Destiny 2 PC Aim Assist Needs to be FIXED
- Thread starter Strakt
- Start date
that's not at all the argument being made. This shit isn't 'fine' on PC until now - Overwatch had the same issue early in the alpha and they killed aim assist, because KB+M is the primary input method on the pc. yeah, you can use a gamepad, but the PRIMARY way that that audience will play that game is KB+M, so letting people effectively fool the game into giving you 'super' KB+M solely to support people who want to use controllers, would be a huge mistake - it's a detriment to literally everyone that doesn't do it, controller or mouse and keyboard alike.
On the console it's different, yeah there's bullshit with KB+M there, but those are also only emulating the right stick motion, so it's not quite the same as PC kb+M, and it's both not as simple to do for anyone and isn't as widespread, there's also not much oyu can do about it since you kind of have to cater to controllers there, since THAT is the primary input method for almost every user of your game. The opposite of the PC where catering to controllers fucks over anyone unwilling to cheat.
pretty done
Member
Game should be balanced for PC. Aim assist should be removed with m/kb and they should add recoil imo. It's so damn easy compared to PS4 beta.
Feels like I'm dunking on a kids hoop
Feels like I'm dunking on a kids hoop
Ive played both betas and while aiming on ps4 was super hard.. the AA isnt as bs as it is on PC (playing @100-120 fps). You can lead yourelf to believe that theres no issue, but the majority outweigh your opinion. Either way.. its cool if you want exploiters running around using AA on m/kb, but i dont.
Warnen
Don't pass gaas, it is your Destiny!
I don't see what this has to do with anything. Cheaters gonna cheat, it's just easier to do on PC (don't have to buy anything extra).
Destiny 2 just going to be harder to balance on PC then PS4, AA and recoil vs mouse and keyboard
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
or maybe shooters are not for you if you want help because you can not aim for yourself...
The à¹ÛBronx
Member
Mind elaborating a bit as I'm slightly lost. I think you may have misunderstood my intent.
And I stopped play Overwatch because that.
If the remove aim assist for controllers in Destiny 2 I don't buy the game.
Fuck cheaters.
SpiceMelange
Member
I already explained to you that the builds are not the same, you can't conclude that pc has stronger AA right now. As far as we know it's just as likely they updated the AA across the board. We haven't played the equivalent build for consoles.
Receipts? Forums cries over overblown issues daily. There's no way to know which is the majority. People happy with the status quo more often than not don't engage, and that's in every sphere of life.
And lastly, yes I'm cool with a very small portion of the player base using emulated analog joysticks (at which raw mouse input is the better controller in most situations in any cases) over shutting down a sizable portion of the player base that prefer to play on controller, yes.
I'm perfectly happy on how Destiny 2 PC plays currently, thank you very much.
martino
Member
are you aware your opinion (this is an unbearable problem as it is) is a minoritiy (sure vocal) until proved otherwise.
Chris_Rivera
Member
I do not support this, leave it there Bungie. Sweet karma for the xim cheaters on console.
PC mouse has little recoil. Then it should be removed from controller also.
PC mouse has little recoil. Then it should be removed from controller also.
FriskyrumX
Banned
There's videos, stop trying to deny it lmao.
Once again, you're playing on PC where the main input is mouse/kb. Controller is an option. Im not saying they remove AA completely, but def tone it down. Ill quote you from one of your previous posts.. "Maybe Destiny PC ain't for you.".
SpiceMelange
Member
It's for me, because the way it's set up suits me perfectly. Probably not for you though!
Exploratory
Banned
The ๖ۜBronx;247429301 said:
It's parody.
Its been proven with clips. Do you ignore all the facts and base them only off opinions?
There is no competitive integrity to the game as-is. Trying to balance an artificial aim auto-correction versus a raw input method where you're actually responsible for all your hits and misses is futile.
I don't really have an issue as a decent KBM user with the current situation since I view D2 as a super casual game, but if you're going to have a discussion you should stop pretending this isn't a shit situation for the average scrub KBM user (the actual majority of the playerbase for the PC version) to benefit a minority of controller users.
I don't really have an issue as a decent KBM user with the current situation since I view D2 as a super casual game, but if you're going to have a discussion you should stop pretending this isn't a shit situation for the average scrub KBM user (the actual majority of the playerbase for the PC version) to benefit a minority of controller users.
Haint
Member
What a text book example of the shoe being on the other foot and the tables turning. Console players complain about cross platform play and XIM cheaters, and the mouse gods descend from the heavens to tell them to git gud and learn to use KB/M, all the while advocating for it to be a native console input. Now a PC game has buffed controller users (probably to a much lesser degree than mouse inherently enjoys) and enabled XIM cheaters, and we got a wambulance parade marching the streets.
SpiceMelange
Member
Bungie will say the same thing to people who cried about pvp and pve not being seperate for years in the destiny subreddit: absolutely nothing, because they value the consistency.
Will the Thrill
Banned
I'd say tone down the AA for PvP only, and possibly remove it in the competitive playlists like Trials. I'd still like to kick back and play PvP on a controller on my PC version in a causal playlist and feel like I could at least do something. I'll still get curvestomped by slightly better than average Kb/M users but oh well. Currently I understand how it can be abused, but I don't think getting rid of it entirely is the full answer for all of PvP.
The ๖ۜBronx;247429823 said:
You and the other post want to keep AA for controllers, which is understandable, but the OP has a very detailed post about why this might not be possible. The chain you're quoting
is a KBM user pointing out rightly that the majority of players/KBM will be affected negatively by this, while the person they're quoting
says they don't care, they just want comfort.
I'm saying this is a false dichotomy when the OP has thoroughly gone down the avenue of why AA might need to be removed, even citing Blizzard having to pull it out of Overwatch for similar reasons. PC devs have no responsibility for controllers being compatible, and games usually use fixed control schemes plugged in from their console port to not have to do much more work than necessary. At least there are a wide variety of controllers made for all types of games, specifically for the PC, including the steam controller, so those that need the comfort can get it. But trying to claim that controllers deserve just as much support, even to the detriment of KBM users isn't true.
Conkerkid11
Member
martino
Member
thoses clips don't prove the majority find the problem to be unbearable as it is.
who is letting his opinion go hyperbole again ?
Woo-Fu
Banned
Actually there is another alternative. Separate queues for aim assist players. Let the people who want aim assist play with the other people who want it, let those who don't play with other people who don't. Seems pretty simple to me.
This is being so greatly over exaggerated it's hilarious.
The KBM controls have almost no recoil vs significant recoil on controller. . A good KBM player will absolutely still destroy a good gamepad player in 99% of situations. It allows controllers to be somewhat competitive so that players coming from console don't feel like PvP (a required part of the game for many quest in D1 at least) is something they have to avoid. It's balanced quite well IMO. They can at least have a chance to do well and I think it would be a shame to remove it and essentially lock those players out of PvP.
The only real issiue I see with this is the people cheating by using KBM and tricking the game into thinking their using a controller to get aim assist. It's PC, people cheat, no surprise there.
This seems to be coming mostly from the elitist PC master race crowd who think that there is no place for game pads in FPS and that aim assist = aimbot and no skill... Reading that reddit thread is embarrassing. How about separate lobbies as compromise...?
The KBM controls have almost no recoil vs significant recoil on controller. . A good KBM player will absolutely still destroy a good gamepad player in 99% of situations. It allows controllers to be somewhat competitive so that players coming from console don't feel like PvP (a required part of the game for many quest in D1 at least) is something they have to avoid. It's balanced quite well IMO. They can at least have a chance to do well and I think it would be a shame to remove it and essentially lock those players out of PvP.
The only real issiue I see with this is the people cheating by using KBM and tricking the game into thinking their using a controller to get aim assist. It's PC, people cheat, no surprise there.
This seems to be coming mostly from the elitist PC master race crowd who think that there is no place for game pads in FPS and that aim assist = aimbot and no skill... Reading that reddit thread is embarrassing. How about separate lobbies as compromise...?
Conkerkid11
Member
You've just said the issue right there though... What?
The people gaining the advantage here are still using mouse and keyboard. If they were elitists, they'd promote the use of XIM in this case as being even better than just regular mouse and keyboard.
Oublieux
Member
I think these are the "best" solutions, but it comes at the cost of fragmenting the player base.
No point in arguing with someone who only cares about his own comfort. Once again kb/m users emulating AA from controllers will be ruining the experience for every type of player.
If you're fine with that, then theres no point in even responding to you.
The real issue seems to be console warriors like you who keep shitposting in this thread and completely missing the point of it.
Woo-Fu
Banned
This is going to fragment the playerbase either way. I won't play PvP at all if I have to play against people using aim assist. I mean, there just isn't any point in that when there are better PvP experiences out there that don't stack the deck like that.
That said, I probably wouldn't play PvP that much even if they did fix the aim assist issue, peer 2 peer horrible tickrate PvP in 2017? No thanks.
I highlighted the point of this entire discussion for you, that's what people have an issue with.
Those are cheaters, not elitists. The elitist are the ones complaining about aim assist even though KBM is still objectively more effective.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Competitive modes in shooters shouldn't have aim assist. End of story
Oublieux
Member
Yeah, I personally feel the same, but the crux of the matter is--and something people are going to have to accept--is that there is no perfect fix. There isn't going to be a solution that makes everyone happy, unfortunately.
RichiRamjag
Member
Well damn, we've gotta quit playing our favorite games because rodrigo doesn't like aim assist.
I don't get this. Have your opinion on it, fine, but you folks doing the "maybe X isn't for you" nonsense need to stop.
OriginalPoe
Banned
Wow, this makes sense... /s
martino
Member
it's not me who is doing hasty generalization and ad hominen...you on the other hand...
I'm no console warrior. I play on all platforms and I want to use PC as my main..
How is it a shitpost?
I get that cheating is the issue. So stop the cheating (which are KBM users...), instead of deleting the feature. The same thing is possible on console but you don't see console players rioting.
re: elitists, I'm talking about the people in the reddit thread saying that aim-assist ("aimbot" lol) has no place in FPS.
Haint
Member
Native KB/M support, not XIM, though the end result is ultimately the same thing. Head to the Gears 4 threads, Cliffy's incendiary comments on the subject pertaining to Lawbreakers, or any of the XIM complaint threads to see hundreds of people advocating for it.
Oublieux
Member
I think the issue is that trying to stop this exploit is nigh impossible because the recognition of whether an input device is a controller or keyboard/mouse is at the system level--would need to fundamentally change how Windows works for that, and that's not something Bungie can do.
Woo-Fu
Banned
There doesn't need to be a perfect fix. There are some obviously better methods that Bungie could use, better methods that lots of other games have used in the past. There is no point in them reinventing the wheel if they're just going to make it a square wheel.
Trying to cater to the controller minority on PC at the expense of everybody---including those controller people they're trying to be fair to in the first place---just doesn't make a lot of sense. The dominant control scheme is going to be m+k+aim assist. That isn't good for the controller players and it isn't good for the legit m&k players.
Read the thread. The feature is causing the cheating. You coming in hot talking about PC elitist in a thread about keeping the competitive community together is a shitpost. I'm disabled and can't use KBm, but I use my steam controller, which is way better and more customizable for my needs than a more expensive solution like a proprietary controller that hurts the game because of its inherent inclusion. And they're right, a soft aimbot has no place in a PVP competitive mode on PC.
I imagine that making the aim assist only kick in for controllers while having counter measures against PC players cheating and tricking the game into having aim assist with the keyboard and mouse is not easy to create.
However this is the absolute ideal situation for shooters playable with controllers and mouse/keyboard at the same time. Controllers get the sticky aim and mouse gets their natural increased precision.
The PC elitist stereotype didn't come out of nowhere and players who prefer the mouse and would whine and bitch about playing against controllers on a normal playing level is quite comfortably within that stereotype. You can feel as good about yourselves as you want with how much 'better' you are at the game with m+k precision but keeping that console shooting experience on PC is an awesome thing for Bungie to shoot for.
Ever since Halo I've played the majority of shooters on console and if it stays right this could actually make me move to PC for the upgrade and still play with a natural controller.
However this is the absolute ideal situation for shooters playable with controllers and mouse/keyboard at the same time. Controllers get the sticky aim and mouse gets their natural increased precision.
The PC elitist stereotype didn't come out of nowhere and players who prefer the mouse and would whine and bitch about playing against controllers on a normal playing level is quite comfortably within that stereotype. You can feel as good about yourselves as you want with how much 'better' you are at the game with m+k precision but keeping that console shooting experience on PC is an awesome thing for Bungie to shoot for.
Ever since Halo I've played the majority of shooters on console and if it stays right this could actually make me move to PC for the upgrade and still play with a natural controller.
So... separate lobbies until they find a solution? No need to be extreme and remove it. And there may be other ways they can detect such things by analyzing input patterns, etc. Maybe not but Bungie has historically had some pretty good banhammer tech.