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A Song of Ice and Fire -- **Unmarked Spoilers For All Books including ADWD**

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F

fanboi

Banned
ItAintEasyBeinCheesy. said:
Does he have enough free time on his hands with this and GOT?

I couldn't red much in the article.
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Jon.i said:
Shouldn't be a problem, other HBO actors have managed to do movies while filming shows. Especially because Game of Thrones doesn't take a lot of time per character so we should probably still see him a lot. (Peter Dinklage is doing X-Men at the moment for instance)
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Jon.i said:
Game of Thrones takes 10 months to prepare, but the filming itself is fairly limited. Charles Dance did all his season 2 scenes in two weeks. Even a more main character like Robb Stark should be able to shoot in 1-2 months, and another 1-2 for the movie. He'd have 8 months for promotion stuff if everything goes smoothly.
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lol from that Cinderella thread :D
 
W

Wh0 N0se

Member
SquiddyCracker said:
Yeah, it is not that subtle guys.

I'm looking at you, Stannis defenders.
Whenever I see someone loving Stannis in the non-book thread, I immediately assume they are book readers :p
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I dunno about Stannis, he was a bit of a badass in the Blackwater episode so I can see how some people like him. In the book he's a bit of a love him or hate him kind of character.

EDIT: And another one:
D.Lo said:
He might start to frey at the edges.
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This is what I was talking about ^
 
S

Shahadan

Member
Was re-reading AFFC for the past few days, I was surprised to see how many thing I thought happened before that book are actually...in that book alone :lol:
I think I've misjudged it the last time, while the Brienne and Sam chapters are still boring as fuck to me, the rest is captivating.

I'm starting again ADWD now, I don't expect the same effect.
 
B

badcrumble

Member
Shahadan said:
Was re-reading AFFC for the past few days, I was surprised to see how many thing I thought happened before that book are actually...in that book alone :lol:
I think I've misjudged it the last time, while the Brienne and Sam chapters are still boring as fuck to me, the rest is captivating.

I'm starting again ADWD now, I don't expect the same effect.
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AFFC really isn't that bad if you read all five books in a row, but I can understand how it was deeply upsetting to people who assumed that Dany and Tyrion were up to some super-exciting stuff that they weren't getting to see, instead of fucking around having repetitive thoughts.

AFFC is a good book, IMO; it's ADWD that has far more chapters that are straight-up duds. But ADWD is also, when you cut out a bunch of the Tyrion/Dany chaff, a pretty solid narrative. The bigger problem with books 4/5, aside from all those dud chapters in ADWD, is that we didn't get the actual climax, since it got moved to TWOW.
 
N

Noema

Member
I'm halfway through ADWD. Can't wait till I'm done with it so I can finally sift through this thread with a nice cup of coffee.
 
C

CassSept

Member
It's a good read though if you have some time to spare. When I finished the series a year ago, almost to a day, I've waded through the entire thread and learned tons about the series, tons upon tons of stuff I would have never picked up on.
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
The talk about primogeniture and lines of succession in the GoT thread got me thinking about (potentially silly) hypothetical situations.

What if Cersei remarried while still being queen regent, and had a son? Let's say she married Willas Tyrell or whatever, like Tywin wanted, and had a son. Would that son be in line for the throne? I'd think not, since he wouldn't be of the Baratheon line. I guess he would be the heir to Casterly Rock, or Highgarden, or... both? And would that make Willas some sort of Prince Consort, or he'd just remain the heir to Highgarden?

Of course that's not going to happen, Cersei would staunchly refuse to remarry (and Tywin's no longer there to bully her into that), and Maggy the Frog's prophecy stated that she'd have 3 children anyway. Just a funny thing to think about.

I can't remember if Cersei was still regent as of ADwD. That walk of shame surely stripped her of the title, and Kevan was Hand of the King and possibly Tommen' regent, I forgot. But then Kevan got murdered, so I wonder who's the regent and/or Hand now. lol. I need to re-read ADwD some time.

Also, who the hell is Casterly Rock's heir now? Cersei? Tywin and Kevan are dead, Cersei is kind of disgraced and busy in King's Landing (being regent or not, she's still the Queen Mother I guess). Lancel took a religious oath. Kevan might have other sons or nephews, though.
 
B

blainethemono

Member
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Customs#cite_note-Radwd44.7B.7B.7B3.7D.7D.7D-11

Noble titles (e.g. Lord of a certain place) and lands are passed on within families; knighthood is not inherited but is conferred on individuals independently due to merit, not birth. In the Great Houses, where elder siblings inherit a significant title and lands, small holdings and keeps may be granted to their younger brothers, who hold their lands as bannermen[11]. Variations may arise, particularly in relation to the place of daughters: though by law a daughter should inherit before her uncle or cousin[12], a male relative may stake a claim and be judged a better choice to be heir[13]. A lord may lay out specific terms for inheritance or pass over their offspring in his will. It invites legal wrangling after their death, and potentially violence during it, but it has happened. Lord Tywin Lannister is rather infamous for refusing to ever acknowledge his son Tyrion as his heir, despite the letter of the law saying the Rock should be his or for example, if his heir is a daughter without a husband, he might specify that she must wed by a certain time or the inheritance will pass to a cousin.[14]
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T

The Anti-Monitor

Banned
Probably Cersei again. Only person who would be able to tell her to pack it and go back to Casterly Rock is dead. And she's gonna be uppity as fuck now that she has an undead Gregor.
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Yeah, I guess it depends on the outcome of that trial by combat.

So let me recall: before Kevan died, he was Regent, and Mace Tyrell was the Hand?
 
T

The Anti-Monitor

Banned
Morrigan Targaryen said:
Yeah, I guess it depends on the outcome of that trial by combat.

So let me recall: before Kevan died, he was Regent, and Mace Tyrell was the Hand?
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Yeah.

And I really doubt the duel will end in any way but UnGregor winning. No point in creating such a character otherwise. Maybe that's why we don't know who he's gonna fight yet.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Morrigan Targaryen said:
That's what I thought, thanks. So I wonder who will be regent now. Mace Tyrell? xD
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Cersei, since she's the mother of the king and his closest (grown) relative. Which is why Varys killed Kevan: so she could rule again. Based on the painfully short amount of information on Kevan's regency it sounds like he was ruling effectively. He brought the Tyrells into the fold, including giving Mace the Handship (a wise move considering Mace is a powerful idiot and easily placated) while recognizing Tarley as the true threat/brains. And it sounded like he was quickly planning on dealing with Aegon.

Cersei...who knows. I hold out hope that she is a changed woman. From what we saw in the epilogue she seems like a caged house cat now, no longer an untamed lion. A smarter Cersei could throw a wrench in Varys' plan and effectively deal with Aegon on the field.

Or it could be all a ruse, and she'll return with the vengeance.
 
D

devilhawk

Member
Morrigan Targaryen said:
Also, who the hell is Casterly Rock's heir now? Cersei? Tywin and Kevan are dead, Cersei is kind of disgraced and busy in King's Landing (being regent or not, she's still the Queen Mother I guess). Lancel took a religious oath. Kevan might have other sons or nephews, though.
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Well going through them:

Tywin's sister Gemma and her Frey husband now hold Riverrun.

Kevan has one other son Martyn (killed in the show, not in the books.) Martyn was exchanged for Robett Glover (who is the heir of Deepwood Motte, ally of Stannis, and was at White Harbor with Davos, Manderly, and Wex). Martyn is a possibility.

Tyrek Lannister, son of Tywin's other brother, was a squire to Robert and has disappeared during the time of the King's Landing riot. He would be the other possibility.

Of course, Tyrion of Jaime would be the most likely if either are pardoned of their crimes and responsibilities respectively.

Cersei is it right now. If guilty, and the fact that her children are bastards, I would guess Martyn is the heir.
 
C

Conor 419

Banned
GUYS STOP TALKING ABOUT INHERITANCE, HAVE YOU MISSED THE POINT OF THE SERIES?

----

As an aside, I am preparing an obituary for my only King; the King in the North, whose name is STARK. Robb and Catelyn get way way way too much shit from (stupid) people, and so I'm going to prepare some nice words for their passing.
 
R

Reyne

Member
Actually, who becomes regent now really depends on who is able to seize power. For instance, Robert named his hand, Ned, as Lord Regent and Protector of the Realm, not Cersei. Had Ned followed Renly's advice, he would have remained regent. Instead, Cersei, who had power, named herself Queen Regent and tossed ol Ned into the dungeons.
I am not so sure there are actually too many Lannister men loyal immediately to Cersei anymore, and besides, the keep is crawling with Tyrell men. Mace Tyrell could reasonably seize the keep and declare himself Lord Regent as it is in his and his family's best interest to do so.
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
I'm re-reading the epilogue. Kevan is thinking that Cersei can never rule again after the walk of shame. He planned on returning her to Casterly Rock:

“Whatever Cersei may have done, she is still a daughter of the Rock, of mine own blood. I will not let her die a traitor’s death, but I have made sure to draw her fangs. All her guards have been dismissed and replaced with my own men. In place of her former ladies-in-waiting, she will henceforth be attended by a septa and three novices selected by the High Septon. She is to have no further voice in the governance of the realm, nor in Tommen’s education. I mean to return her to Casterly Rock after the trial and see that she remains there. Let that suffice.”
The rest he left unsaid. Cersei was soiled goods now, her power at an end. Every baker’s boy and beggar in the city had seen her in her shame and every tart and tanner from Flea Bottom to Pisswater Bend had gazed upon her nakedness, their eager eyes crawling over her breasts and belly and woman’s parts. No queen could expect to rule again after that. In gold and silk and emeralds Cersei had been a queen, the next thing to a goddess; naked, she was only human, an aging woman with stretch marks on her belly and teats that had begun to sag … as the shrews in the crowds had been glad to point out to their husbands and lovers. Better to live shamed than die proud, Ser Kevan told himself. “My niece will make no further mischief,” he promised Mace Tyrell. “You have my word on that, my lord.”
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So obviously she isn't meant to be the regent again... Of course, Kevan is now dead, thanks to Varys, so his plans are foiled... but despite his death, he had a point: even if Cersei wins her trial, nobody respects her anymore. Or maybe it's just Kevan being chauvinistic, lol... but no doubt he's right in assessing how people will see her. This might prove problematic for Cersei if she attempts to rule again.

Reyne said:
Actually, who becomes regent now really depends on who is able to seize power. For instance, Robert named his hand, Ned, as Lord Regent and Protector of the Realm, not Cersei. Had Ned followed Renly's advice, he would have remained regent. Instead, Cersei, who had power, named herself Queen Regent and tossed ol Ned into the dungeons.
I am not so sure there are actually too many Lannister men loyal immediately to Cersei anymore, and besides, the keep is crawling with Tyrell men. Mace Tyrell could reasonably seize the keep and declare himself Lord Regent as it is in his and his family's best interest to do so.
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Good point. It depends on the outcome of the trial and what Cersei and/or Mace Tyrell do after that, I guess.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
devilhawk said:
Well going through them:

Tywin's sister Gemma and her Frey husband now hold Riverrun.

Kevan has one other son Martyn (killed in the show, not in the books.) Martyn was exchanged for Robett Glover (who is the heir of Deepwood Motte, ally of Stannis, and was at White Harbor with Davos, Manderly, and Wex). Martyn is a possibility.

Tyrek Lannister, son of Tywin's other brother, was a squire to Robert and has disappeared during the time of the King's Landing riot. He would be the other possibility.

Of course, Tyrion of Jaime would be the most likely if either are pardoned of their crimes and responsibilities respectively.

Cersei is it right now. If guilty, and the fact that her children are bastards, I would guess Martyn is the heir.
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Tyrek's disappearance reeks of Varys meddling to me; he was also in charge of finding him btw. Once Lancel and Martyn are out of the way (perhaps while coming to King's Landing to claim their father's body), Tyrek would be very close to being heir, and could appear out of nowhere.

Also Robett Glover is more of a North man than Stannis ally; Stannis is merely a means to an end for him (getting Rickon back). His wife has sent troops to Winterfell to fight for Stannis, which goes into the whole northern conspiracy thing we've discussed before (about the North being poised to retake Winterfell).
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Minus_Me said:
Did we ever get one of those museum type exhibits based on the show?
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Nah, only Toronto. I was lucky enough to have seen it, since I happened to be in Toronto for an unrelated reason during the time the exhibit was displayed, though. It's pretty cool for a free exhibit but nothing mindblowing. I did have a bitchin' picture of me on the Iron throne taken, too.
 
M

Minus_Me

Member
Morrigan Targaryen said:
Nah, only Toronto. I was lucky enough to have seen it, since I happened to be in Toronto for an unrelated reason during the time the exhibit was displayed, though. It's pretty cool for a free exhibit but nothing mindblowing. I did have a bitchin' picture of me on the Iron throne taken, too.
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That makes me slightly happier, but I'd love a picture on the Iron Throne.
 
I

Ikael

Member
The Anti-Monitor said:
Yeah.

And I really doubt the duel will end in any way but UnGregor winning. No point in creating such a character otherwise. Maybe that's why we don't know who he's gonna fight yet.
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UnGregor VS the Hound representing (his newfounded) faith

The younger brother will kill the elder, thus confirming the prophecy: she will be dead because of the Valonqar, albeit not in the way she thought, kekekeke

Not to mention that such an scenario will be far more difficult and thus, interesting to deal for the brand new Targaryen boy. Aegon VS Cersei? A cakewalk. Aegon VS the cunning new Supreme Septon? Ooooh boy.
 
D

devilhawk

Member
PhoenixPause said:
Tyrek's disappearance reeks of Varys meddling to me; he was also in charge of finding him btw. Once Lancel and Martyn are out of the way (perhaps while coming to King's Landing to claim their father's body), Tyrek would be very close to being heir, and could appear out of nowhere.

Also Robett Glover is more of a North man than Stannis ally; Stannis is merely a means to an end for him (getting Rickon back). His wife has sent troops to Winterfell to fight for Stannis, which goes into the whole northern conspiracy thing we've discussed before (about the North being poised to retake Winterfell).
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Well sure, the Glovers are northerners. Stannis was also the reason they even hold their seat still. His father's whereabouts are unknown, but Galbart is possibly with Howland. I don't think being part of a north retaking and a Stannis ally is mutually exclusive. Maybe going full northern conspiracy it is though.
 
C

Conor 419

Banned
Rumour has it that

"Bear island knows no King but The King in the North, whose name is STARK" is actually a direct reference to Jon being named Robb's heir to Winterfell, and that the Northmen are using Stannis as a means to place him in power.
 
L

LegendofJoe

Member
I'm okay with whatever happens in the North as long as Rickon survives. If Grrm pulls out some bs death for him I'll be done with the series. Bran is doomed to a shitty life, Jon will probaby never find happiness, and Arya is fucked in the head at this point. That leaves only Sansa and Rickon, and they both better have some kind of happy resolution. There's only so much torture I can take before it becomes too much.
 
C

Conor 419

Banned
I wouldn't put the eggs in the Rickon basket, the kid's going to be wilder than Brandon and Lyanna combined, and maybe not in a good way.

Sansa is widely considered the best hope for the North.
 
D

Dresden

Member
Sansa victory, bro.

She'll marry Aegon, then when he dies, she'll marry Jon, then when he dies, she'll marry Dany, now Dan after an unfortunate accident involving a pentagram and a candlestick in Asshai.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
I forgot Lancel swore a holy vow and joined the Warrior's Sons, thus giving up his claim. Which does make Martyn the heir.

Devan is not a member of the main Lannister line (Tytos->Tywin->Kevan), so he's behind Martyn and Lionel; dunno if he'd be behind Tywin and Willem Frey too.
 
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