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[ManaByte]

The 2 SOC could be 2 chiplets for one console.

Because the Saturn worked out so well.

 

[Loxus]

Because the Saturn worked out so well.

Split up the SOC.
Chiplet design like this.

 

[diffusionx]

Sony simply needs to deliver to spec regardless of price and they can deliver a separate handheld that plays the same games as the main console at lower resolution and potentially frame rate.

That's realistically a $800+ handheld today (ROG Ally X), that has 2 hours battery life while running those games.

I don't think that is a viable handheld at all. I doubt ASUS is selling many of those things.

 

[delfrickintree]

Interesting prospect for a sony handheld, and while it might be a headache for sony and developers, something needs to stop the bleeding off their customer base switching to pc and steamdeck. Its a sentiment Ive heard often lately, sony is depressing their fans and losing their loyalty. Handhelds are the new craze.

Whats so hard about a next gen console whose games can just gimp the graphical settings for a lower powered device. Haven't pc games being doing this for.. ever? Not to mention pssr technology should give it a handicap assistance. Or even just stream the premium games similar to the Portal (off the servers as well as local).

I was holding out for ps5pro, and that reveal was so unimpressive that now I'm holding out even longer. Your move, Sony.

 

[mckmas8808]

You comparison is not valid. Headset is a more specific device, than a handheld.

PS6 handheld and PS6 would have similar architecture, similar button layout etc, so 90% of games would launch on both anyway.

90% is not 100%, so that's a problem already. And will all 90% be good on the handheld? Probably not. This is a terrible idea. Downright laughable. Pure trash. Basura!

 

[Sorcerer]

I think one of the problems with the PSP and the Vita were that the games were too similar to what you had on the main consoles at the time anyway. Perhaps not graphically but gameplay wise. There was nothing unique there. Nintendo at least managed to give you something that was not playable anywhere else (at least at the time) because of the design of the device. And you could put the device down and turn on the main console at home for a different experience.

I'm not sure giving the players a portable PS4 is going to set the world on fire.
That being said the Portal is quite popular from what I understand and that shoots holes in my theory, so I could be dead wrong.

 

[llien]

I really hope the whole console + handheld rumor isn't true, it's gonna suck no matter how they do it.

Isn't cross-platform a norm, not exception nowadays?
Including running on something as weak as switch.

I think the "handheld will bring everything down" worries are unfounded.


On the other hand, if done right, being able to switch from portable to main console as you please, while playing the same game, is a very attractive opportunity.

 

[midnightAI]

I really hope the whole console + handheld rumor isn't true, it's gonna suck no matter how they do it. If all games must run on both, the handheld will hold everything back. If developers are free to make their game for just one of them, then you must own both to have access to everything you might want to play. Or one might get much more support than the other.

I would think what the would do is make something that is powerful enough for PS4 native games,then the rest can be done with remote play like Portal

 

[llien]

I think there could be a problem if Sony release a PS6 PRO afterwards though, the PS6 handheld ports may be a headache for the devs though.

With this logic, how does releasing games for PC market work?

 

[Closer]

PS Vita had nothing common with PS3. It wasn't like Xbox Series S+X.

And also "Sony let developers release some games on both SOCs, and some games only for a home console to utilize its full potential".

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Sucks either way.

PS6 + PS6 Pro + PS Portal 2 would be better.

Fixed

 

[Mibu no ookami]

That's realistically a $800+ handheld today (ROG Ally X), that has 2 hours battery life while running those games.

I don't think that is a viable handheld at all. I doubt ASUS is selling many of those things.

Maybe people don't realize this but ASUS makes zero money off of software, so there is a premium margin on the device itself... They're also not sold at a similar scale as a PlayStation handheld would be, which means reduced cost savings...

 

[RPCGamer]

Given how brutal the costs look like on future nodes, the Series S/X situation almost has to happen since I don't think a $899+ base console works at all.

I was thinking that Sony might actually release 3 consoles, the handheld, the "Series S" using the handheld's SoC but with higher clocks, and the actual new console. All would be in the same generation.

I don't think the $899+ will be the normal price for PS6, but if so, they've completely lost it. The series S (in concept at least) should be the target price for a console.

 

[Sorcerer]

With this logic, how does releasing games for PC market work?

I would imagine Sony or any console company releasing PC ports is not catering to the fanbase specifically. There are reaching out to the market that would not buy the console anyway. They may hope to sway those players, but it's not the goal. Take an already finished game, do a port, and see what it brings in. If the cost of porting an already basically done game is low, I imagine its highly profitable if it sells mildly well. But fans should not be angry about PC ports because it's an entirely different eco-system.

But with the case of a PS6 and PS6 pro you are looking to anger your main fanbase by causing divisions. I remember Nintendo all of all companies did this when they released a new variation (not a new console, just a new variation of the same old thing) of the DS and it was the only way to play the port of Xenoblade.

I remember thinking that was a WTF move. But it never became a trend thankfully.

 

[Loxus]

Sony may just continue with what they did with the PS4 and PS5 generation.

One main console chip, with everything else being an accessory. Then the Pro console 3-4 years later.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

I don't think the $899+ will be the normal price for PS6, but if so, they've completely lost it. The series S (in concept at least) should be the target price for a console.

That's kind of what I was saying.

So you would have:

PS6 Portable
PS6
PS6 X (or whatever)

With the PS6 being a bit better than what people thought the PS5 Pro would be with more memory (since 3/4 GB GDDR7 chips should be available then).

 

[RoadHazard]

Isn't cross-platform a norm, not exception nowadays?
Including running on something as weak as switch.

I think the "handheld will bring everything down" worries are unfounded.


On the other hand, if done right, being able to switch from portable to main console as you please, while playing the same game, is a very attractive opportunity.

Switch misses out on a lot of games exactly because it's terribly underpowered. And a handheld PS6 would be, what, PS4 power? Maybe PS4 Pro. Doubt they could make a handheld with PS5 level performance with a decent price and battery life. So they're gonna have two consoles that are basically two generations apart? That's an even worse scenario than the cross-gen stuff we've had this generation.

 

[SScorpio]

You'd be lucky to get a PS4 Pro powered handheld in 3 years.

There's isn't a chance you're going to have parity between the PS6 and any sort of handheld.

It's at 800p (or 720p for games that can't do 16:10), but the $400 Steam Deck released Feb 2022 is compared to the base PS4 in terms of power. It's also running "PS5 Only" games that were released on PC. Handheld PCs are a new market and seeing rapid development, and we're also at a point of diminishing returns in graphical quality. Just look at the Witcher 3 and Hogwarts Legacy ports to the Switch's 2015 ARM hardware.

People play on traditional consoles, and desktop gaming PCs, but where do exponentially more play? On their phones and tablets. That's right, sitting on a couch by a huge TV, but staring at a tiny screen. Nintendo got lucky and hit on the start of the trend. But it's crazy to think Sony and Microsoft aren't planning something to compete.

Just release a handheld that's 1080p and you are already 25% of the pixels the 4K console is hitting, or way more if the console targets 8K. Yes, devs will need to target two devices. But, they could be much closer than you think. The Steam Deck has the same Zen 2 CPU, and RDNA2 GPU as the PS5 and XS. The consoles have some customizations, but the base is already there. The portable doesn't need the same power as the console, it just needs to run the same games. Look at PS4 to PS5 cross gen, and the PS4 was based on a 2013 tablet and low end notebooks focused CPU. The days of leap frogging massive performance uplifts gen to gen are gone.

But one BIG think I haven't seen mentioned is how are the games releasing for a supposed handheld? You're not going to have a Bluray drive in an on the go device. That pushes what could be a huge audience over to buying everything off a digital store. So Sony cuts out Amazon, Walmart, Target, etc. Anyone that has the portable, including people that also have the console will buy their games digitally. And why would a portable that's releasing in four years not be able to keep up with a base PS5? So have any digital PS4 and PS5 games also run on it. That will lock in customers to the platform all their games are on, so this would drive people to stick to Sony unlike when a lot of people went 360 to PS4.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

PS5 performance in a handheld should be doable in 2028. The GPU would just have to be wide and slow. The price? Well... TBD.

And yes it would be adorably all digital.

 

[llien]

Switch misses out on a lot of games exactly because it's terribly underpowered. And a handheld PS6 would be, what, PS4 power? Maybe PS4 Pro. Doubt they could make a handheld with PS5 level performance with a decent price and battery life. So they're gonna have two consoles that are basically two generations apart? That's an even worse scenario than the cross-gen stuff we've had this generation.

Steam Deck is ahead on CPU front, but 20% behind on GPU vs PS4. Switch 2 is rumored to be aiming a bit above PS4 on GPU front.

The 2 gen difference is a valid point, but let's keep this in mind:
1) PS6 will absolutely aim at 4k
2) PS6 portable could easily get away with 720p + upscaling

4k is 9 times (!!!) more pixels than 720p.
Should be doable without too much effort, I'd hope.
Especially given that CPU would be the same architecture and enough threads/cores.

 

[RoadHazard]

Steam Deck is ahead on CPU front, but 20% behind on GPU vs PS4. Switch 2 is rumored to be aiming a bit above PS4 on GPU front.

The 2 gen difference is a valid point, but let's keep this in mind:
1) PS6 will absolutely aim at 4k
2) PS6 portable could easily get away with 720p + upscaling

4k is 9 times (!!!) more pixels than 720p.
Should be doable without too much effort, I'd hope.
Especially given that CPU would be the same architecture and enough threads/cores.

Maybe. If they can get the same CPU in both (hopefully without severely bottlenecking the real PS6 with a weak CPU).

 

[asdasdasdbb]

Maybe. If they can get the same CPU in both (hopefully without severely bottlenecking the real PS6 with a weak CPU).

I think that's battle been lost, honestly. Pretty much every game is going to be crossgen anyway for most of the lifecycle.

 

[W11d]

I think people who assume ps6 will be a lot more powerful than ps5 will be disappointed. It will be ps5 pro with a better cpu. They need a base console to be affordable.
Also expect cross-gen (ps5-ps6) games will last till ps7 release.

 

[SportsFan581]

It all depends on the pricing. You might see a series S style device from them (rather than a handheld) if they feel like the cost of a full generational leap over the PS5 Pro would be prohibitive to the mass market ($700+). If that's the case you might see them release something similar in performance to the 5 Pro but updated with the new wrinkles at $400 or $500.

 

[diffusionx]

Maybe people don't realize this but ASUS makes zero money off of software, so there is a premium margin on the device itself... They're also not sold at a similar scale as a PlayStation handheld would be, which means reduced cost savings...

Sony's not interested in major subsidizing of their hardware. It's not 2007 anymore. Maybe a little but realistically, we are talking about a $650 handheld minimum which, again, is not viable.

 

[Ribi]

A live service Shadow of the Colossus is not what I had in mind

 

[LordOfChaos]

There are rumors about home console+handheld from Sony. And concerns, that it can generally affect graphics and performance, if the same game must run on both devices.

But what if Sony let developers release some games on both SOCs, and some games only for a home console to utilize its full potential?

I think it would be a little confusing, but right decision overall.

Yes, I should think you'd be able to just do a PS6 release alone if you wanted to

If the handheld was ~PS4 performance they wouldn't hamper the main generation by two full generations back, but the handheld could have a huge inbuilt library to start with by bringing over PS4 games, and then developers who want to port new games to it can

It should be all about freedom, just like they've never mandated 60fps and while some will complain about 30, developers can read the market and make those decisions freely

 

[FalsettoVibe]

PS6 + PS Portal 2

PS Portal 2 plays PS1-PS5 games natively at
1080p (PSSR). Has direct connect remote play with PS6 and cloud streaming only available to PS Plus Premium members.

 

[StueyDuck]

While I think Sony would make a great portable, i just don't think it's happening.

I think they were burnt on vita and know that the 1 2 of switch and steam deck is a tough cookie to crack.

I do see them releasing a portal with more capabilities though. Guess we'll see what they'll do

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Sony's not interested in major subsidizing of their hardware. It's not 2007 anymore. Maybe a little but realistically, we are talking about a $650 handheld minimum which, again, is not viable.

They are literally taking a loss on hardware and have been this entire generation...

 

[diffusionx]

They are literally taking a loss on hardware and have been this entire generation...

That's not even close to true

Sony’s $499 PS5 is no longer selling at a loss

The PS5 won’t be costly like the PS3.

www.theverge.com

 

[Mibu no ookami]

That's not even close to true

Sony’s $499 PS5 is no longer selling at a loss

The PS5 won’t be costly like the PS3.

www.theverge.com

What do you think is a better source. This or every sony financial report?

 

[diffusionx]

What do you think is a better source. This or every sony financial report?

Considering the quote is from Sony's CFO, I take it as reliable.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Considering the quote is from Sony's CFO, I take it as reliable.

A quote that isn't quoted any where else and isn't present in the transcript or video of the earnings report in which this is generally citing. Nor is it in the Q&A.

 

[delfrickintree]

PS6 + PS Portal 2

PS Portal 2 plays PS1-PS5 games natively at
1080p (PSSR). Has direct connect remote play with PS6 and cloud streaming only available to PS Plus Premium members.

Full backwards compatibility would be an instant seller, for both systems. But we all know that wont happen

 

[diffusionx]

A quote that isn't quoted any where else and isn't present in the transcript or video of the earnings report in which this is generally citing. Nor is it in the Q&A.

Alright dude, it was sourced from Bloomberg, maybe they are lying, think whatever you want. I don't really care that much.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

I hope not. Sony's output this gen has been horribly weak this gen (high quality games but they take forever to come out). We don't need a handheld making shit worse than it already is when it comes to output.

 

[Kabelly]

Exclusive to each console? Something will get negelcted. It's literally the reason Nintendo merged everything and it has worked wonderfully for them, and for me as a consumer. I actually didn't own Nintendo's handhelds so I missed a lot of their games and IPs. Switch was my introduction to a lot.

The only way it works in their favour is if the handheld plays the exact same games as the home console and at that point it should still be a hybrid. People underrated having a 2 in 1 machine for Switch and your games.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Alright dude, it was sourced from Bloomberg, maybe they are lying, think whatever you want. I don't really care that much.

It was reported by bloomberg and no one else.

It's not an interview he did with Bloomberg, it's just citing the earnings report.

He never said this during the earnings report.

It's a quote without an actual quote. You'll notice that he doesn't put this in quotation marks, thus he is paraphrasing what he said. He actually uses quotes outside of this in the article from people he is quoting.

The problem? Totoki never said that during the presentation of the earnings report and again, this was not an interview with Bloomberg. So where did the quote come from?

Whole article

Sony Group Corp. raised its fiscal-year profit forecast, betting that improving prospects for its music, movies and electronics divisions will offset slowing gaming demand as the global economy starts to emerge from Covid-19.
The Tokyo-based entertainment giant increased its full-year operating profit outlook to 980 billion yen ($8.99 billion) from 930 billion yen previously. Operating profit for the quarter ended June was 280 billion yen, higher than the average analyst expectations of 226.1 billion yen. Sony switched its accounting method from U.S. standards to IFRS starting with the June quarter.

Sony Chief Financial Officer Hiroki Totoki said that the company’s key product, the $499 PlayStation 5, was no longer selling at a loss. The $399 PS5 Digital Edition is on track to have its loss offset by other hardware sales including peripherals and the PlayStation 4, the CFO added.
Vaccine rollouts have helped some countries start returning to pre-Covid work and lifestyle habits, though uncertainty about coronavirus variants remains. Sony said it expects higher income from film and TV show productions as well as an increase in licensing fee revenues. The company also sees music streaming revenue improving and higher sales of its digital cameras giving a boost to its electronics and image-sensor units.
Sony’s shares have gained 7.7% this year after rising 39% last year.

“Better camera sales are helping offset part of the concern for image sensors being hit by the loss of revenue from smartphone handset clients,” SBI Securities analyst Yoshiharu Izumi said after the results. “The focus so far has been on the group’s entertainment assets such as games and anime, but the first-quarter result confirmed its traditional electronics hardware business remains solid.”

The video game industry was among the big beneficiaries of last year’s surge in stay-at-home entertainment triggered by the pandemic, providing a tailwind for Sony’s PlayStation division. That effect appears to be waning as Sony reported weaker software sales for the period as well as slowing subscriber additions for its PlayStation Plus service and lower revenue from third-party games. PlayStation 5 hardware sales helped push up revenue in the most recent quarter, but the high cost of producing the console weighed on profits.
PlayStation Plus subscribers declined to 46.3 million from 47.6 million in the previous quarter and monthly active users fell to 104 million from 109 million. The company is maintaining its goal of selling over 14.8 million PlayStation 5 units this fiscal year.
“Going forward, Sony will be selling every single PS5 it puts into markets in a matter of seconds. Therefore, a challenge is not generating demand, but supply,” said industry analyst Serkan Toto. “On software, Covid-19 is affecting production and so many big titles that would drive hardware sales and PlayStation network subscribers got delayed to next year.”
Sony’s Fate/Grand Order smartphone franchise, one of the highest-grossing mobile games since its release in 2015, started to lose players to local competitor Uma Musume Pretty Derby made by Cygames, a CyberAgent Inc. unit. The six-year-old FGO is the marquee title in Sony’s smartphone games business, which is focused on the domestic Japanese market.

He quotes SBI Securities analyst Yoshiharu Izumi.

Here is the Q2 2021 QA

Questioner 1Q1: [EP&S segment] Average sales prices for cameras and televisions appear to be increasing, butwhat is your view on the factors driving this? Of the factors behind such price increases, how muchis due to improved product mix, and how much is due to market supply and demand? Could youcomment on how sustainable the first-quarter price increases are on or after the second quarter, giveninventory levels in distribution channels?A1: I believe that TV prices have been impacted by both our product mix and market supply/demandfactors. While our product strategy is to focus on large screen sizes and the high-end category, sincethe first quarter, market demand for small TVs of 32 inches or less has been weak, and prices on themhave dropped. In that sense, prices have been impacted by both factors. In the case of cameras, Ibelieve that the product mix has been extremely beneficial. The market for full-size mirrorlesscameras has picked back up as vaccinations have ramped around the world, marking a break fromthe conditions we saw during the COVID-19 pandemic in FY2020. This has naturally provided uswith a strong tailwind. Current levels of market inventory of both cameras and TVs are notparticularly concerning. Looking ahead to 2H FY2021, we expect panel prices to drop, so how wedeal with that will be crucial.Q2: [I&SS segment] Where did your capacity stand at the end of the first quarter, and what was youraverage wafer input over the quarter? Could you also share your outlook for each of those datapoints in the second quarter? Lastly, if there have been any changes to your outlook for the average selling price per wafer for the second quarter onward, please let us know.A2: As of the end of the first quarter, monthly photodiode production capacity stood at roughly 135,000wafers, which, because of changes in model mix, was less than the 141,000 we quoted as our estimatelast time. We expect monthly capacity to be at 138,000 wafers at the end of the second quarter. Asfor wafer inputs, the simple monthly average for the three months of the first quarter was around137,000 wafers. Our estimate as of the end of the fourth quarter of FY2020 had been roughly 138,000wafers, so the result was basically in line with our expectations and represents full utilization. Weincreased our utilization as we had planned in preparation for shipments for new models this fiscalyear. We expect the simple monthly average for wafer input over the three months of the secondquarter to work out to around 138,000 and are anticipating operating at full utilization. I believethat the average selling price for wafers is down by around 10% compared to the first quarter of theprevious fiscal year, owing largely to a particular Chinese customer.Questioner 2Q1: [Consolidated] Looking at the revisions to your operating income forecasts in the Music, Pictures,and EP&S segments, could you give us a rough idea as to how much of each revision owes to greaterthan-expected performance in the first quarter and how much owes to upward revisions to youroutlook?A1: Our upward revision for the EP&S segment reflects the particularly strong first-quarter result.The revision to our outlook for 2H FY2021 and beyond is not large, but our forecast takes into accountrisks including the difficulty in predicting what TV demand will look like from 2H FY2021 onward,as well as what impact another wave of COVID-19 could have on production, sales, and our supplychain. The Music segment had a very strong first quarter, with streaming exhibiting strong growth.Advertising-supported streaming has struggled due to the pandemic, but now the advertising marketis recovering, and we have reflected that into our forecast to a reasonable extent. We revised ourfull-year forecast for the Pictures segment based on updated information.Q2: [Consolidated] What are your views on macroeconomic conditions, market scale, and the demandenvironment from now until the end of FY2021 in North America and China in particular?A2: I hope that the current brisk conditions continue, but it is impossible to say to what extentconditions will be affected by further waves of COVID-19. For example, around two months ago, wehad expected that theatrical releases would make a steady comeback in the Pictures segment, butnow we think that a full return to movie theatres is proving a challenge. In North America, weunderstand there is still some reluctance to taking children to the cinema to see family-friendly films. We thought the impact of COVID-19 in China was relatively limited, but judging from the recentwave of tougher regulations in China, it seems that the economy is unlikely to be China’s sole focus,so we need to monitor developments there closely.Questioner 3Q1: [Consolidated] What is your view on China’s regulation of platforms? I believe that the directimpact that you would face would be to your mobile games and to the stakes that you hold in certainplatforms. Could you tell us how your entertainment business is affected?A1: At present, we are not heavily reliant on China as a market. It accounts for a somewhat limitedportion of our sales. Issues such as censorship and restrictions on movies released in China haveexisted for some time, and all that we can do is understand the situation and take appropriate actionas quickly as possible. We are going to have to become even more attuned and responsive to suchissues. In terms of our investments, the stakes that we hold are not so sizable as to impact ourbusiness, and given the timing at which we invested, we are not at risk of sustaining very significantlosses. These are strictly capital tie-ups focused on fostering long-term partnerships, and we intendto maintain that stance on these relationships.Q2: [Consolidated] You raised your operating income forecast in the face of uncertainties. If there issome message behind that or some aspect of that upgrade on which you want us to focus, could youlet us know what that is?A2: Across our segments, there were areas where our forecasts went up and others where they wentdown. As such, the upgrade to our consolidated operating income forecast is mostly the product ofslight tweaks. We see it less as a major change and more as a natural increase stemming from theresults we achieved in the first quarter. There is no significant overarching message behind it, andwe arrived at the forecast that we have released by taking both risks and opportunities into accountas they appear to us.Questioner 4Q1: [G&NS segment] Your monthly active users (MAU) stand at 104 million. What is your take onthat number?A1: We do not see 104 million as a very strong number, but we do not expect to see it trend downwardhereafter. We have analyzed the data underlying that number for the first quarter but have beenunable to identify any particularly distinct trends and need to continue to watch the data after this month. We are keenly aware of the substantial impact of stay-at-home demand in FY2020 and notethe uptrend as compared to FY2019. The situation will continue to warrant close monitoring, andwe will also need to work to deepen engagement and bolster the value of the platform. We hope todevise and implement several initiatives this fiscal year as well.

You'll see everything he mentions in his article is from this QA and from the financial report. The only problem? Totoki never said what he said he said.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Why would they do this? Why would they even rerelease an actual proper handheld?

Where is this narrative that handhelds are the next great hype coming from? Because of the steam deck? Or that MS is rumored to be trying its hand at it?

 

[DEAD ORIGINAL]

Two pairs of socks one for the feet the other shoved there pants

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Why would they do this? Why would they even rerelease an actual proper handheld?

Where is this narrative that handhelds are the next great hype coming from? Because of the steam deck? Or that MS is rumored to be trying its hand at it?

It's more about Nintendo not Microsoft or Valve.