Inkvoterad
Member
Lol, this thread is proper example of what a bunch of whiny babies "meat eaters" can be.
Inb4 "spot teh vegan xddd" i do eat meat, mostly.
Inb4 "spot teh vegan xddd" i do eat meat, mostly.
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About 84% of Vegetarians and Vegans give up on the diet and return to meat.
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So classic that someone already made that joke in this very thread. Across GAF, it probably measures in the hundreds. Nice.
Even if plants somehow felt the level of experience sentient animals do without a central nervous system, it would still result in less plant death to not eat meat. Much of the world's crops goes to feeding livestock, and it is a massive energy-conversion loss. More efficient to just eat the crops.
It's just the nature of animals to kill, it's just the nature of animals to rape, it's just the nature of animals to steal, etc. Appeals to nature are a weak foundation for a belief.
Professor Beef
Banned
this pleases me
Maybe you should stop raping people.
Saucycarpdog
Member
I've always wondered something, what are vegan's/non-meat eaters opinion on eating insects? I know some vegans hate eating meat because of how the animals are raised and treated but what if it's meat from an incredibly low life-form?
I have no problem with eating insects as long as it's from an environmentally sustainable source. Same deal with most fish.
BlackGoku03
Member
So do Vegan and Vegetarian groups do as much for other stuff too? Care to share?
And I do donate to hungry children.
I actually hadn't heard that one before, heh.
In a group of ~6 million people (USA vegetarians/vegans) you are bound to find people who may only be proactive about animal rights/liberation, and others who are involved in a myriad of ethical causes. I think it is rational to claim that our treatment of "food" animals is one of the most horrendous things about the human race right now. We all agree that something like child poverty, domestic abuse, etc. is horrible, but those are things that most of us don't directly contribute to. Many of us however give money multiple times a day in direct support of cruelty in the name of convenience. As a moral issue it is more related to ending slavery than ending disease.
The easy reply to your point that you do give is why don't you give more? Any dollar outside of shelter/food/transportation could be given to someone more in need. It's an endless rabbit hole unless you plan to give your life to running a Salvation Army center or something. We all eventually compromise moral consistency for convenience, and giving up unnecessary foods isn't really inconvenient for the modern world.
CornBurrito
Member
But you don't donate all your extra income. Why is entertaining yourself with video games more important than feeding hungry children?
Messofanego
Banned
because many people believe that something tasting good isnt a good enough reason to torture and kill it.
most people just rationalize it because it the norm. most people think its wrong to beat a dog for amusement, but dont see anything wrong with eating a burger. its called cognitive dissonance.
Slackbladder
Member
This has always been my position. Reduce meat intake instead of trying to convince people to give it up entirely.
But woe anyone who thinks fish is an alternative. There is nowhere near enough fish in the sea to make up the difference.
Almost certainly bugs are the future; bugs and larvae and worms etc. Ground up into a paste what's the problem?
Or maybe lab produced meat! I do see the day when meat consumption falls to a very low part of everyday consumption. But there needs to be a good replacement.
But woe anyone who thinks fish is an alternative. There is nowhere near enough fish in the sea to make up the difference.
Almost certainly bugs are the future; bugs and larvae and worms etc. Ground up into a paste what's the problem?
Or maybe lab produced meat! I do see the day when meat consumption falls to a very low part of everyday consumption. But there needs to be a good replacement.
BibiMaghoo
Member
What we need is a huge gas processing plant that only deals with the methane from Cow excrement. That way we can eat meat, reduce green house emissions, and also provide natural gas to each nation as minimal cost for power and heating. See, someone should employ my ideas. And pay me. Lots.
TheSpoiler
Member
Some of these comparisons are hilarious, from both sides really.
Either you do or don't, no need to start getting all huffy once someone from the other side interjects their opinions or lifestyle.
I have some vegan friends, and they are completely tolerable, if not amazing people. They don't enforce their dietary routes on me, and I'm able to eat meat around them. Likewise, I've met some pretty ridiculous people who've slathered me in the BBQ sauce that is vitriol for even mentioning what I eat.
I bet it's real fun being vegan/vegetarian and having some dude come up and be like "SO YO UDONT EAT MET WHY HERE FACTS EAT RED" all damn day.
Either you do or don't, no need to start getting all huffy once someone from the other side interjects their opinions or lifestyle.
I have some vegan friends, and they are completely tolerable, if not amazing people. They don't enforce their dietary routes on me, and I'm able to eat meat around them. Likewise, I've met some pretty ridiculous people who've slathered me in the BBQ sauce that is vitriol for even mentioning what I eat.
I bet it's real fun being vegan/vegetarian and having some dude come up and be like "SO YO UDONT EAT MET WHY HERE FACTS EAT RED" all damn day.
Why ground them up? You can just fry some mealworms and they'll get crunchy.
boiled goose
good with gravy
The whole idea behind the diet is fallacious. Sure we should eat less meat.
Sure the meat industry could be better.
Sure eating some mammals COULD be immoral.
Why the fuck are you not eating oysters?
It's an emotional choice, not a rational one.
Sure the meat industry could be better.
Sure eating some mammals COULD be immoral.
Why the fuck are you not eating oysters?
It's an emotional choice, not a rational one.
Always-honest
Banned
Horse tastes great...
Anyway, i wouldn't become a vegetarian but i can imagine eating even less meat than i do now.
I do agree that the meat industry is horrible as it is right now.
Some of the posts in here are downright embarrassing.
For anyone curious about veganism, here are two talks worth listening to:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0VrZPBskpg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4HJcq8qHAY
The idea of veganism is pretty simple: consuming animal products inherently leads to animal suffering which we can easily avoid by avoiding those animal products. If you agree that it's wrong to hurt animals unnecessarily, you agree with veganism.
For anyone curious about veganism, here are two talks worth listening to:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0VrZPBskpg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4HJcq8qHAY
The idea of veganism is pretty simple: consuming animal products inherently leads to animal suffering which we can easily avoid by avoiding those animal products. If you agree that it's wrong to hurt animals unnecessarily, you agree with veganism.
Super_Cobra
Member
You really can't beat a medium rare steak and bacon. Come at me blocked arteries. Shave off those miserable years as an old person.
markofhavoc
Member
My wife was a vegetarian since she was a kid because her mom was. She started eating meat when we started traveling because she felt she was missing out on culture, now she loves it.
uncelestial
Member
For all the shit that gets thrown at vegetarians "telling everybody they're vegetarian," let me tell you: you meat eaters are about 100x as loud and fucking obnoxious. Your shit is everywhere, I have to look at it constantly, I have to deal with the jokes constantly.
And trying to criticize vegetarianism as some sort of self-serving enterprise when it is more sustainable, ethical, and healthy, is bizarro-world ironic. Especially since that criticism is coming from people whose diet a) is the #1 contributor to greenhouse gas emissions, and b) is rarely made possible in a humane way that offers any quality of life for the livestock. I honestly feel like the "judgemental vegetarian" trope is really just people's conscious telling them maybe they could be making better choices.
^ This, by the way, is the furthest I have ever gone on trying to convince anyone to consider changing their diet, while meat eaters have been dismissive assholes about mine, constantly. "Oh you're veg? Sucks for you," "how can you stand it?" "can you just make do with a salad and some bread -- I really want to eat here" "lol bacon" or some other generic and nonsensical joke about hippies.
Then there are people who act bewildered but absolutely know why someone would make that choice. "Why are you vegetarian? Ethical reasons, environmental reasons, or health reasons?" Like I have to choose just one of these? At least they're being nice, but their tension and unease is really weird. Like, I don't care. I'm not asking for this conversation to happen.
And trying to criticize vegetarianism as some sort of self-serving enterprise when it is more sustainable, ethical, and healthy, is bizarro-world ironic. Especially since that criticism is coming from people whose diet a) is the #1 contributor to greenhouse gas emissions, and b) is rarely made possible in a humane way that offers any quality of life for the livestock. I honestly feel like the "judgemental vegetarian" trope is really just people's conscious telling them maybe they could be making better choices.
^ This, by the way, is the furthest I have ever gone on trying to convince anyone to consider changing their diet, while meat eaters have been dismissive assholes about mine, constantly. "Oh you're veg? Sucks for you," "how can you stand it?" "can you just make do with a salad and some bread -- I really want to eat here" "lol bacon" or some other generic and nonsensical joke about hippies.
Then there are people who act bewildered but absolutely know why someone would make that choice. "Why are you vegetarian? Ethical reasons, environmental reasons, or health reasons?" Like I have to choose just one of these? At least they're being nice, but their tension and unease is really weird. Like, I don't care. I'm not asking for this conversation to happen.
internetwolf
Banned
I don't have rules for what I eat, but almost half of my meals are vegan, I love making vegan dishes and there are plenty of awesome vegan restaurants around me. Vegan cuisine to me is just another option.
I have 2 vegan family members and they have been eating a vegan diet for as long as I can remember.
I have 2 vegan family members and they have been eating a vegan diet for as long as I can remember.
CarpeDeezNutz
Member
I tried a vegan hotdog once tasted like lies would taste if you could eat them.
SprachBrooks
Member
I think being predominantly vegetarian is good for you, it's been proven so. But predominantly does not mean exclusively: meat is important for your diet and frankly, it offers a whole new dynamic to flavour and taste in food.
RumblingRosco
Member
Great post. The sad thing to me is that GAF is generally so progressive, but the hive-mind collectively shits on anyone that supports being a vegetarian/vegan. I'm not a vegetarian or vegan, but I often choose meatless/animal product-free foods in many cases (I'll probably just be fully veg/vegan some day)... and man, it's impressive how angry people get even when I tell them that in real life.
Professor Beef
Banned
we're all a bit gassy tbh, can't blame greenhouse gasses on us
I don't even live in a green house, I think its more white than anything
I don't even live in a green house, I think its more white than anything
I'm assuming this are stats for the US?
Would be interesting to see the same stats for Europe, in comparison. I'd say there's a lot more vegan/vegetarian people in the EU, but that's pure speculation.
I am surprised so many people drop out of it. I am a meat lover and cannot survive without daily intake of meat, but I would imagine if I try to commit to something I'd give it my best shot to stick to it. Does that mean that the people just can't live without the taste of meat, because they lack the proteins and nutrition from meat or because of the lack of veggie options?
Would be interesting to see the same stats for Europe, in comparison. I'd say there's a lot more vegan/vegetarian people in the EU, but that's pure speculation.
I am surprised so many people drop out of it. I am a meat lover and cannot survive without daily intake of meat, but I would imagine if I try to commit to something I'd give it my best shot to stick to it. Does that mean that the people just can't live without the taste of meat, because they lack the proteins and nutrition from meat or because of the lack of veggie options?
You wonder why meat eaters are defensive when you trot out shit like this. I've no problem with vegans/vegetarians etc. Eat what you like but don't start telling me your diet is superior to mine.
The study does mention it is about the US.
Still though things like this can't be accurate. I have been vegetarian most of my life and vegan for just over the last 10 years and I've never had some official government survey asking me whether I am or not. Sure I live in Australia, but I'd imagine the US is the same. Don't see the US government having some official data on the population of who eats meat and who doesn't.
If supposedly this survey does have truth to it, the people were never real vegetarians/vegans to begin with. Just choosing it as they thought it cool for whatever reason and then stopped when they thought it wasn't cool anymore.
EDIT: if anyone even bothered to look at the article this is in reference to it is from December 14 2014. So it or something similar to it has probably been posted to the forum before.
ambar_hitman
Member
I concur with the study. After 11 months of being vegetarian, I gave up and ate chicken today. I AM BACK.
uncelestial
Member
Being veg is objectively better for you, animals, and the environment, so deal with it. I'm not going to not say things that are true just to avoid making meat eaters feel "defensive." If you can't deal with hearing the reasons people choose to be veg in the first place, maybe you *do* have more of a problem with it than you claim.
eot
Banned
I'm assuming this are stats for the US?
Would be interesting to see the same stats for Europe, in comparison. I'd say there's a lot more vegan/vegetarian people in the EU, but that's pure speculation.
I am surprised so many people drop out of it. I am a meat lover and cannot survive without daily intake of meat, but I would imagine if I try to commit to something I'd give it my best shot to stick to it. Does that mean that the people just can't live without the taste of meat, because they lack the proteins and nutrition from meat or because of the lack of veggie options?
I doubt wanting to eat meat is the problem for most people, the social pressure is a much bigger factor (it can cause inconvenience for other people). For vegans it depends on where you live and how strict you are about it, but to really follow that diet you need to pay close attention to what you eat. A lot of things aren't clearly labelled, there might not be more than a handful vegan restaurant options (again, depends), and the social pressure is even worse. As a vegetarian you can still eat most things, it's pretty easy to not eat meat, but so many things contain dairy products. Over time that might wear you down unless you have a deep conviction.
I don't give two shits about how cattle are treated if they end in my stomach in the end.
boiled goose
good with gravy
You offer an interesting perspective about meat eaters being annoying. I agree there.
Then though, you go into being veg is intrinsically bhealthier. I dont buy it. Sure eating too much meat is probably bad for both your health and the environment. But on a personal health basis skipping meat altogether is worse than eating an occasional chicken breast or fish? Doubt it.
Insane Metal
Member
Well, duh.
TheOctodad
Member
This is kind of sad to me.
Insulin resistance and diabetes. Boom.
Cheesecakebobby
Banned
I usually stay away from the health argument. A balanced diet can be veg or otherwise. It is completely irrelevant to the ethical issue.
As others have said however, those who become veg just for health reasons are likely to fail. If your heart (mind) isn't in it, you won't get far.
As others have said however, those who become veg just for health reasons are likely to fail. If your heart (mind) isn't in it, you won't get far.
Harry Stewart
Member
I empathize with vegetarians and vegans more after quitting drinking for six months last year. It wasn't ruining my life or health based, just a personal choice and man, that brings out the worst in people. Once you make a choice to go against the grain of what society and people around you do, you're instantly labelled as "preachy" or "arrogant" when most of the time you're just trying to get a fucking word in, explain your choices, and not have people spew ignorant and short-sided bullshit about your supposed intentions. I don't know that many vegetarians/vegans, but something tells me that most aren't as annoying as people's projections of them are.
Barrel Cannon
Member
The people I know who have been vegetarian since birth haven't changed. I guess it was just the way they are raised. One of my aunts won't even eat veggie burgers because the idea of something tasting like an animal disturbs her.
Razorback
Member
I agree. I've never been lectured by vegetarians but all the vegetarians I know have to put up with a ton of shit from meat-eaters. This thread is a perfect example of that.
The ethical argument to me is the strongest.
I eat meat and I know it's wrong. I don't try to justify it.
Unfortunately changing would bring about a lot of inconvenience and I'm too lazy to do it.
I really hope artificial meat becomes a reality soon.
You believe it's true. I believe its bullshit.
Believe what you want, eat what you want. I have zero problems with you or your beliefs and wouldn't try and convince you of mine either.
Dreams-Visions
Member
They should have never left.
CornBurrito
Member
Not all veggie burgers attempt to imitate meat though.
You don't even mention taste, protein and what other nonsense people come up with as an argument. It's simply a thing that lands in your stomach.
It's a pretty sad and telling statement.
CornBurrito
Member
As long as you are fine with me eating dogs bred for food, your fine.
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