
Will it have a full desktop mode?

If Jez is being fed accurate PR, yes.

Heck, might as well make the controller emulate a virtual keyboard and mouse within the desktop while they are at it.

 

[Codiox]

So its a PC with a frontend?

Using this setup with a controller only since 2015 with Launchbox/Bigbox and Playnite.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Not just codes and invites

Hardware, accessories and even straight cash homie depending on how much influence they have

Scumbags imo

 

[RetroGamingUK]

It's literally just a pc with all the negatives of a pc then.

Yup, you got there in the end.

Phil Spencer an Sarah Bond keep saying it'll be the RoG Ally experience, but people don't want to hear it.

 

[KeplerL2]

Time will tell bro. I'm still not doubting you. I wouldn't be surprised if a closed console is still being tossed around with PC being the backup plan. @SneakersSO says things are still in flux so it sounds like things are not set in stone yet and K KeplerL2 has backed you up. MS has not publicly committed to any one course of action except that there will be first party hardware.

I think a PC makes more sense when we say "Xbox" that has other stores like Steam. Traditional console makes more sense when it comes to BC. So I got no clue

If MS somehow got the legal problems of doing Xbox BC on Windows sorted, then I can see them only bothering with "Xbox PC". But I still think the 1st-party Xbox console and 3rd-party Xbox PC will end up as different things.

 

[SenkiDala]

Yes I'll buy it. If it's what they are saying here : all my Xbox library (I'm here since OG day one), PC power, no paywall for online (even though I'll probably have a GP sub).

But if that's again some fantasy from jez condom... I'm not sure.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

If MS somehow got the legal problems of doing Xbox BC on Windows sorted, then I can see them only bothering with "Xbox PC". But I still think the 1st-party Xbox console and 3rd-party Xbox PC will end up as different things.

Always how I heard it, Xbox console that has the BC and Xbox PC (Asus and the likes) will not have BC

 

[Humdinger]

Well, the announcement sure was well-timed. "Hey, look over here." MS PR got something right for a change.

 

[GHG]

Just going to plonk this here:

 

[Topher]

Just going to plonk this here:

"We built a console because we wanted to build a better PC"

That doesn't even make any sense

 

[Ashamam]

Always how I heard it, Xbox console that has the BC and Xbox PC (Asus and the likes) will not have BC

That doesn't mean the hardware is different though. It could be a case of just needing encryption keys to access functionality.

I thought the only custom aspect of Magnus was going to be the chiplet arrangement. Just like everything else that chooses that platform will be able to customise, or at least choose from a set of off the shelf specs. But the BC was baked into the platform, all of it. So I was more wondering whether Xbox would license those keys out, which in your scenario, they wouldn't.

 

[BigLee74]

Sounds decent? Will quite simply live or die on price. So will likely die.

 

[Jinxed]

We built a console because we wanted to build a better PC

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

 

[Topher]

Satya going for the Guiness Book of World Records for the number of contradictory statements ever in one interview

 

[Ashamam]

Do they have corpo ozempic parties or something? Pulled up some older images and he used to have some fat content on his face. Talking about the actual interview footage, not the linked picture in the article.

 

[RoboFu]

I think it would be cool if they let mother board manufactures add the custom chip sets on to the boards.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Do they have corpo ozempic parties or something? Pulled up some older images and he used to have some fat content on his face. Talking about the actual interview footage, not the linked picture in the article.

well, MS spent closer to $100B on Xbox and still failed, and they are balls deep in the AI race (which is not making money) pressure is high.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

"We built a console because we wanted to build a better PC"

That doesn't even make any sense

I think it does if they are talking about how a Console OS can make the PC OS better....But of course we are talking about MS here.

 

[Tobimacoss]

And that basically confirms the Console form factor isn't going away, and neither are the GDKX optimized game versions aka Console SKUs.

Like I said before, full convergence is about bringing together the two game dev environments together for both PC and Console form factors, not getting rid of either. So Consoles will be have PC store access with Windows SDK games and Xbox PC will have Forwards Compatibility with GDKX optimized versions. It's a new paradigm, both are products that currently don't exist.

Satya going for the Guiness Book of World Records for the number of contradictory statements ever in one interview

First statement he is talking about that they both use the same technologies. Windows NT kernel, Win32 app model aka Windows API, unified dev environment with GDK/GDKX. Thus they're the same in his eyes, just separated due to form factors. Second statement is about creating a new paradigm, of devices that don't currently exist. Consoles that can run PC games too in addition to Console games. And PCs that can run Console games too in addition to PC games. That's the innovation.

 

[Topher]

And that basically confirms the Console form factor isn't going away, and neither are the GDKX optimized game versions aka Console SKUs.

Like I said before, full convergence is about bringing together the two game dev environments together for both PC and Console form factors, not getting rid of either. So Consoles will be have PC store access with Windows SDK games and Xbox PC will have Forwards Compatibility with GDKX optimized versions. It's a new paradigm, both are products that currently don't exist.

First statement he is talking about that they both use the same technologies. Windows NT kernel, Win32 app model aka Windows API, unified dev environment with GDK/GDKX. Thus they're the same in his eyes, just separated due to form factors. Second statement is about creating a new paradigm, of devices that don't currently exist. Consoles that can run PC games too in addition to Console games. And PCs that can run Console games too in addition to PC games. That's the innovation.