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[Bernkastel]

Also you're wrong about edge yes you can remove it you can also run a script to block Windows featured updates and keep security updates for several years well known.

Microsoft has removed all ways to remove Edge. Even if you can it will come back with an update. Blocking updates (assuming its possible) means you are not getting security patches. You can't both get the security updates and chose to not have Edge.

You also can't remove Windows Store and the UWP framework. Even Tiny11 can't.

Also I don't get what you mean by you can't in terms of storage fair enough if you're running a laptop. But again I'm talking about in generalities most gamers are playing on a desktop and can add more space.

I have assembled my own PC. Windows 11 on a 1 TB WDBlue NVMe drive, EndeavourOS on 500 GB WDRed SATA SSD and another Crucial 500 GB Storage for more games. Modded Skyrim takes almost to 267 GB (stored on the NVMe). PSO2 (with classic PSO2 data) on the Crucial SSD takes almost 160 GB. Its frustrating how much space Windows 11 takes.

I meant both Laptop and Desktop.

 

[falconhoof]

I looked into the option of running Linux as main. I've used it as a secondary OS on my laptop, and it was fine for general use and web development.

I can't switch from Windows (10) as a main for the following:
* Linux does not have support for some of the stuff we rely on such as Epic Online Services Voice features, and other libraries.
* I cannot build and deploy Windows Unreal binaries from Linux, I can only build Linux (Windows can deploy both)

It's getting close though, certainly no technical reason, just a need for developers to expand the reach of their offerings.

 

[Bernkastel]

Lol.. Why are you the way you are? Why you keep on making these claims when you know the answer will be "Yes i can"?

Of course i can disable forced updates. I can update whenever i feel like.

Again, learn how to use a damn computer! Stop wasting my time with those replies son.

So your cope is to disable security patches? I don't like to use a PC with security patches disabled. In Linux I can remove any browser and install any browser I want, and system updates will respect my choice.

I don't use Windows 11 but that seems to be an evolution of what i was saying before (the cache thing).

It doesn't mean the RAM can't be used by programs, it means Windows is using it until they do. It's still "free RAM" but at the same time it's been used for better performance.

I mean, the very same reply you posted below says that.

So if that's how it works then where the issue? If this is intended for better performance, why are you so obsessed with seeing little RAM usage numbers? In Task Manager you can see how much RAM is "in use" by the OS and how much is "committed" as cache. The latter is still free RAM that can be used by programs when they need to. Saying the sum of those two metrics is "how much RAM Windows is wasting" is a bad faith argument or simply an ignorant one.

The point is Linux has way better performance. If I use a desktop environment like XFce it will use less than 512 MB RAM. Although I use KDE Plasma, which uses around 2 GB. Linux does not need to reserve system RAM for shady behind the scenes stuffs.

 

[nani17]

Microsoft has removed all ways to remove Edge. Even if you can it will come back with an update. Blocking updates (assuming its possible) means you are not getting security patches. You can't both get the security updates and chose to not have Edge.

You also can't remove Windows Store and the UWP framework. Even Tiny11 can't.

I have assembled my own PC. Windows 11 on a 1 TB WDBlue NVMe drive, EndeavourOS on 500 GB WDRed SATA SSD and another Crucial 500 GB Storage for more games. Modded Skyrim takes almost to 267 GB (stored on the NVMe). PSO2 (with classic PSO2 data) on the Crucial SSD takes almost 160 GB. Its frustrating how much space Windows 11 takes.

I meant both Laptop and Desktop.

Lad stop you can block feature updates and still get security patches

Below is a list of tweaks you can do besides the talon method.

 

[Bernkastel]

Lad stop you can block feature updates and still get security patches

Below is a list of tweaks you can do besides the talon method.

"feature updates delayed by 2 years"
You are just delaying the inevitable.

Also as far as I am aware Tiny11 does not remove Windows Store and UWP framework.

You guys really are making everything complicated. On Linux it just works.

 

[nani17]

"feature updates delayed by 2 years"
You are just delaying the inevitable.

Also as far as I am aware Tiny11 does not remove Windows Store and UWP framework.

You guys really are making everything complicated. On Linux it just works.

Nah your wrong because you don't have to update and if you do you know what you can do???? click remove again

At this point i know your trolling but sure what can you do.

 

[Bernkastel]

Nah your wrong because you don't have to update and if you do you know what you can do???? click remove again

At this point i know your trolling but sure what can you do.

Chris Titus Winutil script can only delay feature updates by 2 years.

 

[nkarafo]

Chris Titus Winutil script can only delay feature updates by 2 years.

Or you can just do it yourself

I only ever update manually for years now.

 

[Hero of Spielberg]

This thread reminds me of when people claim that running a Plex server is as easy as subscribing to Netflix.

 

[Bernkastel]

Or you can just do it yourself

I only ever update manually for years now.

You can just delay the inevitable for 2 years.

 

[Soodanim]

"feature updates delayed by 2 years"
You are just delaying the inevitable.

Also as far as I am aware Tiny11 does not remove Windows Store and UWP framework.

You guys really are making everything complicated. On Linux it just works.

People would respond to you far better if you didn't act like your anecdotal experience and opinion are universal and irrefutable fact. Being obnoxious doesn't help discussion, it hurts your point because people don't take you seriously.

Most people are happy to get feature updates sooner or later, and the 2 year delay helps ensure bugs are ironed out (and worst case, any necessary workarounds are found). Do you know CTT is not able to disable for more than 2 years or is it a guess? I'm pretty sure CTT added a "Disable forever" option when the drive breaking issue happened and CT decided it was time to add it, whereas before he didn't want to be responsible for insecure PCs and didn't feel the need.

No one in this thread is claiming MS are benevolent by any stretch of the imagination, but being mad because UWP and Store are built into a product they make is a bit silly. Not catering an OS designed to be usable by as many people as possible worldwide to the niche lean OS crowd is rather narrow minded. The simple truth is that it's theirs to do with as they please until such a time that higher authorities involve themselves like when the EU didn't like their software monopoly tactics and caused N editions and browser selection. I'm pretty sure that the broad approach is a better approach financially than catering to niche nerds like us. The planet's default OS isn't concerned with pleasing what is at most a couple hundred thousand people when there is no incentive to - the OS currently works. Some just don't like how it works. The harsh truth is it's a product from a business that doesn't owe anyone but shareholders anything and will only act in the name of profit.

As I and others have already described from experience, Linux does not simply work. Pretending it does is denial unless you're throwing Mint on and only browse the web. The lean piecemeal approach and everything working instantly don't co-exist. The fact that Windows works well enough for 90+% of the world means they're doing enough right.

I'm still going to use Linux as my daily driver at home, and I'm still going to get annoyed every day at work because MS has pulled some new shit trying to push their newer but worse versions of software like Outlook and fucked with default programs because they don't respect user choices. But that doesn't change facts.

 

[nkarafo]

You can just delay the inevitable for 2 years.

You make it sound so dramatic.

What exactly will happen in 2 years (it's actually 3 years btw)? I used Windows 7 way after it's support was ended and it was fine. I only changed when new games and apps weren't supported anymore. And this gave me enough time to completely skip Windows 8 and the early days of Windows 10.

I'll just do the same thing again. Keep my current working OS for as long as i need, until games stop supporting it or something better comes along. This will take enough time to even maybe skip Windows 11 completely and go straight to 12. Who knows.

One thing is for certain. I will only ever use the OS that's the most compatible with everything i use, whichever that will be. And if it's shit, i will clean it up as much as i can.

 

[Bernkastel]

You make it sound so dramatic.

What exactly will happen in 2 years (it's actually 3 years btw)? I used Windows 7 way after it's support was ended and it was fine. I only changed when new games and apps weren't supported anymore. And this gave me enough time to completely skip Windows 8 and the early days of Windows 10.

I'll just do the same thing again. Keep my current working OS for as long as i need, until games stop supporting it or something better comes along. This will take enough time to even maybe skip Windows 11 completely and go straight to 12. Who knows.

One thing is for certain. I will only ever use the OS that's the most compatible with everything i use, whichever that will be. And if it's shit, i will clean it up as much as i can.

Well I do like to get the latest security patches by just clicking update. What you are describing is way more hassle than using Linux.

 

[nkarafo]

What you are describing is way more hassle than using Linux.

Maybe but Linux is way more hassle in other things.

But i don't care about that. I don't really care about the OS itself, that's not the reason i got into PCs. I didn't think "oh, can't wait to get my first PC so i can play with Windows or Linux!". I bought my PC to play games and use programs. Compatibility of those is more important to me than the OS.

 

[Bernkastel]

Maybe but Linux is way more hassle in other things.

But i don't care about that. I don't really care about the OS itself, that's not the reason i got into PCs. I didn't think "oh, can't wait to get my first PC so i can play with Windows or Linux!". I bought my PC to play games and use programs. Compatibility of those is more important to me than the OS.

I prefer to have an OS that does not have spyware. Its mostly compatible with games I play.

 

[Nikodemos]

The last time MS had any semblance of private customer friendliness was during Ballmer's time. People like to meme on him (for good reasons), but his "Developers, developers, developers" creed was a genuinely good thing.

By contrast, Nutella seems hellbent on rentseeking the fuck out of MS's software suite.

 

[nkarafo]

I prefer to have an OS that does not have spyware.

Cool, my OS doesn't have that either anymore.

 

[RCX]

Finally got some time next week so I'm installing bazzite and leaving this nightmare of an OS behind.

 

[Bernkastel]

Cool, my OS doesn't have that either anymore.

Or atleast thats what Microsoft wants you to believe. You will get it back anyway when in 2 years you have to get feature updates.

 

[OLED_Gamer]

Finally got some time next week so I'm installing bazzite and leaving this nightmare of an OS behind.

Does Bazzite use HDR? I game on my TV so would like to keep HDR.

 

[Broad Spectrum]

You make it sound so dramatic.

What exactly will happen in 2 years (it's actually 3 years btw)? I used Windows 7 way after it's support was ended and it was fine. I only changed when new games and apps weren't supported anymore. And this gave me enough time to completely skip Windows 8 and the early days of Windows 10.

I'll just do the same thing again. Keep my current working OS for as long as i need, until games stop supporting it or something better comes along. This will take enough time to even maybe skip Windows 11 completely and go straight to 12. Who knows.

One thing is for certain. I will only ever use the OS that's the most compatible with everything i use, whichever that will be. And if it's shit, i will clean it up as much as i can.

Maybe but Linux is way more hassle in other things.

But i don't care about that. I don't really care about the OS itself, that's not the reason i got into PCs. I didn't think "oh, can't wait to get my first PC so i can play with Windows or Linux!". I bought my PC to play games and use programs. Compatibility of those is more important to me than the OS.

Totally valid reasons for wanting to use Windows with the caveat that running an OS beyond when the manufacturer is providing you with security updates is a horrible idea. As much as Microsoft spying annoys me, it's better them than someone that is going to drain your bank accounts.

My experience switching from predominately Windows to Linux was that they're both hassles but in different ways. I didn't find that Linux had more issues than Windows, they were just different and required different methods of problem solving. One of the things Windows used to do that drove me nuts was just randomly break my microphone. No amount of settings changes would bring it back until I rebooted. I've never had that issue on Linux.

 

[nkarafo]

Or atleast thats what Microsoft wants you to believe. You will get it back anyway when in 2 years you have to get feature updates.

And i will remove that too.

 

[Broad Spectrum]

Lad stop you can block feature updates and still get security patches

Below is a list of tweaks you can do besides the talon method.

Windows debloaters are at best snake oil and at worst will expose you to vulnerabilities and computer issues down the line.

 

[EverydayBeast]

The idea of copilot being a game guide I will say is a positive and saves a step myself.

 

[nani17]

Windows debloaters are at best snake oil and at worst will expose you to vulnerabilities and computer issues down the line.

Not necessarily popular YouTuber John Hammond who is well known for cybersecurity has gone through each line of code one or two of the popular debloators especially talon and found nothing wrong.


No vulnerabilities can happen as long as you keep Windows Defender. Now some options out there in the debloaters allow you to remove Windows Defender which is perfectly fine if you have another antivirus however I would suggest it. I've been using these types of tools since this the vista years and found them to be pretty good.

The overall issue is Microsoft consistently piling more stuff on each iteration of Windows to the point where these tools are becoming very very popular.

 

[Broad Spectrum]

Not necessarily popular YouTuber John Hammond who is well known for cybersecurity has gone through each line of code one or two of the popular debloators especially talon and found nothing wrong.


No vulnerabilities can happen as long as you keep Windows Defender. Now some options out there in the debloaters allow you to remove Windows Defender which is perfectly fine if you have another antivirus however I would suggest it. I've been using these types of tools since this the vista years and found them to be pretty good.

The overall issue is Microsoft consistently piling more stuff on each iteration of Windows to the point where these tools are becoming very very popular.

It simply looks like John Hammond is checking if the script itself is malware, not whether running it is going to introduce additional software vulnerabilities with what it does to Windows. Defender is fine as an antivirus (most antivirus programs are snake oil anyways) but it's not going to be able to keep you safe if a debloat script has turned off automatic updates or done something to Windows that introduces a vulnerability.

All of this begs the question. If you so dislike or distrust the bundled Windows software, telemetry, AI spying, that you feel like you need to run a sketchy third-party debloat script to turn off or damage portions of the Windows software, why not just run a different operating system? Or do what most reasonable people do and have a Windows PC for gaming and and a computer that you use for more personal things.

Running a debloat script for "performance" reasons also makes no sense. I've never seen any benchmarks that show they make any kind of difference beyond people in forums who swear up and down they help (they don't).

 

[falconhoof]

why not just run a different operating system?

Because they don't support the software needed to work.

 

[nani17]

Because they don't support the software needed to work.

B Broad Spectrum this mainly why. I play certain games that Linux cannot play.

 

[Durin]

Does Bazzite use HDR? I game on my TV so would like to keep HDR.

Bazzite does, but if you decide to run it it you have multiple desktop environment options (basically your GUI for the OS). Gnome still has HDR support in the experimental/beta stage, whereas KDE would be the one you want that has good HDR support already (also the GUI is closer to windows).

 

[RCX]

Does Bazzite use HDR? I game on my TV so would like to keep HDR.

Had to look it up but yes. Maybe a little more involved than windows but its there.

https://old.reddit.com/r/linux_gaming/comments/1nnms4h/what_is_the_latest_best_practice_to_enable_hdr_in/https://old.reddit.com/r/linux_gaming/comments/1nnms4h/what_is_the_latest_best_practice_to_enable_hdr_in/

 

[Bernkastel]

And i will remove that too.

Windows 11 is still a spyware anyway. And theres a reason no one goes through the hassle. Its just not worth it.

 

[nkarafo]

Windows 11 is still a spyware anyway. And theres a reason no one goes through the hassle. Its just not worth it.

Nah, it only takes a few seconds. And you only have to do it, what, once every few months if you are paranoid?

Much better than having to deal with the occational random game incompatibilities and constant lower performance with Nvidia cards.

 

[Bernkastel]

Nah, it only takes a few seconds. And you only have to do it, what, once every few months if you are paranoid?

Much better than having to deal with the occational random game incompatibilities and constant lower performance with Nvidia cards.

I figured most Microsoft fanboys including you don't actually go through the hassle, and just live with the spyware. Also, Windows itself is a spyware, even if you temporarily turn it off.


You can't escape Microsoft spying. Even if you boast about "turning it off" in GAF. Remember our conversation was about stopping Windows 11 from using 8-10 GB RAM, removing Windows Store and the Windows UWP framework bloat and making the install size less than 15 GB. None of which you can't.

Although you mentioned Tiny11, which can give you the temporary impression of reducing the install size of Windows 11. But you never mentioned tools that try to block Windows 11 spying like O&O Shutup 10. You equated Tiny11 with "removing spyware". Even if now claim to me that you use O&O Shutup 10, Windows 11 still keeps sending data as shown in the video. The video clearly shows "turning off telemetry" does jack shit.

 

[nkarafo]

I figured most Microsoft fanboys including you don't actually go through the hassle, and just live with the spyware. Also, Windows itself is a spyware, even if you temporarily turn it off.

You can't escape Microsoft spying. Even if you boast about "turning it off" in GAF. Remember our conversation was about stopping Windows 11 from using 8-10 GB RAM, removing Windows Store and the Windows UWP framework bloat and making the install size less than 15 GB. None of which you can't.

Although you mentioned Tiny11, which can give you the temporary impression of reducing the install size of Windows 11. But you never mentioned tools that try to block Windows 11 spying like O&O Shutup 10. You equated Tiny11 with "removing spyware". Even if now claim to me that you use O&O Shutup 10, Windows 11 still keeps sending data as shown in the video. The video clearly shows "turning off telemetry" does jack shit.

Imaging thinking people are "Microsoft fanboys" because of... Windows, of all things

Only a deluded Linux maniac who lives alone in his little bubble thinking he is so much better than everyone else believes those exist.

Also, i never mentioned "tiny11" myself, i haven't even ever used it. I have also never mentioned " O&O Shutup 10" either. You are clearly quoting the wrong person.

So if you could stop quoting me, that would be great. I don't care about your input.

 

[Bernkastel]

Imaging thinking people are "Microsoft fanboys" because of... Windows, of all things

Only a deluded Linux maniac who lives alone in his little bubble thinking he is so much better than everyone else believes those exist.

Also, i never mentioned "tiny11" myself, i haven't even ever used it. I have also never mentioned " O&O Shutup 10" either. You are clearly quoting the wrong person.

So if you could stop quoting me, that would be great. I don't care about your input.

I literally showed the video on how much Windows 11 spies on you and sends data. Windows is a spyware.

 

[falconhoof]

I literally showed the video on how much Windows 11 spies on you and sends data. Windows is a spyware.

Dude, you made your point (pages and pages ago), we get it, you don't like Windows. Move on. Further posts are not going to change minds.

Counter points have been made, and replying "Windows is a spyware" isn't winning that argument. I, like others have stated things like software I need to use to work is only on Windows. So best we can do is,
A: Not update to Win 11
B: Maintain good security through updates (of which Win 10 has many years of still), and doing best to remove and disable unwanted features.

That's the end of it. Linux cannot solve for applications/services that do not run on that OS, and until developers deploy for Linux we just have to make do with Windows. No fan boyism, just facts.

 

[nkarafo]

I literally showed the video on how much Windows 11 spies on you and sends data. Windows is a spyware.

I don't care dude, i don't use Windows 11!

 

[Soodanim]

Dude, you made your point (pages and pages ago), we get it, you don't like Windows. Move on. Further posts are not going to change minds.

Counter points have been made, and replying "Windows is a spyware" isn't winning that argument. I, like others have stated things like software I need to use to work is only on Windows. So best we can do is,
A: Not update to Win 11
B: Maintain good security through updates (of which Win 10 has many years of still), and doing best to remove and disable unwanted features.

That's the end of it. Linux cannot solve for applications/services that do not run on that OS, and until developers deploy for Linux we just have to make do with Windows. No fan boyism, just facts.

I don't care dude, i don't use Windows 11!

He's either not willing or not able to have a mature discussion. It doesn't matter which, the outcome is the same.