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Dark Souls |OT4| Victory achieved for Scamco, text defeated

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TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
It sounds like you are constantly looking ahead to what is next instead of enjoying what is right in front of you. S & O is one of the best boss fights in the game and you should be enjoying the challenge of the fight. Think up strategy on how to beat them and learn from your failures so you are elated when you do finally beat them. If you keep thinking of the game as a chore until you get everything you need for some build you looked up on the internet, you may miss the fun that's hitting you right in your face.

I don't enjoy invasions. So that leaves these bosses, which are trouble-some. I enjoy magic, which got nerfed hard, so that leaves... melee. Which is what this build is for. So that leaves... annoyance?

Of course, you're talking to someone that beat Demon's Souls with Poison Cloud and Soul Arrow with HP regen and MP regen rings equipped and a Cresent Falchion+5 along with like starting-to-mid-range armor for NG, NG+, NG++. So...
 

Croc

Banned
Just started this game today after finishing up Demon's Souls for the first time last week. I started off as a Pyromancer (since I played a Mage in DeS and loved it) and picked the Master Key.

I've been playing around 2 hours and have not made much progress. I only found out where to go after reading up online, cause everywhere seemed way too hard to fight through. Turns out I was right and I had missed the way to the Undead Burg (I still think it blends into the mountainside a bit too well).

Anyways, I think I might make a new character since in the couple of hours I've been playing as a Pyromancer, I have used almost no magic at all. Having the limit on magic now just makes me want to not use any at all since I won't know what's ahead. I think I'd rather just make a more melee focused character instead.

Anyone have any starting tips for a more melee oriented character?
 

Soulhouf

Member
pyromancy is good support for melee builds since it does not require any stat investment.

@TheSeks: you're doing it wrong. stop looking at the wiki and at least listen to other players advice. this game is fantastic and you managed to make it look aweful. it's really much easier than Demon's Souls (I beat it SL1 and SL2 which I could never do in Demons).
 

krakov

Member
I don't enjoy invasions. So that leaves these bosses, which are trouble-some. I enjoy magic, which got nerfed hard, so that leaves... melee. Which is what this build is for. So that leaves... annoyance?

Of course, you're talking to someone that beat Demon's Souls with Poison Cloud and Soul Arrow with HP regen and MP regen rings equipped and a Cresent Falchion+5 along with like starting-to-mid-range armor for NG, NG+, NG++. So...

Magic is still really powerful. You will destroy most enemies and many of the bosses with little trouble if you go full on magic build. For PvE it's generally a lot easier than going melee. You also have pyromancy which needs no stat investment and will wreck stuff as well.
 
I'm currently playing a pyromancer and yes, it's rather hard work. If you were a mage in Demon's Souls, go with a Sorcerer here.

Does anyone else feel that a pyromancer is kind of gimped against many bosses as it is? Lots of them resist fire, but even Seath takes decent damage from sorcery.
 

Dresden

Member
Pyro is still powerful, just not the god-stomping Iron Flesh juggernaut it was back on release.

Sorcery is still king for PVE stomping though.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
pyromancy is good support for melee builds since it does not require any stat investment.

Except it gets nerfed at the knees with usage limits. hence "magic nerfed."

it's really much easier than Demon's Souls (I beat it SL1 and SL2 which I could never do in Demons).

I'll agree with this. It is easier than Demon's Souls... until you hit the bosses... with no magic... and then get hit hard because you're using Magic over melee like you did in Demon's Souls.

Fabulous.
 

Grinchy

Banned
Pyro is still powerful, just not the god-stomping Iron Flesh juggernaut it was back on release.

Sorcery is still king for PVE stomping though.

Yeah, my sorcerer feels ridiculously powerful compared to the thief I made the first time around. I can just let my homing soul arrows auto-kill for me while I stand back safely. The build doesn't take a lot of hits but it does so much damage that it becomes laughably easy.
 
I've been playing around 2 hours and have not made much progress. I only found out where to go after reading up online, cause everywhere seemed way too hard to fight through. Turns out I was right and I had missed the way to the Undead Burg (I still think it blends into the mountainside a bit too well).
Haha, I think a lot of people did the same, I did. It does seem when you first hit Firelink that the skeleton graveyard is the logical path, although having played DeS, the entrance to the Catacombs gave me deja vu of that similar cave area in 4-2, so I knew it couldn't be that way! I didn't even notice the aquaduct until I think someone pointed it out here!

Maybe From did it on purpose to get people conversing with each other about the game, since a lot of it is about interaction.
 

Pollux

Member
fucking shit. I finally beat that damn Taurus Demon, and then got obliterated by some dragon. When I go back will the Taurus Demon have respawned and will I have to beat him again?
 

Jhoan

Member
After a couple of hours of playing, I finally made Quelaag's Furysword and upgraded the hell out of it. It's a godsend I have to say; it destroys most enemies like a knife cutting through hot butter. Unfortunately, my first time up against Ornstein and Smough (alone), I got destroyed by both of them. Now I've been helping other players to get a feel for them. I've also been getting destroyed by annoying invaders as well because I'm often ill prepared of when they're gonna come; I got back stabbed, and a lot of the players two hand weapons.

I forgot that Solaire can be summoned for this battle. I'd say the best battle I've had so far against them was me and two other players. I just got destroyed by them again though. I think I'm so strong that I'm able to survive giant Ornstein's impale move and both their butt slams. I leveled my health a little bit more (1001 now) to help as well as my stamina so I'm now LVL 88. I also kindled the bonfire twice to 15 Estus flasks which is more than enough against these two. Also having the Thunder Stoneplate Ring on helps immensely.

I'm for sure going to have to summon two other human players plus Solaire or Solaire and another human to take out Smough first. If any 360 players want to help me take them on, my GT is Johan El Fuerte. I'm currently online waiting to get summoned.

I just got summoned only to watch the host get killed by a mimic box. What an idiot.
 

RedAssedApe

Banned
Just started playing.

Beat the first boss. Bird took me away from undead land. Accidentally attacked the NPC who told me about the two bells. Died. Respawned. Died again and lost all my souls. Died again and again while NPC made disparaging remarks about me. Had to restart my game.

FML. LOL

Warrior build seems a little slow to me and I'm not great at blocking and parrying. Should I pick another class?
 

Booshka

Member
I don't enjoy invasions. So that leaves these bosses, which are trouble-some. I enjoy magic, which got nerfed hard, so that leaves... melee. Which is what this build is for. So that leaves... annoyance?

Of course, you're talking to someone that beat Demon's Souls with Poison Cloud and Soul Arrow with HP regen and MP regen rings equipped and a Cresent Falchion+5 along with like starting-to-mid-range armor for NG, NG+, NG++. So...

The Artorias sword is not good for melee builds, it's a jack of all trades build. If you want to focus on melee, put 20-24 points into strength and 40 into dex and have fun. You can use most weapons and you will do a ton of damage with pure physical melee and ranged weapons.

Magic is also extremely effective in PvE, you just need to level attunement, the governing magic stat and then buy good spells.

henhowc said:
Warrior build seems a little slow to me and I'm not great at blocking and parrying. Should I pick another class?
No, just take off some armor and use quicker weapons, the class doesn't matter. Warrior is great if you want to use a variety of melee weapons.
Don't worry about parrying too much, just block with L2 (LT) and then attack after their hit deflects off your shield. You can do that through the whole game if you just fight one or two enemies at a time and don't get overwhelmed.
 

RedAssedApe

Banned
No, just take off some armor and use quicker weapons, the class doesn't matter. Warrior is great if you want to use a variety of melee weapons.
Don't worry about parrying too much, just block with L2 (LT) and then attack after their hit deflects off your shield. You can do that through the whole game if you just fight one or two enemies at a time and don't get overwhelmed.

But but...I want to do some cool reposte-ing haha
 

Booshka

Member
But but...I want to do some cool reposte-ing haha

Well then just start practicing, the first undead dudes are pretty easy and won't punish you too bad if you mess up. Just get some armor (or the ring) that has poise so you don't get staggered by every hit when you are trying to parry.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
Magic is also extremely effective in PvE, you just need to level attunement, the governing magic stat and then buy good spells.

Certainly doesn't seem like it to me since it does like 5-50 damage a pop.
 

Jhoan

Member
I finally took out Ornstein and Smough. I did with a party of two other players. Feels good man. Giant Ornstein was no match for my party's Pyromancy fireworks display. I'm gonna keep helping people take them out. Now I can finally go on finish this game.
 

Booshka

Member
Certainly doesn't seem like it to me since it does like 5-50 damage a pop.

When you are landing Crystal Soul Spears for 1200+ damage you'll think different. Use a better catalyst, get better spells and level your intelligence. Also, use items that boost sorcery damage. You'll see the gains soon enough.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
You're doing it wrong. Are you buying new spells? Anything above the base Soul Arrow should hit harder.

The catalyst you start with is great until int50 or so.

What catalyst? The one I bought then later found?

Soul Arrow and Greater Soul Arrow both hit for 5-50 a pop on 20 int. Why? I dunno. Entunement is 16. So...

Also continue to walk into the fog gate of S&O. WACK WACK. DIE. WACK WACK. DIE. WACK WACK. DIE. *dodge* WACK. *dodge, heal* WACK WACK. DIE.

Best boss fight of the game, really?
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
Hahaha. Oh wow. Heavy Soul Arrow and Homing Soul arrow both hit for 50 damage against Smog. Nice.
 

Booshka

Member
What catalyst? The one I bought then later found?

Soul Arrow and Greater Soul Arrow both hit for 5-50 a pop on 20 int. Why? I dunno. Entunement is 16. So...

Also continue to walk into the fog gate of S&O. WACK WACK. DIE. WACK WACK. DIE. WACK WACK. DIE. *dodge* WACK. *dodge, heal* WACK WACK. DIE.

Best boss fight of the game, really?

YOU DEFEATED
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
Ascend Flame +1
Thorolund Tailsmen
Havel's Ring
Wolf Ring
Gargoyle Helm
Elite Knight Armor +2
Leather Gauntlets
Elite Knight Leggings +1

And yet I'm hitting either of them for maybe 300 damage with flames. Magic? 50 a pop. Don't even think of the sword because they'll smack me around before I can roll in and kill them.

Fun. Guess it's time to take the long backtrack back toward Sen's and grind souls to level up past 56 to the hundreds for a week.
 

Booshka

Member
You need to use a Catalyst for Intelligence spells. Talisman is for Faith based miracles. Just combustion spam them with Pyro and it'll be easy. Also, take any weapon that you can wield and has a moveset you like to +10 then ascend it to Lightning with the Blacksmith in Anor Londo. Probably will do a lot more damage (to Smough) than whatever you are using. If you have the Eagle Shield (it can be found in Blighttown) it will make the fight much easier.
 

Sullichin

Member
Best boss fight of the game, really?

Yeah, many people consider it to be. Is it really surprising that a fight that's initially very challenging is considered to be one of the best? Most of the best bosses in both games are the tough ones. It's about overcoming the challenge. It seems like you want to cheese your way past the bosses or something, I don't see the point of that..

Ascend Flame +1
Thorolund Tailsmen
Havel's Ring
Wolf Ring
Gargoyle Helm
Elite Knight Armor +2
Leather Gauntlets
Elite Knight Leggings +1

And yet I'm hitting either of them for maybe 300 damage with flames. Magic? 50 a pop. Don't even think of the sword because they'll smack me around before I can roll in and kill them.

Fun. Guess it's time to take the long backtrack back toward Sen's and grind souls to level up past 56 to the hundreds for a week.

Yeah you died a few times so the answer must be to grind hundreds of levels... not. Grinding levels won't make you any better at avoiding their attacks. It's completely possible to beat them with the equipment you have now. If you want to do more damage with your pyromancy/magic pop on the bellowing dragoncrest ring and/or crown of dusk. Maybe try rolling at 25% speed if you feel you're too slow now. I also echo Booshka's suggestions of eagle shield, great combustion, and making a lightning weapon.
 

Booshka

Member
what stat dictates how fast my pyro casts his spells? my flame spell is so fucking slow. and also where can i get more fire spells?

Go to 45 Dexterity for faster pyro casting times. The master pyro trainer is in the Blighttown swamp near where the boulder throwing giants are. The pillar with the Large shard on it near the boss hill is what you are looking for, she is sitting down there. You also pick up more pyro spells in Painted World and Lost Izalith. Also, Chaos Covenant has some pyro spells as well.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
Yeah, many people consider it to be.

Then, no offense, those people are crazy bro. Two bosses, one of which will bum rush you and then smack you twice even with your shield up at the start of the fight isn't really fun. It's stupid. Add in the fact the lock-on will freak out no matter which one you choose to aim at (since you need to lock on for your pyromancies to even bother attempting to hit) and you'll see my point.
 
Go to 45 Dexterity for faster pyro casting times. The master pyro trainer is in the Blighttown swamp near where the boulder throwing giants are. The pillar with the Large shard on it near the boss hill is what you are looking for, she is sitting down there. You also pick up more pyro spells in Painted World and Lost Izalith. Also, Chaos Covenant has some pyro spells as well.

damn i'm in darkroot forest. guess i should make my way towards blighttown.... through the god damn sewers
 

Dresden

Member
Then, no offense, those people are crazy bro. Two bosses, one of which will bum rush you and then smack you twice even with your shield up at the start of the fight isn't really fun. It's stupid. Add in the fact the lock-on will freak out no matter which one you choose to aim at (since you need to lock on for your pyromancies to even bother attempting to hit) and you'll see my point.

Uh, just use Combustion.

It's not a hard fight. Ornstein is always faster and will always rush you ahead of Smough. Lead him ahead of Smough, wait for him to strike, then either block/roll and get a few hits in. As long as you can do a fast roll (>25% weight) it's not difficult at all.

The fight after that is just pure pattern based.

The real difficulty only comes if you opt to kill Smough first.
 

Jhoan

Member
Which is what I'm attempting to do. Guess I should go the other--*SMACK SMACK* YOU DIED.

Are you planning on doing it by yourself? If so, then Godspeed my friend; I've seen videos of it done so you could do it. Especially if you're underleveled. Summoning 2 other players was a Godsend for this battle; it made the battle ridiculously easy. So happy I got my Dragonslayer Spear and the Ornstein armor set.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
Upgrade your armor, it's actually useful to upgrade unlike Demon's

Done. Still dying solo.

I know killing these bitches is possible since I've been summoned and sucessfully done it five times now. It's soloing or getting competent people that will rush in and save my ass from RUSH SMACK SMACK DEATH that is the problem.

Also had an epic battle with me combusting an invader with another summon while the host ran like hell for the boss. Nearly die attempting to kill the invader, summoner died. Host makes it through and somehow survives while I haul ass at 10% health to the boss area (healing up on the way). We take smog out (since that's what he wanted) and then killed Oren. Somehow I managed to solo Oren with like 4 pyromancies and then smacking him for 50 damage a sword hit.
 

Soulhouf

Member
Then, no offense, those people are crazy bro. Two bosses, one of which will bum rush you and then smack you twice even with your shield up at the start of the fight isn't really fun. It's stupid. Add in the fact the lock-on will freak out no matter which one you choose to aim at (since you need to lock on for your pyromancies to even bother attempting to hit) and you'll see my point.

Did you upgrade your Eagle Shield to +10?
Here is a safe way to beat this boss: upgrade your shield as well as a good spear to lightning (winged spear for example). You also beat Pinwheel right? You should have a derp mask. If it's the child one, it's your lucky day.
Use all these with your shield up (you can attack with a spear while your shield is up). The Eagle Shield stability enables you to withstand even the strongest of their attacks without flinching. The only one that you must dodge no matter what is Super Orstein's impale attack but you can avoid it by killing him first.
 
My SL1 run: Beat Seath and Sif, will try 4 Kings next.

Seath was surprisingly easy, I had more trouble with the regular crystal mobs Dukes Archives one-shotting me through my lunging R2 attack. Pyro+ Lightning Reinforced Club made short work of Seath, didn't go for the tail since will never have the stats to use MGS.

Sif was a little more of a challenge, but I've never really had a problem with Sif, it's just a case of rolling through attacks and then pounding him from below or Pyro/heal when he attacks just out of range.

4 Kings next!
 

Yo Gotti

Banned
Ascend Flame +1
Thorolund Tailsmen
Havel's Ring
Wolf Ring
Gargoyle Helm
Elite Knight Armor +2
Leather Gauntlets
Elite Knight Leggings +1

And yet I'm hitting either of them for maybe 300 damage with flames. Magic? 50 a pop. Don't even think of the sword because they'll smack me around before I can roll in and kill them.

Fun. Guess it's time to take the long backtrack back toward Sen's and grind souls to level up past 56 to the hundreds for a week.

1. Your armor sucks. Upgrade it ASAP.
2. Ditch the Wolf Ring for something more useful or nothing at all. Poise will only get you killed in a boss fight as it'll let you stand around to take more punishment than you need to, and you're apparently not so great at dodging.
3. The best way to defeat S&O is melee. Combustion won't last you the whole fight, and everything else is simply too slow.
 
Well, poise is useful if you have a huge twohanded sword doing loads of damage, as it allows you to finish your move and kill off whatever tried to strike you. But yes, it does mean that you'll eat that damage, and unless you actually kill stuff in one attack it's not worth it.

I only use it on my STR knight and he has a sword that easily does 600 damage. I don't think it's worth it with GoA.
 

Yo Gotti

Banned
Well, poise is useful if you have a huge twohanded sword doing loads of damage, as it allows you to finish your move and kill off whatever tried to strike you. But yes, it does mean that you'll eat that damage, and unless you actually kill stuff in one attack it's not worth it.

I only use it on my STR knight and he has a sword that easily does 600 damage. I don't think it's worth it with GoA.

Yea, not that the ring is useless, but in this guys case fighting Ornstein and Smough with the Wolf Ring, when you don't know how to dodge in the first place is suicide.
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
1. Your armor sucks. Upgrade it ASAP.

Gargoyle Helm+5
Elite Knight Armor +8
Leather Gauntlets+6
Elite Knight Leggings +7

?
3. The best way to defeat S&O is melee. Combustion won't last you the whole fight, and everything else is simply too slow.

Then I'm boned and will have to farm humanity until someone ANYONE is smart and able to pull aggro off me and onto them for a few seconds so I can beat the hell out of these bosses. Too bad that won't ever happen since half the player base wants to hold their dick in their hand instead of rushing to the boss and wait for invaders on Anor Londo it seems. :|
 
Gargoyle Helm+5
Elite Knight Armor +8
Leather Gauntlets+6
Elite Knight Leggings +7

?


Then I'm boned and will have to farm humanity until someone ANYONE is smart and able to pull aggro off me and onto them for a few seconds so I can beat the hell out of these bosses. Too bad that won't ever happen since half the player base wants to hold their dick in their hand instead of rushing to the boss and wait for invaders on Anor Londo it seems. :|

What level are you? I have a dude at around lvl 60 who can help you out.

Your armor is fine by the way. I don't know what weapon you're using, but the strength of your weapon is a lot more important than how many hits you can take.
 
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