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Ace Attorney 5: Dual Destinies |OT| Rated M For Objectionable Content

Salsa

Member
looking back I also think the anime cutscenes (specially with the dub) were also kind of a downer. the cheese worked fine with the series until it's spelled out for you, literally.

also not a big fan of the art style there, sometimes. Case 2 had a terrific intro tho (mostly cause there were almost no human characters in it), and the 3D effect on them was nice.
 

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
I'm torn on this. Streamlining it means you aren't stuck pixel hunting or trying to present a single random piece of evidence, and it's better for new players, but it makes the exploration scenes seem even more limited than before and you rarely ever get the satisfaction from cracking a particular tough cross-examination.

I think they made a good change with the addition of the notes and the cursor changing when you hover over something you already examined. They just need to let you examine everything again, as I really missed a lot of the flavor text those segments had. Then for the people who dislike them/when you get stuck in rut the notes are still there.
 

Salsa

Member
well, on the flipside the streamlining means the pace is probably better than ever, so there's that

very little downtime/boring filler, cases fly by yet they're about as long as ever, right? with some exceptions

felt specially good after Apollo and shit like Turnabout Serenade *shudders*
 

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
well, on the flipside the streamlining means the pace is probably better than ever, so there's that

very little downtime/boring filler, cases fly by yet they're about as long as ever, right? with some exceptions

felt specially good after Apollo and shit like Turnabout Serenade *shudders*

Yeah, that's true. And althrough Turnabout Serenade was awful with that damn song video, I found it a little weird how frequently this used and talked about 'videos' but it was a still image. I guess they weren't having any of that shit.
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
I think they made a good change with the addition of the notes and the cursor changing when you hover over something you already examined. They just need to let you examine everything again, as I really missed a lot of the flavor text those segments had. Then for the people who dislike them/when you get stuck in rut the notes are still there.

Yup, being able to investigate everything again would be great.

I don't know if difficulty settings would facilitate this in terms of the hints given, but I also feel, like others, that they need to tone down the obvious hints that made it seem like the game was playing itself at times. Leave that stuff for the new note system during investigations and the consulting for the courtroom segments.
 

Jintor

Member
Investigating everything was never a pit stop imho, and would be even less now that you have reminder notes and 'you've already looked at this' indicators.
 

Moonlight

Banned
Yeah, they went way too overboard. The notes feature was really great, but that was all it needed. The guided tour after that wasn't really necessary.
 
I don't necessarily mind the streamlined investigating. The super obvious hints everyone gives you got to be a bit much though, particularly in the last case.

What bugged me the most was the ridiculous amount of typos. Letters and entire words missing at times. This entry is probably the most egregious offender in the series in this regard, which is a shame because the rest of the presentation is top notch.

I really, really hope this game did well enough for Capcom to localize whatever the future has in store for the series.
 

ZeroX03

Banned
I really, really hope this game did well enough for Capcom to localize whatever the future has in store for the series.

Dual Destinies was the 10th best selling game on Amazon Japan this year. The future in Japan looks stable. I assume the new engine was what a lot of the gruntwork went into, future 3DS titles should be easier/cheaper to produce. Praying for good Western sales.

Wish they'd released Layton VS. Wright first though. Felt it could've helped bring some of the Layton fanbase over.
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
Dual Destinies was the 10th best selling game on Amazon Japan this year. The future in Japan looks stable. I assume the new engine was what a lot of the gruntwork went into, future 3DS titles should be easier/cheaper to produce. Praying for good Western sales.

It's why he specifically mentioned localization. We already knew the game was a big success in Japan when it was at the top of its Media Create chart on its opening week so it's obvious that the series will continue in Japan. The big question is always whether it did well enough in NA and Europe for it to be worth continuing or if we'll never see an AA game localized again after PLvsAA.
 

Lusankya

Member
Wish they'd released Layton VS. Wright first though. Felt it could've helped bring some of the Layton fanbase over.

It can still bring Layton fans over in a few months. And that should be enough, unless Capcom have to decide on a localization right now.
 
Just bought it, completed 1st case and started DLC. Really enjoying new look so far, looks fabulous, perfect transition from 2D to 3D. Can't say much about story cause I just started, only that M rating was totaly justified :) Blood, blood everywhere.
 
I really, really hope this game did well enough for Capcom to localize whatever the future has in store for the series.

It's in the top 20 best sellers ever on the UK eShop as of a few days ago (suck it monster hunter, which was in 20th beforehand).And it's been in the top 5 of the best sellers every day since it launched (that's what, almost 2 months now?)

The only retail level games left above it were ones that were given away for free in promotions (Mario 3D Land has been given out twice, Animal crossing and Layton were popular choices for the buy 3/get a download free here. Monster hunter was also given away in two different promotions).

It's outsold the digital versions of Fire Emblem, Luigis Mansion, link between worlds and goddam pokemon.

If capcom expected it to do any better, they seriously need to fire the person who does the estimates.

I do however think it is helped massively by the fact that we haven't had a proper ace attorney game (Sorry, Investigations) for over 5 years. I doubt an Ace Attorney 6 within the next year after the double whammy of AA5 and PL VS AA will be able to do nearly as well.
 

BlackJace

Member
Streamlined investigation is fine folks. Don't tell me that some of the pixels that needed to be pinpointed in the previous games's investigation weren't migraine-inducing at times.
 

Jintor

Member
Streamlined investigation is fine folks. Don't tell me that some of the pixels that needed to be pinpointed in the previous games's investigation weren't migraine-inducing at times.

I can't remember if the game used to have a 'this thing is interactable' cursor, but it does now, and between that and the 'you've already seen this' cursor I think pixel-hunting would be moot.
 

BlackJace

Member
I can't remember if the game used to have a 'this thing is interactable' cursor, but it does now, and between that and the 'you've already seen this' cursor I think pixel-hunting would be moot.

Nah, the old games didn't have a "you've already seen it cursor". Lord knows how many times I've clicked on something thinking it was a new discovery, only to see the same dialogue :/
 

ZeroX03

Banned
isnt it just MT framework?

Sorry, I meant things more like the new models, backgrounds and the developer learning them, considering the series was 2D for so long (and still reusing GBA assets up until AA4). For future titles they wouldn't have to make a new Phoenix or Apollo model, they'd only need to make case-specific assets and would be well practiced at it.
 
I can't remember if the game used to have a 'this thing is interactable' cursor, but it does now, and between that and the 'you've already seen this' cursor I think pixel-hunting would be moot.

In the previous games the "Examine" prompt wouldn't show up unless the cursor was over an object that had specific dialog, but you could still hypothetically select anything and get "nope nothing here".
 

Gvaz

Banned
Just finished the game. Case 5 wasn't nearly as what the fuck as everyone made it out to be.

Did anyone else notice any bugs with the Text Log? Parts of it simply showed up blank, and the post-game popup was completely blank with no text.
 

Ragus

Banned
15 minutes in. Athena seems like a very interesting character. That flashback was quite tense.

And god damn, that moment
when the doors opens, and HE comes in, shouting OBJECTION.

I simply came. Welcome my old friend.
 

daydream

Banned
Did anyone else notice any bugs with the Text Log? Parts of it simply showed up blank, and the post-game popup was completely blank with no text.

I think it happens during cross-examination since you can always relisten to all the parts of the testimony. I may be wrong, though.
 
Text Log has had all sorts of issues with me. It's had missing text in a number of different sections of the game and once outright crashed the game for me.

It's an awesome idea but I just have no idea when it ended up so buggy. Hopefully those issues are ironed out by the next game.
 

Nachos

Member
So, it's my first time posting here, but it's reassuring to be some folks from PersonaGAF here, too. Been a fan since the first game on DS, but I'd figured I'd post here, since the community thread seems a little less active.

Also, I agree with what everyone's saying. The investigations benefit from being better at communicating what you've already examined and giving better feedback for your actions, but I would've preferred having things to examine. Cross-examining did go too far, though, and hopefully they'll dial it back and make the hint system better at distributing nudges in the right direction to the player, if they need them.

Also, is anyone using Miiverse? I've never really drawn anything in my life, but the way everything's organized made me think this could be a good way to practice, at least. I think I might be making decent progress, too.

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Link
 
been playing this very slowly, just finished ep 2, great characters/trial and ending but the case and story itself was very weak, im sure the rest of the episodes are much better though.
 

NetMapel

Guilty White Male Mods Gave Me This Tag
Athena and Fulbright's banter in Case 3 is great.

"IN JUSTICE WE TRUST !"

Is that your secret codes between each others ?

omg this game is so good, hahaha
 

jaxword

Member
been playing this very slowly, just finished ep 2, great characters/trial and ending but the case and story itself was very weak, im sure the rest of the episodes are much better though.

Case 2 was weak, but it introduced a great successor to Gumshoe, Fulbright.

IN JUSTICE WE TRUST!
 

FluxWaveZ

Member
I actually don't think I ever noticed those details, or at least consciously acknowledged them, aside from the Gavin -> Apollo one that was pointed out earlier. That's awesome.
 

Jintor

Member
The nice thing about that apollo one is
that it's mirrored

also kinda funny about the von karma arm grip animation
since Franny has no reason to do it but imitates it anyway, but Von Karma is actually grabbing his old wound...
 

Salsa

Member
I miss Franziska

they really could have gone nuts with characters coming back for pure fan service and honestly.. I would have been ok with a tiny bit more of that
 
I miss Franziska

they really could have gone nuts with characters coming back for pure fan service and honestly.. I would have been ok with a tiny bit more of that

hell, i miss phoenix wright! :) ...

completed the third case, & i'm very disappointed in the series' overall change in tone from mania to melodrama. i loved the whacked/frantic nature of the original trilogy. yeah, it could occasionally get a bit syrupy, but the primary emphasis was always on sheer lunacy. this game (so far, anyway), not so much. i'm finding most of the characters to be very weak (the detective, the prosecutor, & the mind-bogglingly vapid case 3 client in particular), the humor to be much more orchestrated shtick than out-of-left-field crazed, & the cases themselves, tho sometimes cleverly staged, still very easy to solve...

just not for me, & i will refrain from saying any more. other than, yeah, a bit more fan service, & a few more familiar faces, would've been greatly appreciated...

ps: how could i forget - the music. it almost redefines 'bland'. the arrangements are just so lifeless. what've they done?...
 
Alright, just finished the game, including the DLC case (which is PHENOMENAL), and so I thought I'd post my final thoughts.

Overall, I think AA5 is really an incredible entry into the series. I think they found the right formula of how to keep the main series fresh after the missteps of AA4. (Which is still a good game, but this is on another level.) I think this, along with AAI2, shows that the series has a bright future, even if Takumi doesn't return. I think Eshiro has taken up the mantle quite successfully, and I'm very excited to see where he takes the series going forward. As for pros and cons...

Pros
-The rotating leads. This kept the narrative moving at a great pace, and finally gave Apollo a chance to really shine and an opportunity to redeem Phoenix, all while successfully introducing Athena, who is a great addition to the cast.

-The supporting characters. Overall, the newly introduced characters were very well done. The majority of the new characters were well fleshed out, and quite memorable. Even in cases where certain aspects of the story itself was not as compelling, the cast still shone through. The returning characters also fit into the story well, though some of them could of been utilized a bit more.

-The presentation. The new graphic engine is absolutely stunning. It perfectly fits the tone of the series, and still captured the "spark" that past entries had. The music was also incredible. Both these elements are hallmarks of the series, so it was great to see them get the care and attention they deserve.

-The story. Despite a few slow parts, the narrative overall was very well done. Especially toward the end, the way that the story kept building and intensifying was outstanding. I think a bit part of this was a much more focused Phoenix and Apollo, who both seemed lost in AA4. Also, strong new major characters like Athena and Simon fit into the storyline quite seamlessly. Also, this game probably features the strongest "filler" case in the entire series. (The DLC case, which is A+++.)

-The unique gameplay systems. I was very happy to see that each lead attorney had their special ability present in the game. While the Mood Matrix was the most prominent, the Perceive system and Psyche-Lock system were still very enjoyable. In regards to the Mood Matrix, when I first heard of it, I wasn't that enthused about it, but after playing the game, I think it was handled quite well.

Cons
-The quality control. As has been pointed out numerous times, this game features quite a lot of typos. The script itself was truly excellent, but the lack of polish was glaringly obvious. This needs to be rectified in future installments.

-The anime scenes. While the idea is a good one, the execution of the anime scenes in AA5 left a bit to be desired. The art direction did not quite live up to the rest of the game, presentation wise. In the future, if they intend to keep this features, I hope they raise the quality level.

-The voice acting. Very hit-or-miss. Some fit perfectly, while others seemed uninspired or dreadfully miscast. Unfortunately this spoiled the emotional impact of some scenes, which is a real shame.

-The difficulty level. Overall, this game is way too easy. Almost every single contradiction is spelled out for you, or you are given endless chances. (ie. The Mood Matrix) While in hindsight, it doesn't really affect my enjoyment of the game, they could definitely learn to ease up on the hand holding. (I suspect this was done because they want AA5 to be a good jumping in point for new players.)

-Capcom USA. I feel that they really dropped the ball when it came to this game. I know it has been discussed to death, but the lack of physical release, and the removal of the Trivial DLC is still pretty shameful. Their excuses to why they did these things simply do not hold water. The truth is they were cutting costs and time, and it showed in the final product. (Thankfully, the actually game itself was able to shine through this mismanagement.) Also, why on Earth was this rated M? I don't get it at all.

---

In closing, AA5 is sensational. A MUST play for any AA fan. I feel that the future of this series is very bright. I just hope Capcom USA also realizes this, and puts more effort into supporting the loyal fanbase, and delivering the whole product.

Edit: Whoops, didn't mean to double post. I meant to edit my last one. Sorry.
 
Just finished Case 2. Loving the game to be honest, way better than AA2 (my only frame of comparison). One thing that still sucks is the totally insular and context based internal logic of the game. Like, I found
L'Belle's product in the Forbidden Chamber. C'mon guy. C'mon.
 

graywords

Member
Just finished Case 2. Loving the game to be honest, way better than AA2 (my only frame of comparison). One thing that still sucks is the totally insular and context based internal logic of the game. Like, I found
L'Belle's product in the Forbidden Chamber. C'mon guy. C'mon.

Wasn't that more or less
a red herring, though? I thought the lotion bottle or whatever only got in there because Filch stole it — it proved HE was in the Forbidden Chamber, but didn't end up proving anything about L'Belle.
 

Griss

Member
Not hugely interested in ranking the games, but I do feel like there's a clear drop off in quality after the original trilogy. The games are still enjoyable, sure, and the way they translated the brilliant sprite animations to 3D was fantastic.

But you play AA games for the stories, characters and cases. AA4 and 5 delivered on the characters, mostly. But the overarching stories and the cases themselves have been getting more and more absurd and poorly told. I don't mean absurd in a paranormal way - that wacky stuff has always been there and I love it. I mean absurd in a 'lack of logic' way. A 'lack of people acting like actual humans with logic and sound motivation' way.

The Gavinners case in AA4 was the weakest case I'd played until the Tenma Taro case in AA5. More importantly the overarching stories of both games were terrible.
Kristoph
was a terrible villain for AA4.
The Shadow
was incredibly underwhelming, and the writers obviously put getting to have a massive twist over a conclusion that would be emotionally satisfying.

One huge problem to me is that they keep trying to intimately involve the lawyers in the actual cases themselves. That doesn't work well, imo. Sure, have a friend or coworker either get killed or need to be defended, but when they're always on the scene of the crime as it happens the line between being a lawyer, detective or victim/participant becomes far too blurred.

Eh, that's a pretty terrible explanation of why I feel the quality has declined, I'm tired. Still like the games a lot. Really do. And
feel free to kill me
but I never liked Maya so I have enjoyed having new sidekicks.

EDIT: I'm also completely allergic to anime. Especially terrible anime. They need to get rid of that post-haste. In fact, that kind of gets to what I don't like about the cases anymore. Instead of being similar to real cases, and then made ridiculous, the cases themselves seem like frameworks for anime drama. I don't know, there's been a subtle shift in tone that's hard to describe.
 

Ragus

Banned
I don't get the first case:

Why was Junie in the court in the first place? Was she just a spectator? Where did Ted disarm the bomb? Against whom was the original case before the explosion?
 
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