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Battletech |KS| Turn-based tactical mech combat, Harebrained Schemes, Summer 2017
- Thread starter Lime
- Start date
Yup, called it.
Here's Iglesias' concept art versions:
And a preview of the 3D Marauder model from PGI's Instagram.
Looks like 10k away
And still not a single in-engine screenshot to be seen. Is anyone else concerned about that?
Uh, no. This is harebrained studios. It's not some no-name kickstarter.
HBS already delivered on 3 successful Kickstarters. They are vets at this shit.
MrCunningham
Member
This kickstarter has been really consistent with its funding:
We rarely see any drops below $20K and yesterdays new reward tier gave funding a substantial boost to $52k.
They did just release new concept models for two of the units. I think it does show that they are already working on this. They could open up Unity3D and drop in a few models into an unfinished environment, run the game as a executable and take a screengrab. But I would rather wait for them to have something presentable before they start showing off some in game screenshots.
We rarely see any drops below $20K and yesterdays new reward tier gave funding a substantial boost to $52k.
They did just release new concept models for two of the units. I think it does show that they are already working on this. They could open up Unity3D and drop in a few models into an unfinished environment, run the game as a executable and take a screengrab. But I would rather wait for them to have something presentable before they start showing off some in game screenshots.
They are still in pre-production and they are developing new toolset for the Unity 5 engine. The best you can hope for is the concept art screenshots we have seen. I would love to see an in-engine display with PGI's already finished assets, but I can understand if they aren't able to at this point.
Yeah good points all around.
More_Badass
Member
I usually don't back campaigns that are only at the concept art stage, but Harebrained proved themselves with their other campaigns and have a good track record at translating concept art to gameplay
Banderdash
Member
With PayPal they're over 2 million.
Maybe if it was anybody but HBS.
Fantastic news. It's all gravy from here on out.
Robottiimu2000
Member
I think they might have surprise stretch goal up their sleeve.
In an AMA they mentioned a possible co-op live team if they get over 2.5 mil.
afternoon delight
Member
Loving the way this has turned out, HBS and the Battletech community is really showing up for this. Fucking wonderful.
Nikodemos
Member
Isn't that Katrina?
Poodlestrike
Banned
Customizable drop ships...
All is right with the world.
All is right with the world.
Katrina, yes, my memory fails me.
It is Katherine, or do you actually approve of that little Amaris-wannabe?
GavinUK86
Member
is there something i can play/read if i don't know anything about the battletech universe?
i see the author micheal a stackpole is writing a new novel as a reward so is his warrior trilogy a good place to start? i see the game is set right in the middle of the era those books are.
i see the author micheal a stackpole is writing a new novel as a reward so is his warrior trilogy a good place to start? i see the game is set right in the middle of the era those books are.
Warrior trilogy is a solid starting place and good at establishing the relationships of the Houses.
There's a "primer" available from here:
http://bg.battletech.com/new-to-the-board-game/
Don't mind the link saying "new to the board game", there's more than that there, like the downloadable BT universe guide.
EDIT I forgot to say... Those may give you some ideas. Also, the universe guide is kind of interesting read overall. Also has a short story. (Heck, nearly all Battletech products start with a short story, and occasionally have more than one.)
You could read about things from Sarna, though the wiki isn't terribly good at documenting history and lore, IMO. http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page
Spoilers, of course, if you intend to read books.
The Warrior trilogy is okay, provided you don't buy into Stackpole's anti-Liao propaganda. As novels go, it certainly is a good place to start, though the Blood of Kerensky trilogy is a good alternative, perhaps.
Just don't expect any of the BT books to be great literature, they're perhaps a bit pulpy and campy.
In related news, Catalyst just posted the line art for the new Shadow Hawk (replaces the unseen one but not Project Phoenix versions).
http://catalystgamelabs.tumblr.com/post/131757141746/combat-manual-mercenaries-art
http://catalystgamelabs.tumblr.com/post/131757141746/combat-manual-mercenaries-art
I don't think anyone would expect great literature from books about giant robots shooting each other in space.
Well, even compared to scifi in general, they ain't good. Like, barely above some crap i've read, for most part. There is some good stuff but on average, they aren't very good.
...
Don't hire me for marketing, unless your marketing must be honest.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Mechs with hands bug me. I just keep thinking of all the mechanical issues they'd have...
It's why I could never get into Gundam
It's why I could never get into Gundam
Do they even use the hands?
Someone once told me they didn't. Which didn't make sense because....hands, I mean if you got them you think it would be a useful thing to use in fights if you got up close in combat.
And I know someone will post that Macross gif here but it didn't have hands!
Someone once told me they didn't. Which didn't make sense because....hands, I mean if you got them you think it would be a useful thing to use in fights if you got up close in combat.
And I know someone will post that Macross gif here but it didn't have hands!
Mechs with hands bug me. I just keep thinking of all the mechanical issues they'd have...
It's why I could never get into Gundam
Battletech lore is clear that 'mechs' hands are pretty dexterous. They can pick up humans without harming them. Myomers are neat technology (and the funny part, there is stuff akin to BT's myomers in development IRL),
Heck, 'mechs in BT are overall quite flexible, though not quite as agile as typical Japanese mecha (like Gundams) are.
Don't think they have mechanical problems either, remember a 'mech can serve hundreds of years without bigger issue with reasonable maintenance (and sometimes even with little of that).
Personally i detest 'mechs that aren't agile enough, and i very much like 'mechs having at least one hand actuator for utility.
'Mechs are not just walking tanks. If 'mechs are not flexible enough and are only walking tanks (ie don't have any real special features), i'd rather have actual tanks.
EDIT OTOH, i don't like mecha in other franchises than Battletech in general, agile or not. And too agile 'mechs bother me as much as walking tanks.
The boardgame has rules for cargo carrying and stuff like that. Clubs actually require hands, and hands make punching more accurate (but don't affect damage, unlike lower and upper arm actuator parts, something i never figured out why).
I'm pretty sure some of the novels had the pilots to use 'mechs hands for something but such moments were rare.
No BT video game has any use for them though, unfortunately.
I'm struggling to think of why/how she created Alaric using
Victor's spunk
If you want to get into the universe without reading whole novels, PoptartsNinja did a pretty good write-up on SA. It's snarky, but it's pretty accurate.
http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...serid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=2#post451629132
http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...serid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=3#post451659420
http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...serid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=3#post451649581
In Battletech, the hands have uses outside of pure combat. Most of the fighting in the Third Succession War was in the form of objective raids: quick attacks to capture valuables (parts, technology, resources) and extracting before the enemy can react. For this, hands are a huge boon because they lessen the need to bring trucks and other industrial equipment. Moreover, most of a soldier's time is spent out of combat and hands can be very useful tools for all sorts of purposes.Mechs with hands bug me. I just keep thinking of all the mechanical issues they'd have...
It's why I could never get into Gundam
Just need any kind of DNA sample (eg hair or skin), and those shouldn't be too difficult to get with some preparation.
Project 2501
Member
If I can't get a new Front Mission (up yours Front Mission Evolved!) game, this will definitely do.
Project 2501
Member
Those look like a Maurader and a Warhammer from oldschool Battletech.Yup, called it.
Here's Iglesias' concept art versions:
Poodlestrike
Banned
The one thing I'm not 100% sold on about the Marauder is that it almost looks a little too high tech? Like it's Clan-era, almost. Smooth lines and all that.
Could be appropriate, don't know the beast's deets.
Could be appropriate, don't know the beast's deets.
The Marauder was kind of a high-tech unit (and kind of unique, as non-humanoid 'mechs are rarer than humanoid ones) when it was introduced in-universe, though by 3025, it is centuries old design, though regarded as one of the most deadly ones, in-universe at least.
In tabletop game, it isn't bad but suffers from some serious issues, like weak leg armor for a 'mech of its size, and the Autocannon/5 is simply bad weapon, with its ammo located alone in left torso, meaning it will blow up on first critical hit, most likely destroying the entire 'mech. And of course, the ever present heat problem but then 'mechs without heat issues in 3025 are rare.
Later "upgrades" are a bit of hit and miss but there are many of them, the 'mech was rather popular after all.
MWO's art certainly makes it look like a high-tech 'mech.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Hmm.
Raises and interesting question: how faithful are they going to be to the tabletop, balance-wise? If at all? I've never played it, but from the way y'all have been describing it in this thread, there were some fairly significant issues in terms of mech and weapon balancing. Might have been that way in the games too, now that I think about it, but I was too young to notice at the time.
It is obvious FASA never designed the game with rigorous balance in mind.
Early on, games were typically balanced by tonnage but it is far from perfect.
Relatively soon, advanced technology was added, first Star League tech and then Clan tech, and those sure couldn't be balanced with tonnage (except perhaps against same tech level).
Nowadays, games are typically balanced with Battle Value system (version 2), where each 'mech has a value and a typical game might be, say, 6000 BV so you can bring units up to that amount. The system produces reasonable results if teams are numerically similar and terrain isn't taken into account (terrain has enormous effects on the game, it is really about tactical maneuvering). Roughly equal forces are important because there are some ways to game the system otherwise...
Anyway, the system isn't perfect, and it doesn't solve some underlying balance issues, like Introductory level 'mechs (ie what you have around 3025) being incredibly susceptible to ammunition explosions due to lack of CASE (and it has limited effectiveness even once available).
Since this game won't be a direct translation of the BT rules, i presume they're going to be tweaking things, and probably going to avoid some of the most deadly issues.
I'd expect ballistic weapons (and missiles to a lesser extent) to be more effective or efficient, with ammo explosions being a lesser problem. I'd also expect some weaker weapons to be more useful, namely the small laser and the flamer, and probably the machine gun as well.
A lot is going to depend on how faithful to the construction rules they will stay.
EDIT Custom designs are another can of worms. MWO tried to balance those by introducing hard-point limits, though i'd say the results are mixed. I'd expect this Battletech game to have similar hardpoint limits as MWO, mostly because they share the models, and probably weapon models and locations as well.
Backer mission reward #2: Livestream Q&A w/ Jordan, Mitch, & Mike
I'll take some notes and see if I can summarize some of the stuff in a later post
I'll take some notes and see if I can summarize some of the stuff in a later post
They said that they didn't want to be tied too closely to the tabletop rules, so I'd imagine that they're going to tweak the balance a bit. They'll probably tone down energy weapons a bit, and buff autocannons by quite a lot. The game takes place in 3025 so it won't have to worry about the brokenness of double heatsinks.
Battle Value brings up a different kind of problem though. It's not all that great at determining how good a particular vehicle is, so it ends up encouraging using machines that are very effective for their BV and discourages running high-BV 'Mechs like the Hellbringer Prime.
As i said, it doesn't fix some underlying balance problems. Or shitty 'mech designs like the Hellbringer Prime.
(Of course, the Hellbringer Prime is funny as hell. As said on the official forums, "the Hellbringer isn't just bad, it is bad with balls".)
Poodlestrike
Banned
The one hard-and-fast rule of fan Q&A sessions is that half the questions will be mindnumbingly poorly informed. Like how ever Halo release attracts a bevy of perfectly sincere "will it have multi" questions.
I was reading the thread on their forums with a bunch of interesting questions, yet the hosts doesn't seem to use any of them. It's frustrating to listen to them pick questions about "will mechs be able to prone?", "can I give my mechwarrior a beard?", and all kinds of questions that no one cares about.
Rough notes that I'm too tired to clean up, but not much new:
Update coming later on how this new unlocked sretch goal of Drpoship customization
Design team enjoying the debate in the comments section.
Chris Erhart who unfortunately passed away last year got Jordan on board on Infocom to make Crescent Hawk games.
Mechwarrior 1 was a learning exercise
Mechwarrior 2 a very long development, two versions.
Mitch: I remember when MW2 was coming out and I was making children's game and someone loaded it up and showed it off and I thought "to hell with this" and then wanted to contact Jordan about this.
Microsoft launched a Sidewinder with a torso specifically for the game (according to Jordan)
MW2 was the leading edge technology back then
Mitch: Mechcommander was in development for a while before Mitch came on. Jordan: we were in development of Mechwarrior and we wanted to explore the universe from a different perspective. More as the role of as in the tabletop. Looked what happened in the RTS space and look what could make sense there. But Battletech doesn't have factories and buildings that pump out units. Instead we chose to deal in a different way. Here we wanted the continuity of resources carrying through the whole game.
After the first title, what was the experience: Mechcommander 2 - we started Mechcommander Gold in Chicago and when Microsoft bought FASA they had to move to Seattle. Finished Mechcommander Gold before moving to Seattle. Mitch finally had a say in concept development, which he didn't for Mechcommander Gold. VTOL, Fog of War, Live action video cutscenes, more battletech more fun.
Mike: As far as Shadowrun, we put a lot of thought into the storytelling, some of the ways we can create characters, so even though Battletech is different, same storytelling principles apply.
Challenge in merging open-ended campaign and storytelling and keep on advancing your mercenary unit.
What is going at HBS now? Prototypes, storyboards? A lot of look and feel of the game. Concepting the systems that will need to create for the visuals of the game, design and engineering iterating on the gameplay/combat systems right now. Do their homework, experiment, and hone in on whats fun about Battletech, third path: Planning ahead, project schedule, milestones, funding updates, setting the technical framework, chreating the right architecture for the game, lots of design documents for all the extended mercenary campaign. Tons more systems to spec out.
Feedback from backers can be very positive and learn from bakcer conversations.
Talk about the positives and negatives about Kickstarter transparency and fan demands and feedback.
Questions from the audience:
Hiring pilots dont come with new mechs
Concept of morale we want to address. E.g. how pilots will be affected. Still being explored.
Reserve a callsign before.
Fluid camera goals with a fully 3D game. Light cinematic presentations for attacks, still exploring how much we can do.
Stackpole novella will be Kickstarter exclusive for a limited time depending on licensing.
Physical items: Any progresso non that? They are working with Topps to produce some merchandise in support of the game, we are hopeful but nothing so far.
Story layer on the procedural generation campaign. The goal is to both make it ungoing challenging and on the tactical side. They want to avoid making it too easy or that its just whack-a-mech. The stages of the Kickstarter is somewhat representative of the development side.
DLC? First we develop thjis game then we can look into more DLC or the next campaign. Got exciting ideas for future installments, but really change up how the game is. Always in motion.
Paint schemes/camo/battle damage: Maybe 3 different colors and then a paint scheme/pattern.
Mercenary emblem will be all over the place.
Jordan wont do retcons to Battletech. Avoid the whole Han shot first. Core of the universe that the technology is in decline.
They make fun of aliens, time travel, and shields in Battletech. Its pretty entertaining.
PGI has an announcement to make about more Unseen.
If we have the rights to sell stuff, we would definitely sell you stuff. (aka we dont have the rights).
Flanking maneuvers and scouting to make light mechs useful
Destructible environments: If its man-made we like it to be destructible. We dont know yet, but we wont to be able to smash things.
Verticality: talking about having mechs jumpjet on buildings. But challenging and may be out of scope.
Dark Age: Would Jordan change it if he could? They were looking for a way to have a wider range of mechs. Would I change it? Yeah I would change some things. More broadly accessible, only partially successful. It brought combined arms much more to the front, but from a fiction standpoint it was only partially successful.
Days like Xcom in the dropship screen.
A bunch of irrelevant questions that I zoned out of.
Update coming later on how this new unlocked sretch goal of Drpoship customization
Design team enjoying the debate in the comments section.
Chris Erhart who unfortunately passed away last year got Jordan on board on Infocom to make Crescent Hawk games.
Mechwarrior 1 was a learning exercise
Mechwarrior 2 a very long development, two versions.
Mitch: I remember when MW2 was coming out and I was making children's game and someone loaded it up and showed it off and I thought "to hell with this" and then wanted to contact Jordan about this.
Microsoft launched a Sidewinder with a torso specifically for the game (according to Jordan)
MW2 was the leading edge technology back then
Mitch: Mechcommander was in development for a while before Mitch came on. Jordan: we were in development of Mechwarrior and we wanted to explore the universe from a different perspective. More as the role of as in the tabletop. Looked what happened in the RTS space and look what could make sense there. But Battletech doesn't have factories and buildings that pump out units. Instead we chose to deal in a different way. Here we wanted the continuity of resources carrying through the whole game.
After the first title, what was the experience: Mechcommander 2 - we started Mechcommander Gold in Chicago and when Microsoft bought FASA they had to move to Seattle. Finished Mechcommander Gold before moving to Seattle. Mitch finally had a say in concept development, which he didn't for Mechcommander Gold. VTOL, Fog of War, Live action video cutscenes, more battletech more fun.
Mike: As far as Shadowrun, we put a lot of thought into the storytelling, some of the ways we can create characters, so even though Battletech is different, same storytelling principles apply.
Challenge in merging open-ended campaign and storytelling and keep on advancing your mercenary unit.
What is going at HBS now? Prototypes, storyboards? A lot of look and feel of the game. Concepting the systems that will need to create for the visuals of the game, design and engineering iterating on the gameplay/combat systems right now. Do their homework, experiment, and hone in on whats fun about Battletech, third path: Planning ahead, project schedule, milestones, funding updates, setting the technical framework, chreating the right architecture for the game, lots of design documents for all the extended mercenary campaign. Tons more systems to spec out.
Feedback from backers can be very positive and learn from bakcer conversations.
Talk about the positives and negatives about Kickstarter transparency and fan demands and feedback.
Questions from the audience:
Hiring pilots dont come with new mechs
Concept of morale we want to address. E.g. how pilots will be affected. Still being explored.
Reserve a callsign before.
Fluid camera goals with a fully 3D game. Light cinematic presentations for attacks, still exploring how much we can do.
Stackpole novella will be Kickstarter exclusive for a limited time depending on licensing.
Physical items: Any progresso non that? They are working with Topps to produce some merchandise in support of the game, we are hopeful but nothing so far.
Story layer on the procedural generation campaign. The goal is to both make it ungoing challenging and on the tactical side. They want to avoid making it too easy or that its just whack-a-mech. The stages of the Kickstarter is somewhat representative of the development side.
DLC? First we develop thjis game then we can look into more DLC or the next campaign. Got exciting ideas for future installments, but really change up how the game is. Always in motion.
Paint schemes/camo/battle damage: Maybe 3 different colors and then a paint scheme/pattern.
Mercenary emblem will be all over the place.
Jordan wont do retcons to Battletech. Avoid the whole Han shot first. Core of the universe that the technology is in decline.
They make fun of aliens, time travel, and shields in Battletech. Its pretty entertaining.
PGI has an announcement to make about more Unseen.
If we have the rights to sell stuff, we would definitely sell you stuff. (aka we dont have the rights).
Flanking maneuvers and scouting to make light mechs useful
Destructible environments: If its man-made we like it to be destructible. We dont know yet, but we wont to be able to smash things.
Verticality: talking about having mechs jumpjet on buildings. But challenging and may be out of scope.
Dark Age: Would Jordan change it if he could? They were looking for a way to have a wider range of mechs. Would I change it? Yeah I would change some things. More broadly accessible, only partially successful. It brought combined arms much more to the front, but from a fiction standpoint it was only partially successful.
Days like Xcom in the dropship screen.
A bunch of irrelevant questions that I zoned out of.
Robottiimu2000
Member
One of the BIG things about BT is that to you can build your units. IMO almost all the kosher units suck if you think about the solely on their design. If you make your own mechs you pretty much always can make better ones. Almost all mechs are designed to be "good" at all ranges which makes them actually bad at all of them... Though recently I've been loving playing with the kosher units.
There are tons of ways to balance out BT like item availability and money. I find that money is actually one of the best ways of balancing the game, though you rarely find people using it.
Ofcourse some of the weapons would need tweaking like the medium laser which is just OP. But when you play a campaing with limited supplie availability and limited money, and with repairing and salvaging the game really shines, compared to a game where you just pick up or build units from a list to your liking according to some arbitary number of BV.
Who likes even matches anyway?!
But this also what makes the battletech a great game, there are several different ways to play it, wheter you build your units or go with kosher units you can modify the way you choose to play to that best suiting your style and needs.
edit:
Banderdash
Member
Genuinely surprised there's no talk of having the Northwind Highlanders in the skirmish mode.