Support NeoGAF

[inm8num2]

I love how Kim has stuck it to Howard twice now (first in the hearing: "Who's the other Hamlin?"). On one hand I can understand Howard being in a tough position of trying to run the firm, keep clients happy, deal with Chuck's illness, steer the firm clear of the McGill brothers' endless quarrel, etc. On the other hand, the way Howard treated Kim last season was really shitty, and she's 100% right about how ultimately it was wrong to hide Chuck's illness from clients.

Also, it's a shame the first letters of each episode title can't be used to spell "Huell's Back".

 

[Madouu]

Slippin' Jimmy literally came back in this one. I love it. We also got to see him dip his toes into being a criminal lawyer with the scene during community service. You could practically see the dollar signs in his eyes. He made $700 for less than 5 minutes of work.

To me, the most important there was that the guy stuck to the agreement and paid him fair and square, unlike the two guys from the music store that backpedaled on what was agreed upon. I feel like that was much more of an eye opener for him than just the effort>$ ratio.

It's also a question of respect, the guy respected him for what he has done there and treated him almost like a genius, something he didn't get much of in normal practice. Sure there is a feeling of satisfaction in helping old people, but it doesn't come close to this. Jimmy needs this kind of recognition and this will pull him to the other side. He loves having someone there, a witness that can see how he outplays the system, it was his friend before, and then it was Kim, and from now on it might be every criminal he takes in and witnesses him work his magic.

 

[minor effort]

Also, it's a shame the first letters of each episode title can't be used to spell "Huell's Back".

too bad nacho didn't have huell last night to make the switch. there would have been no tension whatsoever, wouldn't have even needed to break the danged air conditioner.

 

[Niraj]

it's okay. gus is on it.

I don't know. I can't help but feel like things are eventually going to blow up in Gus' face.

 

[ColdPizza]

I don't know. I can't help but feel like things are eventually going to blow up in Gus' face.

lol

 

[Creaking]

Sabotaging the AC, beyond the jacket, meant they'd need a fan. So that can easily seen as being deliberate.

Sabotaging the AC also masked his nervous sweatiness.

 

[Fried Food]

I feel like all the time between this and the previous episode, hurt this episode.

 

[Oddduck]

It disappoints me to see people deriding this season for being too slow and that "nothing's happening!". I love how this show is paced.

I think Seasons 1 and 2 felt better paced than the current season.

Still, Season 3 has been great television, so I'm not complaining.

 

[Crimson-Death]

To me, the most important there was that the guy stuck to the agreement and paid him fair and square, unlike the two guys from the music store that backpedaled on what was agreed upon. I feel like that was much more of an eye opener for him than just the effort>$ ratio.

It's also a question of respect, the guy respected him for what he has done there and treated him almost like a genius, something he didn't get much of in normal practice. Sure there is a feeling of satisfaction in helping old people, but it doesn't come close to this. Jimmy needs this kind of recognition and this will pull him to the other side. He loves having someone there, a witness that can see how he outplays the system, it was his friend before, and then it was Kim, and from now on it might be every criminal he takes in and witnesses him work his magic.

This is excellent. Perfect analysis of what the writers had in mind there, all the psychological tidbits and pieces were there in the episode, including the story of Slippin' Jimmy's coin collection. It shows us exactly why he is going to decide to be the shady Saul Goodman, despite trying to be a good man for Kim.

And this season seemed to be much better paced than the last one, and definitely better paced than the first, not that I complained about them at all. And not only is it better paced, things moved crisply. Much better than the first 3 seasons of Breaking Bad anyway, but those there were deliberate anyway.

 

[SpaceWolf]

Fun game I like to play while watching this show: count how many times Kim is seen wearing a blue item of clothing. The results may shock you!

In a flashback scene, when the lab barely received it's equipment and Gus and Gale are going back and forth about it, Gale talks about testing the product from Walt and he talks about how much better the cook is who made that batch, which convinces Gus to work wtih Walt.

The lab wasn't even set up at that point and Gus and Walt had already been introduced so the lab could not have been up and running earlier than late 2008/early 2009.

Ah, interesting. Thank you for the clarification.

In that case, yeah, I totally agree with you. Seems the writers pulled the trigger on Gus buying the laundromat way to quickly.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Chuck currently reenacting the microwave tunnel scene from MGS4.

Chuck = Old Snake

Hahaha glad I wasn't the only one who thought of that.

It was a good scene but the pills would obviously make noise when he threw it in the pocket but w/e cant look at ll the small details.
He couldve just gotten the coffee and as he was bringing it back, slid the pills in slowly as he was kneeling next to him or something

Why didn't Nacho just wait for him to go to the bathroom or something.

I knooooow right? Or just pretend your shoe's untie and crouch down or whatever.

But, it wouldn't make for such tense TV that way, so I can't really fault them too much.

 

[-griffy-]

Ah, interesting. Thank you for the clarification.

In that case, yeah, I totally agree with you. Seems the writers pulled the trigger on Gus buying the laundromat way to quickly.

I mean, he's going to want to establish the laundromat as a legitimate business before he puts a meth lab in it. Not to mention he's not even at the point where he's manufacturing his own meth in the US yet.

 

[SpaceWolf]

I mean, he's going to want to establish the laundromat as a legitimate business before he puts a meth lab in it. Not to mention he's not even at the point where he's manufacturing his own meth in the US yet.

Well, I mean, doesn't that kind of back-up the argument the writers have put the laundromat in play too early?

 

[-griffy-]

Well, I mean, doesn't that kind of back-up the argument the writers have put the laundromat in play too early?

No, my point is he's playing the long game. Buy the laundromat now, get it up and running and established as a legit business over the span of years, then you have it in place when you are ready to make your own meth stateside.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Maybe for some reason he delays buying the laundromat?

 

[Cornballer]

- Podcast is up

Gilligan, Gould, the regular hosts, Patrick Fabian, writer Heather Marion, and a costume designer this week.

They note on the podcast this week that the bandaid box from the opener here (filled with coins) is also seen in the pilot of BCS when Saul opens up the shoe box with the VCR cassettes and other items during the black and white intro. They mention that we don't know what's stored in the bandaid box in the present day scenes.


EDIT: They also mention that the director, Adam Bernstein, is ridiculously diverse in his talents and directed episodes 2 & 3 of Breaking Bad along with the pilots of Fargo, 30 Rock, Scrubs, and Oz, among other things.

 

[Grinchy]

In a flashback scene, when the lab barely received it's equipment and Gus and Gale are going back and forth about it, Gale talks about testing the product from Walt and he talks about how much better the cook is who made that batch, which convinces Gus to work wtih Walt.

The lab wasn't even set up at that point and Gus and Walt had already been introduced so the lab could not have been up and running earlier than late 2008/early 2009.

Maybe it's all intentional. Gus is a very careful man. Maybe he wanted to get the laundromat up and running and to have it be a very legitimate business before he brought in millions of dollars of lab equipment to start cooking meth in it.

 

[SpaceWolf]

Maybe it's all intentional. Gus is a very careful man. Maybe he wanted to get the laundromat up and running and to have it be a very legitimate business before he brought in millions of dollars of lab equipment to start cooking meth in it.

Wouldn't it be easier to buy the place and build the underground lab first before turning it into a legitimate business as opposed to the other way around?

 

[Veelk]

Wouldn't it be easier to buy the place and build the underground lab first before turning it into a legitimate business as opposed to the other way around?

Well, that's another thing. Building an entire underground space without anyone noticing anything would probably be a huge and methodical endeavor. So many workers to pay off.

8 years is going to be a bit much regardless of anything, but I could see it taking a long while.

 

[Nowise10]

Nacho scene was amazing, was on the edge of my seat the entire time. Felt like something was not going to go right.

 

[Cornballer]

- YahooTV: ‘Better Call Saul’ Postmortem: Peter Gould and Michael McKean Talk Chuck’s Hope, Slippin’ Jimmy, and Mike’s Dead Body Find

We’ve all been looking at this as, “When is Jimmy going to become Saul?” Is that the wrong question? It seems like we’re learning more and more that Jimmy’s always been Saul in a way. He does have this anger in him, this bitterness, and maybe we didn’t see it, because, as Chuck has said, everybody loves Jimmy. We’ve focused on the good, fun, charming things in him. But now we’re starting to see, in that flashback scene for instance, that he’s had this anger, this bitterness about his parents’ failure — what he sees as their failures — with their business. Have we been asking the wrong question? He isn’t really becoming Saul, he’s just revealing, has revealed, more of these less endearing aspects of himself?

Gould: This is going beyond drama into the question of do people change? People seem to change, but are they really changing or are they revealing new aspects that were always there? Those are things, man, we talk about them all the time in the writer’s room, and in life we talk about them all the time. “How could this person do that?” Well, I understand how you draw a line from this to that. We tend to put them in psychological terms, maybe they’re philosophical, too. We certainly say Saul Goodman’s an identity that a man takes on for reasons, and hopefully as we go, those reasons will come about and some of them are going to be purely logical and some of them are going to be emotional. Interestingly enough, sometimes it’s easier for me to see the emotional reasons that people do things, but the truth is, in real life, most people will give you a functional reason for all their decisions. Sometimes the functional reason, which, arguably, the self-deception, is harder to understand than the emotional reason. Boy, that’s heavy. Maybe that’s almost too abstract.

- YahooTV: ‘Better Call Saul’ Postmortem: Patrick Fabian Talks the Howard vs. Kim Showdown and His HHM Partnership with Chuck

The big showdown… When we see Howard approach Kim at the restaurant and he insists that she remain seated, we might initially think he’s jabbing her for the sake of jabbing her, or because he’s still upset that she left the firm. But as he explains later, he’s there wining and dining HHM’s clients to repair the firm’s reputation after the bar hearing. He’s doing that three meals a day, he tells her, which explains why he would be angry. But is that all that’s behind that?

First of all, I believe it’s the first time we’ve seen Howard actually doing field work, right? Even when we were doing the deposition for Mesa Verde, that was Chuck doing the work. Howard was just sitting there as a nod to the judges, you know what I mean? And so now, Howard is literally like he just stepped out of law school, having to take his clients out to stay the hemorrhage, and this hemorrhage comes directly from Jimmy and Kim. However, one of the great things that binds Chuck and Howard is their sense of manners, and that there’s a sense of how you behave in this and in the world.

So, we’re in that restaurant, and I see Kim. It would be rude and wrong to not go over and acknowledge her, so, of course I’m going to go over and acknowledge them. And I understand the situation; they understand the situation. But nonetheless, I’m going to inquire about it. I’m going to find out how they’re doing, and I’m going to compliment Kim. The fact that she reads the “don’t get up” [as an insult]… I can easily justify that as Howard literally being nice, saying “No, you don’t have to get up. I’m just literally here for a second to say hello.” The fact that she takes it the way she does and then throws that check at me, Howard finds so distasteful.

When Kim left the firm back in Season 2, there was a begrudging admiration. I’ve done my job well, too well — she wasn’t going to stick around and get her name on the wall. She decided to fly the coop. But my gift to her, I think, comes from that actual love that Howard has for her. He thinks of her as his protégé. He chose her over Jimmy, so when he gave that gift, that’s Howard giving away money. That’s him… as close as Howard can come to kissing Kim Wexler, that’s as close as it gets. That’s typical… you know what I mean? “I’m going to take money out of my account and say, ‘Don’t worry about that. That’s a gift.'” And so, for her to turn around, leave me, then grill me on the stand, then force me to go to lunch like a first year, and then throw that money in my face? That gets in my grill, and we see that play out at the valet. Howard’s not going to take that. He’s not going to cash that check. She’s made her own bed.

- AMC Interview: Michael Mando (Nacho Varga)

Q: With Tuco in jail, Nacho has stepped into his role. Is that a job he initially wanted?

A: I never thought that Nacho wanted a career in the criminal world. I felt he got into it because he needed money for something in particular. It’s like sinking sand – he’s slowly getting caught up in it – but I don’t think it’s where his ambitions are. I think he feels the Salamancas act way too impulsively and don’t have a very clear perspective or foresight. Their actions are usually counter-productive, dangerous and unnecessary. I think that’s what frustrates him. Nothing in that moment requires that kind of violence.

Q: Does Nacho think taking on more responsibility offers him a chance to show Hector a better way?

A: One thing I learned from Nacho is that the type of respect that truly matters is one that nobody can give or take from you: self-respect. Nacho has mastered that because he does not act upon his ego. He never does something to prove something to somebody else. If he ever does something, it’s out of conviction. I don’t think he cares what Hector really thinks of him. I think he wants to stay on Hector’s good side because that’s how he can survive for now, but I don’t think he frankly cares if Hector or anybody in the cartel is impressed with him.

Q: As you said, Hector is impulsive while Nacho operates with a much cooler head. Why do you think Nacho continues to work with a man who operates so differently from himself?

A: It’s very difficult to leave the drug game, especially when you live in a small city like Albuquerque. I think there are multiple pieces keeping him there – most of which we haven’t addressed yet, like why exactly is he trying to have so much money? What’s his end game? I think because of the fact that his father owns a shop there, he’s very dependent and as we see this season, he loves his father so much that he’s willing to put everything aside. In other words, if he were to leave Albuquerque, he would open up his father to a possible attack by the Salamancas if they were to look for him.

- AMC vid: Inside Better Call Saul Ep 8

The cast and creators discuss Jimmy’s rapid devolution into Saul and how Mike and Gus have further cemented their partnership.

 

[Socreges]

Timeline for Gus buying the lab in 2003 and it barely finishes in early 2009.

I don't think they planned that out very well. Forced the laundromat for that nostalgia.

Sabotaging the AC also masked his nervous sweatiness.

Yep, that too. Except:

+

Weather in Albuquerque NM on March 4 2003

😱

Spoiler

First off, yes it could be a different day. Although March would not be a hot month either way.

Secondly, no...doesn't matter. Still fun, though.

 

[Einchy]

Yep, that too. Except:

+

Weather in Albuquerque NM on March 4 2003

😱

Ah but you see it was hot in there because of the kitchen.

Spoiler

THEY'RE PLAYING 4-D CHESS

 

[SpaceWolf]

Yep, that too. Except:

+

Weather in Albuquerque NM on March 4 2003

😱

 

[CoffeeExpress]

Great episode.

Although Nacho should have just waited until hector went to the bathroom. The dude is like what, at least 60-70 ? I'm sure he is going pretty often.

 

[Blastoise]

I don't even care about Jimmy. Just make it the Mike and Gus Show.

 

[Cornballer]

- Podcast sequence via Warming Glow: Bob Odenkirk Precisely Pinpoints The Difference Between Jimmy And Saul Goodman On ‘Better Call Saul’

In this week’s episode, when Jimmy threatened the parks and rec guy with a lawsuit in order to free the drug dealer from his community service hours, that wasn’t exactly a move closer to Saul Goodman for Jimmy. “I don’t think that’s Saul,” Bob Odenkirk said on this week’s Better Call Saul Insider podcast. “That’s Jimmy. That’s who he is. That’s a facility he has. To manipulate other people and think about what matters to him and negotiate.”

It’s his ability to manipulate other people and negotiate, in fact, that makes Jimmy a good lawyer, but not necessarily Saul Goodman. If coming up with a quick scheme to allow Jimmy to rest his back while doing community service and freeing a drug dealer to make a deal is not Saul-like, then what is?

The difference between Jimmy and Saul is not in their actions, it’s in the consequences, Odenkirk says. “Saul is the guy who doesn’t really care about the collateral damage. And knows it. And is aware of it.”

While Jimmy sometimes “does things to hurt people,” Odenkirk continues, “it’s not the purpose of his schemes. He’s oblivious to the collateral damage. Or he doesn’t want to look at it.”

Saul, on the other hand, is more “fully mature. He’s fully aware of who is going to get hurt, and he doesn’t care. It’s about serving himself. So, when he makes those emotional choices without regard to the consequences, that’s when we’re getting in touch with Saul.”

“It’s not the name,” Odenkirk continues. “It’s not the fast talking. He did that when he was 16. He’s done that his whole life. It’s the growth of the character to an awareness that people get hurt by his schemes and then not caring. A choice to be mercenary.”

So why exactly does Jimmy turn into Saul Goodman? “It’s just getting his feelings hurt in life over and over,” Odenkirk presumes. Jimmy has learned the wrong lessons in life. “We very often feed our kids too many cookies because our parents wouldn’t give us cookies. That’s not the right lesson.” Giving cookies to your kids is fine, but it’s important to give the right amount of cookies.

in Saul, Jimmy gets his feelings hurt by Chuck, by Kim, and by Hamlin, and instead of being more careful of other people’s feelings, Jimmy McGill simply takes the wrong lesson in life and decides to double down by hurting other people even more.

That’s the journey of Jimmy McGill to Saul Goodman. In other words, we’ll know that Saul Goodman has arrived when Jimmy hatches a scheme fully knowing that it will result in someone else’s emotional pain, and he goes through with it anyway, indifferent to the consequences.

 

[Oathbreaker]

Nacho my hero.

 

[Fuu]

.

 

[crisdecuba]

- Podcast sequence via Warming Glow: Bob Odenkirk Precisely Pinpoints The Difference Between Jimmy And Saul Goodman On ‘Better Call Saul’

This was great - wonderful insight into the character from Bob. Also, thank you for all your efforts in these threads. From time to time I go back to the season 5 threads to re-read real time reactions and that wouldn't be possible without your efforts. Kudos to you!

 

[Cornballer]

- LA Times interview: 'Better Call Saul' stars Jonathan Banks and Giancarlo Esposito break bad a second time

 

[riotous]

Mike knows the money will go in a business of some sort so he can launder the money. Gus respects Mike and family. Thats why I am assuming it will be the laundromat.

I personally don't think so:
- That defies what Gus says to Mike about Hector finding out they are involved, Mike would end up an employee of Gus via the laundromat in order to launder the money.
- If Mike is being paid via the laundromat, he'd have been instantly identified in BB by the cops when the drug lab is fou d. I dont remember if that happens?

 

[zewone]

Mike was agreeing to work for Gus as a fixer/hitman in order for Gus to provide a legal way to get that money to his daughter in law.

At least, that's what I got from the scene.

 

[CHC]

Man that pill swap scene was fucking white knuckle. I mean, you kind of knew how it was going to go but nevertheless.... really a pulse-pounder. I don't see Nacho surviving the whole show though, unfortunately.

To me, the most important there was that the guy stuck to the agreement and paid him fair and square, unlike the two guys from the music store that backpedaled on what was agreed upon. I feel like that was much more of an eye opener for him than just the effort>$ ratio.

It's also a question of respect, the guy respected him for what he has done there and treated him almost like a genius, something he didn't get much of in normal practice. Sure there is a feeling of satisfaction in helping old people, but it doesn't come close to this. Jimmy needs this kind of recognition and this will pull him to the other side. He loves having someone there, a witness that can see how he outplays the system, it was his friend before, and then it was Kim, and from now on it might be every criminal he takes in and witnesses him work his magic.

That's a really good takeaway. This show is nothing if not nuanced.

 

[I-hate-u]

- Podcast sequence via Warming Glow: Bob Odenkirk Precisely Pinpoints The Difference Between Jimmy And Saul Goodman On ‘Better Call Saul'

Makes perfect sense to me. Saul was perfectly fine with killing Badger, something I don't think Season 3 Jimmy would do. He's still far from his persona.

Something big has to happen soon (I am talking by the end of this season) unless they are gonna stretch this show as long as Breaking Bad,

 

[Dio Brando]

Makes perfect sense to me. Saul was perfectly fine with killing Badger, something I don't think Season 3 Jimmy would do. He's still far from his persona.

Something big has to happen soon (I am talking by the end of this season) unless they are gonna stretch this show as long as Breaking Bad,

seeing how vince gilligan ended BB, i dont think he would even entertain the idea of stretching BCS.

 

[Linius]

Also don't feel like Breaking Bad was 'stretched out' by any means. Well apart from the fact that they split the final season in two years. Don't suppose BCS is going to run any longer than needed. Will be surprised if it's going past 5 seasons.

 

[PHOENIXZERO]

Yep, that too. Except:

+

Weather in Albuquerque NM on March 4 2003

😱

Spoiler

First off, yes it could be a different day. Although March would not be a hot month either way.

Secondly, no...doesn't matter. Still fun, though.

Ehhh, easy enough to blame on the kitchen, even in the winter it can get unbearably hot though someone would've opened a door. *shrug*

 

[SpaceWolf]

No Season 4 order announcement yet? I constantly live in terror this show is going to wind up getting itself cancelled somehow, albeit probably foolishly.

 

[Hanmik]

Who was the corpse Mike dug up?

 

[Birbo]

Who was the corpse Mike dug up?

That innocent guy that died because of him.

 

[Cornballer]

No Season 4 order announcement yet?

Not yet, but it'll be fine. Don't worry about it.

Who was the corpse Mike dug up?

The good samaritan that was killed after Mike robbed the delivery last season.

 

[Hanmik]

That innocent guy that died because of him.

Ahh know I remember ._thanks

 

[SpaceWolf]

Who was the corpse Mike dug up?

The Good Samaritan from last season who Hector's gang end up wasting after he attempted to help their driver after Mike robbed one of their trucks. Didn't think that was particularly well telegraphed myself.

 

[Dangerblade]

Weren't people saying the corpse was the husband of the woman who works at the school that Mike became friendly with?

 

[Cornballer]

Weren't people saying the corpse was the husband of the woman who works at the school that Mike became friendly with?

Yes, but it's not the case.

- YahooTV interview with Peter Gould

There is also a wonderful opening scene with Mike, who has had very little dialogue in several of his most powerful scenes this season, but manages to tell us everything we need to know, of course, because Jonathan Banks is so great. Why did he specifically go to find Anita’s husband? Was it to give her closure because he’s interested in her?

Gould: Just to be clear, that’s not Anita’s husband.

Oh!

Gould: Remember, she said her husband vanished years ago… in [“Expenses”], she says her husband vanished years ago… she’s essentially saying she’s lost this person, and she wants closure because she doesn’t know what happened to the body. Mike is so dripping with guilt at all times, ever since we’ve met him, about his son, about so many things. About the things he did to avenge his son. If Chuck is starting to get to grips a little bit with the damage he’s done in his life, Mike is weighed down by [his damage] and is driven by it almost completely. Mike hears this from this woman, and he thinks to himself about the good Samaritan who died, really, because Mike had this clever idea that he thought would be zero impact, about raiding Hector’s truck. He goes out to make sure that body is found, and that’s what we intended. I know the bread crumbs are scattered, I understand that, but it’s not intended to be Anita’s husband… she says he was lost in a forest, and it was years ago. Mike’s not coincidentally meeting the wife of the victim, Hector’s victim. We never know what happened. We had talked about having Anita’s husband be MIA, in the military. We had talked about a lot of possibilities before we landed on the idea of the story as it’s told in that episode.

The husband, the missing husband, is he one of those situations where maybe we don’t need to know the rest of the story?

Gould: You know, all I can say is Tamara Tunie is wonderful, and this character has unfinished business.

 

[zewone]

Weren't people saying the corpse was the husband of the woman who works at the school that Mike became friendly with?

If it was, I want to know how Mike knew him or found him. The scene didn't make sense to me.

 

[SpaceWolf]

If it was, I want to know how Mike knew him or found him. The scene didn't make sense to me.

Mike knew where on the road he hijacked the truck. It was just a matter of searching for a body within the immediate area.

 

[Cornballer]

Mike knew where on the road he hijacked the truck. It was just a matter of searching for a body within the immediate area.

Mike asked Nacho for one more thing which was the approximate location of the body.

 

[SpaceWolf]

Mike asked Nacho for one more thing which was the approximate location of the body.

Totally forgot about that! There we go, then!