KINGofCRA5H
Member
Yeah, same. Great work, Jason.
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Destiny |OT34| Stop Hammer Time!
- Thread starter DrDrizzay101
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Yeah, same. Great work, Jason.
Definity
Member
I'm sure the tools are improving just like with any other software development cycle but I agree -If the designers don't have efficient tools to crank out content then this will not end well.
captscience
Member
It's obviously a huge task to rework a dev studio's tools but the compounded amount of wasted time working with their garbage tools must be astronomical.
They should be taking any time they've bought by not releasing any DLC this year to prioritize and rebuild the foundation or we're never going to get the amount and quality of content the game deserves.
That's a bit Harsh. Jason is doing his job as a journalist. I for one am really happy reading the article, and I'm glad he teased it here. And I'm happy that somebody took the time to investigate it as best as they could. Many real details were in the article.
Jason and Kirk publish a high standard of article on Kotaku. They have had a lot of good Destiny articles. They arguably have the best most in depth Destiny coverage on the Internet for the kind of player that posts in this OT.
The rest of what is on Kotaku, I usually ignore it.
Strangelove77
Member
I suppose that's the difference. I'd rather be confused by a lack of details and coherence than laugh at a shitload of bad narrative and plot. The writing for the Ghost's dialogue is bad enough, I don't know if i could take more of that.
I judged Tomb Raider 2013 way more harshly than Destiny because it tried so hard and failed so badly to tell a story. Destiny barely tried, so there's only so much shit I can talk about it.
I've also never read a single grimoire card. My personal opinion is that I shouldn't have to.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
Let's consider if you were him and have a passion for this game as much as the majority of DGAF. And you just wrote that, of course you would want to tell people. Personally I am glad Jason was comfortable enough to tease DGAF and posts here sometime.
TheCanisDirus
Member
Exactly what i've always thought. Pretty sure that's the case.
JohnOfMars
Banned
That's fine with me. I think King's Fall is a bit of a miss anyway, and they had nearly a year for that one.
it was pretty good.
Ill try it is pretty long.
TLDR
A "Super Cut" of the story was put together of all the cut scenes in the summer of 2013 and shown to the execs. Everyone hated it. Some said that the Super Cut did not do the story justice.
It was supposed to be a linear story where you would see all zones/planets within the first few hours.
Story was scrapped and started over. They pushed hard to make the March date and had to plead with Activision to get it pushed back.
They reused a lot of pieces that were in the original story, left out Dreadnaught/Europa/Osirus (a guy that gives you quests on Mecury), Crow (would have been like Cayde-6 and they reused his model to become the queens brother)
They were expecting 90 metacritic, pretty tough to get that 78 metacritic, missed out on a bonus from Activision. Bungie employees admitted they thought the players would not like the story but felt the other things they did right would make up for it.
Dark Below was made in 6 weeks after it was all scrapped and developers were almost locked into a room.
Does not talk much about HOW.
Micro transactions are the future, supposedly no new DLC. They pitched that to activision and they agreed.
Takes the designers and insane amount of time to work with their engine. IE. to move a patrol chest two feet can take 12 hours as they have to load the game world the night before on their server and hope it does not error overnight.
Diablo 3 developers came in to help Bungie and talk about their experiences. They supposedly made a big impact on how they went about their expansion with Reaper of Souls, correcting some of the things the original game did wrong. Bungie
May have missed somethings but that is the big points I think.
That's pretty good.
everyday math
Banned
Man what an article by Jason. Damn
KINGofCRA5H
Member
The part about the multiple fireteams in a patrol like setting makes me sad. We'll never have something like that.
noomi
Member
Thank you for your elaboration. I assume you are a developer yourself?
theSlacker
Member
The thing that bothers me the most is knowing how much more areas the game, and then the expansion, was suppose to ship with. Several completely new area to explore instead of just retreading the same zones we have had since launch.
The sad thing is is that since we acepted how the game is, and since it is a pretty big success now they may not even see the need for putting in/doing the work for a bunch of new areas. Even when we get "2" we may just get stuck with the same areas that they launch that version of the game with for years. Why bother when people are fine with just going though the same area again backwards with some new enemies?
The sad thing is is that since we acepted how the game is, and since it is a pretty big success now they may not even see the need for putting in/doing the work for a bunch of new areas. Even when we get "2" we may just get stuck with the same areas that they launch that version of the game with for years. Why bother when people are fine with just going though the same area again backwards with some new enemies?
Midshipman
Member
destinylfg had people looking when I did it a while back. Might have luck there.
gutterboy44
Member
Oh for sure. I imagine they were supposed to be truly supplemental material for those who wanted to dive deeper with their original story arc. It just so happened with what launched, if you wanted any story, you had to go to the grimoire. It should never have been that way. That said, there is some really great shit in there. Enough so that you find yourself thinking, "A Destiny movie would totally be possible."
Subtervotion
Member
That's really harsh. All his posts were humble and he never teased a huge reveal. This story is one we all wanted to know the truth of. Can't be disappointed in that.
Hey Jason, now do Mass Effect 3.
everyday math
Banned
R.I.P Europa
I don't agree with this at all. we only had vague knowledge of what happened. this clarifies everything. calm down.
MrAnderson
Member
My takeaway from that article is that due to the release schedule agreement and crappy game engine we will never get a decent amount of content in future releases. It also kinda sucks that TTK was essentially the last part of vanilla destiny that was sold back to us.
Strangelove77
Member
There's so many loading screens in this game to put that info over too. I wouldn't mind that at all. I can only look at my ship so much.
noomi
Member
I'm real curious to see if anything at the Lighthouse has changed post TTK, you know people will be hunting for little hidden secrets once they arrive.
I won't be doing Hard Mode for a while yet, so if the crew is up for a NM run (and okay with me not talking
) I'd love to do itI don't see it as a hitpiece. There is a lot of details in there that were previously unknown and Jason got in contact with several inside sources both current and former Bungie employees.
MrAnderson
Member
There was that one hallway blocked off by a light wall and what looked to be like vendor stalls.
theSlacker
Member
So Taken King originally had a Raid on Mars (possibly Cabal I imagine) and they cut it for Destiny 2?
Don't even care about the raids, the prospect of entire new zones as big as the ones on the planets currently would be much better then how reused the current zones have gotten. The Dreadnaught is nice but feels smaller overall.
guybrushfreeman
Unconfirmed Member
Man that was a great article. Much more than just what we thought we knew in the end. Even the stuff we guessed it's much different to have a real source for. It's fascinating to think about the decision to gut the story. I mean, here we are now years later and the game is still story light in a way that brings it down.
The Taken King is much better, sure but it's much better than a complete failure, which is what vanilla shipped with. Could the original story really have been worse than a having a lack of story weigh down the product even years later? So much content is still being frankensteined together even now. It seems like even another year or more of content will be put together shoving old assets and ideas together filtered through increasing player demands and expectations.
The article also raises the point about if Bungie can ever get ahead. It feels like the game is always stuck perpetually behind, always catching up to players expectations and never quite reaching them. Can Bungie actually get what players want out or will they always be playing catchup to a project reboot from years ago?
Anyway thanks again for the article Jason. I wish Bungie had managed to learn a little more from Diablo III than they did. Maybe there's hope still.
The Taken King is much better, sure but it's much better than a complete failure, which is what vanilla shipped with. Could the original story really have been worse than a having a lack of story weigh down the product even years later? So much content is still being frankensteined together even now. It seems like even another year or more of content will be put together shoving old assets and ideas together filtered through increasing player demands and expectations.
The article also raises the point about if Bungie can ever get ahead. It feels like the game is always stuck perpetually behind, always catching up to players expectations and never quite reaching them. Can Bungie actually get what players want out or will they always be playing catchup to a project reboot from years ago?
Anyway thanks again for the article Jason. I wish Bungie had managed to learn a little more from Diablo III than they did. Maybe there's hope still.
TheAquaticApe
Member
Frenden. Mah bearded NM Titan brother.
everyday math
Banned
This isn't a hit piece at all. There's tons of info that hasn't been talked about in there.
He contacted it seems quite a bit of former employees.
I know a lot of things about Halo and Destiny's development. I also have respect for my fellow man and don't fucking stab people in the back for clicks.
When I "revealed" that Reach had a cut Lockout Forge remake, I asked if it was postable first. If I had been told no, I would have never talked about it.
Yes.
It's very annoying when so called "journalism" writes things out of context to make standard development issues and choices out to be some dramatic material when it's a problem you encounter, deal with, solve, and move onwards.
TheCanisDirus
Member
Bingo. We fucked ourselves. Imagine if we all knew the potential scope from day one. Maybe more of us would have not bought in. Oh well, is what it is. It's going to be a long while before Destiny meets the original scope that everyone thought it would have.
noomi
Member
You will be able to do hard mode on Friday.
What we don't know is if you'll get locked out of double loot drops if you do normal mode prior to hard mode.
Who is Jason "stabbing in the back"?
BTW, you also don't work "for clicks". Jason is a journalist who tries to write articles that people want to read, like this one.
Subtervotion
Member
If you watch the very first trailers of Destiny, you see a ship fly to Mercury. It is almost literally the Lighthouse cinematic. The ship just flies differently. I figured this cinematic was originally a story cinematic re-purposed for Trials of Osiris. I guess I was right.
Fantastic read. Really puts things into perspective. I love Destiny and this makes its faults easier to stomach.
gutterboy44
Member
Destiny 2 will really be make or break. If the trickle of content via microtransaction revenue doesn't free up enough developmental resources to resolve their tool issues as well as move concisely in a new direction opposed to re-patching the old hatchet job, then I don't see how they will catch up in 2017 or 2018. TTK definitely bought them some time. With a new raid pre-Destiny 2 seemingly completely out of the picture after reading this article, I can't help but believe the speculation about old strikes, VoG, Crota, and Y1 exotics all being left intentional out dated at TTK launch. Bringing them to Y2 levels over the next few months as a relatively low over head source of new content to keep players playing would be a smart move if you really need all the resources you can get to get Destiny 2 back on track. The bit about them outsourcing material is encouraging. Do what ever it takes. We all know there is an amazing game in there somewhere.
Poker Face
Member
destiny 2 is going to be so good.
For fuck's sake. This piece held nothing compelling inside it for me personally, and I imagine that I do have a more sober conceptualization of "what regular game development looks like" than many in his intended audience. It bores the crap out of me reading stuff like this, and I'll never fully understand why so much of the playerbase is starving for it. But the market is clearly there, and more importantly there's no need to call the man an asshole.
In fact I think you should be temporarily banned for it. He's a member of our community like any other.
wowbaggerBR
Member
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