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CoD Black Ops |OT| Always Bet On Black
- Thread starter divisionbyzorro
- Start date
My framerates for Black Ops on PC are a lot worse than COD4 and Modern Warfare 2 for some reason. Did Treyarch update the engine that much for this game or is this just a badly-optimized COD?
Now I'll admit that what I'm running is only an 8800GT, but in COD4 with detail settings cranked up and 2xAA on my 1440 x 900 monitor I would get between 60 and 90fps in 32-player games. I never got the time to measure on MW2's free weekends but I don't remember seeing that game stutter on my system at all.
In 16-player games on Black Ops with 0xAA, no AF, and no Shadow Warming I'm still only getting 30-50fps. That's about the same framerate I get for Crysis (DX9).
Now I'll admit that what I'm running is only an 8800GT, but in COD4 with detail settings cranked up and 2xAA on my 1440 x 900 monitor I would get between 60 and 90fps in 32-player games. I never got the time to measure on MW2's free weekends but I don't remember seeing that game stutter on my system at all.
In 16-player games on Black Ops with 0xAA, no AF, and no Shadow Warming I'm still only getting 30-50fps. That's about the same framerate I get for Crysis (DX9).
Rewrite said:
Not something that I heard of before, is anything else on the PS3 taking that long to download? Ever tried downloading like a demo or something to see if it affects anything else? Maybe today is just a bad day to download the patch.
RedSwirl said:
I don't own the PC version, but it just sounds like the game just wasn't optimized very well. There have been several patches to address the performance issues, none of them have helped you I presume?
It seems that people with Quad Core and high-end video cards seem to be fine at this point. People with weaker machines are probably not so lucky.
spiderman123
Member
This is the most fucked up night ever. They need to fix this split screen bullshit. First off all there is this pair of split screeners, each on opposite teams the first one is in a party and he with his ghost camping G11 friends decide to sit in a corner while the other guy decides to boost. They need to fucking fix this dumb ass glitch man
Mr. Enigma
Member
spiderman123 said:
Did you report him for boosting? If so and it checks out, he'll get reset back to fresh meat level 1.
spiderman123
Member
AnEternalEnigma said:
i did but they need to fix this shit seriously
Xux
Member
divisionbyzorro said:
I don't really mind a small magazine as long as the reload time is good (I think they should raise the AK74u's reload time since it's so ridiculously fast compared to the MP5k's and in relation to the 20 round SMGs reload speeds; I also don't think the 100 round capacity is what makes the good LMGs very good) or has a good recoil to make each bullet count (like the Skorpion). I do think the 20 guns should get more magazines to be more along the lines with the 30 round guns so it'd be 20+100 rounds and 30+90.
Even then, though, SMGs are still worse guns despite the smaller hip spread, higher mobility, and faster ADS because of their higher recoil and lower damage at every range. Using them just feels like it boils down to "hope that they're not using a FAMAS and maybe I'll do okay" when you're on top of someone.
divisionbyzorro said:Regarding the Stoner, it does have a ridiculous DPS. I wouldn't change much about it though, other than give it a slightly longer reload, longer ADS, or wider hipfire circle. Or maybe just a smaller clip size would be enough. I don't really think it's OP as it is though. The FAMAS and AUG just need a lower fire rate.
Those are my thoughts anyway. You're the numbers guy around here though; I trust your opinions on CoD math pretty much implicitly.
Yeah, getting rid of the AR like stuff about the Stoner would probably fine though I'd probably raise it's recoil, too, if I'd leave the damage alone.
Looking at the numbers, the lower rate of fire ARs still kill faster up close than the higher rate of fire SMGs. I'd sum up my main issue with the balance as "There are ARs that are better at close range than SMGs."
Here's a good chart if you've missed it:
http://denkirson.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=2097
DodgyGeezerFella
Member
RedSwirl said:
People (myself included, i geeked out 1 night to try it) have noticed an insane boost in performance from running the game in Windows XP, were talking a 30-40 FPS increase. I took some shots to show the difference here -
XP -
http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=xp1q74k.jpg
http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=xp2270e.jpg
http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=xp3r7kf.jpg
Win 7 -
http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=win71b7ks.jpg
http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=win72p7h1.jpg
http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=win73f71s.jpg
Stuttered like crazy on both however so it still pissed me off, but there really is something wierd with what Treyarch did to the engine. Black Ops kinda bums me out though as i specifically built my brother a computer before it came out hoping he could play it with solid performance (he played MW2 on a 4550), and all this shit happens :/
Just waiting patch after patch for the thing to be sorted out.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
You should turn down textures one notch and shader warming just helps with the hitching so it should be on for everyone. All it does is add a couple seconds to the map load.RedSwirl said:
BigBlue1974
Member
PS3, http://over30clan.webs.com/ if you are interested.Ryck said:
Lionheart1827
Member
spiderman123 said:
I cant stand split screeners for other reasons, but report em for boosting.
I find whenever a split screen pair is on my team one of the following happens:
1)They both are severely negative and ruin the game
2)One guy has an ok score, and the other guy probably put the controller down and ends up going 1-18.
3)They both have shitty connections
I rarely ever see a split screen pair do good. :/
Jack Scofield
Member
Today I went back to MW2 after a few months hiatus (not because of Black Ops, mind you. I don't waste my time with Treyarch products). It's amazing how terrible these players still are, especially when no one bothers to shoot down enemy aircraft. "DURR. Maybe this time the Pave Low WON'T kill me." Hahahaha. Suck it down, chumps.
Also, I've noticed that the losers who DO shoot down killstreaks are usually the worst players in the match. Their K is usually something around 1.00 or even lower. Probably a correlation. Equipping a Stinger is like broadcasting to the world that you're a terrible player who can't aim worth shit. Take some advice from me and stop the opposing team from earning killstreaks in the first place.
Also, I've noticed that the losers who DO shoot down killstreaks are usually the worst players in the match. Their K
is usually something around 1.00 or even lower. Probably a correlation. Equipping a Stinger is like broadcasting to the world that you're a terrible player who can't aim worth shit. Take some advice from me and stop the opposing team from earning killstreaks in the first place.spiderman123
Member
I've busted a over 2.5 k/d above and over 20 kills every game and I still lose for the past 11 matches. Anyone wants to party up PLEASE!
edit: nvm I got someone. But if anyone else wishes to join your welcome too
edit: nvm I got someone. But if anyone else wishes to join your welcome too
So they are terrible if they do shoot down enemy aircraft and they're terrible if they don't. I guess everyone is just terrible lolJack Scofield said:Today I went back to MW2 after a few months hiatus (not because of Black Ops, mind you. I don't waste my time with Treyarch products). It's amazing how terrible these players still are, especially when no one bothers to shoot down enemy aircraft. "DURR. Maybe this time the Pave Low WON'T kill me." Hahahaha. Suck it down, chumps.
Also, I've noticed that the losers who DO shoot down killstreaks are usually the worst players in the match. Their K
divisionbyzorro
Member
Jack Scofield said:Today I went back to MW2 after a few months hiatus (not because of Black Ops, mind you. I don't waste my time with Treyarch products). It's amazing how terrible these players still are, especially when no one bothers to shoot down enemy aircraft. "DURR. Maybe this time the Pave Low WON'T kill me." Hahahaha. Suck it down, chumps.
Also, I've noticed that the losers who DO shoot down killstreaks are usually the worst players in the match. Their K
And this post belongs in the Black Ops thread...why?
MarshMellow96
Member
Damn, this thread takes some turns..
spiderman123
Member
VALKYRAY said:
well if you continue trolling you'll never see OT2
Kermit The Dog
Banned
Jack Scofield said:Today I went back to MW2 after a few months hiatus (not because of Black Ops, mind you. I don't waste my time with Treyarch products). It's amazing how terrible these players still are, especially when no one bothers to shoot down enemy aircraft. "DURR. Maybe this time the Pave Low WON'T kill me." Hahahaha. Suck it down, chumps.
Also, I've noticed that the losers who DO shoot down killstreaks are usually the worst players in the match. Their K
Fancy someone coming into the BO thread, espousing his derision for a game he's yet played, and then having the hide to waffle on about the worst game in the series, MW2. Ridiculous.
Give it a try mate, you'll be pleasantly surprised.
divisionbyzorro
Member
There are a few reasons why the thread is dying:
For the record, at this point in the life of the MW2 thread, most of the conversation was people bitching about nuke boosting and care package glitching.
- It's basically the same game we've seen for the past four years. There's not much left to say!
- This thread has, at multiple times, devolved into ridiculous personal fights, which has (rightfully) caused people to unsub from the thread.
- We've also had a greater degree of asinine trolling than the MW2 thread did, which has also caused people to unsub.
- Not everybody subs; we lost people when we were moved into the Community forum and it took people a while to find us again.
- There's also an unreasonable amount of Treyarch hate on NeoGAF.
For the record, at this point in the life of the MW2 thread, most of the conversation was people bitching about nuke boosting and care package glitching.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
I think it's the childish fighting and boring as fuck KDR W/L ratio discussions that go way to in-depth that 99% of people don't care about or find interesting.
there are reasons behind all that treyarch hate dont you thinkdivisionbyzorro said:There are a few reasons why the thread is dying:
- It's basically the same game we've seen for the past four years. There's not much left to say!
- This thread has, at multiple times, devolved into ridiculous personal fights, which has (rightfully) caused people to unsub from the thread.
- We've also had a greater degree of asinine trolling than the MW2 thread did, which has also caused people to unsub.
- Not everybody subs; we lost people when we were moved into the Community forum and it took people a while to find us again.
- There's also an unreasonable amount of Treyarch hate on NeoGAF.
For the record, at this point in the life of the MW2 thread, most of the conversation was people bitching about nuke boosting and care package glitching.
Kermit The Dog
Banned
VALKYRAY said:
Not really. WaW was built like a brick shithouse and had the best maps in the series.
BO is the most balanced and hacker-free COD ever, but has netcode issues undoubtedly.
As a rule, I'm more excited about Treyarch COD's than any other because they actually give a toss about the userbase and know how to design a fucking map.
The only reason IW don't cop as much heat is because of the absolute genius of COD4. It had its problems too, but it was unquestionably a masterpiece. The less said about MW2, the better.
Mr Nightman
Banned
This is it exactly, I mean some kd discussion is fine but thats all that goes down here anymore.Stallion Free said:
TurboLibre
Member
What the heck? I just exited a lobby and my profile actually changed to another players. It was very brief (a little over a minute), but my name, emblem, rank, everything was changed to some other guys. I couldn't even access certain playlists because my level wasn't high enough.
Crazy.
Crazy.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Lol yeah they care about you if you are on 360. Did you see those quotes?3ur4zn said:
And they have their share of shit maps.
Jack Scofield
Member
3ur4zn said:
Not hard to craft a competent game when all you do is re-skin the hard work of your predecessors.
Good intentions don't excuse poor results. It doesn't matter how great their game is if the online functionality is crap. What makes it even worse is that all previous CODs never had this problem; Treyarch seemed to conjure it up out of thin air for Black Ops.
Unless you're playing on the PS3 or PC.
I can't hate IW for attempting to change up the COD formula, even if the results weren't spectacular. If it weren't for MW2, I honestly think Black Ops would still have three locked killstreak rewards, no titles, emblems, or anything else IW introduced in MW2. The series would be even MORE stagnant than it is now.
The revisionist love for WaW and Treyarch in general is hilarious.
divisionbyzorro
Member
I can only speak from my experiences. I never played CoD3, and I've only played CoD on 360. W@W was fantastic, and Black Ops generally plays quite smoothly for me. In fact, Black Ops is easily my favorite in the series so far. As such, I find Treyarch to be a perfectly competent development studio. Yeah, I get that they kinda shit the bed with the PC version, at least at launch, but let's not forgot which studio decided to shit directly on their PC fans with MW2 (the whole dedicated server fiasco).
(And holding CoD3 against Treyarch is simply ignorant; the fact that the game even exists is something of a miracle given the ridiculously short dev time the studio had to make that game. Basically, blame Kotick, not Vahn.)
To be honest, I still feel like CoD4 was "lightning in a bottle." Both studios have been trying desperately to repeat that level of genius ever since 2007, and neither of them have gotten back to that point. W@W was, essentially, a CoD4 mod. MW2 was an entertaining game, yet horribly unbalanced to the point of being broken (and it was a ridiculous glitch-fest too, in case you forgot). I think Black Ops has come the closest; it's taken the best ideas from MW2, W@W, and CoD4, and it's introduced a few new ideas of its own.
tl;dr: The way I see it:
Infinity Ward is still riding on the wave of good feelings from CoD4, but is trending downwards.
Treyarch is still riding on the wave of shit from CoD3, but is trending upwards.
(And holding CoD3 against Treyarch is simply ignorant; the fact that the game even exists is something of a miracle given the ridiculously short dev time the studio had to make that game. Basically, blame Kotick, not Vahn.)
To be honest, I still feel like CoD4 was "lightning in a bottle." Both studios have been trying desperately to repeat that level of genius ever since 2007, and neither of them have gotten back to that point. W@W was, essentially, a CoD4 mod. MW2 was an entertaining game, yet horribly unbalanced to the point of being broken (and it was a ridiculous glitch-fest too, in case you forgot). I think Black Ops has come the closest; it's taken the best ideas from MW2, W@W, and CoD4, and it's introduced a few new ideas of its own.
tl;dr: The way I see it:
Infinity Ward is still riding on the wave of good feelings from CoD4, but is trending downwards.
Treyarch is still riding on the wave of shit from CoD3, but is trending upwards.
Mr. Enigma
Member
This thread sucks because of people like VALKYRAY, who do nothing but troll and play Infinity Ward fanboy at the slightest hint of unhappiness someone has with this game. This thread would be infinitely better if there was a way to remove him from it.
It really isn't. There were the javelin and the care package glitches and those were awful times, to be sure, but it was temporary and nothing like it remains. Black Ops has glitches in every little thing - from napalm fire to climbing ladders to picking up weapons. It has no big, game-breaking glitches, but it has such a neverending list of little glitches that the overall experience is just annoying to me.divisionbyzorro said:
Napalm fire, climbing ladders, picking up weapons, switching weapons, chopper gunner, laggy dogs... So many annoying little glitches in Black Ops. I'm going to make a list some day!
To me, it's completely unavoidable that MW2 has the far smoother gameplay experience. It has a few things that some people can't tolerate (the tubing and sniping, duh), but those few things being bad don't mean that the controls and the smooth framerate and things like that are bad. Because they're completely fucking awesome.
buy teh haloz
Banned
What's wrong with the napalm fire?
That is what I mean. They're just completely broken in every possible way. Killstreaks overall are kind-of bad in this game.Xux said:
Dogs are pretty bad too, I mean... I never understood it in WaW and I don't understand it now - why do the dogs need to be host-controlled? Why can't my local copy of the game generate some local, completely lag free, dogs for me to combat with? What the fuck is it supposed to matter if other players see the exact same dogs as me? So stupid.
Oh! I'm also really getting annoyed by how, when you're in the Chopper Gunner, there are corners where it's impossible to aim no matter what - when you're over it, you're not allowed to position the gun toward there and when you're not, there are houses in the way. Normally, that would be fine and it would be fair if those corners existed as a place to hide from the death from above...if they weren't fucking spawn points! So unfair!
buy teh haloz
Banned
Yeah, I remember that air strikes had the same problem, but it was much less noticeable. It's a pity they didn't tweak them a bit more.
divisionbyzorro
Member
aku:jiki said:
You're totally glossing over MW2s glitches. That game was literally unplayable for weeks at a time! How many times did they promise that they'd fixed care packages?
In terms of existing bugs in Black Ops, the only two that really bother me are invisible napalm fire and the double airstrike sound glitch. Weapons swapping/switching has never been a problem to me, and I can count the times I've even seen enemy dogs on my hands, so I can't really speak to seeing laggy dogs. Id agree that the ladders could be stickier, but I've adjusted at this point. I almost wonder if they were deliberately screwing with trickshotters here (ladder jumps were really popular in the community at one point).
And regarding the Chopper Gunner; isn't the limited path of the CG the only thing that keeps it from being better than the Gunship? I'm pretty sure the weird pathing is a balance decision; if you want a chopper that kicks serious ass all around the map, use the Gunship. The CG is almost too powerful at 9 kils as it is; the ease of shooting down air support and weird pathing is the only thing keeping it in check.
At it's best; at the highest peaks of gameplay, MW2 was indeed better than Black Ops. But even at its worst, Black Ops has never made me nearly as frustrated at MW2 did, and on average, my experience with BO has been infinitely more enoyable than MW2 was when I quit playing it. I guess I'm saying that my memories of my time with MW2 is overshadowed by glitches and exploits; of course, only time will tell how I remember Black Ops a year from now...
I am not; I'm speaking as someone who never stopped playing MW2 (obsessively, GAF would say) and reflecting back on it. Yes, the care package "era" was fucking awful, but it was a year ago and nothing like it has popped up since. I can't agree that something that happened in february 2010 should bother me in february 2011.divisionbyzorro said:
Also, I have to maintain that a few weeks of glitches is nothing compared to a game being constantly broken. Sure, MW2 has had problems but at least it works when it works - Black Ops can't even claim to that. It simply never works!
Yes, but I'm talking about specific situations. On Havana and in Demolition, and there's at least one other map that I can't remember which (Jungle maybe?), where there is a spawn point that's impossible to aim at. But guys on the ground can easily aim a Strela at me. Shouldn't be possible, and indeed, I do see that corner - I'm just not allowed to aim at it. It's a fuck-up by Treyarch, not a balance decision.divisionbyzorr said:
Yes, that means it's only in Demolition and "I can play something else if I want to get kills with my Chopper Gunner blah blah blah" - why the fuck should I have to? It's my favorite mode and the features offered in the marketing should work as well in that mode as in your favorite mode. (Not directed at you, dvb, I just know somebody's gonna pull that bullshit argument.)
Here's an argument I can't believe you're being blind to; you played MW2 a hell of a lot more than you're playing BO. In this thread alone, you've made multiple posts detailing how you're suffering CoD fatigue and hardly play this game, yet at this point in the MW2 thread, you were still happily tube-whoring your way to those 10 nukes.divisionbyzorro said:
Maybe you just haven't played BO as much as you played MW2, and thus haven't spotted all the problems in BO.
divisionbyzorro
Member
aku:jiki said:
Saying that Black Ops never works is something of an exaggeration. Sure, there are glitches that haven't yet been fixed and are annoying to deal with, but so did MW2. As I recall, Pave Lows never worked properly for as long as I played the game, and I was still having Stingers randomly miss Harriers when I quit. Of course, I've played MW2 for maybe a couple of hours since last spring, so I can't really speak too much to what the game plays like now; maybe it is all sunshine and rainbows as far as glitches are concerned. But I can only form my opinions based on my own personal experiences.
And of course, my original point was about the relative development abilities of Infinity Ward and Treyarch, and pointing out that neither studio is immune to game-crippling bugs and glitches. Which is very true.
aku:jiki said:
I know exactly what you're talking about; Havana and Array both have spots where, if the chopper is hovering around them, you simply can't pull the gun far enough downward to shoot them because the chopper is too close. I guess it just never got under my skin though; I always appreciated that the CG had some sort of weakness.
aku:jiki said:
Yes, you're right - I loved tube-whoring for a while. But I got sick of it. I was actually pretty terrible at MW2, all things considered, and I had given myself the goal of collecting all of the killstreak reward emblems. So I tube-whored my way to ten nukes, earned the rest of the rewards "legitimately," and once I reached that goal (plus a few other emblems like the 8-bit Price), I started playing the game for the sake of playing the game. At that point, without a false motivation to push me through, I started seeing more and more of the flaws. Emblem collection actually motivated me to play that game a lot more than I otherwise would have; once that ran out, the only thing left was to try to actually get better at the game. And in that phase, I started hating everything about the game. I left feeling like I had tricked myself into playing a bad game just to collect pointless shiny objects.
You're right about the CoD fatigue though; I just don't attribute that to being the fault of Black Ops. That's the fault of being given slight variations on the same game for four years in a row now. If you ate pizza every day for dinner, it wouldn't matter if the pizza kept getting better and better - eventually you just want a hamburger!
...okay, that was a stupid analogy, but you get the point.
Actually, I don't think it is. When you boil the situation down, what are the most vital aspects of a CoD game? Is it the hit detection, movement smoothness and so on, or is it the fact that PaveLows don't count toward your killstreak, people can get multiple care packages or the fact that the Intervention has too much aim assist? Of course it's the former(s), nobody would argue against that.divisionbyzorro said:
And on that level, I can't escape the fact that when I shoot people in MW2, they die. If the match lags, it'll lag in a "fair" way - meaning as long as my aim is true and his is off, I will get the kill because even if there was a time difference, I still hit and he still missed. I just get the kill in 1 second rather than instantly. In Black Ops, that seems to never happen. All the bloody time, people fly around corners and blast me like their FAMAS was a shotgun.
Like you already posted yourself; it already does! The fact that it moves in a predictable circle and the low altitude (meaning lots of obstacles in the way of targets) are two huge tweaks, and they're enough. It's not fair that the g uys on the ground get an invincibility area - if I know a dude is trying to take me down and I'm better at piloting the CG than he is at taking it down, I should get him.divisionbyzorro said:
All he needs to do is mad dash it for the closest house, tac-insert inside and prepare the Strela before moving up to a window and locking on. Taking out a chopper is extremely easy if you figure this tactic out - the chopper gunner shouldn't be pre-punished because people are too stupid to.
Oh, me neither! I'm just saying that the math alone makes sense - you've spent less time on this, so you've noticed less flaws. I can't agree that means that the game, objectively speaking, has less flaws though...divisionbyzorro said:
Kermit The Dog
Banned
aku:jiki said:
No, it really is.
Yeah, but you're completely exaggerating the impact of BO's flaws. It doesn't 'break the game' like MW2's exploits and glitches did.
I've put 27 days into WaW and I'd laugh hysterically at anyone who denied to my face that WaW isn't the most solidly built COD game ever made, irrespective of the COD4 'reskin' barb... So, let's agree it's subjective and move on?
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
I'm pretty sure the hit boxes are fucked on any killstreak dropped from a plane. I have been killed whilst deep inside buildings far away from any visual of the killstreak yet I have still been killed.
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