2013 Major League Soccer |OT| Pick your side, it's time for War

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Amibguous Cad said:
How else to break a tie when you're in an elimination tournament?
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The best rule I've ever seen, used in a youth tournament I played in as a kid (though I don't remember the specific times, and they were deliberately short for scheduling reasons):

15 minutes ET
Still tied? Each team goes down to 10 men (or less if red cards).
15 minutes ET
Still tied? Down to 9 (or less if red cards)

Repeat until 7 on 7 (or less if red cards).

Goals get scored as field gets empty, but it's still actually soccer being played and team versus team instead of dumb 1 on 1 weirdness that is less about which is the better team and more about who has the better/luckier keeper.
 
That may be the worst idea ever.

1. You know how exhausted everyone looks after just 15 minutes ET right? Professional soccer players cover a lot more ground than little kids. They would be too tired to move after just 2-3 ETs. So the game would be stagnant and awful to watch, and there would be little chance of goals being scored, which would mean... more ETs?

2. Removing players after each ET would mean even more running for each player to attack / defend, making them even more tired than if it was 11 v 11. And it would get worse with each ET.

3. In your local crappy youth whatever, this may have led to attacking play because who cares, but in a situation that actually matters with trophies and money and jobs on the line, it will lead to the attacking players being subbed off first. Eventually it would be a bunch of defenders and defensive midfielders. All the Feilhaber and Fagundez types would be taken off as superfluous luxuries. Eventually maybe each team would keep one attacker, either a speed guy if he had any legs left (unlikely) or a Conor Casey type they could boot the ball up to and hope to get lucky. Exciting stuff.

Like I said regarding the away goals rule, in soccer the consequences are often the exact opposite of what is intended.
Did the golden goal lead to attacking soccer? All you have to do is score and you win, seems pretty obvious right? Teams clamped down on defense, to make sure they didn't give up the goal, and it was far more boring than playing for a fixed period of time.
 
Well, I also think that a game going into ET should grant each team an additional substitution, but that's neither here nor there. I definitely don't think any of these ETs should be golden goal either.

I don't think it necessarily leads to more attacking play, I just think that when the numbers get low enough, it doesn't matter if it leads to attacking play or not, it's just inevitable that a goal happens.

Anyway, maybe not perfect, but infinitely better than Penalties
 
penalty shootouts are not the ideal solution and I hate when games have to be resolved like that. But I don't see any valid alternatives.
 
I actually kinda like the going down a few men tactic for resolving overtime. I think I'd start with going to ten men to start the overtime, then go down by one every 10 minutes, instead of 15, but on the whole I think it works better than shootouts, NASL style or no.
 
Dartastic said:
A penalty kick is absolutely representative of what should have happened. Jack was on the attack, and he had an opportunity to make something happen as we had two players in position in the center of the field, one of whom was Valeri. Meanwhile, a Sounders player literally reached his arm out away from his body (and it could easily be interpreted as on purpose) to hit the ball with his hand and disrupt the play while he was in the penalty box. This screws up Jack's attack, and potentially screwed up a very legitimate scoring opportunity for the Timbers. A penalty kick is absolutely proportional if the disruption screwed up a legitimate scoring opportunity. Don't reach your arms out away from your body like that if you don't wanna get called for it, especially in the penalty box. It's that simple. It's a fair rule. If the same thing happened in reverse I would have said that my idiot Timbers player should have kept his damn arms down because it was absolutely his fault.
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Was the ball likely to produce a goal scoring opportunity as good as a penalty? If not, then the penalty is disproportional, and we're better off giving refs more leeway to call fouls in the box that do not warrant a penalty (and for that matter, allow for penalties called outside the box, like when someone pulls down an attacker when they're free in on the keeper).

Look, I'm not saying it was a bad penalty call. Obviously, by the rules of the game, that's what it is. I'm saying that we ought to overhaul the rules. If you could remove yourself from the partisanship from the moment, I think you'd see merit in the idea.
 
Amibguous Cad said:
Was the ball likely to produce a goal scoring opportunity as good as a penalty? If not, then the penalty is disproportional, and we're better off giving refs more leeway to call fouls in the box that do not warrant a penalty (and for that matter, allow for penalties called outside the box, like when someone pulls down an attacker when they're free in on the keeper).

Look, I'm not saying it was a bad penalty call. Obviously, by the rules of the game, that's what it is. I'm saying that we ought to overhaul the rules. If you could remove yourself from the partisanship from the moment, I think you'd see merit in the idea.
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That's the problem though; you can't tell if the opportunity will be as good as a penalty kick. That's why the rules are so harsh in the penalty box; it's because in those situations something can very well happen and you want to make sure that the rules are not broken in those areas by enforcing harsh penalties.

Completely outside of the partisanship, I still don't see merit in the idea. Referees, especially in MLS, make so many terrible calls that allowing leeway in basic Soccer rules is a terrible idea. I do believe in goal line technology though. A ball should not be able to bounce into the goal, bounce out, and have it not count.
 
Judderman said:
Houston-KC is about to start.

Anyone gonna watch the NASL Soccer Bowl tonight? (What a silly name, haha.)
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I'll probably check it out, thanks for the reminder. ESPN3 right?
I don't mind the name Soccer Bowl, I wouldn't want it in MLS but I think it works for NASL.
 
I was upset when I saw that the 2nd leg for the conference finals isn't for 2 weeks. But after that game, this FIFA break comes at a good time.
 
perfectchaos007 said:
Dynamo are in trouble. I don't see them pulling out a win in KC.
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SKC has had lots of problems at home this season, but you have to give them a slight edge at home. What I think helps them more is the fact that Houston really can't come to bunker or play "not to lose". That's what New England did and we overcame it and took it right at the end.
 
Sapong, Bunbury and Jacob Peterson have to be worst trio of forwards in the league. Terrible game. Combination of fatigue and two sides who just play physical when they face each other made for an ugly game. Vermes again with his perplexing lineup decisions. I would love to see the three guys I mentioned shown the door after the season. But that seems to be hoping for too much.
 
That game was very messy. Still hoping the Dynamo pull this out in KC. I have to say I'm also a bit worried about RSL. It should be epic though.
 
The NASL Soccer Bowl started 15 minutes ago, pretty good attendance from what I see.

Good to see Carlos Mendes again, even if he is wearing a Cosmos kit.
 
What an horrid game... just shit soccer. The NASL Soccer Bowl with Senna and the MLS rejects was far better.

I guess we'll see how Portland and RSL play tomorrow. If it's similar to this crap, we can blame MLS for not letting the teams rest and putting the first leg in the middle of next week. If they play a good game it will confirm that these two teams are not entertaining, and that pretty much the entire eastern conference is a joke.
 
I don't see how anyone can not call Vermes's approach (when he has the right personnel at the right positions) entertaining. SKC's games with Houston tend to get physical. But it is not representative of Vermes's general approach.
 
xbhaskarx said:
What an horrid game... just shit soccer. The NASL Soccer Bowl with Senna and the MLS rejects was far better.

I guess we'll see how Portland and RSL play tomorrow. If it's similar to this crap, we can blame MLS for not letting the teams rest and putting the first leg in the middle of next week. If they play a good game it will confirm that these two teams are not entertaining, and that pretty much the entire eastern conference is a joke.
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It's gonna be a pretty rough game, but it's not going to be nowhere what today's game was. Man. I'm stressing a bit about tomorrow.
 
Nesotenso said:
I don't see how anyone can not call Vermes's approach (when he has the right personnel at the right positions) entertaining. SKC's games with Houston tend to get physical. But it is not representative of Vermes's general approach.
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It's just so broken up and not very fluid because of all the fouling and physical play... and even when they are playing well they don't seem to score as many goals as you'd expect. Maybe I'm just a bad soccer fans but I enjoy goals...

Entertaining soccer is obviously subjective, but if I had to rank the teams I most enjoyed watching this year, it would be the five western playoff teams, Vancouver, and pretty much only New England from the east (Montreal and NY were okay at times).
 
See eastern fans, this is entertaining soccer, and on three days rest... any ten minute stretch from tonight is better than the entirety of that awfulness between Houston and SKC.

Admit that your conference is a joke or lose all credibility.
 
Yeah. This is going to be really, really hard to come back from. RSL just outplayed us tonight, plain and simple. We weren't playing our best and they took great advantage of it. Real good soccer from RSL.
 
OH FUCKING GOD THANK GOD WE NEEDED THAT SO BADLY

Post insane last second goal edit - a 3 goal deficit against RSL is pretty ridiculous to come back from. Borderline impossible, honestly. 2 goals? Doable, especially at home. Despite how well RSL played, we definitely weren't playing our best after they scored a couple goals. We were making bad passes, and making bad decisions. We'll see. It's going to be really difficult still, but WOW we needed that second goal.
 
What a game... the only disappointment is that we now have to wait two weeks for the second part.

Portland are pretty damn good at home, I definitely think it's possible that they make up the two goals. RSL looked a quite shaky in the second leg in Seattle last year didn't they? Three goals, that would be asking for too much.
 
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November 19th announcement is confirmed! Woohoo.
 
Well the league already lost Hans Backe... I look forward to the new and innovative perplexed angry/sad faces Sigi will make in future years.
 
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