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DC Cinematic Universe |OT| Superfriends with Benefits
- Thread starter Penguin
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evil solrac v3.0
Member
so....jokes basically.
that was the worst line in that movie. it was so cringy and just made Superman sound like such a buffoon.
I bet Snyder is giddy with anticipation :-/
This is so far removed from how I respond to that line, it boggles the mind.
Coming from seeing Civil War makes me more worried for Justice League. Civil War tackles the same theme's and has a few similar sub plot beats and handles it so much better without needing to throw characters under the bus like Snyder did to Superman.
The MCU works because it isn't some grand deconstruction of Gods among men and the detachment and hate they get. The DCEU spends so much time talking about Superman n the super part is forgets about the man. Civil War shows that behind the powers these are people who are flawed but still have fun.
It's one of the reason's why Suicide Squad looks so much better than BvS, and so does wonder woman.
The MCU works because it isn't some grand deconstruction of Gods among men and the detachment and hate they get. The DCEU spends so much time talking about Superman n the super part is forgets about the man. Civil War shows that behind the powers these are people who are flawed but still have fun.
It's one of the reason's why Suicide Squad looks so much better than BvS, and so does wonder woman.
Wasn't that a callback to a similar line in one of the Reeves Superman movies?
It's not because superman isn't a god at all, he's a guy from Kansas who's parent taught him humility and selfishness. Clark Kent is a character who is as powerful with his pen as a warrior for Justice, then he is when's pushing doomsday into outer space.
God superman typically only ends in super dick's we see in Kingdom Come and Injustice.
with the exception of Wonder Woman I've never been a fan of the god interpretation. it's why post crisis and the new 52 are my favorite eras of DC.
Well it's a matter of perspective.
The general opinion of DC treating it's characters as gods is not that they're devoid of humanity, but that they do have an internal duality between the perfect archetype they represent and the flawed humand beings they are. They don't treat their powers as a personal thing, they are not "one of us", they are for being above the rest and using those gifts for good.
In fact, the new 52 superman is influenced a lot by the Hercules and Samson myths.
I expect SS and WW to be, at the very least, decent. Just like with every MCU film, they'll be competently constructed with clear arcs and at least a few characters that are easy to understand and relate to. And everyone will go "holy shit! I completely forgot WB has the capacity to make a serviceable comicbook movie!!"
But the only major thing that will have changed is Zack Snyder is not behind the camera.
I have really high hopes for Wonder Woman. It's certainly aiming really high, it's going to be dark but it's also having that unexplored fantastical elements that should blend for a very interesting take. I honestly expect it to be at Batman Begins level, specially due to Jenkins, Monster is fucking fantastic really.
johnnydrama
Banned
I think all of the directors currently assigned to DC movies show great promise, apart from Hack Snyder.
KDash31987
Member
Yup. When Superman rescues Lois after the helicopter accident in the first movie, he says, "Well, I certainly hope this little incident hasn't put you off flying, miss. Statistically speaking, of course, it's still the safest way to travel."
Scene: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=394jYH82s2o (it's at 4:18)
Sibersk Esto
Banned
I have no idea what Seth Grahame-Smith did for WB to give him Flash as his directorial debut.
BadAss2961
Member
They didn't. The Knightmare opens up the existence of alternate timelines within the universe. It could be interpreted as less of a foreshadowing and more of an establishment of the intricate parts of comic book logic. The kind of shit that makes Flashpoint and other multiverse situations possible. I get the feeling that's why Zack wanted it there so much. Also so he could tease Darkseid, parademons, and indulge in a post-apocalypse scenario for a bit with a gun-toting Batman alt.
They don't have to follow up on it at all since future Flash could've killed the Knightmare outcome just by interfering, or Bruce could just follow through on the Lois thing to prevent it from happening.
Because Snyder felt like he has something to say about superheroes. We aren't allowed to have fun.
johnnydrama
Banned
Man, Nolan really got Batman in Batman Begins, and I don't know what went wrong after that.
This is Batman. https://t.co/b9v5vuz0PN
This is Batman. https://t.co/b9v5vuz0PN
Best film in the trilogy.
johnnydrama
Banned
Best comic book film ever made. Fight me.
TropicalFish
Member
I still hate the knightmare sequence.
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Lord Virgin
Unconfirmed Member
So you guys want Superman cracking lame jokes? Yikes.
I didn't think of that. That's a pretty cool way of looking at it.
Not for me. My favourite interpretation of characters stem from Grant Morrison's run in 90s JLA. All JL memebers were portrayed as gods but better characterised. You just need a good writer to make it work.
Something is wrong with me because I liked that video.
unholyrevenger72
Banned
BvS would have reached a billion if he had. Personally, somber, serious Superman is totally OK with me. I even like Snyder Superman more than Donner Superman.
I really hated seeing Batman use a gun but that was, in a ham fisted way, sort of the point. I think that this was the 'what if' version of events and isn't something that the DCU is now locked into creatively speaking.
He wrote LEGO Batman which is, I'm told, a total "home run".
who said anything about him cracking lame jokes? I just want a Supes that gets treated with respect, and not thrown under the bus. I want a Superman that behaves like Superman and not always frowning or be annoyed at being Superman, I want a Superman that WANTS to be a hero and loves it, I want a Superman that's a hero not just because he is powerful but also because he leads by example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYmFIjCvwDU
that is the most Superman moment in 2016, this is what Superman should be to me. Whoever has seen the two episodes knows the context of that scene and why it's so powerful.
Halcyon
Member
I agree with this. Begins captures the feeling of Batman for me moreso than any other movie.
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Lord Virgin
Unconfirmed Member
Guek did:
Also; yawn. They finally made him interesting and people don't like it and want the boring Superman. If he actually ends up like the Reeves Superman, Batfleck should just finish the job the next time. Martha or no Martha.
GreyOcelot
Member
batman begins was great, but there's a few aspects that really grind my gears. namely bruce planning to murder joe chill, and subsequently running away lost and without purpose. i don't care for that take on batman. i would have rather seen a driven man who knew he wanted to prevent future joe chill's in any way he could. then there's the way the movie toes the line between the "i don't kill at all. ever" batman, while having him clearly responsible for the deaths of several people. that was lame as fuck. either stick to the recent comics and have him never kill. or don't do it at all (ie. what batfleck was like). and then the really cheesy, generic hollywood third act really hurt the movie. don't get me wrong it's a great movie and a comic book movie classic. but to me, the dark knight edges it out due to tightness of the script and of course heath ledger's joker.
edit: i wanted to add in that nolan very clearly had no idea how to shoot decent action scenes in begins, the editing is so frantic too, you can't even tell what the hell is going on in 90% of the fight scenes. it's amazing that it took 25+ years to get a batman who could kick some major ass
edit: i wanted to add in that nolan very clearly had no idea how to shoot decent action scenes in begins, the editing is so frantic too, you can't even tell what the hell is going on in 90% of the fight scenes. it's amazing that it took 25+ years to get a batman who could kick some major ass
Nice way of pissing off the already confused audiences. If so, the scene just shouldn't exist.
SJRB
Gold Member
I think Batman Begins is actually the most Batman movie, where Batman does Batman-y stuff. Gotham looks best, the atmosphere of the movie is the best, the Bat suit is the best and the action is the best. Katie Homes > Maggie Gyllenhaal. Also - dat soundtrack.
The other Nolan movies are mostly about Bruce Wayne and social commentary and pretentious nonsense. The Batman takes a backseat, or is just a side figure.
I appreciate what Snyder might be trying to do when it comes to Superman, it just feels like those self doubting and introspective aspects of Supes have been most dominate across two movies now. I'd imagine it kind of comes across as very little growth, and is kind of limiting on the universe as a whole because he is the most powerful aspect of it.
Also, everything else aside, I don't know how Snyder isn't flirting with exhaustion of some sort. Going from everything involved to make this, after MoS, then the reaction to the movie while getting prepped for JL, then jumping in to that movie....yikes.
Well, uh, wasn't expecting that at that link...
I guess I need the context, cause there isn't anything there that looks like Superman to me. Seems like we got mourning and anguish covered.
Batman is only in like the last half of the movie. Which is fine, Begins is great, but Bats being an aspect of the story along with strong villains, Wayne side conflict and a strong and active supporting cast/'family' is part of a 'Batman' story to me.
Also, everything else aside, I don't know how Snyder isn't flirting with exhaustion of some sort. Going from everything involved to make this, after MoS, then the reaction to the movie while getting prepped for JL, then jumping in to that movie....yikes.
Well, uh, wasn't expecting that at that link...
I guess I need the context, cause there isn't anything there that looks like Superman to me. Seems like we got mourning and anguish covered.
Batman is only in like the last half of the movie. Which is fine, Begins is great, but Bats being an aspect of the story along with strong villains, Wayne side conflict and a strong and active supporting cast/'family' is part of a 'Batman' story to me.
It's like I said before some people want a fully formed Superman from the jump or just the straight up Reeves version of fully formed Superman. Your post is a example of that. No character progression or arc, not being show to be an actual person or character and instead just purely a symbol. One that flies in, smiles, and has no problems what so ever. I'm sorry but no. I don't want that at all, neither do many others. Superman for all his powers is still just a guy. If he was still on Krypton or under a red son he's just another man walking around. His powers do not and should not stop him from having doubts, feeling frustration and annoyance, being sad, angry, happy, feeling love, etc. He's at his most interesting when he's allowed to express these things in and out of the costume. He's more then a simple power set and a smile.
It's a damned if you do situation it seems. You show Superman as an actual person with a character arc like every other character out there and there is push back. You show him as being fully formed with no where to go and he will be called boring while people go on to praise Batman once again.
The boring aspect is why Batman eventually became more popular. Batman was allowed to be a character. To grow and change. To have things affect him on an emotional level. Superman was just the boy scout that was all powerful with no faults. That's why you see the constant attempt in recent years to write and show Superman differently. Yet many people will not allow that to happen it seems.
Sure he's not smiling to much in this film. There are few reasons for him to be when a good part of the film are reactions to his very existence and good he's trying to do. I like that he was getting annoyed that are questioning him after he just saves a ton of people from a massive flood. You'd be feeling "These fucking people...." as well. People don't simple all the time or for no reason when they're trying to work out shit in their life or in serious situations. I do think Cavil should have been given more dialogue and I think it's actually there but not in the theater cut but I've always said acting just isn't delivering lines but how you express yourself outside of that. Film is visual. Sometimes that can do more visually then simply saying one is sad or happy in dialogue.
Except he's not interesting at all. He just walks around moping all the time and barely speaks.
As I told you before, no, we haven't had Superman growth in 2 movies, it's still the same rookie, insecure character that would have been fine in an origin story, but sucks in the second film of the trilogy. "This world doesn't let people stay good" gtfo with that nonsense in the latter half of the second Superman movie.
Also if you think he's coming back in full God mode let me tell you that it's not happening, get ready for 2 hours of more brooding and a single glimpse of the real superman at the very end. Snyder's superman looks great, I'll give him that, but he's managing to be more boring than boyscout superman. I wish we would have gotten something akin to the New52 one.
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Lord Virgin
Unconfirmed Member
I find conflicted Supes to be much more interesting than whatever Reeves was doing and what people are expecting. But then again, I don't care much for the character in the first place and he was always boring to me until MoS. Both in the comics and in the animated stuff.
Dude just wants to stay home and fuck Lois, but nooo some idiot needs to be saved. I'd be pretty pissed too. You seen Amy Adams? Goddamn.
I have to disagree again. I do see the growth in how he interacts with others from Lois to Lex, how he carries himself, how he approaches fighting (one of the biggest changes when he's in the costume), how he fights, etc. I've watched Man of Steel (more times then I remember) and BvS (three times so far) enough times to see the difference.
The dude is poweless in a world where super abilities are commonplace, he has been bullied and mocked because of it his entire life, his dreams of becoming a hero and following in the footsteps of his idol 'All Might' has pretty much vanished at that point in the series, the basic gist of it is that All Might himself (the scrawny blonde guy in that scene, he looks like that because he has to deal with life-threatning injury which only allows him to use his powers for a short time) tells him to follow his dreams and be a hero, whereas everyone else including his mom told him the contrary.
you really need the context to fully get that scene, it's not the same without it.
Eh I like it. It's the only Nolan Batman movie that had Gotham that actually feel like Gotham.
N7Commander95
Member
People keep saying this, as I imgaine they are trying to make a point
But Caps kill count pretty large at this point, whereas Supes is still on one lol
Plus I dont think Cap is reaaaly going to be compared to Superman after Civil War
I have never seen Captain America
Fly
Turn back time
Punch Darkseid in the face
Use heat vision
Or X-Ray Vision
Or Super speed
I think you're lying!
KonradLaw
Member
Lol at this intereview with Jai Courtney
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8YdEJswdr4
"Even in the the squad you'll find some characters with a higher moral code, but Boomerang aint one of them."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8YdEJswdr4
"Even in the the squad you'll find some characters with a higher moral code, but Boomerang aint one of them."
I've seen Civil War and I contend that Cap does a better job at inspiring people then the Snyderman does.
It's not about the kill count for me, becuase I typically have no problem with Superman killing if it's a Zod like threat. However when he takes a life it has to be the only other possible option.
That's the thing your looking at Clark through his powers, and not at the man which is why Snyder failed to capture who Superman is.
I still enjoy BvS but my Superman bias just can't get past him being thrown under the bus. The movie spends so much time on what everyone else thinks of him without counterbalancing it with giving Clark himself much to do instead, focusing on more development for Bruce.
Even at the end we don't actual join him in the sun.
and the tones are more that people are guilty they didn't respect him in life, more so then any lasting inspiration and it's why killing superman is a mistake.
He was barely a "guy" or a "character" in both MOS and BvS. Cavill was way better as Superman than when he was Clark Kent (acting ability comes into play here)....but as Clark he really had nothing to go on.
We don't have a clue about how he does his reporting, or what he thinks about anything, he barely had dialogue in BvS.
If that's what you call "conflict" no wonder the movie sucked.
You can still give the Reeves Superman conflict, he can actually act, and he would have pulled it off.
Finaika
Member
Who has Cap killed?
I get the Cap comparisons, even if I don't agree with most of them. It's not about power set or kill counts, more about Cap's resilience and confidence. Their 'morals' might not be the same, but MCU Cap is steadfast in his pursuit of what he believes to be 'right' in a kind of classic superhero comic book sense.
This will change some with Civil War, probably, but as it stands Cap is the shining red and blue example of Truth and Justice in the MCU. Not too mention he has a sort of reverence among the rest of the heroes; he kind of is portrayed as a prototype with a history most of them respect, along with inspiration. I think a lot of people are hoping to get to that point (or would have reached that point by now) with Snyder Supes.
This will change some with Civil War, probably, but as it stands Cap is the shining red and blue example of Truth and Justice in the MCU. Not too mention he has a sort of reverence among the rest of the heroes; he kind of is portrayed as a prototype with a history most of them respect, along with inspiration. I think a lot of people are hoping to get to that point (or would have reached that point by now) with Snyder Supes.
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