Vincent Grayson
Member
So why even bother discussing videogames? If the only thing that ever matters is what you get out of it, what's the point in talking to anyone else about games?
Bungie apologizes for Taken King controversy, CE items to be sold separate
- Thread starter LiK
- Start date
So why even bother discussing videogames? If the only thing that ever matters is what you get out of it, what's the point in talking to anyone else about games?
Lalalandia
Member
You have to hand it to Bungie they've successfully moved the conversation from $40 for 1/3 of the $60 game content AND the $40=£40 debacle. GG Bingie I underestimated your PR
benicillin
Banned
It's not beside the point that he was trying to make, which is a false equivalence between "if the CE items are half the cost of TTK then how much value is really in TTK?" The pricing of the two are completely unrelated. CE items are priced at a premium because it's a premium item.
There doesn't seem to be a victory condition here, people are just upset in general and nothing realistic will probably make people happy, because giving away all the CE content or firing Luke Smith isn't a real option.
Breakfast at Noon
Member
the $40 vs £40 was not going anywhere anyway as only a few people seem actually bothered by this, i assume most in here are american and unaeffected.
I love Destiny. I was one of the first players to score a platinum, I kept playing despite a plethora of bugs making some of the content painful at times, I forged some lasting relationships with fellow gaffers, and I agree some of the content is still remarkable.
I don't see how you can excuse Bungie and Activision's practise just because you've had a great time with the game.
It is beside the point when the point is they had a chance to garner good will lost here, and chose profit instead.
backflip10019
Member
3 animations and 3 colors for twenty fucking dollars. Jesus, for another $20 you could've gotten the Witcher 3 a couple weeks back. What a massive ripoff.
Lalalandia
Member
By this logic Aliens: Colonial Marines is a good game if I could somehow stomach replaying that over and I we again. Or Solitaire or Minesweeper. The mechanic quality of the game does not excuse the paucity of content.
benicillin
Banned
What exactly did you hope would happen? From what I saw people wanted them to sell the CE items without having to rebuy the rest of the game (which makes sense) and that happened, so what else did you want?
StalkerUKCG
Banned
Ridiculous price point for 9 mostly cosmetic items. Not even close to the same level of content as TDB or HoW and the same price.
Smh
Smh
I really like[d] Destiny, I'm yet to play 2nd DLC properly, but I wouldn't put down 20 for few cosmetic items. To me that is ludicrous price no matter how much I like some game selling them.
GlamFM
Banned
I´m not excusing Bungie for any of their PR and pricing bullshit.
Only talking about value here.
A gesture.
Not a way to squeeze as much profit as they can from the situation.
This discussion stemmed from you saying "We should wait to find out more about the next DLC before calling it "overpriced" IMO."
And while there is a valid discussion regarding personal value, with dollar to time ratios, etc... there is also an objective quality we can compare which is actual content, like amount of missions, amount of maps, amount of new items etc... and we can compare this to other games, to what's come before with this game, and we should. While we may get hundreds of hours of enjoyment replaying this content, that doesn't mean we can't look at the overall quality of the content and comment on its flaws.
Many players have felt let down by this in the past, even the OT has the most loyal players making detailed posts breaking down their opinion on the quality of HoW and stating how it does better but it's still not great.
So while "wait and see" seems fair, we've been giving them that benefit since day one, and we've been doing that despite all the shifty practise that's accompanied it.
I think it's much fairer at this point to assume the content will be lacking, that many of the fundamental issues will not be addressed, that Bungie will continue to make shifty decisions, than it is to give them any more benefit.
The fact that some of the content we have is incredibly fun and can be played for hundreds of hours is one of the saddest parts, this game has so much potential.
You're right, people will never be happy as long as the kind of practises being seen here continue.
Destiny being fun to play is not the issue.
Lalalandia
Member
I don't know I saw a gesture in that statement it just took a single finger to make
Yup.
For me it's one of my biggest points of contention with the expansion content.
The conversion is totally fucked up but I expect this will carry forward through Destiny's lifetime.
Is COD DLC's UK priced more in line with US prices?
PedroLumpy
Member
If they had originally offered this bundling structure, I imagine the response would have been far more muted. But they started with their bonkers bundling structure and pissed everyone off first. Once everyone is already pissed, they're more likely to react badly to something just being overpriced.
The Jackdog
Member
game is still one of the top played games on live consistently, like top 3.
Its a shame i dont think bungie is going to have much reason to change what they are doing
Its a shame i dont think bungie is going to have much reason to change what they are doing
I've come to realize that people will never be happy. Before it was about the principal. Now it's about the pricing. I bet if you lowered the price it would then be about content.
Gafs favorite thing to do is give Destiny crap. No point in arguing/wasting time trying to convince people that it's a good game.
Louis Cyphre
Banned
Are we going to see a GOTY edition with all the DLC included priced at $60 for a new player like me? I'm not overly concerned about skins and cosmetic things, just game content.
You know it's not only in Gaf that people are angry because of the issues brought up.
It's fucking everywhere
In Service
Member
I approve of any apology that uses the word Asshat.
Darren_z33
Member
Too little too late for me. I already feel burned with how little content the game had, I didn't buy any dlc and I don't see me making a purchase on Destiny 2.
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
Onviously they can't just give the content away free to everyone. People buying the $60 Legendary Edition (like me) shouldn't get it. If they want it, that's what the new, more expensive collector's edition is for. But there's a really simple "victory" compromise actually. Include the CE content in the $40 standalone edition of Taken King. You can ONLY buy the standalone if you've already bought the base game AND both expansions. That's $90-$100 pre-TTK, $130-$140 after (and much more for both if they got the Ghost Edition). All things considered, I think it would be completely fair to expect people already spending that much, many of whom already bought the ORIGINAL collector's editions, to get this new "collector's edition" content automatically. This upgrade is an awkward compromise that, while better than nothing, is asking $20 MORE from the game's most faithful fans just because they know they'll pay it.
Considering this isn't major, expensive to develop content, and that they were never planning on giving it to anyone who wasn't a NEW CE buyer anyway, I just don't see why they can't also give this content to the people already spending a minimum of $50 more than those new CE buyers, rather than expecting them to spend $70+ more total now.
Honestly, the whole change of heart seems kind of cynical given that it's effectively an apology with a price tag. It almost seems opportunistic.
I'm aware it's everywhere. Before this debacle Destiny was actually doing very well. HoW was a huge success and everything has been going great.
Coverage isn't garnered by success though. It's only until someone makes a mistake that people will dig for clicks.
While people can brush it off as a minor collectors item now and say "you don't have to buy it". You have to wonder if such pricing schemes end up inflating the cost of future items. They could charge future expansions more for less stuff by simply pointing out "look you guys paid 20$ for a few cosmetic items so this is really good value".
Some people with memories of a goldfish will parrot this line and in the end nothing gets fixed.
I've stayed out of this thread after posting quite a few times on the intial one regarding Like Smith's interview.
Many gaffers and my clan mates have taken the stance of "oh, didn't you want it the CE DLC to be sold separately? Well there you go now Bungie will allow you to buy it, hell I am.".
I'd never want anything for free -it's be nice but it would be stupid to expect it. Plain and simple at work I do my job to get paid and I expect Bungie and Activision are no different. So I won't knock them for that.
The issue here is one of value and principle principle meaning morally correct behavior and attitude.
For many of us who own vanilla Destiny and the subsequent expansion packs, we have to pay $40 for the TKK, ok no problem. If we want the CE DLC, which we felt entitled to, we have to pay an additional $20.
Let's put that into perspective. TDB a $20 expansion included quests, strikes and a raid with a refresh to vendor gear and new weapons. The HOW a $20 expansion included quests, strikes PoE, refresh to vendor gear, new weapons and ToO along with making Crucible a viable option to get loot from.
For the same price Bungie wants to sell us 3 shaders, emblems and class items. Two of my clan mates are likes "yes i can buy it now and I will, I have the $20 to give" but the having the $20 to give is not the fucking point. Bungie and Activision have found a way to monetize Luke Smith's PR stumbled and it's shameless and not right
Many gaffers and my clan mates have taken the stance of "oh, didn't you want it the CE DLC to be sold separately? Well there you go now Bungie will allow you to buy it, hell I am.".
I'd never want anything for free -it's be nice but it would be stupid to expect it. Plain and simple at work I do my job to get paid and I expect Bungie and Activision are no different. So I won't knock them for that.
The issue here is one of value and principle principle meaning morally correct behavior and attitude.
For many of us who own vanilla Destiny and the subsequent expansion packs, we have to pay $40 for the TKK, ok no problem. If we want the CE DLC, which we felt entitled to, we have to pay an additional $20.
Let's put that into perspective. TDB a $20 expansion included quests, strikes and a raid with a refresh to vendor gear and new weapons. The HOW a $20 expansion included quests, strikes PoE, refresh to vendor gear, new weapons and ToO along with making Crucible a viable option to get loot from.
For the same price Bungie wants to sell us 3 shaders, emblems and class items. Two of my clan mates are likes "yes i can buy it now and I will, I have the $20 to give" but the having the $20 to give is not the fucking point. Bungie and Activision have found a way to monetize Luke Smith's PR stumbled and it's shameless and not right
Exactly.
... Huh?
They're not going to be happy, because in Destiny there are long standing problems with both these aspects. Once people break and become fed up, their tolerance for this kind of nonsense goes away. What makes Destiny such a PR debacle every time they mess up, is the fact that they haven't bought any goodwill to counterbalance the constant gaffes and mistakes in their entire execution post release.
RipperGrim
Member
Well at least he apologized for being a douche bag.
Breakfast at Noon
Member
yes the legendary edition is just that.
Going by the price of that thing, I can see how he made the intuitive leap he made in his mind.
Louis Cyphre
Banned
I see, thanks.
Omegasquash
Member
So, I can still buy TTK for $40.
If I want to get emblem/shaders/emotes etc, I can get them for $20, because now they're being offered separately from the full-on "buy it all over again" package.
OK. Sell whatever you want, Bungie. I don't mind that at all. TBH $20 sounds a little pricey, but I'm never one to buy costumes/gestures anyway.
As long as it doesn't give competitive advantages to players, then we're good. I don't ever want to set foot into a raid and hear someone say "OK everyone pop your RED BULL damage upgrade and burn it with Gjally...oh wait you don't drink Red Bull GTFO", then kick some kid that just dropped a half hour into said raid.
ALL THAT ASIDE: I feel like this is new(ish) territory. They're learning, and they're responding. I'm cool with that. Not defending what they said, just saying it is what it is.
If I want to get emblem/shaders/emotes etc, I can get them for $20, because now they're being offered separately from the full-on "buy it all over again" package.
OK. Sell whatever you want, Bungie. I don't mind that at all. TBH $20 sounds a little pricey, but I'm never one to buy costumes/gestures anyway.
As long as it doesn't give competitive advantages to players, then we're good. I don't ever want to set foot into a raid and hear someone say "OK everyone pop your RED BULL damage upgrade and burn it with Gjally...oh wait you don't drink Red Bull GTFO", then kick some kid that just dropped a half hour into said raid.
ALL THAT ASIDE: I feel like this is new(ish) territory. They're learning, and they're responding. I'm cool with that. Not defending what they said, just saying it is what it is.
Read this earlier today at work, at first glance I thought they had dropped the price of the DLC to 20...
Then I looked at it more carefully and when I figured out what they were saying I honestly couldn't help but smile at the stupidly crazy conclusion they managed to drag this whole issue to.
Simply amazing.
Then I looked at it more carefully and when I figured out what they were saying I honestly couldn't help but smile at the stupidly crazy conclusion they managed to drag this whole issue to.
Simply amazing.
Breakfast at Noon
Member
if you buy it "digitaly" you can play destiny now and the first 2 DLC and you will get TTK when it releases in september.
There's it so much goodwill you can burn through though.
I'm not sure "they're still learning" is a valid excuse at this point.
The "you'll never be happy" people astonish me. The problem was that Bungie was charging an absurd amount for content and forcing people to rebuy stuff they already owned.
In other words, "I don't want to spend $80 for a $40 DLC and some emotes."
So Bungie said "you'll buy whatever we throw at you."
And this pissed people off.
So Bungie said "sorry, okay, we didn't mean to say you'd buy whatever we throw at you. Here's $20 horse armor as an apology."
And this pissed people off.
The appropriate response would have been "we shouldn't take you for granted. We will offer this at a reasonable rate, say, $5."
Instead they went all smugly "you'll do whatever we want," we said "you suck," and they said "you'll do whatever we want" but pretended to sound sorry for the first time.
That is what Bungie did.
Like, bare minimum, they could at least throw in all the pre-order DLC from the original game, like the Blacksmith shader, for free or something.
In other words, "I don't want to spend $80 for a $40 DLC and some emotes."
So Bungie said "you'll buy whatever we throw at you."
And this pissed people off.
So Bungie said "sorry, okay, we didn't mean to say you'd buy whatever we throw at you. Here's $20 horse armor as an apology."
And this pissed people off.
The appropriate response would have been "we shouldn't take you for granted. We will offer this at a reasonable rate, say, $5."
Instead they went all smugly "you'll do whatever we want," we said "you suck," and they said "you'll do whatever we want" but pretended to sound sorry for the first time.
That is what Bungie did.
Like, bare minimum, they could at least throw in all the pre-order DLC from the original game, like the Blacksmith shader, for free or something.
Orthogonal
Member
That isn't the whole story. The value proposition is borked because that same $20 extra on the physical CE comes with not just the digital stuff but a ton of physical items as well.
This $20 upgrade package lacks all the physical goods, but still commands the same premium.
benicillin
Banned
This was never a realistic solution because Bungie doesn't set prices, Activision does, and Activision isn't going to cannibalize sales of the CE of one of their best selling IPs. Be realistic now.
Or just price bundle at e.g. 10? They still would turn good profits on that stuff, not just as insane profits as with 20 price. Especially when you take into consideration the fact that Bungie just takes old models and slaps new color on them, for most part.
Orthogonal
Member
No, the legendary edition does not have the CE digital content. You have to buy the $80 CE for that.
Yes. Of course. Bungie can somehow get a digital upgrade to happen but can't influence the price at all.