Support NeoGAF

[guek]

This is part of my problem with the film. 1) it's too overstuffed and 2) because of that, it can't really pay attention to the things it NEEDS to pay attention to.

Basically - Pa Kent wasn't character assassinated ENOUGH. They need to make him really stern, and they didn't. He was always wrinkled and kindly and wise. Goyer wanted him to be Obi-Wan but he wasn't, and he couldn't be, not with his entire character based on justified suspicion. They needed to make him less Obi-Wan and more... shit, I dunno, Coach Taylor, I guess. But you'd have to cut some of those flashbacks to fit that in, if it had even occurred to them that they weren't making Pa Kent hard-edged enough to justify their choice of characterization.

You get a sterner, tougher Pa Kent, that fight in the truck plays a lot more strongly (Finally! Clark's standing up to this guy for being unfair!) and then when he finally has his ONE moment of caring/compassion, it's because he knows his son will learn what he's been trying to teach him all this time, and that will keep him safe.

But instead, that moment doesn't land all the way, because they trapped Jonathan in this weird Obi-Wan limbo his character had no business occupying.

I get where you're coming from. Pa Kent's character was half baked at best, and if they wanted him to be a source of conflict for Clark, it would have been better if they had gone the full nine yards. That said, I still personally would have preferred a more comics accurate portrayal as the inspirational, human father of Kal-El.

 

[The Driver]

Not super hot on Leto's haircut but I'm sure in makeup and shit he'll look pretty good. Wonder more about what kind of laugh he's gonna have.

I think honestly, what I want the most is the best Batman action possible. Snyder already gave us the best Superman action on film and I want him to do the same for Batman, namely I want the absolutely vicious Batman that doesn't mess around and breaks bone when it's necessary. I'd also like them to play up Affleck's height and mass, we already got a ninjaesque Batman, let's see something new.

 

[Marion Cobretti]

He's a veteran Batman, it's being directed by Snyder, and Affleck looks massive in the suit.

It's a guess, but I think it's safe to bet that this is going to be one very brutal Batman. A very efficient master tactician at that.

 

[A.D. Skinner]

He's a veteran Batman, it's being directed by Snyder, and Affleck looks massive in the suit.

It's a guess, but I think it's safe to bet that this is going to be one very brutal Batman. A very efficient master tactician at that.

I want that Batman that looks to take dudes out with one blow, and I think massive stubbly Batman is the one!

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I'm really curious to know how involved Snyder is in designing this Joker.

So we're potentially getting this version of the Joker on the big screen?

 

[Schweinehund]

Looks more end game joker, which is pretty much a genius joker, master planner, psychotic. TDKR joker was psychotic but I wouldn't call him a master planner, not on the level of end game joker.

 

[Betty]

So we're potentially getting this version of the Joker on the big screen?

Gotta save that rendition for Bardem.

 

[Rooster12]

To use the Nolan quote again, what he really means is relatable -- that the movies, while based on unrealistic characters/concepts, are grounded in a world that's familiar and that we can relate to. It's not realistic in the sense that Superman and Wonder Woman can totally exist, but that were Superman and Wonder Woman to exist, this is what they would totally look and act like.

I always thought the best Superman stories was when he was not relatable....the best parts are always when everyone was just staring at awe at the guy.

 

[cackhyena]

Looks more end game joker, which is pretty much a genius joker, master planner, psychotic. TDKR joker was psychotic but I wouldn't call him a master planner, not on the level of end game joker.

Seemed like a pretty good planner in TDK to me.

 

[Marion Cobretti]

Ledger Joker was kinda suave, and a pretty good planner considering he was all about chaos. I think Leto Joker is gonna be pure nuts and uncontrollable. Perhaps genius as well.

 

[Sibersk Esto]

Leto looks like he's going for Batman R.I.P joker

 

[pulga]

I'm really curious to know how involved Snyder is in designing this Joker.

 

[Schweinehund]

Seemed like a pretty good planner in TDK to me.

TDKR = The Dark Knight Returns.

Nolan's Joker was a good planner, but I wouldn't say he was as psychotic as Snyder's take on Joker. I recommend anyone that's a Joker fan to read Death of a Family, End Game and the Batman annuals. Batman Annual 3 & the back up stories in End Game is the take on Joker I'm hoping for in the movies.

 

[DaveH]

To use the Nolan quote again, what he really means is relatable -- that the movies, while based on unrealistic characters/concepts, are grounded in a world that's familiar and that we can relate to.

I always thought the best Superman stories was when he was not relatable....the best parts are always when everyone was just staring at awe at the guy.

This is a frustrating criticism because people play a ridiculous game of semantics and equivocation that shouldn't be taken seriously.

When describing realism with respect to an approach to adapted fiction, rarely does anyone mean, "we're going to undermine the fantastic elements that make up that piece of fiction."

Rather, it's simply a tool for some aspect(s) of the work... as Blader has pointed out repeatedly, in Nolan's case, the world (not necessarily the character). Thus raising strawmen about intrinsically imaginative and fanciful elements- like aliens, goddesses, or viable vigilantes- is an intellectually dishonest allegation... as if there is, or should be, no difference or preference between Batman '66, Batman: TAS, and Batman Begins simply by virtue that viable vigilantism is unrealistic. That's an absurd argument devoid of value since there are reasons to recommend any of those approaches over the other... but the fact that viable vigilantism is fanciful has no bearing whatsoever.

So again, here, Blader is describing the application of the tool to the world, not necessarily the characters... but Rooster is equivocating a relatable world to relatable characters (which may be part of it, but not explicitly stated in the post). Part of the reason that Kingdom Come has as powerful an impact as it does, is because Alex Ross painted off of photographed models in that Norman Rockwell hyperrealism approach. Compared to other comics artwork at the time, Kingdom Come was far and away realistic visually, but nonetheless did not, necessarily, need to betray Superman as "awe inspiring"... in fact, the story is precipitated by the idea that Superman's exile causes the heroes to retire or darken.

And, in fact, I doubt you can find any Superman that isn't relatable on some level. Kingdom Come is about being hurt when reality doesn't meet your ideals, trying again but seeing your good intentions go awry. All-Star is what you would do with your last days on Earth if unfettered by normal constraints. Etc.

Of course, the internet lacks nuance and tools like "realism" and "relatability" get ridiculously reduced into "realism means nothing fantastic" and "relatability means no awe or inspiration."

 

[Kenzodielocke]

he now reminds me of Farin Urlaub (leadsinger of Die Aerzte)

 

[cackhyena]

TDKR = The Dark Knight Returns.

Nolan's Joker was a good planner, but I wouldn't say he was as psychotic as Snyder's take on Joker. I recommend anyone that's a Joker fan to read Death of a Family, End Game and the Batman annuals. Batman Annual 3 & the back up stories in End Game is the take on Joker I'm hoping for in the movies.

Ah, I was thinking of the movie. Haven't read comics in forever.

 

[malfcn]

Anyone see the updates on Gadot, showing off her muscles?

More at the link.

 

[DaveH]

Anyone see the updates on Gadot, showing off her muscles?

Yep.

 

[Jigorath]

Anyone see the updates on Gadot, showing off her muscles?




More at the link.

Wow she's gorgeous. She and Michelle gonna make a great Wonder Woman movie.

 

[#1 defender]

he now reminds me of Farin Urlaub (leadsinger of Die Aerzte)

That's appropriate, because Farin always reminded me of Conrad Veidt in The Man Who Laughs, who was an inspiration for The Joker.

 

[Guffers]

This is a frustrating criticism because people play a ridiculous game of semantics and equivocation that shouldn't be taken seriously.

When describing realism with respect to an approach to adapted fiction, rarely does anyone mean, "we're going to undermine the fantastic elements that make up that piece of fiction."

Rather, it's simply a tool for some aspect(s) of the work... as Blader has pointed out repeatedly, in Nolan's case, the world (not necessarily the character). Thus raising strawmen about intrinsically imaginative and fanciful elements- like aliens, goddesses, or viable vigilantes- is an intellectually dishonest allegation... as if there is, or should be, no difference or preference between Batman '66, Batman: TAS, and Batman Begins simply by virtue that viable vigilantism is unrealistic. That's an absurd argument devoid of value since there are reasons to recommend any of those approaches over the other... but the fact that viable vigilantism is fanciful has no bearing whatsoever.

So again, here, Blader is describing the application of the tool to the world, not necessarily the characters... but Rooster is equivocating a relatable world to relatable characters (which may be part of it, but not explicitly stated in the post). Part of the reason that Kingdom Come has as powerful an impact as it does, is because Alex Ross painted off of photographed models in that Norman Rockwell hyperrealism approach. Compared to other comics artwork at the time, Kingdom Come was far and away realistic visually, but nonetheless did not, necessarily, need to betray Superman as "awe inspiring"... in fact, the story is precipitated by the idea that Superman's exile causes the heroes to retire or darken.

And, in fact, I doubt you can find any Superman that isn't relatable on some level. Kingdom Come is about being hurt when reality doesn't meet your ideals, trying again but seeing your good intentions go awry. All-Star is what you would do with your last days on Earth if unfettered by normal constraints. Etc.

Of course, the internet lacks nuance and tools like "realism" and "relatability" get ridiculously reduced into "realism means nothing fantastic" and "relatability means no awe or inspiration."

I just wanted to say that this is a fantastic post. Cheers Dave. 🍻

 

[anaron]

lol what in the fresh hell, I'm seeing news about a trailer leaking on 4chan's tv section and pulled almost immediately

 

[strafer]

why on gods greeen earth are you on 4chan?

I rather have my balls removed

 

[anaron]

why on gods greeen earth are you on 4chan?

I rather have my balls removed

lol NO, I'm seeing it reported on another site/twitter


it's likely not even real but in the event that it is, maybe it's coming soon

 

[Ahasverus]

lol what in the fresh hell, I'm seeing news about a trailer leaking on 4chan's tv section and pulled almost immediately

It's 4chan. If it was real, it'd be already out.

 

[Delta Assault]

This is a frustrating criticism because people play a ridiculous game of semantics and equivocation that shouldn't be taken seriously.

When describing realism with respect to an approach to adapted fiction, rarely does anyone mean, "we're going to undermine the fantastic elements that make up that piece of fiction."

Rather, it's simply a tool for some aspect(s) of the work... as Blader has pointed out repeatedly, in Nolan's case, the world (not necessarily the character). Thus raising strawmen about intrinsically imaginative and fanciful elements- like aliens, goddesses, or viable vigilantes- is an intellectually dishonest allegation... as if there is, or should be, no difference or preference between Batman '66, Batman: TAS, and Batman Begins simply by virtue that viable vigilantism is unrealistic. That's an absurd argument devoid of value since there are reasons to recommend any of those approaches over the other... but the fact that viable vigilantism is fanciful has no bearing whatsoever.

So again, here, Blader is describing the application of the tool to the world, not necessarily the characters... but Rooster is equivocating a relatable world to relatable characters (which may be part of it, but not explicitly stated in the post). Part of the reason that Kingdom Come has as powerful an impact as it does, is because Alex Ross painted off of photographed models in that Norman Rockwell hyperrealism approach. Compared to other comics artwork at the time, Kingdom Come was far and away realistic visually, but nonetheless did not, necessarily, need to betray Superman as "awe inspiring"... in fact, the story is precipitated by the idea that Superman's exile causes the heroes to retire or darken.

And, in fact, I doubt you can find any Superman that isn't relatable on some level. Kingdom Come is about being hurt when reality doesn't meet your ideals, trying again but seeing your good intentions go awry. All-Star is what you would do with your last days on Earth if unfettered by normal constraints. Etc.

Of course, the internet lacks nuance and tools like "realism" and "relatability" get ridiculously reduced into "realism means nothing fantastic" and "relatability means no awe or inspiration."

Richard Donner used the word " verisimilitude" which is probably nearer to the idea without allowing for misinterpretation.

 

[Akahige]

lol what in the fresh hell, I'm seeing news about a trailer leaking on 4chan's tv section and pulled almost immediately

I read something like that too, seems more than a little bull shitty.

 

[Penguin]

I'd put no stock in it since no one has seen it

I mean descriptions, but no screen caps or someone didn't save it?

Yeah....

 

[Polarburr]

According to El Mayimbe, Chris Pine is being considered to play GL. Take it with a grain of salt obviously.

https://instagram.com/p/0DRjwtjpnt/

 

[Loxley]

According to El Mayimbe, Chris Pine is being considered to play GL. Take it with a grain of salt obviously.

https://instagram.com/p/0DRjwtjpnt/

I'd be down for that.

 

[Dysun]

Pine as GL would be perfect, now I'll be disappointed

 

[Tabby]

According to El Mayimbe, Chris Pine is being considered to play GL. Take it with a grain of salt obviously.

https://instagram.com/p/0DRjwtjpnt/

That'd be a really safe choice for DC... Hm.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Sigh, we don't need another Hal Jordon. There are better GL characters to choose from, why not go with John Stewart or Kyle Rayner?

 

[ninjabat]

Pine is good, but I would rather have a John Stewart in Earth's sector. Maybe introduce an experienced Hal Jordan later in deep space. Possibly in the Green Lantern movie.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Fuck Hal Jordan. Worst Green Lantern. Nothing about him has ever really been appealing, especially in contrast to those who came before AND after him.

 

[broncobuster]

Back during Green Lantern '11 casting, when we didn't know better, Chris Pine's name kept in rumors and I was into it. Now most rumors are pointing towards John Stewart. If it had to be Hal, Pine is all right. I doubt it will be Hal.

 

[Tabby]

I must be the only one to hate John Stewart then. Nothing more the an angry man to me. Hal Jordan is more interesting and I'd much rather see him being bros with Flash.

 

[Rooster12]

Fuck Hal Jordan. Worst Green Lantern. Nothing about him has ever really been appealing, especially in contrast to those who came before AND after him.

Sinestro wouldn't work well without Hal Jordan....actually it probably wouldn't make a lick of sense.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Fuck Hal Jordan. Worst Green Lantern. Nothing about him has ever really been appealing, especially in contrast to those who came before AND after him.

how is it you can be so level headed one minute and a complete fanboy the next?
better than wet blanket Stewart and rageaholic Gardner. clearly you've never read Emerald Dawn. Kyle? please.

 

[OricWindstar]

I love John Stewart, but I don't get the hate for Hal. Maybe I'm wrong, but it just sounds like people who have only seen the cartoon deciding to hate a character because he's not the one they grew up with. And I'm saying that as someone who grew up with and loves the JL animated universe.

Either one is good for me.

Sinestro wouldn't work well without Hal Jordan....actually it probably wouldn't make a lick of sense.

Also, good point. If we're going the Sinestro route, Hal seems the obvious choice.

 

[guek]

Hal has often been accused of being the most generic lantern which isn't too far off. I'm a fan of Hal but in the past, he's been a bit of a no-nonsense straightforward character without too many glaring flaws. Even his stint as Parallax which gave him a defining role was retconed as the product of a fear virus. I like him, but he's often portrayed as very vanilla compared to the other lanterns.

 

[a916]

Sinestro wouldn't work well without Hal Jordan....actually it probably wouldn't make a lick of sense.

Yeah, I kinda need Sinestro... and I don't think Flash has as good of a banter with John Stewart either... they'll need it to combat the seriousness that is the World's Finest

 

[Rooster12]

Pretty much, unless John Stewart has some memorable villain that I don't know about.

 

[Ahasverus]

What if it's a whitewashed John Stewart

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Sinestro wouldn't work well without Hal Jordan....actually it probably wouldn't make a lick of sense.

Couldn't they just say the last GL movie is canon and either start the movie with Hal dying and the ring going to someone else or have it mentioned at some point that Hal died and just move on.

I mean, I'd quite like Sinestro in any GL movie too, but I'd much rather see a different GL take the lead.

As Bobby rightly points out, Hal is the worst GL...

 

[3N16MA]

Someone call Tyrese.

 

[jackdoe]

Couldn't they just say the last GL movie is canon and either start the movie with Hal dying and the ring going to someone else or have it mentioned at some point that Hal died and just move on.

I mean, I'd quite like Sinestro in any GL movie too, but I'd much rather see a different GL take the lead.

As Bobby rightly points out, Hal is the worst GL...

I disagree. John Stewart is the worst Green Lantern. He's just so bland. I'd take Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, or Kyle Rayner any day of the week over him. Hell, if the Green Lantern in Justice League were any of these guys, I wouldn't complain.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I disagree. John Stewart is the worst Green Lantern. He's just so bland. I'd take Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, or Kyle Rayner any day of the week over him. Hell, if the Green Lantern in Justice League were any of these guys, I wouldn't complain.

I guess I have fond memories of John Stewart from the Justice League cartoon. Would be make for a better live action GL than Rayner? Nope, but I'd certainly take him over Hal.

Whenever I think of Hal Jordan GL, I can't shake the memory of Reynolds in that godawful mask. It's just burnt into my memory as a reminder of how bad comic book movies could get...

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

John Stewart has been the GL for many people for years now. He's already familiar to many who grew up with the JL television renditions.
The only justification I see for Hal Jordan being attempted twice, is that WB feels more comfortable with a white GL leading a movie even though that didn't help much the last time.

 

[Marion Cobretti]

Hal is bland? I thought he was supposed to be the funny guy.

Correct me if wrong.