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[oilvomer]

Well this is a new tactic again, we had the conciliatory Florence speech, that did not work, so it is the 'we have done all we can, over to you' tactic

This is going to play to anti EU folk, and it is a gamble, as if the EU turn around and say tough, we are not changing... that could be that for the negotiations

 

[slider]

This is how Leavers have been attempting to communicate with mainland Europeans for decades, not sure why that would change now.

Lol.

 

[Camp Freddie]

So the "September plan" of walking away has been delayed a month because they had to think of an excuse.

May's speech was just a pathetic attempt to act nice while offering nothing useful, in order to justify her "dramatically" walking out later. During the negotiations, Davis didn't give the EU any arguments or figures to back up anything in the Florence speech.

This is typical May posturing, just like her speeches about healing divides and tackling poverty and inequality. She does literally nothing to back her words up with actions.

 

[jelly]

I don't know what is going on. A game, self harm to make the rich richer, a long term plan to scupper Brexit, like they are hoping the economy goes tits up like now please to put people off. It's baffling. They surely aren't just going with, you've got to believe, it will be fine.

 

[Xando]

Reading reports that DD couldn’t even be arsed to come to brussels for negotiations today

https://twitter.com/marioledwith/status/917314289953886208

 

[keep]

For my money, I still think they (May, Davies, etc) genuinely believe they can speak to the EU on the same level hence all the posturing, "walking away", "no deal is better than a bad deal", etc.

 

[Burai]

I don't know what is going on. A game, self harm to make the rich richer, a long term plan to scupper Brexit, like they are hoping the economy goes tits up like now please to put people off. It's baffling. They surely aren't just going with, you've got to believe, it will be fine.

It's an attempt to hold onto power at any cost. As soon as May upsets the Brexit ultras by compromising, they'll vote against the whip and the minority government will quickly collapse. It's why we all expected to be going back to the polls in October.

This is why May wanted that huge majority. That way she could have done whatever she pleased and not had to worry about either side rebelling because there would have been enough partisan MPs to fall in line and tip the balance.

 

[oti]

Reading reports that DD couldn’t even be arsed to come to brussels for negotiations today

https://twitter.com/marioledwith/status/917314289953886208

Fascinating how the UK is finding new and exciting ways to embarrass itself.

 

[slider]

Fascinating how the UK is finding new and exciting ways to embarrass itself.

New and exciting? C'mon, oti. I think you mean innovative and creative.

 

[alt27]

AMazing how the uk gov straight up lied about the Scots oil income just for the referendum.

Corrected the figures a couple years later , LOL.

Fucking pathetic .

 

[Maledict]

AMazing how the uk gov straight up lied about the Scots oil income just for the referendum.

Corrected the figures a couple years later , LOL.

Fucking pathetic .

CAre for a link to help us understand what you’re talking about?

 

[theaface]

Reading reports that DD couldn’t even be arsed to come to brussels for negotiations today

https://twitter.com/marioledwith/status/917314289953886208

That's the kind of creative breakthrough these negotiations actually need. I'm not sure seeing Davis looking sweaty and disheveled after another bruising round of no progress accomplishes a great deal other than feed my schadenfreude.

 

[alt27]

CAre for a link to help us understand what you’re talking about?

I originally read about it in a report , but can’t find it now , and of course BBC doesn’t cover it ,

But this pro independence site does and links the gov data from previous years

https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-magic-money-rigs/

So of course , shout me down for showing a pro Indy site as proof but it links gov data that they changed on a whim for their personal gain

 

[Maledict]

I originally read about it in a report , but can’t find it now , and of course BBC doesn’t cover it ,

But this pro independence site does and links the gov data from previous years

https://wingsoverscotland.com/the-magic-money-rigs/

So of course , shout me down for showing a pro Indy site as proof but it links gov data that they changed on a whim for their personal gain

Sorry but I’m not taking anything from Wings over Scotland as being anywhere near the truth. They are so fanatically pro independence, and were a heavy part of the more rabid pro independence crowd that strayed well unacceptable behavior during the referendum.

Not saying the story might not be true, but I’d want to see it appear elsewhere. There are pro independence newspapers and journals out there, I’m sure if this actually happened the it will get picked up by them soon enough (no reason for it not too and every reason it should!)

 

[alt27]

Sorry but I’m not taking anything from Wings over Scotland as being anywhere near the truth. They are so fanatically pro independence, and were a heavy part of the more rabid pro independence crowd that strayed well unacceptable behavior during the referendum.

Not saying the story might not be true, but I’d want to see it appear elsewhere. There are pro independence newspapers and journals out there, I’m sure if this actually happened the it will get picked up by them soon enough (no reason for it not too and every reason it should!)

Yeah I get it , but links are there to actual government websites that show the data , and we all know BBC is anti independence so they won’t cover it , and foreign media don’t give a shit as story has gone now .

 

[Psychotext]

Yeah I get it , but links are there to actual government websites that show the data , and we all know BBC is anti independence so they won’t cover it , and foreign media don’t give a shit as story has gone now .

I love how people think the BBC have whatever angle it is that doesn't agree with their personal viewpoints despite being analysed repeatedly by third parties and consistently coming out as fair (to the point of being dangerous as they give garbage opinions considerable airtime).

 

[Uzzy]

Looks like May's statement is scheduled for 16:30 today. Should be interesting.

 

[alt27]

I love how people think the BBC have whatever angle it is that doesn't agree with their personal viewpoints despite being analysed repeatedly by third parties and consistently coming out as fair (to the point of being dangerous as they give garbage opinions considerable airtime).

Please link me to the analysis of the Indy vote that bbc was fair and balanced .

LOL 😂.

 

[liquidtmd]

Looks like May's statement is scheduled for 16:30 today. Should be interesting.

Maybot will be cycling through her EU conversational Negotiation matrix

 

[Chinner]

Looks like May's statement is scheduled for 16:30 today. Should be interesting.

I thought it was 15:30. Wonder if they timed it to stop there being a live reaction from the markets?

 

[Zaph]

Given the access she has to all the reports, briefings and negotiations, at what point does party-before-country become treason?

 

[liquidtmd]

It's tragic that by and large the Conservative Government was seen to be mostly 'Project Fear' in relation to the Brexit Referendum, and now that are decrying anyone who points out this is a really fucking stupid idea as doomsayers or...Project Fear.

Pass the gin. I need to get drunk before 4.30pm

 

[jelly]

Stop being negative. Rules the waves with jam and cakes.

Speech is going to be such patriotic good old colonial shite but don't mention the rape, pillaging and slaving while talking about trade unicorns and how we would be lucky to get lube before being screwed by every country on trade. Delusional.

 

[Bedlam]

boldstrategycotton.jpg

"She will also implicitly warn of the risk of talks breaking down, calling to both sides to be constructive and 'prove the doomsayers wrong'"

Is one of the sides she is talking about here the EU by any chance? That side which consistently said "Brexit is a bad idea and it will ruin your economy"; meaning that side would be "doomsayers". The side that you fucked over with Brexit in general? You are seeking support from that side to prove the things that the side said wrong?

I hope not, because that can't be real. How deluded can you possibly be?!

 

[CTLance]

How deluded can you possibly be?!

Are you tempting them? Because, to me that sounds exactly like you're tempting them.

How about this:

You guys unilaterally declare war on EU, then immediately turn around to sue for peace and/or surrender unconditionally before a single soldier has been dispatched. Now that EU has won the three minute war of 2017 (and thus, unbeknownst to them, have laid claim to the British Islands), they're responsible to rescue the poor victims of the war.

I mean... Hey, the Germans did quite well after WW2.
Care packets and a Marshall plan equivalent would do wonders to rescue what's left of the UK economy. Sure, May and Co would need to hang out with the Kims, but who cares, I hear North Korea is lovely during this time of the year.

Spoiler

Please don't let anyone in May's circle actually read GAF. While I'm obviously joking, I'm not so sure they're still sane enough to notice.

 

[theaface]

UK ministers 'deeply pessimistic' about Brexit talks progress

Theresa May’s government will publish two white papers on customs and trade arrangements after Brexit, amid warnings from within government to expect two more thorny rounds of negotiations with the EU.

They claimed it might take a bout of “theatrics” to force a breakthrough in December, perhaps involving a change of tone from the Brexit secretary, David Davis, that would allow the EU to say it had pushed Britain enough.

May will try to encourage the commission by declaring that “the ball is in their court”. She will use a statement to parliament on Monday to argue that a good deal is important for European countries as well as Britain: “So while, of course, progress will not always be smooth, by approaching these negotiations in a constructive way – in a spirit of friendship and cooperation and with our sights firmly set on the future – I believe we can prove the doomsayers wrong.”

A spokesman for the Department for Exiting the European Union said: “We go into the fifth round of talks confident we can build on the concrete progress we have made across a range of issues.

“We have taken decisive steps forward on citizens’ rights, Northern Ireland and on a large number of the separation issues.

“It’s important to continue that momentum and for the negotiations to move on to the next phase in order that we can discuss our future partnership.”

 

[Zaph]

UK ministers 'deeply pessimistic' about Brexit talks progress

PM goes on the offensive by asking please be nice

.

 

[jelly]

Is it the German cars thing, lol.

The EU must be thinking, just admit Brexit is stupid and we can all go home. Won't someone just say it!

 

[liquidtmd]

The EU must be thinking, just admit Brexit is stupid and we can all go home. Won't someone just say it!

If Brexit was a GAF thread, the first post would by the EU and it would be this

The EU mods should have closed negotiations there and then. This reaction was just perfect.

16 months on it still hasn't been topped

Listening to Theresa's speech right now - I'm literally mimicking the guy and she's my Prime Minister

 

[theaface]

This speech is fucking painful. Same guff that was in her Florence speech.

"We don't want any of the existing 26 letters in the alphabet, we'd like Europe to get creative and invent us a new letter. As I said in my speech at Lancaster House ad naseum".

It's all 'what can you do for us?' and nothing going back the other way.

 

[ittoryu]

May says the ball is now in the court of the EU.

This is fucking unbelievable.

 

[Burai]

Her transition plan is pure brilliance. All the benefits of being in the EU, minus freedom of movement and we can negotiate trade deals.

And then let me guess, you'll just keep wanting to extend it forever until it becomes the new norm.

Trojan Cake.

 

[oti]

This is just tiresome at this point. Same arguments, same smug faces just similing arguments away, same Corbyn saying correct things but also believing wrong things.

People deserve better than this Kindergarten garbage.


God this is pathetic.
UK politics are pathetic.

 

[liquidtmd]

Her transition plan is pure brilliance. All the benefits of being in the EU, minus freedom of movement and we can negotiate trade deals.

And then let me guess, you'll just keep wanting to extend it forever until it becomes the new norm.

Trojan Cake.

Not forever, don't be cynical!

Spoiler

Just until the Tory Party disintegrates and Labour have to deal with it,
take the negativity around it and hopefully take enough damage to see the Tories get re-elected again circa 2025

 

[anonymous_abc]

.

 

[TrutaS]

Terrible speech from May, just reitirating everything that was said in Florence and which lead to the EU voting there wasn't enough progress. And Corbyn's response where he promises to go through with brexit is honestly not much better. Please just someone end this farce...

 

[Zaph]

I would love to Lasso of trouth all the brexiteers in order for them to tell the world why they really want out.

oh you don't need superhero powers for that https://youtu.be/V-WEDoXx910?t=395

 

[liquidtmd]

I would love to Lasso of trouth all the brexiteers in order for them to tell the world why they really want out.

I think the main problem is far too many wouldn't really know if pushed.

A lethal combination of political apathy, a North / South divide between perceived neglect so 'why vote to stay with the status quo' (that had nothing to do with EU rule) and decades of exposure to a shitty mainstream media who pimped the extreme outlier cases of EU Bureaucracy daily I believe did far more damage to the ref vote as opposed to 'lol all UK are racists / little Englanders'

Sure that faction and mentality exists, but not to the degree of the 52% that voted Leave by far.

I dearly wish the Ref paper had three questions voters had to get right about basic EU functionality in order for the vote to register.

 

[jelly]

Terrible speech from May, just reitirating everything that was said in Florence and which lead to the EU voting there wasn't enough progress. And Corbyn's response where he promises to go through with brexit is honestly not much better. Please just someone end this farce...

We are so screwed. What is in the water, honestly. Tories and Labour are going to take us out and give us a different take on an equally shit cake. I imagine Labour will get into power, screw it up royally with less tax receipts after leaving the EU, the Tories will blame it all on them then we get stuck with the Tories for another 20 years making hard kicking of the general public because Labour wasted Brexit or some blameful shite they'll come up with, not that they went through with Brexit. The EU should just ignore us at this point until the UK can act like adults or for the best, come to their senses and stop it.

 

[MarkMclovin]

oh you don't need superhero powers for that https://youtu.be/V-WEDoXx910?t=395

They always go to the fucking valleys for this type of shit. Every time.

It's like they don't have stupid people in England with this view either?

 

[Zaph]

They always go to the fucking valleys for this type of shit. Every time.

It's like they don't have stupid people in England with this view either?

While there are no doubt many similar places in England, I think Wales is often used as the go-to example because the cognitive dissonance is so concentrated there - complaining about immigration where there is virtually none (2%) while sitting in a shopping arcade renovated with EU money.

It would take an editor with inhuman amounts of self-control to not use it.

 

[dumbo]

Achieving that partnership will require leadership and flexibility, not just from us but from our friends, the 27 nations of the EU

Sorry, Theresa, but they are not 'our friends'.
- the EU are our *allies*.
- when we leave, we become their *rival*.

The EU does not want to 'punish' us, but we will be their rival - competing for their jobs and profits. The EU will not be 'flexible' in order to help a rival.

 

[Camp Freddie]

They always go to the fucking valleys for this type of shit. Every time.

It's like they don't have stupid people in England with this view either?

Don't worry, the media come oop north too when they need to find some poor people with odd accents to act all stupid so they can pretend things are much better in the home counties.

They used to get cockneys to fill that role, but gentrification means they're too likely to find rich young hipsters these days.

I'm not listening to May's speech.
Sir Humphrey: "Yes Prime Minister, a very bold statement with a nice use of metaphor. I assume you did not mean to refer to your diplomatic offer as balls though. You know the Germans after all, no sense of humour and they have a vulgar habit of taking everything so literally."

 

[jelly]

In the Commons, the Conservative MP Michael Fabricant says Labour could not negotiate their way out of a paper bag. A Labour MP - it sounded very like Chris Bryant - shouted that they would not have got into the paper bag in the first place.

 

[sammex]

BAE Systems 'to axe more than 1,000 jobs'

John Cameron, deputy chairman of the union Unite, said it was concerned about a "lack of work going forward".

Up to 10,000 people work at the Warton and Samlesbury plants, where aircraft assembly takes place.

The cuts are believed to centre on the lack of orders for the Eurofighter Typhoon on which 5,000 staff work.

Hmm I wonder what possibly could be going on here?

Oh yeah, from back in July...

France and Germany to develop new European fighter jet

The move also reflects efforts to give fresh impetus to Franco-German relations in the aftermath of Britain’s decision to leave the European Union and was described by defence experts as a snub to Europe’s leading military power.

France and Germany said their new combat system, which analysts say could involve a mixture of manned and unmanned aircraft, would replace the Rafale and Eurofighter, rival jets that compete fiercely for global sales.

Tip of the iceburg.

 

[avaya]

I do love the complete hypocrisy in the "German cars" argument. Nevermind the fact that the people buying German cars are still likely to buy German cars regardless of a 10% WTO tariff. In fact, there are no British cars, they are all foreign. They will all be tariffed at 10%. It's a bizarre argument.

No the hypocrisy around it stems from the fact that these people argue that the EU-27 will be rational when they see the potential Economic impact so they should not fall back to ideological red lines. The English on the other hand are allowed to foam at the mouth with their Nationalism and destroy this fucking country and that is A OK.

The fuck outta here with that bullshit.

oh you don't need superhero powers for that https://youtu.be/V-WEDoXx910?t=395

"I know I shouldn't be prejudiced but I want my Country back to how it was." Did Clegg have to travel that far to realise old people are racist as fuck?

 

[Tacitus_]

Sorry, Theresa, but they are not 'our friends'.
- the EU are our *allies*.
- when we leave, we become their *rival*.

The EU does not want to 'punish' us, but we will be their rival - competing for their jobs and profits. The EU will not be 'flexible' in order to help a rival.

I wouldn't put it so harshly. I'm sure the EU could flex on something if UK tried to find some common ground instead of trying to ram stuff through that the EU has explicitly said that they won't flex on.

 

[jufonuk]

Her transition plan is pure brilliance. All the benefits of being in the EU, minus freedom of movement and we can negotiate trade deals.

And then let me guess, you'll just keep wanting to extend it forever until it becomes the new norm.

Trojan Cake.

This is all it will be mark my words some kind of Eu. Style membership transition deal but infinite extension until the Eu. Tell us to leave by then we will say no don’t tell us to leave we will stay how dare you order us about

 

[Norwegian_Imposter]

As a guy in Norway with lots of British workers alongside me. If the country walks away with no deal my employment and life here in Norway goes poof. It's so short sighted. Oh and I'm a lucky one as I have a Swedish wife so I won't be forced out but my colleagues would.

 

[liquidtmd]

I wouldn't put it so harshly. I'm sure the EU could flex on something if UK tried to find some common ground instead of trying to ram stuff through that the EU has explicitly said that they won't flex on.

Agreed. The tone of May and her Government publicly has been fucking terrible. They knew from day one what the EU wouldn't and couldn't shift on, but still they've danced around and wasted so much time like they are Week 1 candidates on the Apprentice trying to barter a butcher over the price of sausages.

From the top down, day 1 the tone should have been more to the Public

May: "We voted to Leave the EU. There are consequences to that. The Four Freedoms are in stone. They are ingrained in the principles of the EU. We must respect them. The EU won't budge on these as it would be inflicting damage on itself. We will work hard but there will be concessions. Some big ones on our part since we made this choice together. It will be a road of discovery and hopefully in return for candour, we can establish a new relationship with the EU that works, whilst appreciating leaving has consequences"

Something like that. But no. From Day 1 we've had power plays, shit like "the EU will do a deal, it's in their interests too", and a real sense that even now the UK government are counting down the clock like it's a game of chicken with seemingly no regard to talk in a conciliatory fashion.

I don't doubt there's arseholes in the EU commission but I'm pretty sure their tone would have been more reasonable if our Government knew what it was doing.