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Better Call Saul S3 |OT| Gus Who's Back - Mondays 10/9c on AMC
- Thread starter TheOddOne
- Start date
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Yep. Halt & Catch Fire is gonna make it to Season 4. Turn: Washington's​ Spies also, making it to Season 4. And those shows are generally ignored by critics and in the ratings. If AMC was tightening their belt, I feel like Into the Badlands and Preacher would be out the door before Better Call Saul.
Or tbey could be working out tbe details of contracts.
BizzyBum
Member
Not to derail the thread too much but was it bad? I am sorta waiting on Preacher and Badlands to get renewed for a 3rd season before I start watching.
flaxknuckles
Member
I didn't watch it because I heard it was a prequel and unfaithful to the comic.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
Jimmy has finally crossed the line for me. I understood everything he had to do (even if it wasn't moral), but taking advantage of old women just so he could get his payout and disregarding the fallout.
Also, funny that Chuck is still playing that fake healing card considering his reaction after Howard left was anything but feeling better.
Also, funny that Chuck is still playing that fake healing card considering his reaction after Howard left was anything but feeling better.
I suspect they're waiting to get final numbers before deciding whether or not they'll mandate S4 is the final season.
Final seasons, when announced and planned, for critically acclaimed TV shows, are generally ratings monsters. Look at Better Call Saul's predecessor. It would be shortsighted to cancel the show outright and leave that money/exposure on the table.
Seasoned Badger
Member
I feel like they really wanted to milk the Jimmy vs Chuck drama after season 1 when all I want to see is Saul go around building his connection to the underworld. If it wasn't for Mike's side of the story, I probably won't be as interested as I am.
Note that they're drinking Zafiro, the same drink Gus used to poison Eladio.
yeah i found that really tough to watch, this ranks the worst thing over anything in breaking bad.
lol
BreezyLimbo
Banned
its one thing to kill a person
it's one thing to have a person live in fear
But it's a complete other thing to strip a person of everyone that they love being with, to slowly strangle their relationships with other people, until they're nothing but a husk, sitting alone.
Netflix will get right on it as soon as it saves Hannibal
Just like after his win with Chuck. Kim even foreshadowed this with her comment to her friend. They tore down a sick and elderly man. Then Jimmy tore down an elderly woman.
The Giant
Banned
It's a good show. You just have to ignore the fans of the comic. They will always hate everything, cause it doesn't follow exactly what happens in the comix.
Better Call Saul's ratings are about on par with Breaking Bad's first two seasons' ratings.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Breaking_Bad_episodes
Why is everyone worrying?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Breaking_Bad_episodes
Why is everyone worrying?
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
It's far worse. Chuck was a jerk, and actively harmed Jimmy before and screwed him over many times. That old lady was 100% innocent and a total sweetheart.
#teamIrene
Baroquemantic
Member
Just finished watching the latest episode, and honestly, fuck Jimmy. What a shit thing to do to that woman. I'm glad his punk ass is working at a Cinnabon. And poor Kim. She overworked herself. Hope she can bounce back.
Jay Shadow
Member
Pretty standard for most show threads.
MomoPufflet
Member
It's going to be weird just watching Saul fuck people over and be a sleaze for an entire season, assuming there is another season. They'll be able to ramp up the stakes as he does shadier things I'm guessing, but it will be odd not having someone to root for. Really came to like Jimmy but those days are gone now.
Not even comparable. AMC was just getting into drama at that point. It's a totally different network now.
That said, I wouldn't be worried about S4. I also wouldn't be surprised if we get an announcement of two more seasons and that's it. We'll see.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
While I agree that Jimmy's actions were despicable, is not one person going to stand up and call out those old ladies for turning on their friend so easily?
It was pretty dumb that seemingly none of them talked to her about settling. They gave her the cold shoulder immediately.
brianmcdoogle
Member
Question: Has any critic of substance written about the difference of fan reaction to Kim Wexler and Skyler White.
dead souls
Member
Sometimes being an awful show will do that to you. Then again, sometimes you're an awful show and you're Walking Dead and a massive hit, so who knows?
Yeah I think two more seasons, or one large order (14-16 episodes) airing over two years MM/BB style, is the most we'll get out of the show which is fine by me. BCS is great but I'm always glad to see a show end before it starts to diminish in quality.
Walking dead has zombies and is a soap opera, what did Preacher have?
I don't feel there is much to write about. There is a massive difference both regarding how their characters are positioned in the story and how they are written. But most importantly, the culture is different for how female characters are perceived these days. Atleast a little.
While I'm sure that wasn't your intention, I feel like many people would frame that kind of exploration as a vindication. "See? This is a female character I like, so I wasn't being sexist when I called Skyler a nagging bitch!"
Edit: Well, I take that back. There is an honest exploration to be done with regards to how Kim is written vs how Skyler was. The most significant aspect of that being how Kim is in charge of her own life and career path, meaning she can be largely unconcerned with Jimmy fucking shit up unless she wants to be. Meanwhile, Skyler was a pregnant full time stay at home mom whose been married to walt for some 20 odd years. Their relationship is by its very nature more co-dependent than Kim and Jimmy's and Skyler simply cannot ignore Walt's misadventures the way Kim is free to. That is a compare and contrast worth exploring. But then again, that has little to do with fan reaction so much as exploring the writing itself, so it might not be what your looking for, but that's what I'd look into.
brianmcdoogle
Member
No, I really mean no intention in my question other than I wonder if someone wrote about the differences and similarities to the main female characters in each show and how the fans are reacting. Definitely not trying to excuse the people who hated Skyler (because those people were mostly loons and asses).
Well, not that I know of. Ask Cornballer, he keeps up to date on stuff written about this show.
The biggest hurdle that they created with Skyler was characterizing her in the early part of the show, especially Season 1, as an antagonist to Walt. The whole pilot is meant for the audience to sympathize with Walt, and part of that was making Skyler so emasculating.
They then in the later seasons (effectively, in my opinion), they attempt to morph her into a sympathetic victim. Part of the show's mission statement is to change the audience's perception of a character: in this show, just take a look at Howard, and at Chuck, and now at Jimmy. But a lot of people couldn't get over how Skyler seemed at first, and whether that tells you there's a fundamental issue about the way people react to women - fictional or otherwise - then feel free to think that. I do think that there is some element of that in a chunk of the fan base, yes.
Dio Brando
Banned
not that Jimmy was ever an avatar of honesty and goodness, but holy shit, i cannot remember the last time i was so pissed watching something. heartless monster.
I would say that even Season 1 people weren't reasonable with Skyler.
The only reason Skyler is an 'antagonist' is because Walt pre-emptively made her one by the fact that he lies to her, and her finding out about the lies (even before she finds out about the drug making) means that they are at odds.
Not to mention that her 'emasculating' isn't anything like that at all. She never diminishes Walt intentionally and works to do a lot to ensure his happiness. Like the whole birthday party thing, she goes out of her way to do for him. He's got self esteem issues and some things she does can be controlling or unintentionally annoying, but those are just human failings. She was always working from a place of good intent. I noticed this back when I watched the first episode of Fargo, and that series has a nagging wife character that truly engaged in passive aggression and demeaning wordplay. Skyler never did any of that. From episode 1, she only ever wanted the best for Walt. Walt's problem is that he just wanted money and to have a sense of control over his life. But she wasn't never the one who took that away from him.
People can justify Skylar's character all they want but I think it's pretty obvious she was created as a caricature and primarily as a foil for Walt's activities, which is the central thrust of the show, so they (perhaps unwittingly) set things up for people to not like her and it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with her being a woman, but of course many people as very simple and stupid about these kinds of things so you got comments like 'nagging bitch'. It's best to ignore voices from the sewer. Early on she simply represents the product of Walt's frustrated ambition. People forget how broad of a character she was in S1, because she shifted a lot towards being more intelligent and capable, and not just a clueless, judgmental suburbanite.
I'd say the transition never really fully worked, I mean she was more interesting later, but it always felt like they were trying to salvage what was really a fairly one dimensional character. Same with Marie, except with Marie they just dropped all of her storylines that didn't involve Hank. See, nobody hates Marie, because she barely existed for most of the show.
Breaking Bad wasn't about the women in the story. That is how it was designed.
Kim's in a different league, character wise. She's got her own entire thing going on and her relationship with Jimmy has never been the sole focus of her character, she's multi-faceted and has her own story going on at the same time. You could easily replace Jimmy from her story and replace it with some other instigating events, and most of her character would remain intact, because she's got her own motivations. She's the co-lead of the show along with Jimmy and Mike.
I think what I'm trying to say here is - you don't need to defend Skylar or else be doing a disservice to women in fiction. Skylar was poorly written at the beginning and positioned in such a way that yes she is an 'antagonist' to the show's plot going ahead. This is what the writers chose to do. As the show went on, they kind of realised they got that wrong and her character changed, but she could only be salvaged as a character so far. Breaking Bad isn't perfect, y'know?
I'd say the transition never really fully worked, I mean she was more interesting later, but it always felt like they were trying to salvage what was really a fairly one dimensional character. Same with Marie, except with Marie they just dropped all of her storylines that didn't involve Hank. See, nobody hates Marie, because she barely existed for most of the show.
Breaking Bad wasn't about the women in the story. That is how it was designed.
Kim's in a different league, character wise. She's got her own entire thing going on and her relationship with Jimmy has never been the sole focus of her character, she's multi-faceted and has her own story going on at the same time. You could easily replace Jimmy from her story and replace it with some other instigating events, and most of her character would remain intact, because she's got her own motivations. She's the co-lead of the show along with Jimmy and Mike.
I think what I'm trying to say here is - you don't need to defend Skylar or else be doing a disservice to women in fiction. Skylar was poorly written at the beginning and positioned in such a way that yes she is an 'antagonist' to the show's plot going ahead. This is what the writers chose to do. As the show went on, they kind of realised they got that wrong and her character changed, but she could only be salvaged as a character so far. Breaking Bad isn't perfect, y'know?
I don't want to get too deep into this debate because I haven't seen the first season of BB in years and I don't feel like talking BB too much in this thread anyway.
But from what I remember, I disagree completely. Writers faults, if they have them, tend to be ubiquitous throughout the show. You can either write a compelling character or you can't, and they wouldn't have been able to write Walt well if they couldn't write his most significant relationship well. Which is why "Just kill off X character" never actually fixes show's problems. Because it's never the characters, it's the writers.
Her arc is definitely slower than Walts since she's kept in the dark most of the game and is a side character (if a significant one) to Walt's major character status, but she still came off as a fully realized human being to me with her own mindset and mentality that both played off Walt in different ways. That's good character writing.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
Knew that was gonna happen with Kim with how hard she was working but goddamn at that cut. Jimmy is a desperate asshole. Chuck is gonna get fucked.
Yeah I don't wanna side track into it too much either, I suppose this was just a latent thought I had since Breaking Bad finished. I rewatched S1 and was kinda surprised by how broad some of it is, and that includes Skylar, but also other parts. It does get better quite quickly, though.
Anyway, you disagree, no problem!
One of my few problems with Breaking Bad is the characterization of all the non-Walt characters in Season 1. They are very thin. But pretty much immediately in Season 2, it gets much better! (Hank's panic attacks, Jesse and Jane, etc.)