-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Breaking Bad - Season 5 interim thread - the series concludes Summer 2013 on AMC
- Thread starter Cornballer
- Start date
- Status
triplestation
Member
Wow
Holy shit wow
Omg its forreeals 2 weeks away.....
So excited my face is just blank.....
Nameless
Member
Marie dealt with mostly all of this with Hank and didn't react like a passive aggressive child. The pregnancy might have be a valid excuse if Sky didn't pull the same shit after having Holly. Going Chris Hansen over some weed, spite fucking your boss, ...totally reasonable.
Funny how Skyler ultimately came to understand Walt's plight and just how far you have to go sometimes to protect those you love. Had she realized this earlier everyone could have saved some trouble.
Skyler never wanted Jesse and Walt to talk to eachother again. Walt/Jesse scenes...never again.
Think about that.
She hates Jesse.
She's clearly evil incarnate.
Also she fucked the biggest rat in history.
I understand her issue with her predicament that she was somewhat forced into and I often feel bad for her, but let's not act like she isn't a bitch. Just like Walt is an asshole.
Think about that.
She hates Jesse.
She's clearly evil incarnate.
Also she fucked the biggest rat in history.
I understand her issue with her predicament that she was somewhat forced into and I often feel bad for her, but let's not act like she isn't a bitch. Just like Walt is an asshole.
Black Mamba
Member
Marie dealt with it by going back to shoplifting, or really in this case open house item looting, and embarrassing Hank.
And Skyler fucking her boss was a reaction to Walt breaking into the home, after she had begged him to sign divorce papers, and refusing to leave and trying to show a sign of pure dominance over her (knowing she can't tell the police).
It's hilarious, people here don't think Gus slicing Victor's neck in front of Walt and Jesse to let them know (as Jesse put it) that while he can't kill them he can make their lives hell in a show of taking control back. Skyler does the same thing by fucking Ted and telling Walt (surprised more people don't notice this parallel) to take some control back from the man ruining her life.
And yes, what Skyler did was reasonable. Go re-watch what led up to it. Walt deserved much worse at that time.
lol, no she did not.
GAF can be hilarious. Skyler isn't some supermodel wife who brings you a beer and sucks your dick every night, so she's a terrible character. Woe be Walt. Now people are trying to claim that Walt wasn't ever happy with her, which is outrageous because if there's one thing that's unquestioned his Walt's utter devotion to Skyler. He goes to enormous lengths to not only make sure they have money (that she doesn't ask for) but her safety and intense desire not to lose her in his life. If Walt wasn't happy with her, he would not be fighting so damn hard for this. He's just a man who lost control.
Skyler's only mistake is her reciprocated love for Walt has clouded her judgment and she should have taken the lawyer's advice and turned him in and divorced him. Wouldn't have made for a very good show, of course, so I'm glad she didn't.
I'm at the point where I wish in the final scene Skyler stabs Walt in the back and then comes clean about how she's really Gus Fringe's wife from Chile and something something. Just to fuck with y'all.
Started watching this series in May and now I have caught up fully. The series is good but not as great as what many on here are claiming it to be. What I don't like about the show is that Walt and Jesse just keeps making the same stupid mistakes over and over again without really learning from them.
This whole "Skyler haters are misogynists" argument seems pretty weak to me. I'm still not a huge fan of the character, but I don't dislike her anywhere near as much as I did in seasons 1 - 3. The cause of this seems pretty clear to me: she's moved from an antagonist, to someone who assists Walt.
As much as I've grown to dislike Walt immensely, the show is still framed around him. God knows I hated Vic and Shane in The Shield, but that didn't stop me sympathising with them (final season of The Shield spoilers -
).
It's a simple fact that we're conditioned by TV shows to root for protagonists, even if we passively or actively dislike them. So when an obstacle arises (man or woman), we naturally dislike them.
To accuse me and many others of being a misogynist because of this is lazy.
As much as I've grown to dislike Walt immensely, the show is still framed around him. God knows I hated Vic and Shane in The Shield, but that didn't stop me sympathising with them (final season of The Shield spoilers -
I never thought I'd feel bad for Shane after the Season 5 finale, and yet I was welling up with tears during the series finale
It's a simple fact that we're conditioned by TV shows to root for protagonists, even if we passively or actively dislike them. So when an obstacle arises (man or woman), we naturally dislike them.
To accuse me and many others of being a misogynist because of this is lazy.
PezDispenser
Banned
...did we watch the same show?
Not really.
True, dude starting cooking meth and being a total lying dickhead.
smokeymicpot
Beat EviLore at pool.
Exactly no reason for Skyler to be pissed.
Well, he was late to the birthday party while working extra to make ends meet to pay for printer paper.
faceless007
Member
While I don't necessarily agree that Skylar-hating is inherently misogynistic, I think part of that angle comes from a trend that's been happening in TV in general, where we have a lot of shows about male anti-heroes who do absolutely despicable and immoral things, and their wives or girlfriends who naturally, as a source of dramatic tension, object to them. And it's pretty commonplace in discussions about all these shows to see lots of vitriol and anger directed at the love interest for no better reason than she gets in the way of the hero, even though that's what anyone with a functioning moral compass would do. And also, if she cheats on the hero, she deserves to die, but all the other crimes of the hero are totally justifiable.
So when some people act like infidelity by the woman is a greater crime than murder, theft, organized crime, ordering hits, etc. it's hard not to see an underlying subtext rooted in misogynistic value systems. I'm not saying this describes everyone who even slightly dislikes Skylar, but it does describe a lot of posts I've read about this and other shows.
So when some people act like infidelity by the woman is a greater crime than murder, theft, organized crime, ordering hits, etc. it's hard not to see an underlying subtext rooted in misogynistic value systems. I'm not saying this describes everyone who even slightly dislikes Skylar, but it does describe a lot of posts I've read about this and other shows.
I hate to do this, but AAA ether.
How dare he!! And he used the MASTER CARD!!!! the fiend!!
So Skylar is now also to blame for not finding out about Walt's drug involvement sooner? Seriously?
Marie dealt with it by stealing things. After Skylar had Holly she was fine to Walt until she found out he had been blatantly lying. Her reaction to Walt doing weed was perfectly reasonable, she was just as much amused as annoyed. It IS ridiculous for a guy like Walt to suddenly start doing weed, and it is also a terrible idea for him to start doing this as a baby is being born. Obviously cheating on Walt is bad, but at that point is you want to compare personality flaws, I'd say she compares pretty damn favorably to Walt.
Of course try as you might to make this about personality flaws, that's not what Skyler hate is actually about. Everyone on this show is extremely flawed, and Skyler is among the most innocent.
She should have kept her mouth shut like a good wife would have!
Nameless
Member
All those blaming misogyny for the Skyler criticism be prepared; you will be called to arms to defend Lena Dunham in the Girls thread. At least there some of these arguments will be justified.
It doesn't matter that Skyler is a woman. Everything I said about her would apply just the same for Walt's gay life partner, Bruce. He'd be a loving over imposing douche with a talent for childish melodrama, who's douchiness was an interesting obstacle for Walt to contend with while leveling up in the drug business. If anything is misogonistic it's the way in which people take certain criticisms directed at a particular woman and assume they must apply to, or inform one's opinion about, all women, who they then must swoop in and defend.
What's strange is this is unique to Breaking Bad: LOST-GAF shat on Kate, 24 GAF shat on Kim, Mad Men GAF shits on Betty, Girls GAF shits on the entire cast, Walking Dead GAF shits on Lori. Only shitting on Skyler(even with actual thought out arguments), for whatever reason, gets your world view and character brought into to question.
It doesn't matter that Skyler is a woman. Everything I said about her would apply just the same for Walt's gay life partner, Bruce. He'd be a loving over imposing douche with a talent for childish melodrama, who's douchiness was an interesting obstacle for Walt to contend with while leveling up in the drug business. If anything is misogonistic it's the way in which people take certain criticisms directed at a particular woman and assume they must apply to, or inform one's opinion about, all women, who they then must swoop in and defend.
What's strange is this is unique to Breaking Bad: LOST-GAF shat on Kate, 24 GAF shat on Kim, Mad Men GAF shits on Betty, Girls GAF shits on the entire cast, Walking Dead GAF shits on Lori. Only shitting on Skyler(even with actual thought out arguments), for whatever reason, gets your world view and character brought into to question.
For the record I don't blame all dislike for Skyler on misogyny. Skyler is probably my least favorite character on the show. It's because her scenes simply are not as interesting as the other characters. But when I hear "she's too controlling!" or "she's a bitch!" as the reason for disliking her, it makes me wonder if said opinions don't belong to boys in their early twenties who think the world belongs to them and how dare wives try to keep track of their badassery or hold them to any degree of familial responsibility.
Can't comment all of your examples (I was LTTP on Lost and didn't realize Kate was disliked, and I haven't seen Girls), but the rest of those are very different cases. Betty is specifically written to be childish and unlikeable. Lori is truly a horribly written character (as is practically everyone on that show). Kim is famously known for distracting from the main storyline with pointless blunders. Syler is not childish, is not poorly written, and does not have pointless side stories.
shakin_haitian
Banned
They are basically broke. After a lifetime of working, they had 7000 dollars in their savings account. If certain recent things hadn't have happened to me during the last year, and not been stupid going out to eat constantly, I'd already have 7k in the bank on top of my 401k contributions, after two years.
They were watching every penny and only had 7k over more than 30 . Years. Of. Working.
I'm sorry but this just hypothetical bullshit.
FantasticMrFoxdie
Mumber
LOL Always fun when this turns into a Skylar debate...
shutupshutupshutupshutupshutup.gif
shutupshutupshutupshutupshutup.gif
Black Mamba
Member
Some of those characters are hated for vastly different reason (I haven't watched all those shows). Kate, for instance, made lots of bad decisions which got her some hate (though, I liked her). Betty's problem, I think, is she is mostly a one note character related to her relationship with the kids. That as she is a snob and completely immature. She is the anti-Skyler And besides, many people who don't like Betty also don't like Don as a person, either, and often root against him (unlike with Walt).
i'm still confused on what Skyler did that was filled with douchiness.
I think some of the hate is mysogony and some of the hate is what I said; people don't like that she's the one person who walt can't defeat.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I still don't know any girl that watches this show that likes Skyler. Now they don't mind her as much but for the first long while they hated her. Not saying this is 50 people, it's only a little more than a handful, but yeah.
Stupid debate is stoop.
Stupid debate is stoop.
Women are immune to societal implications about women?
Nameless
Member
Oh Skyler is definitely written to be at the very least partly unlikable, especially in the first couple seasons. Establishing her as this ball-busting-battle-ax was a deliberate move that raised the stakes for the protagonist in a major way. If ever Walt's hidden life encroached upon his family life there were legitimate consequences waiting for him at home.
If the roles were reversed and Skyler was the woman with cancer continually being talked down to by her pushy husband, Cranston probably would have been shot in the streets years ago.
Black Mamba
Member
WTF, Skyler was not some ball-busting-battle-ax in the first few seasons and that kind of interpretation is why misogyny term gets thrown around.
King Allant
Member
and Andrea
wat
Jessie's soul.
Nameless
Member
If anything Betty deserves a bit of a pass growing up in a time where woman were rarely allowed to thrive outside of riding the coattails of men in these hyper dependent roles. She was born and bred to be taken care of by a man, is it shocking she ends up spoiled, entitled, and incapable of making any real decisions? I still wouldn't pull the misogyny card, but it's more compelling here.
And with Sky it's not even so much what she does as how she handles things. I drew the comparisons with Marie to show how differently the two react to similar situations. Marie handles things like a woman generally, without resorting to passive agressive extremes, condescension, or throwing tantrums.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
no, the point is that people are overthinking it. She's presented as a contradiction to the focus of the story so it's natural for people to dislike her. It's not some weird undercurrent of sexism or whatever. Though of course I'm sure there's some of that like everywhere, but mostly it's overthinking.
BannedEpisode
Member
People hate Lori because she cant even go ten minutes without crashing a car on an empty road.
SuperSonic1305
Member
Watched season 1 again and noticed some stuff I didn't before. First time Walt gets drug money he puts it in a dryer. Pretty funny.
Nameless
Member
"please, just this once, crawl out from my ass". - Walt
"I feel like I'm never allowed to make my own decisions" - Walt
"The ball-buster paid me a visit" - Jesse
-Hank jokes about Walt facing Sky's wrath
- her reaction to the weed
-dat MasterCard, which was a valid complaint executed in a condescending manner
- her beheading Hank due to her own insecurities about her Sister
-Smoking while pregnant.
Granted I'm 10-11.episodes into my rewatch. Yeah, she's totally reasonable and likeable.
Black Mamba
Member
And again, marie handled it by stealing. And what Marie was upset at Hank about most of all was treating her like an asshole and not opening up to her with his feelings. Not nearly the same as Walt. not even in the same ballpark. Those are regular people problems, not what Walt was doing.
You still haven't been able to explain what sky did that was handled poorly that would make her look bad. She did NONE of the things you claim. It's your own warped perspective that is making you see it that way.
And back to betty, your entire argument falls on its face because we see it completely contrasted by other women on the show, in particular Jane and Peggy who also are probably the 2 most liked characters on the show along with Ken Consgrove. I bet most people who hate Betty love Peggy.
Nameless
Member
Me saying how I'd critique a man with Skyler's tendencies isn't hypothetical. I expect more out of someone who names themselves after a God. Kaep would be on Team Walt, you're on some Russell Wilson shit right now
Smoking while pregnant was the only legitimate one.
Skyler is at fault because Walt is a pussy?
Jesse being a dbag because he doesn't know about life?
Non weed smoker over reacting about weed ...surprise.
MasterCard....theyre broke!
Hank knew Marie was a shoplifter and about the tiara that almost got her jailed
Give me a break.
e:about the smoking thing....motherfucker faked a fueg state that lead to her smoking.
If you can blame skysky for Walt being a pussy then you can certainly blame walt for making skysky smoke.
Black Mamba
Member
Which she was totally justified in doing. Walt was the one overreacting here because, guess what, he was doing something illegal.
This is characteristic of everything Walt did, including in business. Hell, it's more directly related to the car wash since Walt had to wash cars when he was just the cashier. Gilligan made this point clearly.
So jesse's term for any wife, someone he never had met before, is evidence?
Seriously, a joke about getting between two women in a fight?
Which is the same as your 1st point and now you're repeating shit.
Oh give me a break. And hilariously, you use the 1st comment about Walt telling her to get out his ass which he said super condescendingly. hypocrite, much?
insecurities!? She shoplifted and nearly got Skyler arrested for it. You fucking kidding me?
While obviously wrong, this has nothing to do with her douchiness to Walt. She also smoked only like 4 cigs and said she was deeply ashamed for it.
Yeah, and I just did the first 4 seasons and honestly, it's fine to not like Skyler because she is the one person who Walt cannot control but at the same time your criticisms are patently absurd and at times immature.
I do know who kaep is, but her tendencies are normal for any normal person.
I also don't know who Russell Wilson is.
Sutton Dagger
Member
Sorry to barge in to the middle of a 'debate' but does anyone know if there is a re-cap episode planned or if anyone knows of a great fan made recap?
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I honestly think people hate Skyler for the same reason my girlfriend hated Doakes on Dexter. They're the obstacles to our beloved anti-hero protagonists. Gender has nothing to do with it.
- Status