MaximumFlipFlop
Banned
What kind of comparison is this? RDR's horse physics make it a better game that GTA IV.
Doesn't make a whole lotta sense.
Grand Theft Auto IV has the best driving physics of any open-world game, ever
- Thread starter MrOogieBoogie
- Start date
What kind of comparison is this? RDR's horse physics make it a better game that GTA IV.
Doesn't make a whole lotta sense.
... Like I just said, what the fuck man? Way to grasp the argument.
But it's not a REALISTIC model as you are trying to argue, drawing parallels to your precious Forza and starting to comment on what's not realistic.
More realistic ≠ simulator nor realistic.
Driving in GTAIV is definitely my favorite of the various open world games. It's really, really good and fun just to drive around. I think Saints Row works really well for what it's going for (extremely arcadey like the rest of the game), but Sleeping Dogs? Horrible. The worst driving physics in an open world game I have ever personally played. Not sim enough to give you accuracy, not arcadey enough for precision. I never felt like I was properly in control of the car.
It makes sense if you consider these mechanics a large part of your enjoyment when it comes to open world games.
It makes sense if you consider these mechanics a large part of your enjoyment when it comes to open world games.
QUOTE]Say what you will about Sleeping Dogs. Driving is arcade style and the police chases are something out of a Michael Bay film. Thing is, it doesn't take itself too seriously so the flow of the game makes sense. It's thematically consistent throughout- ridiculous fights, free running, car explosions and firefights that all cater to flashy, aggressive playing.
[/QUOTE]
I NEVER got that feel while driving in SD, the driving is so easy, requires no effort, twitchy controls as it gets and the way the cops work in that game is laughable at best, one of the worst ways implemented into an open world game, almost as bas as Test drive unlimited 2.
When you are told to shoot the tyres it's the most anti climatic and disappointing thing I have seen as they try to make it look epic by having it slow mo and then you go and shoot the tyre and... the car literally jumps a little in the air and explodes, I expected this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbCgCXotkZ8, this is what you call EPIC and I never once saw a car do something like that in SD yet happens all the time in JC2.
Driving is boring and being in a super car or a normal car feels the same except from the better acceleration, never felt as epic as you make out or intense since its so easy to drive.
Because in IV there is a larger margin of error it feels a lot more intense and immerses you in, since the physics are so in depth you have to remember different things in order to successfully drive ( remember to break early, tyre lock, don't turn when going to fast). None of those are over the top either, I am able to make sharp turns when needed, corner at high speeds when needed and the E break does what it needs to well.
Yes IV doesn't do that roll but it's not made in the way that makes you think shooting tyres= epic roll.
[/QUOTE]
I NEVER got that feel while driving in SD, the driving is so easy, requires no effort, twitchy controls as it gets and the way the cops work in that game is laughable at best, one of the worst ways implemented into an open world game, almost as bas as Test drive unlimited 2.
When you are told to shoot the tyres it's the most anti climatic and disappointing thing I have seen as they try to make it look epic by having it slow mo and then you go and shoot the tyre and... the car literally jumps a little in the air and explodes, I expected this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbCgCXotkZ8, this is what you call EPIC and I never once saw a car do something like that in SD yet happens all the time in JC2.
Driving is boring and being in a super car or a normal car feels the same except from the better acceleration, never felt as epic as you make out or intense since its so easy to drive.
Because in IV there is a larger margin of error it feels a lot more intense and immerses you in, since the physics are so in depth you have to remember different things in order to successfully drive ( remember to break early, tyre lock, don't turn when going to fast). None of those are over the top either, I am able to make sharp turns when needed, corner at high speeds when needed and the E break does what it needs to well.
Yes IV doesn't do that roll but it's not made in the way that makes you think shooting tyres= epic roll.
X being more realistic than Y, doesn't mean X is striving for simulation, though.
Max Armstrong
Member
I agree with OP
nikos
Member
I'm currently playing through Sleeping Dogs and was thinking about how much I love the driving physics. I remember GTA IV's being pretty bad, and I really liked that game.
Sleeping Dogs' driving was awful in the beginning, with the camera shake, but it's probably the best in any of these types of sandbox games now, IMO. Its driving engine never becomes a nuisance or gets in the way for me.
Sleeping Dogs' driving was awful in the beginning, with the camera shake, but it's probably the best in any of these types of sandbox games now, IMO. Its driving engine never becomes a nuisance or gets in the way for me.
Doom fans= COD is simulation
COD= BF is simulation
BF= RO2 is simulation
RO2= arma is simulation
arma= VBS2 is simulation
Funny how it works.
Totally agree. I can't believe there's people thinking Sleeping Dogs had good driving physics, it's like every car has the same speed, the same braking distance, the same feel. It's terrible, really. Like, Burnout Paradise bad. Cars hovering above the ground with magical brakes and inexistent inertia.
GTAIV driving model is hard to master, unforgiving and absolutely rewarding. All things gamers despise nowadays *sighs*
GTAIV driving model is hard to master, unforgiving and absolutely rewarding. All things gamers despise nowadays *sighs*
GTAIV went for a more realistic model. Adding realism was certainly their goal and it seems to be a big reason why a lot of people like it, going by the comments here.
Never said they were trying to make the world's greatest driving simulator.
No, in Sleeping Dogs the cars do what you want them to do and you can do crazy shit and it's fun.
In GTA4 the car sometimes does what you want it too, and doing crazy shit is basically impossible because every car drives like you're drunk.
valkillmore
Member
But do gamers really despise hard to master, unforgiving yet absolutely rewarding gameplay experiences? I think you're whitewashing gamers unfairly. I think the problem doesn't exist within gamers, but game developers and to a lesser extent, publishers. Developers dumbing down their games in order to make them more palatable to non-gamers, with the intention to broaden the audience. What they don't realize is that only alienates their core audience. GTA4 sold plenty well for having 'difficult, unforgiving' controls.
No, cars in GTA IV does what you want all the time and are great to do stunts in.
The difference is you need to actually learn the cars.
dripdripsplash
Member
I loved the physics of the cars in GTA IV. I don't get the hate that some have for it. I'll choose it over San Andreas'/Sleeping Dogs car-physics any day.
Spring-Loaded
Member
The problem with GTAIV handling was the mission design never took that handling into account. People you were chasing/running from drove perfectly because of too much scripting, so shooting out their tires did jack most of the time. If your tires blew, you were fucked and had to start over.
When there's no rubber-banding, perfect/"impossible" A.I. handling or linear mission design, then the dynamism of the physics stops being so annoying. The physics-based driving actually makes everything, even small occurrences more exciting when you know every other driver, pedestrian, object or enemy will react to a given action in an expected, but not entirely predictable way. If you're car catches fire, you need to slow down to increase the chance of surviving diving out of it, but you also risk maybe being in the car when it explodes, and you have to account for how long you'll roll after jumping out, Etc.
When there's no rubber-banding, perfect/"impossible" A.I. handling or linear mission design, then the dynamism of the physics stops being so annoying. The physics-based driving actually makes everything, even small occurrences more exciting when you know every other driver, pedestrian, object or enemy will react to a given action in an expected, but not entirely predictable way. If you're car catches fire, you need to slow down to increase the chance of surviving diving out of it, but you also risk maybe being in the car when it explodes, and you have to account for how long you'll roll after jumping out, Etc.
You can say that about absolutely any driving game ever.
Treemonkeys
Member
Cars in GTA4 did what I wanted them too...love how people just blame their skill on the game, why games are being dumbed down 101. You can't even admit that it was hard for you to make them do what you wanted instead just make an absurd/extreme statement.
Yes, your point being?
Sorry, did you want the car to go from full speed to a standstill within 1 second? Did you want he car to make the 90 degree turn while going very fast?
Yea, darn you game...
Again cars are very controllable once you know how to control them, just because SD has super easy and very very simple physics doesn't mean all games should.
It's not about the car not responding to what you want, it is you not doing what is required for the car to do what you want ( as in if you want to make a certain turn, you can't just turn, you have to make sure you angle yourself properly and the speed is correct and you break effectively) May seem like a chore but is something you can do within 1 second of you deciding to turn and once you get used to how it all works, it's very natural in a way and doesn't seem as daunting.
You actually have a very good point. It's true however that GTA4 is often criticized by gamers for its driving physics and I always thought that was mainly because driving is hard to master in the game. However from this thread I get the idea that it's a roughly 50-50 situation with half of the gaffer loving the driving model and the other half hating it. So yeah, I might have overgeneralized the issue a little too much.
Dion Blaster
Member
Mayyyyybe the most realistic (?) but certainly not for the purpose of enjoyment in a video game. They actually took a step back from the GTA 3 games when it comes to driving enjoyment.
That's subjective. I think the driving was the best in the series, and it was quite fun just to toss the cars around.
Ploid 3.0
Member
Cars in gta4 are stubborn mules. Cars on SD are motorcycles.
QFT.
Its a legit complaint if you ask me.
The cars understeered. Understeer means the car has a balance problem and isn't doing what it ideally should be. The front is pushing out wide.
And because of the crappy, front-heavy weight distribution(causing the understeer), the rear end was super-light on top of it, making it skittish. This means that you could go from massive understeer to snap oversteer in a moment's notice. It also means that driving in a straight-line, any small little adjustment would often mean your rear end sliding around. To say they drive like boats is maybe a bit inaccurate. Its more that they all drive like trucks. All the weight at the front, none at the back.
To a lot of people that enjoy driving, and especially to people with experience playing racing sim-style games, these are negative, unwanted handling characteristics that aren't fun.
Most arcade games have extreme oversteer characteristics that are usually quite forgiving and controllable. Which is why they get away with it. GTAIV kind of doesn't really hit any sweet spot.
Of course its possible to become good at driving the cars in GTAIV. Some obviously have enjoyed mastering that challenge. But somebody equally could take a wheel off a car and learn to drive it and maybe get some satisfaction out of it. Just dont expect many people to agree it handles very well.
GlamFM
Banned
My biggest problem with the driving wasn't the physics (although I really don't like them so much), but the camera.
Always a little too low to see what's in front of you, always a little of center to the left and always to slow.
When taking a sharp turn I would see the side of my car and not what's in front of me - stupid.
Always a little too low to see what's in front of you, always a little of center to the left and always to slow.
When taking a sharp turn I would see the side of my car and not what's in front of me - stupid.
My fav part with GTA IV was the driving, since I wasn't too enamoured with the rest of the game.
I've started replaying TBOGT on PC (360 on my first playthrough) and I remembered why I prefer the driving model over other games. There's inertia. The cars actually feel like they have weight and you can't just e-brake around a corner. Normal cars have heaps of body roll and aren't well balanced. Performance cars actually feel substantially different but they still have that sense of inertia. It's not totally realistic but it's satisfying.
Other games feel cheap and unsatisfying, because you can cheese your way out of things. SR is the worst for this - the cars feel like they're made out of paper the way they can turn. Sleeping Dogs isn't that much better.
I do agree it needs some tweaking but I hope they don't dumb it down too much.
I've started replaying TBOGT on PC (360 on my first playthrough) and I remembered why I prefer the driving model over other games. There's inertia. The cars actually feel like they have weight and you can't just e-brake around a corner. Normal cars have heaps of body roll and aren't well balanced. Performance cars actually feel substantially different but they still have that sense of inertia. It's not totally realistic but it's satisfying.
Other games feel cheap and unsatisfying, because you can cheese your way out of things. SR is the worst for this - the cars feel like they're made out of paper the way they can turn. Sleeping Dogs isn't that much better.
I do agree it needs some tweaking but I hope they don't dumb it down too much.
The worst thing is this problem I have with driving on the PC version with the controller ( happened recently, did not happen before) were if I press the handbreak button while driving the camera does a 360 rotation making it ridiculously hard to control the car while the camera is moving around so much.
I never had a problem with the actual camera though, I am the type of person who moves the camera a lot so to me it was very nice.
As much of a detractor I am for GTA4, I did like the driving model. The camera, however, was annoying and so was the stupid implementation of the randomly fly out your windshield thing. I was able to at times slam head first at an incredibly fast speed and be fine, and other times not be moving very fast and fling out. When a police chase ended because of that...ugh.
Spring-Loaded
Member
You have to babysit the camera while driving. Since acceleration/break are on the triggers, it's not so bad. It definitely needs to be addressed in V though.
MrOogieBoogie
BioShock Infinite is like playing some homeless guy's vivid imagination
My issue with driving in the PC version using a controller was that whenever I would go into hood cam the speed of rotating the camera with the right stick would slow down dramatically, making it difficult to pan around to avoid other cars/pedestrians. Anyone experience anything like this?
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
jesus christ no
thesuperfunk
Member
Driver: San Francisco gets my vote ... it really suited all those old-school movie-based challenges!
I totally agree with it being too low, i usually manually keep it a bit higher up with the analog stick, but every time i have to hit the handbrake it's a problem.
I do like it being a bit slow on the horizontal front, though, as the games where the camera is always exactly snapped to the back of the car look odd to me, like the car is a sticker on the screen (think the gun in an FPS) or something.
fastford58
Member
Physics were good, not great, but the camera sucked.
I had a lot of fun with the cars in GTA4. Hopefully 5 uses a physics based system, but tweaks it out a bit more.
Once thing games need to stop is excessive body roll. You take a corner at 10mph and the whole car leans like it is on 10lb/inch coil springs. It's retarded.
I had a lot of fun with the cars in GTA4. Hopefully 5 uses a physics based system, but tweaks it out a bit more.
Once thing games need to stop is excessive body roll. You take a corner at 10mph and the whole car leans like it is on 10lb/inch coil springs. It's retarded.
diggmcbadass
Member
Mafia 2 had the best open world driving I've ever tried. I played gtaIV right after Mafia, and all the cars in gta felt like they were made of paper.
chemicals
Member
What he said.
I HATED the driving in GTA IV. Ruined the game for me. I preferred the arcadey driving of the PS2 games. You just can't slide around corners at high speeds or anything cool in GTA IV. I couldn't bring myself to beat 4 because of the changed driving. At least Saints Row games kept an arcadey feel to them this gen.
astroturfing
Member
very true. i can't even begin to understand opposing views.
for me Sleeping Dogs, Mafia II, Just Cause 2 etc don't even close to being as enjoyable and fun when it comes to just simply driving a vehicle. cars in GTAIV feel awesome.
for me Sleeping Dogs, Mafia II, Just Cause 2 etc don't even close to being as enjoyable and fun when it comes to just simply driving a vehicle. cars in GTAIV feel awesome.
I absolutely agree.
Nowhere near as enjoyable though and a million times more frustrating.
theDeeDubs
Member
I wouldn't describe the car handling as realistic or good in any way. The cars felt like hover boats with terrible suspension. The camera also sucked.
YouEnjoyMySelf
Banned
GTAIV has awesome driving, for what it is. Never played Sleeping Dogs, but from what I've seen the driving looks similar to SR3. Every car feels the same and it's like playing Cruisin' USA every time you get in a car.
Lion Heart
Banned
I like Sleeping dogs but in spite of the driving physics. I'd probably take the original Driver over SD in car handling.