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[Panajev2001a]

Start with demos, then patches/upgrades, etc... (fine for a game like an MMORPG) then whole mini-games then whole games.

I think it could be a nice test-ground for a next-generation delivery model like STEAM that Sony/SCE might implement for PlayStation 3.

Hopefully this is good news for a possible PSP Linux development kit, maybe available to those who have Playstation 2 Linux already.

I like the news about the detachable battery: very good indeed, no need for a PSP SP... just get another regular battery or buy the ultra large battery when they release it.

 

[kaching]

Yeah - it'd be really nice if this openness to accessing a variety of file types on memstick means we'll eventually see PSP SDK Lite for hobbyist devs which can load on a pc, generate PSP sanctioned executables that can be transferred to memstick and played directly.

 

[The Faceless Master]

Maybe Sandisk games will be cheaper

LOL

 

[Ninja Scooter]

i wonder if someone could comeup with an "HDloader" type program that could utilize this feature to save battery life?

 

[kevm3]

hopefully the psp will be easy enough to program to where we can have a big amateur game creation scene... it'll be so much easier to distribute games if they're downloadable.

 

[Brofist]

Good news, except for the fact that <1 GB Memory Stick sounds almost useless now, and throw in a possible 2nd battery.... hehe damn I'm gonna be broke.

 

[FreakyFink]

Attention Bay Area residents...

It appears Sony is looking for feedback/discussion on PSP multiplayer, and, dare I speculate, a possible PSP-to-PS# connection.

Sony is conducting two focus groups next Thursday evening, which I'm guessing will be held in Foster City.

Check out Craigslist for full details.

 

[Defensor]

Attention Bay Area residents...

It appears Sony is looking for feedback/discussion on PSP multiplayer, and, dare I speculate, a possible PSP-to-PS# connection.

Sony is conducting two focus groups next Thursday evening, which I'm guessing will be held in Foster City.

Check out Craigslist for full details.

Wario GO! and report back.

 

[Wario64]

Why does it say San Francisco instead of Foster City?

I think I'll have to pass, unless they have playable PSP units...

 

[Panajev2001a]

hopefully the psp will be easy enough to program to where we can have a big amateur game creation scene... it'll be so much easier to distribute games if they're downloadable.

PSP uses a very OpenGL like API: there should be a few more things, but it won't be as hard as Playstation 2 development.

 

[seismologist]

The only thing that sucks are the reports that PSP gets hot while your playing it.
Crative Zen is like that. The thing gets so hot you have to put it down. It seems like the technology isn't ready to be stuffed in a handheld.

 

[jiggle]

Attention Bay Area residents...

It appears Sony is looking for feedback/discussion on PSP multiplayer, and, dare I speculate, a possible PSP-to-PS# connection.

Sony is conducting two focus groups next Thursday evening, which I'm guessing will be held in Foster City.

Check out Craigslist for full details.

Tempted to try signing up. What do you do in one of these focus group thing? Just test and discuss?

 

[Defensor]

jiggle GO! and report back.

 

[Lord Error]

The only thing that sucks are the reports that PSP gets hot while your playing it.

It gets slightly warm, and by no means hot, according to impressions at IGN.

 

[FreakyFink]

Tempted to try signing up. What do you do in one of these focus group thing? Just test and discuss?

Generally focus groups will not get hands-on with a product. The product idea and features will be expressed and perhaps a demo unit shown. It's not out of the question, though. When you email in your application, ask if you'll get to try out any products.

And yes, you'll have a group discussion of about 8-12 people led my a moderator. It's very likely a two-way mirror will be installed and the whole session videotaped.

 

[mj1108]

Attention Bay Area residents...

It appears Sony is looking for feedback/discussion on PSP multiplayer, and, dare I speculate, a possible PSP-to-PS# connection.

Sony is conducting two focus groups next Thursday evening, which I'm guessing will be held in Foster City.

Check out Craigslist for full details.

Ah! I wanna go! Anyone confirm that this is for Sony/PSP as the original ad says nothing of it.

 

[Wario64]

Ah! I wanna go! Anyone confirm that this is for Sony/PSP as the original ad says nothing of it.

They usually try to avoid stating the purpose of the focus group directly when they post those ads up. You have to look for the keywords. Pretty sure it has to do with PSP just reading from the requirements to partcipate. Cell phone users, handheld gaming...very likely it's PSP

 

[Scrow]

http://gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=4950

Software delays could push back the launch of the PlayStation Portable

The first suggestion that Sony may be forced to delay the launch of PSP has come from Sony Computer Entertainment network systems boss Izumi Kawanishi, who told a Japanese publication that the schedule depends on game publishers.

Speaking in an interview with Impress Watch AV, Kawanishi said that it is still possible that the console will be released this year in Japan, but that this depends on whether game publishers will have software ready for launch.

This is the first time that anyone within Sony has voiced any doubt over the launch schedule for the unit, although several analysts and media commentators have expressed concern over the launch timetable, especially in light of the system's public debut at the Tokyo Game Show last month.

Much of the software shown there appeared to be very incomplete, with some analysts pegging most the titles on display at around 60 to 75 per cent completion - suggesting that they may not be ready until next year, thus missing the planned Q4 2004 launch of the device.

Kawanishi also confirmed that development of the PlayStation Portable began directly before the system was announced at E3 2003, meaning that the console has been developed in only 18 months - an ambitious timetable which would go some way towards explaining why developers are having difficulty preparing titles in time for launch.

In the same interview, Kawanishi explained a little more of the planned functionality for the device - which will appear as an external drive when connected to a PC with a USB cable, allowing users to drag and drop MP3 or ATRAC3 music files and JPEG images directly onto it.

 

[lexi]

This is interesting coming from Kawanishi, instead of some analyst, it defintley raises the question as to whether the PSP may launch early 2005 in Japan.

I wonder where the analysts are pulling the November date from? It get's interesting from here on in, that's for sure.

 

[mrklaw]

Additional batteries will be available for purchase separately for the PSP, which uses a detachable battery rather than an internal battery. Kawanishi says that SCE decided to go with a detachable battery since the user can simply swap them out when the battery gets low

Thats new to me. How does that sit with also selling an external battery pack? A second normal battery, combined with the instant resume mode would surely make the external pack redundant?

 

[Panajev2001a]

Thats new to me. How does that sit with also selling an external battery pack? A second normal battery, combined with the instant resume mode would surely make the external pack redundant?

Hey, they might have changed their mind: I think that having a detachable battery is a very smart idea.

Makes purchasing PSP on day 1 more future proof (that and the upgradeable firmware).

 

[Fafalada]

In terms of chipset performance, pretty much. There's still some differences though, both good and bad. PSP is only capable of about half the polygon output PS2 is and it's far less programmable, but it also has plenty of hardwired effects that'll make things much simpler and a better RAM layout.

The programmability argument while true is kinda irellevant. There's nothing this generation that is as programmable as PS2 on geometry side, and a portable chipset designed for market with much lower budgets and shorter development cycles shouldn't try to compete with that either. It pains me to say it (I'm very attached to programmability ) but fixed function T&L was the right choice there.
Performance wise I also don't think things are quite as clear cut but I can't really go into detail there for a bunch of reasons.

Last I checked they still had a programmable VFPU

VFPU more or less fixes everything that I wasn't too happy with in VU0, although it unfortunately had to revert one thing that I liked(but we all knew that would happen).

 

[DrLazy]

Ultimately, it expects PS2-level sales—tens of millions of customers. All of whom, of course, will be buying games at about 40 bucks a pop, a substantial cut of which goes to Sony. (One advantage of the PSP for Sony—though not its customers—is that to play a Need for Speed or Hot Shots Golf head-to-head game with your friend, each of you must purchase the software.)

Link to Story

 

[Grubdog]

Ultimately, it expects PS2-level sales—tens of millions of customers.

hahahaha, people aren't THAT stupid

 

[Panajev2001a]

hahahaha, people aren't THAT stupid

Which is why they will buy even more PSP's thn that .

 

[JackFrost2012]

Which is why they will buy even more PSP's thn that .

True; with multiple PSPs, you can swap them out every 90 minutes.

 

[jarrod]

I'll ask again but audio wise how does PSP compare to PS2 and DS to N64? Everyone seems to gloss over it?

 

[Mrbob]

True; with multiple PSPs, you can swap them out every 90 minutes.

Don't spread FUD!!!!

You get two hours out of every PSP! POTATOWNED.

And 40 dollar portable game prices?


*flashbacks to GBA launch*

No thanks.

 

[Panajev2001a]

I'll ask again but audio wise how does PSP compare to PS2 and DS to N64? Even seems to gloss over it?

It takes each of them and spanks them on the butt-cheecks until they become red.

 

[jarrod]

Now you're getting me hot Pana!

 

[Panajev2001a]

VFPU more or less fixes everything that I wasn't too happy with in VU0, although it unfortunately had to revert one thing that I liked(but we all knew that would happen).

Basically it works only in macro-mode (things you did not like: you wanted micro-mode ), but has more micro-memory or something ?

VU0's problems were IMHO: lack of direct GIF interface, not enough Micro Memory and Data Memory (4 KB each).

Did you have other complaints on VU0 or did I hit them all already ?

 

[Deku Tree]

That $40 a game quote sounds more like a guestimate by MSNBC than an announcement.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Now you're getting me hot Pana!

Well, the VME is a dedicated and modern programmable-DSP while PlayStation 2's SPU2 uhm... well that is the only case in which 2x PSOne seems to be true: developers seem not to like SPU2 too much.

 

[jarrod]

Well, the VME is a dedicated and modern programmable-DSP while PlayStation 2's SPU2 uhm... well that is the only case in which 2x PSOne seems to be true: developers seem not to like SPU2 too much.

Good to know, and it's nice to see someone really make audio a prime concern in a handheld for change... speaking of which, have any insight how DS compares to N64? OT I know, but I don't care.... I'm the Handheld Emporer!

 

[jarrod]

$40 is about what I expect.... you can't have DC/PS2 level budgets and charge GBA prices. I'd like to see Sony institute a pricing range though (like Nintendo is for DS)... $39 for GT4 mobile sounds fair but and maybe $29 for something like Lumines?

 

[Fafalada]

Did you have other complaints on VU0 or did I hit them all already?

Well not so much a complaint, as good as the VU instruction set was for its time(better then any other vector SIMD at the time really), it wasn't perfect. VFPUs might as well be though - it even goes beyond what I wanted in many ways.

Did you have other complaints on VU0 or did I hit them all already?

Simply put - memory traffic handling hampers the useability of VU0(primarily output, but input was less then ideal for general purpose vector unit also) - it's not GIF interface I was looking for, a generic output path would be more usefull, though ideally you'd want VU0 to work like an SPU in regards to that.
Suffice to say that VFPU addresses these issues better.

And yeah, other I would have still liked the option of micro-mode, though I always knew that would be a bit excessive to expect.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Well neither the Nintendo 64 nor the Nintendo DS have any Audio DSP it seems.

In the N64 you had the main CPU with some help from the RSP (http://n64.icequake.net/mirror/www.white-tower.demon.co.uk/n64/) which handled 3D graphics T&L and some audio routines in parallel with the CPU: the cost for each audio channel on the CPU was not a trivial one.

On the DS audio seems to be processed by the 67 MHz ARM7 GBA CPU together with Touch Screen functionality and WiFi. Optimized audio engines might be allowed by Nintendo to steal some cycles off the ARM9 CPU, but currently I think all is done by the ARM7.

The most important thing is quality of music: space on the ROM whether taken by Instruments (for the MIDI engine) or by Redbook stereo audio/or a proprietary Nintendo format is one of the main limiting factor to quality.

On GBA thew cost of keweping all the graphics and sounds and music compressed and decompress all on the fly was non trivial and the balancing job that needed to be done between graphics and audio processing (the same CPU was working on both graphics and sound, while on the DS this is separate) ended up in cases to be quite evident.

Still, plenty of games even on GBA are able to do good graphics with good quality music.

The N64 CPU was fast in clock-rate, but memory latency (and the lack of effective ways to hide latencies) killed performance everywhere.

The DS gains points there IMHO.

Even in games that push the limits in terms of WiFi and Touch Screen utilization (which might also include graphical processing, that 2D engine is not going to sit idle all the time) what we might see is less complex music (less channels being available), but the quality of each of those channels should still be high.

After latency is taken into account, the Nintendo DS and the Nintendo 64 seem to be pretty much on equal footing in terms of performance (minus bi-linear filtering which was a hack on the Nintendo 64 btw... 3 samples instead of 4) in graphics, audio, etc... processing.

 

[sonycowboy]

$40 is about what I expect.... you can't have DC/PS2 level budgets and charge GBA prices. I'd like to see Sony institute a pricing range though (like Nintendo is for DS)... $39 for GT4 mobile sounds fair but and maybe $29 for something like Lumines?

Trust the free market. (that's how it will turn out)

 

[sonycowboy]

BTW,

Aren't most of the DS games being listed for $39.99 and in fact alot are being listed at $49.99

Damn PSP

http://www.ebgames.com/ebx/groups/nintendo_ds/

 

[Mrbob]

Uhhh I thought DS games were going to be $29.99?

 

[Deku Tree]

Uhhh I thought DS games were going to be $29.99?

That's what Nintendo Announced.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Simply put - memory traffic handling hampers the useability of VU0(primarily output, but input was less then ideal for general purpose vector unit also) - it's not GIF interface I was looking for, a generic output path would be more usefull, though ideally you'd want VU0 to work like an SPU in regards to that.
Suffice to say that VFPU addresses these issues better.

And yeah, other I would have still liked the option of micro-mode, though I always knew that would be a bit excessive to expect.

The I/O issues you mention seems to me fault of the low memory for data and instructions which was given to the VU0: plus, but also due to the differences between VIF0 and VIF1... IIRC there are some VIF codes missing in VIF0.

You could DMA in and out of the VIF0, but there was no dual buffering support: that was only for VU1.

On VU1, to solve problems I double buffer and I split internally each buffer in two, so that each buffer has its Input and Output section.

You could not do that with VU0.

VFPU being in MAcro-Mode basically should not need a VIF... I wonder how I/O is handled for VFPU and how much more Memory does it have.

 

[Vashu]

EBgames = ripoff?

 

[jarrod]

Uhhh I thought DS games were going to be $29.99?

Nintendo suggested pricing ranges, at least for Japan so far. Smaller scale projects like One-Line Puzzle will be cheaper than standard DS games (3800 yen vs 4800 yen). Otherwise pricing should be in line with GBA games (which are also 4800 yen in Japan).

 

[jarrod]

Thanks Pana.

 

[Link316]

Uhhh I thought DS games were going to be $29.99?

no, Nintendo just said $29.99's the lower limit

 

[jarrod]

no, Nintendo just said $29.99's the lower limit

Actually they said "as low as $29.99", not that $29.99 was the lowest threshhold. I'm expecting 3rd party games at $34.99 for launch and 1st party at $29.99 probably. Maybe some smaller scale 3rd party games (like Ping Pals) will be $29.99 too.

 

[sonycowboy]

Actually they said "as low as $29.99", not that $29.99 was the lowest threshhold. I'm expecting 3rd party games at $34.99 for launch and 1st party at $29.99 probably. Maybe some smaller scale 3rd party games (like Ping Pals) will be $29.99 too.

1 month out and retailers have absolutely no idea what the software will retail for? I don't think so. The $49.99 have to be placeholders, but I'd thinking that we'll see most front-line games @ $39.99.

 

[Che]

True; with multiple PSPs, you can swap them out every 90 minutes.

:lol

 

[jarrod]

1 month out and retailers have absolutely no idea what the software will retail for? I don't think so. The $49.99 have to be placeholders, but I'd thinking that we'll see most front-line games @ $39.99.

Well, I'm hearing $34.99 fwiw. $39.99 seems excessive, though it's also possible (shades of GBA launch). I still expect Nintendo games (and small scale 3rd party stuff) at $29.99 probably though.