Who here is ready to have an ethics debate on posting photos of a comic page from your iPad. I struggle with this quite a bit, and I want to say that it is ok as promotional material for trying to explain to someone why you should read a book, but it is not ok to post multiple pages or spoilers from new releases. I wish Eric_J was here to give us his two cents on the matter.
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COMICS! |OT| October 2014. Witches, wytches, and things that go GROOT in the night.
- Thread starter Spike Spiegel
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TetraxShards
Member
Just saw this. Neither Deus Ex sequel is great, but Invisible War is NOT better than Human Revolution. Director's Cut of HR makes it a lot better IMO, those boss fights in Vanilla were woeful.
Ms. Marvel Volume 3: The Instagram Gauntlet
I loved 1, absolutely despised 2 and have liked everything I've seen so far of inquisition. So I am hyped but cautious.
echoshifting
Banned
I'm inclined to agree. It's cool for promoting a book and makes sense in this medium as a way to do that, but I don't even like posting full pages. Posting multiple pages of spoilers, especially for new books, isn't just inconsiderate to creators, but to readers as well, since those are a bit harder to avoid than tagged spoilers. Fortunately I don't think that happens too often around here.
That said, I do think there is a right way to do it, such as that Thor: God Butcher thead that went up a few months ago. That was basically a passionate love letter to that series. I thought it was great.
So I'm up to issue 3 of The Auteur. As much as I'm having a blast reading it, I can't confidently recommend it to everyone. The writing can be pretty immature, and if you don't like that kind of thing, you should stay well away. For the first two issues, the writer was walking the fine line between immature and hilarious, but with the third issue, at some points it was just straight up immature to a slightly annoying degree.
But with that said, the artist is still absolutely incredible and even with the bit of immaturity, I'm still hugely enjoying the book as a whole.
I just wanted to add that caveat to my previous praising of the book so that people who are more turned off by that kind of thing can know to stay away.
I haven't given a ton of thought to this, but if I want to post full pages, I like to stick to pages that were in the previews. Other than that, I'll usually stick to panels.
But with that said, the artist is still absolutely incredible and even with the bit of immaturity, I'm still hugely enjoying the book as a whole.
I just wanted to add that caveat to my previous praising of the book so that people who are more turned off by that kind of thing can know to stay away.
I haven't given a ton of thought to this, but if I want to post full pages, I like to stick to pages that were in the previews. Other than that, I'll usually stick to panels.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
I like to screenshot little moments I find funny.
Freezasaurus
Member
It's like I don't even know these people anymore.
A page or three sounds fine to me. Publishers often give away more than that in previews.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Pie and Beans hates everything besides Scarlet Spider/New Warriors and Superior Foes
The Pie and Beans actually totally enjoys right now ongoing comic list:
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
Superior Foes of Spider-Man
New Warriors
Rocket Raccoon
Injustice: Gods Among Us
Southern Bastards
Sex Criminals
Thor (although I'm at a rocky point with it due to the new gimmick forced upon it)
Saga (although I have read barely any of the 'second series')
Empowered (although I haven't been keeping up with that either)
This is excludes all the one-off indie stuff I pick up (I have a sickness for Fantagraphics and NoBrow stuff) and the JAPANESE MUNGUHS that I obsessively keep up with.
TetraxShards
Member
*Pie calling new Thor a gimmick*
That's two for two in bad comic opinions.
It absolutely is though. Doesn't mean the book won't be good but the amount of press it got puts it squarely in the gimmick category. Even the fact that they've added her to Puzzle Quest even though she's had two pages with no dialogue.
Serpentine
Banned
ya i probably won't place the order for a few more weeks, so I'll probs put Preacher back anyway.
and I'm pretty dang glad to see you enjoy The Auteur. A hidden gem from this year for sure. I can't really call it crass, it's like... it kinda is, but it's actually got a point to make and there's actually a story there behind the concept. The editor wrote a thing about that in the back of the first issue, dunno if it's in the TP
gpoy
speaking of elevator pitch Image comics...
She's a temporary change, sure, but that shouldn't diminish her as a character or as a sign of positive change on Marvel's part. You may as well call Kamala Khan a gimmick too, with the press she gets from taking Carol's old mantle.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Hell, you may as well call Spider-Man a gimmick, if we're going that route.
Or the X-Men.
Or Batman.
Bryan pls
Yeah, it's totally not cool to post an entire page from a book that's just been released or contains spoiler material.
I think it's okay if you post specific panels but it's so iffy with full pages.
I do advocate downloading certain titles that aren't available digitally and are out of print I.E. Miracle Man (I know this is no longer the case.).
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Spurrier is a really willfully obtuse writer. It's like he builds scaffolding of bullshit over every line of dialogue. It's kinda like if you re watch Angel but a million times worse.
It's a beautiful book but not really sure what ONI was thinking when they released this, really doesn't fit with anything else they publish.
Definitely not a book for everyone but worth checking out for the art.
TetraxShards
Member
No-one except people like us have even heard of Carol Danvers before though, and if they have it's either "The woman Rogue got her 90s cartoon powers from" or on GAF "The heroine that gave birth to her own rapist.". Carol hasn't been in three blockbuster movies either (more's the pity). Ms Marvel's press was way more "STRONG FEMALE MUSLIM PROTAGONIST" as opposed to "NEW VERSION OF MS. MARVEL SHOCKS FANBOYS!". There was already a Thor Girl before anyway.
Doesn't matter to me as long as the book's good, which Ms. Marvel is and hopefully Thor will be. The concept of Thor becoming unworthy is really interesting to me, especially if it leads to more Young Thor flashbacks because those are awesome.
You basically nailed it!
This is an industry that is trying to get as much mindshare as possible & "gimmicks" come with that territory. What we should all care about is supporting good books. If you support quality art/writing, we'll get better books.
crimsonspider89
Banned
I just want more bearded destoyer arm wielding an axe that can slay a celestial Barbariarian THor.
You can always pick up the Walt Simonson's Thor Omnibus if you haven't.
Probably one of the greatest runs on Thor ever!
I like to screenshot little moments I find funny.
This is also acceptable, and something I wish could be worked out legally to make it even more fun. Give us the option in app to
Crop a pannel and share it with social media like Tumblr. Let them enable a link that lets us rate panels and have it refer you back to the actual book so you can purchase it.
Also if that [redacted] guy ever comes back give him a raise if he can pitch these ideas to Amazon and also get me on a decent podcast/website.
Also, if [redacted] ever comes back; he should know I'm mad we didn't get drinks during my time at comic con.
Edit: Amazon ninjas.
Mac the KNife
Member
Female Thor, Kamala Kahn & Miles Morales are all gimmicks. That doesn't mean they can't be good, but they're definitely gimmicks.
Woot! Escaped from the OCD pit of collecting stuff in Smash Bros today (finally finished off the trophies and challenges), freeing up a nice solid week and some change to finally dig into Theatrhythm: Curtain Call before Bayonetta 2 arrives! Now if I can just squeeze some comics in there (I swear I will guys, really!)
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
I'll go further than the Girl Thor being a gimmick and if I'm right, isn't it just fucking weird full stop?
We'll see how the second issue plays out, but the first just felt like an abrupt handbrake turn on a run that I had endeared to but along comes event shit to stir things up. Again.
At least Kamala doesn't have a fucking VENOM BLAST™ to job everything in the world, although I guess the healing factor and "dog that can conveniently teleport her to interesting Marvel stuff while keeping teenage life hunky" is already on the ehhhhhhhhhh pile. Oh and thats she's one of those lucky Inhumans that doesnt have all their flesh replaced by undulating fish-guts because theory of what-the-fuck evorution. Check that cis-still get to pretend your normal mutant/inhuman privelege, sistah.
So, to sort of kick her misogynist (this era's most over-used term/heavy handed plot device) husband Odin in the balls (who is of course as backward thinking and pig headed as any story requires), Thor's mother will take up the mantle and secretly potter around as NuThor all while sort of... kind of making her son feel like shit? All in some long con to show Odin she can be A MIGHTY WARRIOR also, when, up to this point she was rocking it as a Queen anyway? The art has to stay ambiguous to not show her supposed actual age, and on we go for a full two years. SUPERIOR THORA
We'll see how the second issue plays out, but the first just felt like an abrupt handbrake turn on a run that I had endeared to but along comes event shit to stir things up. Again.
At least Kamala doesn't have a fucking VENOM BLAST™ to job everything in the world, although I guess the healing factor and "dog that can conveniently teleport her to interesting Marvel stuff while keeping teenage life hunky" is already on the ehhhhhhhhhh pile. Oh and thats she's one of those lucky Inhumans that doesnt have all their flesh replaced by undulating fish-guts because theory of what-the-fuck evorution. Check that cis-still get to pretend your normal mutant/inhuman privelege, sistah.
Awesome. I feel pretty confident that you'll love Preacher. I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts on it!
And yeah! I'm really surprised that it hasn't gotten more attention. Great stuff.
And the immature stuff I was talking about was
the part where the producer decides to shoot that one scene naked and they decided a nice half-page panel close-up of his dick for no reason at all was a funny thing to do. Also the recurring stuff about the producer drooling over that girl's big booty seemed pretty immature and unnecessary to me. I mean, that had something to do with the plot, so the idea of it didn't bother me, but I guess how it was executed was kind of immature if that makes sense.
But man, I still can't get over how incredible James Callahan's art is.
Freezasaurus
Member
I don't know who the new Thor could be. All they've said for sure is that she's someone that Thor has saved in the past.
So, any attempts at providing more diverse characters to help move away from the white/male norm are just empty coporate moves? Not to put words in anyone's mouths, but that's what tends to be the implication whenever someone writes a new character off as a "gimmick".
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
I think theres quite a few cool new characters that Marvel gave a go, but then they didnt sell. So they instead squeeze these newly diverse characters into already established roles, and that feels a lot more like a gimmick to me.
Guess I can't blame them, I can instead glare at those that didn't buy Fearless Defenders or New Warriors currently. I liked the new Inhumans characters okay, but that book suffered the Joe Mad Momentum Killshot, so... I havent allowed myself attachment despite Stegman art.
The page ON THE MOON before someone picks up the hammer is pretty all over the place, but thats the point I guess. A flowing cape and lock of blond hair is supposed to suggest its someone other than
Thor's mum
Freezasaurus
Member
echoshifting
Banned
It's obviously
Loki
Mac the KNife
Member
When they're piggybacking off of existing, popular characters? Yeah. If these characters were called anything other than "Thor" and "Spider-Man" would anyone care? Sif had a pretty well received book not too long ago and it was cancelled in a year. But Thor sells.
I'm down for diversity in comics and I see where you're coming from, but this seems like a weak way for it to happen, personally.
For the record, I liked the first few issues I read of Ms. Marvel.
Edit: And hey, if I'm a writer or artist at Marvel or DC I wouldn't want to develop some awesome brand new character for those corporations to own in perpetuity anyway. So if this is the concession that's fine. Still a gimmick though
It's because books like New Warriors and Fearless Defenders, those that have diversity front and center, tend not to sell because they aren't as recognized as the bigger players. As such, people don't want to buy them becauce they're not Avengers/X-Men/Spider-Man, etc. What Marvel is doing now is less "gimmicks" and more them simply trying new things to cater to the resurgence of female fandom and the growing voices of them and other marginalized audiences. And we should applaud them for it, IMO.
TetraxShards
Member
Everything is an empty corporate move, to an extent. Nothing is done at these big companies without thinking about how much dolla dolla it's going to bring in. These companies are aware of the pressures that are being applied to them by people that want more diversity (and they're right to want it) and they're going to try and draw people in to a hobby with an aging demographic.
It's a good way to attract younger fans and fans from different demographics, because they want to see characters like them. It's been that way since 1940 when Robin first appeared, maybe even earlier. My niece is six and knows very little about comics because in her words "they're for boys", but when I was home for my birthday and playing Marvel Heroes on my laptop she was fascinated by Captain Marvel because like my niece she's blonde. Now she wants to be Captain Marvel for Halloween and my sister-in-law is despairing at getting the hair right. I don't begrudge a young black kid thinking Miles Morales is cool or anything like that at all.
And I am skeptical, because I've every right to be. You should be too. I remember when Avengers Arena was announced and I was nearly sick at the idea that the cast of Avengers Academy, which is as diverse as nearly any team in superhero comics and a book I'm extremely fond of, were going to be messily killed off for shock value. I was extremely skeptical, but I gave it a chance and it was my favourite book of 2013.
And I wouldn't go implying people are racists for calling corporate gimmicks what they are, but that's just me.
Serpentine
Banned
mmm yeah i see your point. I also definitely forgot about
the dick close up. I remember thinking, "damn, they're just going all in!" after that but really i knew that after i read issue 1
Tyrant Rave
Banned
All I know is that New Warriors getting cancelled at issue number 12 is a crime
I just want my Kaine and Aracely fix :'(
I just want my Kaine and Aracely fix :'(
TetraxShards
Member
That happened near the end of the original 2099. Miguel was offered the hammer by Captain America and was eventually deemed worthy to lift it.
That's pretty rad.
Face it Tiger..
Banned
I don't agree with you about Kamala or Miles.
Miles has his own universe to parade around, and Kamala has her own identity and comic book and her backstory as a dormant Inhuman is very interesting.
If it's not an editorial mandate where your next character has to be this race or gender so we can sell more books and it's down to the creative team wanting to tell interesting stories from different perspectives then I would be hesitant to label them as gimmicks, just seems undermining. Maybe I put too much faith in what writers and artists say though.
Is anyone reading Justice League 3000? Thinking about picking it up after reading an interview where giffen talks about booster and beetle, sounds like he's having a blast with the book.
Haha yeah. And really, I'd be disappointed if I had finished the book without thinking it had gone too far at least once. It's unapologetically crazy and that's the appeal.
In fact, there was a line of dialogue in issue 3 just a handful of pages after that
dick close-up
It was pretty funny, because it made me think that Rick Spears knew exactly what he was doing by intentionally going over-the-top.
It's deceptive that I've been using the most words in my posts talking about the slightly negative aspects of The Auteur though, because really that's just me being nitpicky and I think the book is great fun and mostly brilliant.
TheDarkKnight774
Member
Clone Thor is back...but is a girl!
echoshifting
Banned
Glor
Yes. This works for me.
Yes. This works for me.
TetraxShards
Member
Then fans overuse the term, and Axel Alonso goes apeshit at a con panel about it and threatens to have her called Thirl.
All according to keikaku....
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