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AusPoliGAF |OT| Boats? What Boats?

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D

Dead Man

Member
wonzo said:
vic labor puttin the dlp ahead of the greens
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Fuck Labor. Fuck them federally, and in every fucking state. Useless fuckwits.
 
M

markot

Banned
Labour fears the greens more than it does most other parties. They're bleeding votes to it. And trying to do anything with the greens and it bleeds right labour votes the other way.
 
S

shanshan310

Member
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit.../02/2014-edtrs_socialshare-all-nnn-nnn-vars-o

lol, even doing very little Abbott is still in the bad books with Alan Jones for pandering.

Some amazingly terrible quotes in there.

Jones said the promised benefits of the deal, such as tariff-free access to Chinese markets for Australian dairy farmers and wine producers didn't stack up.
"Hang on… China are giving us nothing. The dairy farms are owned by China," Jones cried.

Jones' rage turned to US President Barack Obama for upstaging his G20 host with an "absolutely meaningless" climate pact with China.
"We're supposed to have a wonderful alliance, some sort of mate," Jones fumed.

"You know that wind turbines are a fake and heavily subsidised by the taxpayer. Global warming is a hoax, we've had nothing for 18 years," the 2GB breakfast host thundered.
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Why is Jones still allowed a platform to yell from ><
 
M

mjontrix

Member
A last-minute breakthrough by Trade Minister Andrew Robb will give Australian dairy farmers tariff-free access within four years to China's enormously lucrative infant formula market, minus any of the "safeguard" caps that currently restrict competitors from New Zealand, according to sources.
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Kudos to Andrew Robb - I dunno how he did it but well done! That's actually a good deal there. Overall still bad, but not awful.
 
S

Shaneus

Member
ConstructMe said:
In vic how can you want labour, need the new the new highway traffic is mental in peak times. They say they will tear up the contracts.
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Because better public transport is infinitely better than "more roads! more infrastructure!". It's the catchcry of Liberals everywhere, not realising that the same party pushing to build more roads is the very same that introduced a new reindexed an existing tax on petrol.
 
C

ConstructMe

Banned
Shaneus said:
Because better public transport is infinitely better than "more roads! more infrastructure!". It's the catchcry of Liberals everywhere, not realising that the same party pushing to build more roads is the very same that introduced a new reindexed an existing tax on petrol.
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Yeah, but for heaps of people who live beyong greater Melbourne it aint an option, theres already an expansive pt network in melb, if you live anwhere beyond really geelong or ballarat and commute that way it aint an viable option. Rail Link? The one in brisbane has low ridership and there a skybuses every 10 mins 24/7. Doncaster line? Not financially viable. Melb Metro/rail Link? Not an option under lib or lab right now due to the federal govs priorities.

Imagine how theyd be without citylink now....that was criticized by the greenies too.
 
D

Dastardly Jerks

Banned
It's strike.

Like this:

ConstructMe said:
Yeah, but for heaps of people who live beyong greater Melbourne it aint an option, theres already an expansive pt network in melb, if you live anwhere beyond really geelong or ballarat and commute that way it aint an viable option. Rail Link? The one in brisbane has low ridership and there a skybuses every 10 mins 24/7. Doncaster line? Not financially viable. Melb Metro/rail Link? Not an option under lib or lab right now due to the federal govs priorities.

Imagine how theyd be without citylink now....that was criticized by the greenies too.
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B

bomma_man

Member
I think the point is that if you're going to spend heaps of money on transport infrastructure it should be on public transport rather than a massive highway. Is that controversial? Cars are really fucking inefficient when you think about it, and a new highway would be contrary to the 'decaring' process that the centre of Melbourne is going through. It's the equivelant of the difference between Liberal and Labor NBN policy.
 
D

Dryk

Member
William McDougall, infrastructure engineer and transport consultant who has worked on several projects in Victoria, including an early study into the link: &#8220;Having studied the East West Link several times over the years, I&#8217;m convinced that it&#8217;s not needed.&#8220;

Dr Alan March, associate professor of urban planning at Melbourne University: &#8220;I look at this as a choice about where public investment and resources are going and, when it is compared with other short-term and long-term choices that could be made, this is not a good choice.&#8221;

Dr John Stone, lecturer in transport policy, University of Melbourne: &#8220;This project has problems because the only credible cost benefit analysis has shown that it is not going to make a return on the investment that we make.&#8221;

Professor Graham Currie, Australia&#8217;s first professor of public transport, at Monash University, with 30 years experience as a transit planner: &#8220;Is it a good idea to build more motorways in inner areas? I think it&#8217;s of questionable value. It smudges congestion around a bit but doesn&#8217;t really solve it.&#8221;
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http://www.theguardian.com/australi...-east-west-link-18km-road-election-flashpoint

Add to this the mountain of research showing that adding in more road capacity doesn't relieve congestion effectively (it's offset in less than a decade on most major projects) and it becomes clear why the East-West Link may not be the most prudent use of transport funds.
 
C

ConstructMe

Banned
Alright, yes the east west link itself does seem a huge task and a pre election "quick fix", but you have to admit something has to be done about the congestion round that part of melb and what do you guys suggest? Keeping in mind a lot of that would be regional traffic where pt aint viable/an option.

Even so why the hell is voting mandatory? If you dont care you will just do a bs vote so why not just cut out the middle man and save some paper.
 
J

jey_16

Banned
I can understand the need for the E-W link one day (along with the North East Link) but the Metro tunnel is urgently needed (Infrastructure Australia has put it as priority no. 1) Its pointless buying new trains when the capacity in the network is not there to support them. Every day, my train has to stop before Flinder st because there are no free platforms and the city loop is full.

With the billions going to the E-W link, there is no funding for PT. Its the reason why the Liberals changed the plans for the rail tunnel at the last minute because it pushed it back further (est. completion 2026) and they have only funded a fraction of it.

Also, the E-W link does nothing to ease congestion on Hoddle St
 
J

Jintor

Member
ConstructMe said:
Even so why the hell is voting mandatory? If you dont care you will just do a bs vote so why not just cut out the middle man and save some paper.
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Well, non mandatory America tends to push politics towards the extremes. That said, the government we've got had turned it prey bloody extreme so -_0_/-
 
D.Lo

D.Lo

Member
ConstructMe said:
Even so why the hell is voting mandatory? If you dont care you will just do a bs vote so why not just cut out the middle man and save some paper.
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Countries where voting isn't mandatory veer right and grey (because old people have nothing better to do than vote), and veer extreme, because parties not only have to win your vote, but have to get you off your ass in the first place. So they have to appeal to their base first and foremost, then to swinging voters.

So it is more democratic, but usually produces worse results.
 
B

bomma_man

Member
Jintor said:
Well, non mandatory America tends to push politics towards the extremes. That said, the government we've got had turned it prey bloody extreme so -_0_/-
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D.Lo said:
Countries where voting isn't mandatory veer right and grey (because old people have nothing better to do than vote), and veer extreme, because parties not only have to win your vote, but have to get you off your ass in the first place. So they have to appeal to their base first and foremost, then to swinging voters.

So it is more democratic, but usually produces worse results.
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In comparison to America, sure, but there are like ten countries on earth that enforce mandatory voting, and none of them are similar economically and culturally to Australia. Do we have a better, more informed voting bloc than Sweden or Denmark?
 
M

magenta

Member
ConstructMe said:
Even so why the hell is voting mandatory? If you dont care you will just do a bs vote so why not just cut out the middle man and save some paper.
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Unlike most countries we see voting as a civic duty that we must do as part of being an Australian citizen, like taxation, compulsory education and jury duty.
 
M

mjontrix

Member
Kanyon said:
What's the general consensus on the Green Climate Fund here on GAF?

I know News is a Murdoch mouthpiece but it brings up a compelling point, that we are woefully behind the curve on implementing green and renewable technologies.
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The fund is to push more investments into emerging countries. And try to keep China and Russia out.

In Fiji they're already having trouble with investing - the government is letting more and more investments in from China and Russia. Their endgame of course is to have some sort of military position there - but the current government is not letting for now.
 
T

Tommy DJ

Member
ConstructMe said:
Alright, yes the east west link itself does seem a huge task and a pre election "quick fix", but you have to admit something has to be done about the congestion round that part of melb and what do you guys suggest? Keeping in mind a lot of that would be regional traffic where pt aint viable/an option.
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Better land use mix and behavioural changes are theoretically the best long term solution to transport issues in general. The fundamental issue with Melbourne is that its a radial network: everyone wants to rush into the middle. Melbourne's geography is especially unfriendly for this sort of thing with major congestion sites around those damned river crossings.

The East West Link attempts to solve this in the worst way possible: another road route to cross the river. What is doesn't do is encourage a more sustainable modal split, major changes in trip generation/distribution, or any changes in commuting behaviour really. Nothing about it makes sense since it does nothing but encourage the status quo. Its a solution that will work for 10 years then have Melbourne bitching about congestion again.
 
D

Dastardly Jerks

Banned
#&#8206;BREAKING&#8236;: Jacqui Lambie has been removed as deputy Senate leader of the Palmer United Party for failing to attend party meetings.
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ahahaha

ConstructMe said:
Oh no, dont like any reasoning in here do you? Just pipe dreams, get real and address my points or gtfo.
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When you have something relevant to say, I'll be sure to address it. I don't go to the comments of Herald Sun articles for a reason.
 
R

r1chard

Member
Tommy DJ said:
Better land use mix and behavioural changes are theoretically the best long term solution to transport issues in general. The fundamental issue with Melbourne is that its a radial network: everyone wants to rush into the middle. Melbourne's geography is especially unfriendly for this sort of thing with major congestion sites around those damned river crossings.

The East West Link attempts to solve this in the worst way possible: another road route to cross the river. What is doesn't do is encourage a more sustainable modal split, major changes in trip generation/distribution, or any changes in commuting behaviour really. Nothing about it makes sense since it does nothing but encourage the status quo. Its a solution that will work for 10 years then have Melbourne bitching about congestion again.
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There are credible doubts it'll work at all. As already mentioned, some models have predicted congestion will get worse, not better.

Remember, the Doncaster rail link is too expensive, at $1B. The East-West tunnel is $5.8B.
 
F

Fredescu

Member
Everyone knows petitions don't work. What he should do is go into politics, get elected, then become a senior member of his party and have his party gain a majority in the lower house.
 
F

Fredescu

Member
Shaneus said:
What?
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Mr wonzo should have included the time stamp in that screenshot. I looked it up and he really actually just tweeted that like an hour ago. This isn't digging for old speeches of things people used to believe before they were corrupted by party donations. This is literally something he's doing right now.
 
S

Shaneus

Member
Fredescu said:
Mr wonzo should have included the time stamp in that screenshot. I looked it up and he really actually just tweeted that like an hour ago. This isn't digging for old speeches of things people used to believe before they were corrupted by party donations. This is literally something he's doing right now.
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Oh, I wasn't talking about the time it was done, I just couldn't wrap my head around him petitioning against something that was ultimately as a result of cuts that his government made.
 
F

Fredescu

Member
Shaneus said:
Oh, I wasn't talking about the time it was done, I just couldn't wrap my head around him petitioning against something that was ultimately as a result of cuts that his government made.
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Yeah, I guess I was explaining my thought process.

"This is so stupid, surely this is a tweet from before he was in office."

*looks up twitter*

"Wooooow"
 
F

Fredescu

Member
He's getting some solid signatories:


B2wnwMzCYAAOcED.png
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It's not related to this thread, but between Pyne starting a petition against his own Government and Gamergate defending Jack Thomson, it's been a pretty funny morning so far.
 
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