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Amazon's 'The Man in the High Castle' S2 |OT| Alt-Right History

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M

metalslimer

Member
Second season was great. This show is interesting in that it has some really well done villains with really infuriating at times good guys. I did feel weird that show seems at times to be manipulating you into feeling bad for Nazis. Smith is by far the most interesting character on the show.

At times the show did seem to be falling into filler but I guess everything was important setup for the end.
 
M

Makonero

Member
metalslimer said:
Second season was great. This show is interesting in that it has some really well done villains with really infuriating at times good guys. I did feel weird that show seems at times to be manipulating you into feeling bad for Nazis. Smith is by far the most interesting character on the show.

At times the show did seem to be falling into filler but I guess everything was important setup for the end.
Click to expand...

It's not even good guys or bad guys at this point. They are all varying shades of gray (with the nazis and Kido as very dark shades of gray). It's shocking to me that they've managed to make the whole show so morally ambiguous.

The moment where the resistance is about to use Thomas's illness against Smith, knowing the kid will die, proves how morally gray they are. Juliana is the only one who stays true to her moral compass, as The Man points out in the final episode.
 
Moff

Moff

Member
metalslimer said:
Second season was great. This show is interesting in that it has some really well done villains with really infuriating at times good guys. I did feel weird that show seems at times to be manipulating you into feeling bad for Nazis. Smith is by far the most interesting character on the show.

At times the show did seem to be falling into filler but I guess everything was important setup for the end.
Click to expand...

Smith is so likeable
, I was almost certain they'd path a way for Smith to join the resistance after Heusmann took over, but then he just had him expose and arrest him. I am really excited to see where this is going now.
 
S

SpaceWolf

Banned
Moff said:
Smith is so likeable
, I was almost certain they'd path a way for Smith to join the resistance after Heusmann took over, but then he just had him expose and arrest him. I am really excited to see where this is going now.
Click to expand...

Smith losing his son is definitely going to have a significant impact on his journey going forward.
 
Z

ZZMitch

Member
Been watching this show with my mom over winter brake. She is intrigued by the show and we are still just on episode 8 of the first season. Excited to see how she likes Season 2 since it is a big step up in my opinion.
 
Moff

Moff

Member
SpaceWolf said:
Smith losing his son is definitely going to have a significant impact on his journey going forward.
Click to expand...
9vfoqeH.gif
 
S

scitek

Member
This show is one of the best I've seen at building and selling its setting. It's so well produced.

And holy shit, it has some of the best villains I've seen in a while. The guy playing Smith is killing it. Overall, season 2 was leaps and bounds better than the first. Hope the new showrunner isn't a bad sign.
 
X

Xando

Member
SpaceWolf said:
Smith losing his son is definitely going to have a significant impact on his journey going forward.
Click to expand...
It'll be interesting if they kill him next season because after how last season ended Smith is going to be going into the nazi leadership next season
 
S

SpaceWolf

Banned
B-Dubs said:
No joke, it's going to be fascinating to watch his character next season given how this one ended.
Click to expand...

Not only going forward, in going back as well I'd be really intrigued to hear more about Smith's backstory in Season 3 beyond the few hints we've been given and to really learn what ultimately led him to fully embrace the Nazi lifestyle. I
was genuinely shocked to hear Smith had served so vigorously in the United States Military and that he was on the side of the Americans right up to the bombing of Washington.
Did he trade in all his values purely to ensure the safety of his loved ones? I'd love to know more!

Xando said:
It'll be interesting if they kill him next season because after how last season ended Smith is going to be going into the nazi leadership next season
Click to expand...

Yeah, I thought it was really interesting that by the end of this season...
Smith managed to reach a professional high (receiving the highest honour by speaking for the Nazi regime beside Himmler in Berlin, before an audience of millions) whilst at the same time having to suffer a very personal low (his son cheerfully walking to his death). I got the feeling that while speaking on that podium, Smith's heart really wasn't in it. Watching his story continue in Season 3 is going to be fascinating.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
SpaceWolf said:
Not only going forward, in going back as well I'd be really intrigued to hear more about Smith's backstory in Season 3 beyond the few hints we've been given and to really learn what ultimately led him to fully embrace the Nazi lifestyle. I
was genuinely shocked to hear Smith had served so vigorously in the United States Military and that he was on the side of the Americans right up to the bombing of Washington.
Did he trade in all his values purely to ensure the safety of his loved ones? I'd love to know more!
Click to expand...

No doubt. Right now he's easily the most interesting character on the show.
 
Moff

Moff

Member
Rufus Sewell is obviously the star of this show, no doubt.
I think it's inevitable that he ends up on the good side, if he reforms the Nazis or joins the rebellion, who knows. but I think the latter is hard now after they eliminated the obvious way with Heusmann and Heydrich who wanted him dead.
 
T

The Silver

Member
Julianna reminds me of how I can't stand those type of super idealistic moral high ground characters who stand in the way of reality and the people who try to get shit done.
I had forgotten a lot of S1 but remembering how much they warned her about Joe and everything I was almost hoping she would get got in episode 10. The fact that it all "worked out" doesn't change how stupid her decisions are in the moment, it makes me resent it all the more actually
. To mention Code Geass, she feels like the Suzaku of this show.


Love me some Smith, I don't know what it says when the damn nazi feels more...sympathetic than the actual good, honest, main character but there it is.
At least Frank went out with a bang(im sorry I had to). I'm not sure how I'd feel if they brought him back.
 
S

scitek

Member
The Silver said:
Love me some Smith, I don't know what it says when the damn nazi feels more...sympathetic than the actual good, honest, main character but there it is.
Click to expand...

I think it's fantastic. He's a traitorous, manipulative piece of shit, but he has depth, and Sewell plays him so well, it's hard not to like and hate him at the same time. I think that's exactly what the writers are going for, and they pull it off really well.
 
M

Mascot

Member
I've just started S1 and am two episodes in. The victorious Nazi alt-history is always a great backdrop for drama but I'm a little disappointed with the overall 'feel' of the atmosphere and production values in TMITHC. There seems to be a level of gritty authenticity somehow missing, that intangible thing absent from, say, 11.22.63 (but present in, say, Game of Thrones) that makes it feel believable, no matter how outlandish the original content. It's a very difficult thing to describe or even define. Do you know what I mean? I don't know if it's the script, the characters, the production values or what, but I was hoping for something a lot darker considering the source material.
 
A

Anbokr

Bull on a Donut
Blasted through season 2 a week or so back and I absolutely loved it. One of my favorite shows right now.

I thought season 1 was just OK, but season 2 was a major step up. Just love the production value and set pieces of this show, nothing else seems like it when it comes to the depth and breadth of the world. I just love the alternate history/reality aspect of it too, nothing else on TV scratches that itch.

edit: Just read the post above mine, hilarious that we posted back to back completely different views on the atmosphere/production of the show. I remember that aspect being my favorite part about season 1 (I had a variety of other gripes about s1, that was certainly not among them), but in season 2 I think the production values are even better. I guess the major difference is I don't know much about the source material, so I had no preconceptions going in.

scitek said:
This show is one of the best I've seen at building and selling its setting. It's so well produced.
Click to expand...

My general sentiment as well. While I certainly wouldn't call this my favorite show or the best show I've ever watched; bar none, I think the production value is better than any other show I've seen. The way they bring this alternate setting to life is just so breathtaking; it just feels so real/natural when watching which is amazing -- you're drawn into the world
like Tagomi in our world :)
.
 
E

E92 M3

Member
The reason we can sympathize with the Nazis so easily is because it's post-war/cleansing and they aren't actively murdering people.

I've experienced the cognitive dissonance of an SS officer being my favorite character lol.
 
I

Irminsul

Member
scitek said:
This show is one of the best I've seen at building and selling its setting. It's so well produced.
Click to expand...
I generally agree, but with one caveat: As a German native speaker, some scenes in Berlin are really irritating. The German is gramatically fine, but so obviously translated from English (as well as spoken by people whose German is obviously not native, at least for some of them).

It doesn't help that I can't get to grasp why so many people in Berlin would bother learning English.

But apart from these minor gripes, the atmosphere and world-building is really great.
 
Moff

Moff

Member
Some of the actors are obviously German, but not all of them. Personally it didn't bother me at all. I didn't expect an all German cast for all of the Nazi characters.
 
Z

ZZMitch

Member
Irminsul said:
It doesn't help that I can't get to grasp why so many people in Berlin would bother learning English.
Click to expand...

I think it's just so viewers don't have to just watch the subtitles for the whole conversation. I feel like it's pretty common in movies/TV shows to do greetings/conversation lead ins in the native language and then switch to English. I suppose it dampens the immersion somewhat but I appreciate not having to spend half an episode watching subtitles personally!
 
M

Makonero

Member
So I have a question: most of the tapes are clearly from alternate universes that Abendsen travels to. But the one alternate universe we see clearly is running at the same time as the "regular" universe.

So where did the "future" films come from? The A-Bomb films, the Grasshopper Lies Heavy one, the one with Dixon dead in a Nazi uniform...? These clearly are alternate universes where these events have already happened.

Unless there's something else going on with time travel too.
 
LoveCake

LoveCake

Member
I enjoyed the first series (I was a bit miffed and disappointed at the very end with the Tagomi revelation), I have been watching this second series and am on ep 7 and I have to say I have no idea what is going on or whos side anyone is on anymore.
:/
 
V

Vulcano's assistant

Banned
This season got right making Smith and his family the center of the drama. They really are the best part of the series.

And it is nice that they got Joe out of the way too, at least his Fresh Prince of Berlin story was funny, and he wasn't making any plot contributions.
 
S

SpaceWolf

Banned
Vulcano's assistant said:
This season got right making Smith and his family the center of the drama. They really are the best part of the series.

And it is nice that they got Joe out of the way too, at least his Fresh Prince of Berlin story was funny, and he wasn't making any plot contributions.
Click to expand...

This won't be the last of Joe. Same with people claiming we've seen the last of Frank. They'll both be back in full force for Season 3.

God, I really wish Joe would go, though.
 
V

Vulcano's assistant

Banned
SpaceWolf said:
This won't be the last of Joe. Same with people claiming we've seen the last of Frank. They'll both be back in full force for Season 3.

God, I really wish Joe would go, though.
Click to expand...

I'm intrigued to see a storyline in a German prison, or just more of Europe in general. Maybe they'll send him to a frozen piece of land in Easter Europe where we get to meet some interesting characters. I'll hate it if he just returns to America.
 
Z

ZZMitch

Member
Vulcano's assistant said:
I'm intrigued to see a storyline in a German prison, or just more of Europe in general. Maybe they'll send him to a frozen piece of land in Easter Europe where we get to meet some interesting characters. I'll hate if he just returns to America.
Click to expand...

I think he does return to America at some point tho. I mean Juliana and Joe have to meet up again right? Seems like it's bound to happen
 
Nydius

Nydius

Gold Member
SpaceWolf said:
Not only going forward, in going back as well I'd be really intrigued to hear more about Smith's backstory in Season 3 beyond the few hints we've been given and to really learn what ultimately led him to fully embrace the Nazi lifestyle. I
was genuinely shocked to hear Smith had served so vigorously in the United States Military and that he was on the side of the Americans right up to the bombing of Washington.
Did he trade in all his values purely to ensure the safety of his loved ones? I'd love to know more!
Click to expand...

I'm really hoping this gets further attention too.

I wasn't really enthused in the early episodes but by the midway point and the ending I was really happy with the way Season 2 progressed. The way Smith's character is written is so well done that you feel like you should either hate him or sympathize with him and then go back to hating him again. Rufus Sewell does a great job breathing life into that character and making him feel both human and a duplicitous piece of shit at the same time.
 
T

tmdorsey

Member
Me and the wife finished up the second season last night and it ended really good! The half of the season was definitely slow, but we loved how it picked up near the end. Ready for season 3!
 
S

SaintR

Member
Still in the process of watching Season 2. Anyone else notice the lack of on scene trivia (Amazon's X-Ray)?

One of the fun parts of watching Season 1 was touching the screen every time an interesting piece of architecture or technology came up and seeing some trivia on it. So far all I've seen for season 2 is actor trivia on the X-ray thing. Maybe I'm the only that noticed this I dunno. Still, fascinating (and terrifying) Season 2 so far!
 
J

Jacob4815

Member
Epcott said:
Loved season 2. I just find it hard to believe
the sister has been alive and well this whole time.
Click to expand...

We have seen Trudy's dead body in season 1, so she definitely comes from an other reality.
Or maybe, the killed Trudy is the "alternate Trudy"

What do you guys think about the last Smith scene?
He enters in the bunker with all the Hitler's films, and he's very surprised looking at one specific film.
Maybe Hitler planned a way to became immortal and Smith will have to bring him back from an alternate reality?
 
aparisi2274

aparisi2274

Member
I wonder just how many people are from
alt. timelines
? So far we know two.
Tagomi and his assistant
.
I love how they both prefer to be in the other timeline.... wonder if they will butt heads in S3 about the better reality.
 
E

effzee

Member
I'm binge watching the whole show and halfway through season 2.

This show's premise is great but my god are the actors horrible. I'm talking about the leads.

The actors playing Joe Blake, Frank, and Juliana are the least believable. Especially the actor playing Frank.

Show also suffers from a complete lack and sense of time and space. And some consistency issues. In one episode
when Juliana is in NYC, Dixon tells her that her sister Trudy worshipped her but after what Juliana dod, even she can't forgive her
. Umm wtf? Isn't Trudy dead way before?

That said I can't stop watching.
 
M

Mascot

Member
Just finished S2 and it definitely gets a lot better towards the end. I realised that Joe was my major annoyance with S1, so the less Joe, the better. Frank is a fucking paper-thin character too.

I hope they up the lighting budget for S3. Everything indoors is very gloomy.
 
K

Kalentan

Member
So I just began watching this show on Wednesday and it's now 4 AM as of this post and I just finished Season 2.

Holy fuck this show! I mean that in the best way possible.

Once it revealed the whole
reality jumping. I WAS SO FUCKING IN. The show now had my full undivided attention. Shit was intense and it really challenges you as the viewer to have to have to understand that sometimes the good guys aren't good and sometimes the bad guys aren't bad but sometimes it's neither it's all just grey and sometimes the attempt to persue a goal can blind you to what you have become.

Fuck... Where the hell is Season 3!?
 
E

effzee

Member
Finished season 2. Love the premise and overall story but hate all the actors and characters, save for the fine actor playing Smith.

Some of the Japanese and German actors are decent as well.

Is it me or the character motivations make zero sense? Anyone introduced to the concept of these films which show the future or alternate history would send shockwaves to the soul yet instead of that being the main focus of inquiry, characters are just told to accept them and they move on.

I'd get it if no one in the show's universe knew the origins and meaning of the films, but a handful of characters know. It feels cheap how they drag this mystery cause no one even seems to be working to solve it. Julianna and Frank should be hellbent to figure how in the world the movies work or why they show what they show.

And if I understood it correctly
the basic plot is certain people can travel between realities or dimension. In the dimension the show is set in, the Nazis dropped a bomb on DC and then took over the US.

They wiped history of the Allied forces ever winning the war. Shouldn't Smith know this? We see in Ep10 him and his wife together in a house when they are expecting their first born as the bomb is dropped.

Knowing this, how is Smith all of a sudden Nazi #1 in the US? Did they just accept and transform to true believers as Nazis?

Also The Man In The High Castle's entire motivation seems to be to risk a girl who knows nothing and looks constantly constipated to magically make her way from the Japanese territories to the Reich and by change work with George and figure out a reason to shoot him.

Or did he know Smith's son would be ill and the only way to prevent all out war would be to prevent the knowledge of his illness bringing down Smith? Its so far fetched. He set up this elaborate plan in the hopes that Julianna finds a way to let Smith go to Germany to stop the war. Well why Julianna? He could have explained that to George and told him to just keep shut about it.

And in the end her sister is alive. So she took dumped this massive responsibility on her sister who could have been killed 30 different times until the very moment she served her true purpose.

Am I not getting the overall plot or is it best not to think about it?
 
V

velociraptor

Junior Member
Is this a show worth watching? The premise sounds intriguing but I'm worried it might be one of those boring-as-fuck dramas. eg Mr Robot. What started out as a fantastic series quickly delved into a mundane effort. S2 moved at such a slow pace that I just gave up altogether half-way through. It felt like a grind to watch!

Shows that I enjoy or have enjoyed: Game of Thrones, Westworld, Luther, and to a lesser extent, Gotham, Flash and Arrow.
 
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