Will there be a thread for Bayonetta 2 that's exempt from gender debates/discussion? I'm a relic from the 90s that doesn't find that side of the modern gaming discourse to be entertaining, enlightening or worthwhile.
I'm assuming that I'm going to have to avoid all NeoGAF B2 threads from now on damnit. It's a shame as the game looks godtier. WiiU purchase incoming.
I've had this account sitting here for years (and for so long that I don't remember why I picked this stupid username in the first place), and while somewhat props to Arthur Gies for discussing female objectification, nothing brings forth my ire more than dismissing Bayonetta as cheap fanservice. What I love to bits about Bayonetta is that - intentionally or not - Platinum made one of the most positive female characters in gaming. Bayo gets my big ol' feminist stamp of approval. The only real problem with Bayonetta is not the character herself, but that she exists in such a lacking female character vacuum. After the edge-blunting of both Samus and Lara, she's the only female power fantasy character in gaming we've got left - and it just so happens that the only female power fantasy character we have left is an incredibly sexual one. (My comfort thought is that Bayonetta is the most impressive power fantasy in gaming, regardless of gender. Punting a god into the sun with her hair, when will your faves ever?)
Playing the Bayonetta 2 demo made me remember how much I relished her character, and the freedom that she brings. Bayonetta is a sexual character that is never, ever punished for her enjoyment of her sexuality. How often does that happen in ANY medium? The camera never exploits or objectifies her in a way that she doesn't know about or actively acknowledge. (Negative examples: Poor Miranda from Mass Effect 2, and personally as of this week, Cia's slow camera pan introduction Hyrule Warriors pissed me off.) The best example of this is in Bayonetta 1 when she's in shock over possibly losing Luka. The camera pulls back and focuses on her, and respects her. Her emotional reaction is more important than that of a cheap fan-service shot. (Looking at you, ME2.) When Jeanne is grabbed in the B2 demo, Bayonetta immediately stops teasing, and the camera once again respects her. My favourite Luka moment with her in B1 is when they're with Cereza, and Bayonetta runs off to protect THEM - and you don't doubt for a moment she's beyond capable of it. I remember sitting there slackjawed, as it was such a rare thing to see, regardless of the medium. Bayonetta's relationship with Jeanne is wonderful, too, and passes the Bechdel Test with flying colours. Their relationship is hilarious, but touching, and somewhere between BFFs and badass rivals. I love Jeanne herself, from her to design to her foul mouth to her badass motorcycle. Seeing them fight side by side again in the new demo was amazing. I will absolutely say that Jeanne getting demon fingered while be dragged to hell was cheap and crap, though. What the hell, Platinum?
Bayonetta is also treated with respect in gameplay. Her attack reactions outside of taunts are NEVER sexual, they're gruff and guttural, and always realistic. She gives a punch, she takes a punch. (Negative example: Vanille in FFXIII. I'm pretty sure taking a step would give that girl an orgasm.) Bayonetta isn't some delicate waif that holds back on strength to be appealing. When's she's using Shuraba, she's going to gut you with a goddamn sword. When she's using Kilgore, she's blowing the shit out of things with giant guns attached to her arms and legs, and most likely destroying balance on the leaderboards in the process. When she's using Durga, her attacks are strong and weighty. When she's skating around with Odette, she's elegant as hell. Platinum respects her character in cutscenes, and they respect her in gameplay. Her voice actress casting in both English and Japanese has also been incredible, as she's no-nonsense, confident and snarky no matter what the language. She's not a cutesty sexualised girl, she's a grown woman with her control of her own sexuality and a relatable disgust for cockroaches.
(Obvious shout out Shimazaki and her incredible designs on all the characters, especially Bayonetta herself. It's fascinating to have a female character that was designed to be sexual, that was then filtered a female fashion gaze. Even Luka and Rodin didn't escape it!)
Tear into CD Projekt Red, to Vanillaware, to Koei Tecmo and Team Ninja, for their treatment of sexuality and women. Tear into those bloody cinematic designers for Mass Effect 2 and 3 that thought Miranda's ass was more important than her face and respecting her character. Platinum's not close to perfect, but if you're going to have a female character with sexuality, the Bayonetta team gets a hell of a lot closer to the vast majority at getting it right.
I know we've only seen snippets of it, but GODDAMN to that opening scene where she's walking along in her fur lined dress in her Louis Vuitton heels, and she doesn't even flinch at kicking a plane. Playing the demo, too, I'd forgotten how much of a freeing rush it was to play as her. There's no one like Bayonetta. These high review scores-! Bring it on, Nintendo!
(Hi, I have passionate feelings about video game characters that use their hair to beat the shit out of angels. I know, I know, Junior Members with opinions and a semi-thread derail, yuck. Kudos to Monocle above who said the same thing, but better, and with a lot less words.)
Will there be a thread for Bayonetta 2 that's exempt from gender debates/discussion? I'm a relic from the 90s that doesn't find that side of the modern gaming discourse to be entertaining, enlightening or worthwhile.
I'm assuming that I'm going to have to avoid all NeoGAF B2 threads from now on damnit. It's a shame as the game looks godtier. WiiU purchase incoming.
Sometimes I wish I could be a woman.Sometimes, I wish I could be half the woman Bayonetta is.
Might have to finally get a Wii U...
Reminds me of Zero Escape: Great review scores, crappy sales.Nice scores. Sucks that the game is gonna sell like absolute crap.
Reminds me of Zero Escape: Great review scores, crappy sales.
Why do the good games get ignored while Destiny sells buckets? *Sigh*
Indeed, it is why we keep getting Adam Sandler films and Michael Bay keeps directing.It happens in like, any existing medium ever
"Though I was disappointed by some of the familiarity..."
Really enjoyed this post and hope it gets more recognition, especially as I find Mirandas bloody arse takes up more screen time than her face half the time. I'm sure they were proud of what they sculpted there, but at some point they may as well have made it a plot point and drew a face on it so it's where she talked from and could be where she showed her emotions...
And don't get me started on goddamn Vanille. I may have actually made it past the 20 hour mark where it allegedly gets good if it wasn't for here annoying high orgasmic voice.
Alright it's 5am here so I'll attempt to put something at least a bit coherent out there.I agree on the first part, but I completely disagree with you on the second. Would you care to explain why you think so rather than asserting a "full stop"? I'm genuinely curious.
And don't get me started on goddamn Vanille. I may have actually made it past the 20 hour mark where it allegedly gets good if it wasn't for here annoying high orgasmic voice.
Game Informer
This one just jumped out at me as a pretty weird complaint to throw at a sequel.
Very good reviews all around. Although, some reviews seem to have docked a fairly significant amount of points even after highly praising the game as a whole. Huh? Anyway... HYPED!
Will there be a thread for Bayonetta 2 that's exempt from gender debates/discussion? I'm a relic from the 90s that doesn't find that side of the modern gaming discourse to be entertaining, enlightening or worthwhile.
I'm assuming that I'm going to have to avoid all NeoGAF B2 threads from now on damnit. It's a shame as the game looks godtier. WiiU purchase incoming.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
Non Wii U owner here, paid for a copy to give to my friend who's going through a rough time at the moment. He loved the first one
The Evil Within and Bayonetta 2, back to back! You can backlog when you're dead.After all the thrills of The Last of Us, and scare me shitless Alien Isolation, I think a good sit down with Bayo 2 will be very welcoming. Reviews are looking really good so I'll probably pick this up in the next month or so. The backlog must be cleared.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
You think the discussion about the game has been good otherwise? There's hardly been that much of any gameplay talk about it. It's mostlyWill there be a thread for Bayonetta 2 that's exempt from gender debates/discussion? I'm a relic from the 90s that doesn't find that side of the modern gaming discourse to be entertaining, enlightening or worthwhile.
I'm assuming that I'm going to have to avoid all NeoGAF B2 threads from now on damnit. It's a shame as the game looks godtier. WiiU purchase incoming.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
Perhaps for Alabama. ;-)I hate to say it but Gies is spot on.
This is one step too far.
Really happy to see this game getting the stellar review scores it deserves. Hopefully these scores will pique enough people's interests that the sales are decent.
That said, people in the OT will probably concentrate mostly on the gameplay.
You know even if Bayonetta 2 underperforms, I still think we will get a third game. A Bayonetta 3 would be an excellent launch title for Nintendos next hardware, be it handheld or console.
Platinum Games did the unthinkable and made a game even better than the original; loaded with humor, sexuality, action and bigger than life setpieces, Bayonetta 2 is the pinnacle of its genre, an absolutely brilliant action game that will be hard to overcome.
Hoping so. It's already hurt sales for the fact that only the WiiU is giving this game a chance. PG needs every cent they get to put towards a Bayo3.
I've only played the demo of the first game so I'm freely admitting that I do not have all the information necessary to reach a full conclusion. Just as an outsider who has mostly seen trailers, it's actually made me want to play the games less.
But hey, I enjoyed Lolipop Chainsaw so I can be won over.
Remember boy's we need to buy multiple copies to show platinum we need a Bayo 3.
Waiting on my lottery win so I can have a Scrooge McDuck vault of them to swim through.
Non Wii U owner here, paid for a copy to give to my friend who's going through a rough time at the moment. He loved the first one
Got 3, am i good?
I have a limited leather bound edition and a regular-ass edition on pre-order. I may gift a couple of standards to friends and family too.
I am doing my part.
But I'm not rich... I can't afford to buy more than 4 copies at once a month
this is my trouble with the series. I don't dislike Bayonetta as a character, I dislike the way they show her off. I just can't stand it. I try to see it the way other people do, to be able to buy the games and enjoy them but it's just too hard :/Part of the problem is, from what I've seen, Bayonetta games do suffer from an inconsistency. Character animation, voice acting, and character design are all communicating a hyper-sexualized character who is entirely in control of their own sexuality. However the camera movements do then undo some of that by reverting back to almost voyeuristic male gaze swooping and zooming.
It would be a great way for both parties to break even as well. I mean think about it, Bayo 3 would sell well as a launch title.