Manmademan
Member
yep. If you don't mind me spoiling the fuck out of it for you I could give you a summary or post panels.
Avengers & X-Men: AXIS (OT) The Red Onslaught
- Thread starter Dalek
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yep. If you don't mind me spoiling the fuck out of it for you I could give you a summary or post panels.
echoshifting
Banned
Make it so.
Please.
If inversion brought out redneck hero Carnage, anything is possible
Manmademan
Member
Carnage was a redneck in Axis 003, before Inversion.
ok, I'm going to skip a lot of the fluff and get to the meat of why this is weird- some of the fluff is funny, mind you, but- still fluff.
This all starts in Avengers World #15. Doom and Valeria are talking about the inversion, what to do- Doom is now altruistic, and makes Latveria a democracy now for no goddamn reason. but we show here that Doom has had his engineers (I guess the ones that aren't busy with incursion stuff?) build a giant machine-
ignoring Wanda's porn face in the background, we see that Doom knows that she is going to come after him eventually, so this machine is designed to drain her powers. He knows how strong she is, and even a sliver of her full potential drained into the machine will let him do pretty much anything, and rewrite the marvel universe at will.
from here we skip ahead in their conversation, get some scenes with Valeria and maria hill in the helicarrier, showing that valeria needs SHIELDS help, because she has to assemble a team to help take down wanda when she shows up. What's this team, mind you? Why, it's the most D-list roster of Avengers you could possibly come up with. If there was a chance to insert NFL superpro into something, it would be here.
3D Man(!), Valkyrie, Bloodstone, USAgent, Coulson, Fucking Stingray(?!!!) and Valeria in a spare suit of Doctor Doom power armor go to take on wanda when she arrives in Latveria. Each one of these gets a quick "recruitment" scene showing what losers they are now (bloodstone is in shitty reality tv, USAgent is trying to trick kids into joining the army, Valkyrie is beating the hell out of muggers who steal purses because why the hell not) but we never actually get an explanation as to why THIS crew is essential other than Valeria says so.
It goes about as badly as you'd think, but they get her in there- mostly by accident.
The machine doesn't stop her by any means, but at least they get some of her power before she loses interest in beating on scrubs, noticing that Doom has come back from wherever he went between issues. Wanda apparently leaves, but doesn't actually FIND doom here.
we get a quick panel of doom with what's essentially a bootleg cosmic cube, full of wanda's power. With this thing he can do whatever he wants. reality is his bitch.
The world is going to shit, everyone's inverted, the x-men are about to set off a gene bomb in the middle of new york, you can take any aspect of marvel universe history and change it, and what does doom do?
hey, cassie lang was kind of hot, let's bring that bitch back. Aww yeah. Doom always had a thing for Blondes. But wait- what was that about Brother Voodoo? We need to bring that guy back, somebody has to stop wanda- but we used up all that power on cassie lang! don't worry bros-
"oh, yeah- i can ressurrect anyone I want, I know a guy."
wat
WHAT
CapNBritain
Member
I'm not following a lot of the tie-ins, so I didn't know this. I really hate when details to events are stuffed away inside tie-ins. It cheapens the main series because you can see where there's missing context. You get weird pacing where interesting, relevant stuff is handwaved away in one page but then you get several pages of focusing on random elements that don't seem as important as their page count would indicate. At least Remender is making those segments entertaining.
Is this all on editorial?
echoshifting
Banned
Wow, excellent summary MMM...thanks! And I understand your frustrations in that context. Definitely editorial, yep...the right doom does not know what the left doom is doing. "I'm gonna make up for killing this ONE person by bringing her back, man feels good to be good... but oh yeah shit needed that for world saving shit shit shit time for another demonic pact I suppose."
Doesn't really make sense no matter how you slice it.
Doesn't really make sense no matter how you slice it.
Manmademan
Member
If not...then why have editors?
exactly. it's as if everyone is just doing their own thing and the whole event is just throwing stuff at the wall. As I mentioned before (I figure we're done with spoilers here), all you need to do is replace cassie lang with brother voodoo in the last page of Avengers World #16 and there is no plot hole- or just add those two in addition to her. problem solved. but nope- we need to give doom the ability to bring people back from the dead out of nowhere to have Axis 8 make sense instead.
Manmademan
Member
That's when the issue went from "good" to "GREAT" for me.
Hahaha, Stingray is called when Prowler is busy.
I'm guessing they care more about bringing Voodoo back because Bendis pulled his usual crap with him and Remender wants to use him. At this point Remender is basically setting up the team and plot lines for his post-axis book.
That's not how brains work tho.
Manmademan
Member
no argument there. there's a lot of weird plot lines and strange retcons all up in this book for no good reason.
still the worst event I've ever read though.
MUTANT brain tho
Bendis did the same thing to Hickman. Killed Xavier after Hickman told him he planned to use him in his Incursion saga and Secret Wars. Bendis says Hickman gives him shit for it all the time.
Twice in one page.
I like this better than some of the recent events like Original Sin. This event at least has interesting tie-ins, actual action, and Nova is proving himself in the eyes of the other.
Manmademan
Member
I'm trying to make it a thing. say it enough times and marvel will remember they still have him somewhere.
Sadly, there are probably licensing issues with that guy and it will never happen.
We'll get Kickers Inc. back in Secret Wars before that happens.
Manmademan
Member
oh god that actually COULD happen.
don't give marvel any ideas
jesus, just when I thought I knew about every terrible marvel series there was, you drop "Kickers Inc." on me
You say this now but New Universe vs. Malibu will be awesome.
Manmademan
Member
Two labels enter...hopefully no one leaves
crimsonspider89
Banned
I think everybody loves Carnage Man.
Yeah, this...
I will defend the concept to the death because the idea of inversion is really cool. But they flipped too far too soon and turned it into Avengers vs X-Men 2.0. And I liked Averngers vs. X-Men, and I liked Remenders stuff, but here... it feels like making this a giant event hurts it big-time. If it'd been an Uncanny Avengers/Captain America crossover (with a few loose tie-ins like Magneto etc) it'd have been great. But as it stands, it's a mess.
I mean Superior Tony Stark is... basically not inverted at all. He's the old, profiteering jerk again. It'd have been nice to invert him as something else -- shit, they could've made him resentful he wasn't a Doctor, and try taking Latveria from Doom and called it StarkLand (the licensing rights alone...)
Also, Scarlet Witch needs to go away and have a Parallax style retcon. She's a beyond horrible character at this point in terms of personality, powers, and general shittiness.
I will defend the concept to the death because the idea of inversion is really cool. But they flipped too far too soon and turned it into Avengers vs X-Men 2.0. And I liked Averngers vs. X-Men, and I liked Remenders stuff, but here... it feels like making this a giant event hurts it big-time. If it'd been an Uncanny Avengers/Captain America crossover (with a few loose tie-ins like Magneto etc) it'd have been great. But as it stands, it's a mess.
I mean Superior Tony Stark is... basically not inverted at all. He's the old, profiteering jerk again. It'd have been nice to invert him as something else -- shit, they could've made him resentful he wasn't a Doctor, and try taking Latveria from Doom and called it StarkLand (the licensing rights alone...)
Also, Scarlet Witch needs to go away and have a Parallax style retcon. She's a beyond horrible character at this point in terms of personality, powers, and general shittiness.
I am shocked they haven't been seen in the incursions.
Manmademan
Member
Well, this tony stark is totally drinking alcohol, so it's an inversion for sure.
Agree on Wanda. powers are beyond broken, character is unlikable, where do you go from here?
Rogue and her having sex
Manmademan
Member
character redeemed!
The problem with Scarlet Witch is that the writers at Marvel don't like her either after everything that has happened.
Manmademan
Member
Democracies require a motivated, well educated populace to succeed, and generally need to happen organically. You can't simply abdicate and drop democracy on a dictatorship and hope for the best.
crimsonspider89
Banned
Wanda has always been capable of being a bitch but also being the good girl.
She shows her emotion to her friends but tries to remain confident to everyone else.
And Wanda's powers are doing what they always have.
But yeah, several writers and editors hate Wanda. There original plan was probably to turn her into a full fledged villain if you are going by where she was in the new Marvel handbook.
She shows her emotion to her friends but tries to remain confident to everyone else.
And Wanda's powers are doing what they always have.
But yeah, several writers and editors hate Wanda. There original plan was probably to turn her into a full fledged villain if you are going by where she was in the new Marvel handbook.
I see some people complaining that Axis is being used to set up Marvel's chess pieces for 2015, but so far I think even that is being kind. If 2015 is going to focus on Hickman wrapping his Avengers stuff up, I don't see anything in Axis to date that was really necessary for accomplishing that goal.
Hell, Female Thor, Old Man Rogers, and Falcon Cap seem to be road blocks that Hickman has had to work around rather than anything necessary.
Hell, Female Thor, Old Man Rogers, and Falcon Cap seem to be road blocks that Hickman has had to work around rather than anything necessary.
Supermanisdead
Member
Nah, Axis is Marvel realizing their comics don't sell without major events every 6 months and this is the lamest one yet. Expect some sacrificial death at the end, everyone gets turned back to normal, we get a bunch of new #1 issues that will coast with a pointless 6 issue introductory arc until the summer event.
We already know every that "spins out of" Axis since this event at least had the good sense to wrap itself up in 3 months time. I think we are put out of our misery next week.
TetraxShards
Member
Don't think they'll be teaching AXIS in brain surgeon college, slick.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
they would bring back the ultraverse just to wipe it out. but it would go out with a bang
naw on wanda, if douchebags like namor can stick around, then wanda has a place
Supermanisdead
Member
It's not that Wanda is a douche or anything, it's that she's just so horribly written. Nobody has written her to be believably emotional or angry, but instead she's just been a huge bitch for no reason.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
i dont think she is either, but shes not the worst character walking around the 616. there are characters that have done all sorts of foul or fucked things, yet, it seems shes always under the spotlight.
Vermillion
Banned
Namor's a fun douchebag, because of his arrogance. Wanda's just... ugh.
Because no one has bothered to do anything with her in the past decade beyond dwell on the fallout of House of M.
Supermanisdead
Member
Well because she's running around going "uhh, maybe mutants deserved it lawl" and generally being annoying. She made me drop Uncanny Avengers. She's just so... "fuck off Wanda."
Namor is at least funny and confident with his arrogance. Wanda is just a dumb loser.
Namor is at least funny and confident with his arrogance. Wanda is just a dumb loser.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
pretty much my point. when was the last time people threw stark under the bus for civil war though?
i think after everyone telling her to fuck off no matter what she does has probably prompted that.
Manmademan
Member
What wanda did was just a tiiiiiiiiny bit worse than Tony getting overzealous with registration during civil war.
even before House of M, Wanda was responsible for Avengers: Dissasembled. That alone should have been enough to get her thrown in the raft or whatever and never see the light of day.
waltzing around being an ass after house of M is just a bonus.
but really- where do you go from here? they've amped her to the point where she's a walking disaster area, and even tiny fractions of what she's capable of can easily resurrect anyone that's died, ever. The Avengers were in full panic mode over the phoenix force showing up- Wanda has shown herself to be not quite as powerful but definitely in the same league, and not controllable at ALL.
Either they get rid of her permanently during axis, or find some way to nerf her into oblivion.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
lets not pretend that civil war was tonys first shot at douchedom though. hes been a fucktard for a long time. wandas problem is that shes far too fucking susceptible to being controlled into doing someones shit then blowing her stack. putting restrictions on her powers would be the best, as long as they dont give her the nate grey treatment
Supermanisdead
Member
uh, house of m and disassembled were much worse than tony in civil war. the fact that they basically had an event to say "it was dr doom all along, lol!" was even more ridiculous.
they need to just kill her off and leave her for dead.
they need to just kill her off and leave her for dead.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
you mean as ridiculous as "lol cant remember, so it wasnt me"?
Supermanisdead
Member
no, slightly more ridiculous because she depowered millions of people with 3 words. she's too powerful and unstable to be taken seriously anymore. every story with her in the last decade has been "gets corrupted; does something bad"
she's just a bad character, conceptually speaking at this point. she has no personality left besides "crazy, unstable and unnecessarily rude"
she's just a bad character, conceptually speaking at this point. she has no personality left besides "crazy, unstable and unnecessarily rude"
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
unstable and powerful, yet cant be taken seriously?
unstable, ill give, you, but crazy and rude? no.
Supermanisdead
Member
yeah, taken seriously as a hero. what are her powers? she randomly is able to do anything. she's going down the jean grey road and i wouldn't be surprised if they just rebooted her powers to make them simpler and weaker when the next avengers movie rolls around.
hell, she might even be getting nerfed right now in this event.
hell, she might even be getting nerfed right now in this event.
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