Question: What was your head like going into this movie and what were you set out to do differently?
JOSS WHEDON: Yeah, the first one, it was a raggedy me that made that film. It did take a lot out of me. Going in this time, I just had to sort of recalibrate my entire existence and throw myself into it more wholeheartedly and say, Okay, Im actually going to make it harder to make from the last one. Im gonna just invest myself in every part of it, in every production meeting, in every location scout, and every question about a prop that Id like to avoid. I might even work harder on the script. Theres nothing in it that Im not going to let tear me apart. Im just gonna give myself up to it
like a Christian to a lion.
Im curious about the look of the Vision and how its going to evolve. Are you still working on how its gonna look?
WHEDON: No, we make them as close as we can. The stunt guy, we have to make allowances for the shape of his face and padding and things that were putting on him, but theyre not meant to look different. Basically, what usually happens is, one of the guys, Ryan Meinderding or one of the guys on his staff draws something unbelievably beautiful, and we try to create that in real life, and it takes a long time. The first tests were very Violet Beaurogarde. It really took a long time to get to a place where we felt like
even though we will work on him in post
he walks on and we go, Oh, its The Vision! My God!
That was our reaction when we walked out there.
WHEDON: Yeah, and of course, I wanted Paul to play this part since before I wanted to make an Avengers movie. Lets face it, its about cheek bones, people.
When did you first start coming up with ideas for the sequel, and were your first ideas the ones youre actually making?
WHEDON: Yeah, before I took the first job, I said, Well, I dont know if Im right for this or if I want it or you want me, but in the second one, the villain has Ultron and he has to create the Vision, and then, that has to be Paul Bettany. (laughter) It took me three years before I could tell Paul that Id had that conversation, but after that, I stopped. I was like, That would be cool if theres you have Ultron and you have Vision and Paul played him, and Scarlet Witch and Pietro, definitely. Theyre from my era, theyre very different, their powers are different, its not all punching, it gives a different palettes, we can do more interesting things, its fun; those things were absolutes.
avengers-age-of-ultron-joss-whedon-elizabeth-olsen-jeremy-rennerBut then I didnt actually want to make the film necessarily. I was ragged from the first one, and so I just turned off my brain. I was like, Do not think of cool ideas for the next one. Just get through this. But after a few months when they talked about actually paying me, I would say, Alright, this is now something that makes sense in my life; do I have anything to say? And so my agent called. I was in London, and he called and said, You know, theres a deal thats worth talking about. Time to start to thinking about whether theres a movie, and Im going, Alright. I went to a pub, and sat down with my notebook, and about forty-five minutes later, my notebook was filled. And I texted my agent, Yeah. I have so many things to say. I was kind of surprised. It took me unawares. It was very beautiful.
Introducing characters like Pietro who I know is a favorite of yours. When youre inserting them here, are you always thinking, Im inserting this character and now Im building this huge arc that is going to play out over phase three or phase four?
WHEDON: Yeah, I mean, youre aware of that, but you sort of cant be slavish to it. One, I think the biggest mistake in the world of franchising is
well, as he says in Gattaca: Know how I beat you? I didnt save anything for the way back. Dont worry about, Well, we can do something next time. Its like, whatever you want, get it in there. Not that we can do everything with every character but you wanna get an arc thats complete. You dont want people to think Wow, thats part one of something or even part two of something. I have been lambasted for criticizing Empire Strikes Back. I wasnt criticizing the film which I love very much. I was saying that the experience of having a movie not end, its weird for me and kind of disturbing. For me, I need to get everything in that I need from him, and then if he continues, either I or somebody else will need more. These characters have existed in their iconic narratives for longer than Ive been around, which is just really long.
When you filled your notebook up are the ideas you wrote down the ones youre doing?
WHEDON: A lot of them, a lot of them. And theres some that youre like, This is the heart of the
no, that doesnt work. But yeah, generally speaking, its character stuff, really. Its not necessarily
its definitely not plot stuff because thats the stuff that you can pull out of yourself with agony. The character stuff of, Oh these people connect and these people cant connect, and we can tear them the part and bring them together, and you know, have this insight into the character, thats the stuff that makes me wanna make a film, not like, Oh and then theres a cool plot twist. I have to have a mind for that.
Can you talk about the success of the Hulk in the first film? Did you want to preserve him for the world of the Avengers?
WHEDON: Well, I wasnt the one who said, Dont make a Hulk film or anything like that. Kevin said to me, We think right now its good to have somebody that you can only have in the Avengers. There may be rights issues, I have no idea. Everybody loves Mark. Hes phenomenal, but the fact there hasnt been a Hulk since that Hulk doesnt suck. My job is hard enough, you know. Caps had a movie, Thors had a movie. Everyones gone through big changes, Iron Mans had a movie, so I have to juggle everybodys perception of that while still making a movie that you can see having not seen any except the first Avengers or not even that.
You said that the movie is much bigger this time around, so how much bigger?
WHEDON: I dont remember saying it was bigger. I remember saying it was harder
but it is bigger. The cast is bigger. The scope is bigger. We have more to work with, not that were trying to spend more. In fact, were trying to avoid bloat wherever possible. But with this, were on a broader canvas, were in more countries. We have a bigger world to work with and a bigger world for them just to be in. Once they exist as a team, we have to deal with what everybody thinks about that, and what that means to the world. So its not as simple as it was.
Is there a kind of a Dr. Frankenstein and his monster thing happening with Tony Stark and Ultron?
WHEDON: In the Marvel universe, theres a lot of Frankensteins. Steve Rogers himself, one of the better-looking Frankensteins of our era. Yeah, theres always an element to that. Theres a lot of people, whether theyre trying to do good or bad, who think they have the next big idea. And the next big idea is usually a very bad one.
You talked in the past about how the Hulk is probably one of the harder characters to adapt into a live-action film. Giving him a bigger role in this film Im curious exactly how are you handling that? We know that Bruce has his hands in the creation of Ultron, so I was curious if you can talk about the expansion of Hulks character and if well hear him talk more this time around?
WHEDON: His monologue about his childhood is very poignant
and lacks pronouns. No. The talking thing is something that I sort of pitch it and I take it away. Its moment to moment. Done wrong, it could kill ya, so Im pretty leery about that. But Banner, you know, has a significant role, and the Hulk, we really held back on him for a long while in the first one. And said, Theres something terrible coming that youll love. Which is what makes the Hulk so hard to write is that youre pretending hes a werewolf when hes a superhero. You want it vice versa. You want to see him, Banner doesnt want to see him, but you dont want Banner to be that guy who gets in the way of you seeing him. So the question is, how has he progressed? How can we bring changes on what the Hulk does? And thats not just in the screenplay, thats moment to moment, because even when they are putting in temp mix they have a library of two roars. Aaarrgh! Uuurrgh! What if he wasnt roaring? Im angry, and Im not roaring. Im being very polite to a lot of reporters and Im filled with rage. (laughter)
Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch, you brought them in, and you have the Vision. Thats like a second team like Hawkeye and Captain America in the old days. And theyre not mutants now. Are you bringing them in with the age of miracles? Are they going to be an Inhuman thing? Is there an explanation besides just war technology?
WHEDON: Struckers been doing experiments, and hes got the scepter, and hes been using alien tech to do them. Its kind of where I landed with that, but look for an exciting retcon in Avengers 6!
In terms of coming back to write a sequel, now youve worked with this cast and youve had that first experience, does that help you find the voice the second time around? Are things that you knew that you wanted to do specifically because of the actors?
WHEDON: Yeah, I mean, most of them had already played the parts before even the first one, and its hard not to hear Robert Downey in your head. Hes very distinctive. Its been easier. Its been easier for me to give them what they are comfortable with, and also to let them sort of mold stuff a little bit, you know? There are certain things where Im like, if you want to make this more your own in some way I havent thought of yet, we have mutual trust, where if I say, I know this feels weird, but I need it. And they will back me. And if they say, I feel like I could come at this differently, I will back them, because, you know, were creating those characters together, and they will always see something that I missed. And they will always have some little insight, especially when all ten of them are in a room. Ive got all of these enormously interesting actors playing enormously interesting characters. Im not going to get every nuance of everybody, and somebody will say, Wait a minute. Arent I dead already in this scene? Should I have so many lines? Right, good point. Sorry. By the way, please dont turn that into a headline. Im so sick of reading about killing people. (laughter) A joke.
Wheres does Wanda fall in the sort of tradition of the strong but somewhat damaged-by-powers characters that youve written in the past, like Buffy?
WHEDON: Well, you know, strong but damaged by power describes every person in this movie. It may, in fact, describe what the movie is about. You know, the more power that we have, the less human we are. Her damage pre-dates her power, and these kids, theyve had a rough history. But is she in an idiom with which I am comfortable? Why, yes sir, she is. (laughter)
Weve gotten a glimpse of the relationship between Wanda and Pietro and we know that Iron Man and Ultron are tied together. Was there an organic way to bring those two stories together? They felt like two separate stories in a lot of ways.
WHEDON: They did. They did, and that was, you know, a concern for Marvel for a long time, but a lot of the working out of the story was how do we get these things connect? Im not probably going to explain that, but its very important to me that they do feel like part of the same story, and part of the same universe, and all their origins are tied up in each other.
During Phase Two, Hawkeye wasnt around too much, and Im curious if were gonna find out what hes been up to in this film?
WHEDON: Um, yeah, we are. Cause somethings up with that boy. Thats all Im gonna say.
About the character of Ultron, when you have a guy like Spader who has an incredible presence, which I imagine lends itself to the character quite well, but Im curious, how is he acting in a general scene amongst humans, his open philosophy, how that kind of translates to the screen?
WHEDON: Well, Ultron feels a certain distance from humanity, and the day Spader got here we put on the mocap pajamas, a giant thing with red dots on it for his eye line, and a giant pack, and a helmet with two cameras in his face with lights to record his performance. He then did a scene with Scarlet, but not looking him in eye because she was looking up in his eye line, nor could he see her because he had two lights shining in his face, and he had his glasses on. Therefore, he has a certain distance from humanity, too. God bless him, he was wonderful, and very game and has been the whole time. Very interested in the mechanics of the mechanics, and of you know, finding the humanity. He and I share a genuine love of this version of Ultron, and he has an innate eccentricity in his delivery that is everything that I had hoped Ultron would be.
How is he different from other villains youve seen in superhero movies?
WHEDON: I think for me, theres always a point where Im writing them where Im like Theyre right! The Avengers suck! We got to do something about that. We got to take care of these guys. Hopefully, you will come out of this, if not agreeing with him then getting him, and getting his pain, which leads to a lot of damage, and some humo. Hows he different? I mean, villains are different from each other. The important thing for me is hes not this external thing. Hes not Independence Day. Not that Im criticizing that movie, but its not like we spent some time on the alien going Oh, I hate that Will Smith! Punched me right in the face my first day there! (laughter) When hes in his scenes, you want to feel like he will never understand that hes not the hero.
With Quicksilver, did the X-Men Quicksilver that just came out change your visual approach to anything? The speedshots?
WHEDON: Not really. I mean, theres some things that we now would probably care to avoid just so that were not
But we were never doing the same version. Obviously, at some point well go into slow-mo because thats whats fun about a super-speedy guy. For me, whats fun about Quicksilver isnt necessarily seeing Quicksilver, its seeing the Avengers the way he does. They really took to the mattresses with that one scene, but hes just a very different guy in ours and I think were just kind of proceeding as planned.
Could you talk about working as a filmmaker on a studio film? You and James Gunn have worked within the studio system before, but you also were working with your own characters at that time. Whats it like playing with someone elses character in a studio film like this?
WHEDON: Well, Im aware of cant do that or say that. I know that I work for Disney. I know that I want children to see this film and not have nightmares about it. But I understand the parameters, and at the same time, I dont know of a place that would let me make a film this personal for this much money. Marvel, I feel like they treat the movies, or they have for memy experience of itlike they treat the comic books. When a new writer and artist comes on board, they have their own vision of what it is, and they respect that, because they cant say, Rom Lim, draw like John Buscema. He cant. I get to make a movie thats very much about the things I need to talk about, and sometimes, I forget that during the whole process because these characters are so dear to me from before, and they belong to them, but then when the thing shakes out, its very much the movie I dreamed of, and thats why Im back.
When making The Avengers, you already knew that Ultrons gonna be the guy. The same with Vision and the twins as well. Are you already trying to plan out in your mind that every character leads to something else? Are you already thinking big ideas for how stuff will connect down the road into Avengers 3?
WHEDON: There comes a point in filming when you are writing, filming and editing, and, you cannot make a grocery list. I havent had a good idea about anything. Im so excited that Im wearing underwear, that I got that right today. Every now and then, itll happen, but right now were just past the halfway point, and Im still finessing and finessing and finessing, and I got nothing. I do this, I go home, I rewrite, I go to sleep. I do this, I go home, I rewrite, I go to sleep.
