Support NeoGAF

[plantedunicorn]

I don't like that landfall change at all. I intentionally put myself in harms way to use that perk in PVE.

 

[Pandora012]

Don't talk about the real problems! /s

They aren't problems. They are features!!!

 

[LTWood12]

I've probably seen that video at least 5 times, and it still brings tears to my eyes w/ laughter.

 

[Slammin_Hammon]

Some terrible decisions with the balance changes.

• Nerfing TLW further and to make matters worse nerfing the perk that encourages you to use it how it's designed to be used.
• Not addressing the issue with snipers (ridiculous AA) but instead making changes to the ammo economy that won't amount to much
• Not changing Firebolts because they couldn't figure out how to. (easy answer have lower base firebolt damage with viking funeral equipped or at least don't show the ticks)

The most disturbing part though was watching their testers play and seeing they were terrible at the game. You can't balance you're game around just usage statistics and you can't balance it around a group that isn't representative of the avg. player.

Reposting so it doesn't get lost.

 

[Night_Knight]

.

 

[WhiskerFrisker]

So their fix to Sunsingers is "please use Voidwalker".

...

Okay.

Sunsingers rip.

Honestly I don't mind the special ammo nerf because less people will be running around with special, primarily shotgunners won't rush as much. I've been moving towards Fusion rifles anyway so I'm indifferent to snipers.

 

[Pandora012]

Oh yeah I forgot. Bungie should hire you.



Did those tears contain salt?

They should. We need to nerf TLW even more!!! You guys like using a weapon? Nerf!!! Make everything equal!!! With equality, comes power!!!

 

[NCR Redslayer]

Reposting so it doesn't get lost.

So destiny is doom.

 

[Axoman]

Some terrible decisions with the balance changes.

• Nerfing TLW further and to make matters worse nerfing the perk that encourages you to use it how it's designed to be used.
• Not addressing the issue with snipers (ridiculous AA) but instead making changes to the ammo economy that won't amount to much
• Not changing Firebolts because they couldn't figure out how to. (easy answer have lower base firebolt damage with viking funeral equipped or at least don't show the ticks)

I completely agree. The Last Word nerf is ridiculous. Let's take what makes the gun great, it's signature perk, and nullify it.

The most disturbing part though was watching their testers play and seeing they were terrible at the game. You can't balance you're game around just usage statistics and you can't balance it around a group that isn't representative of the avg. player.

You hit the nail on the head. They rely way to heavily on usage data and weapon popularity to make these decisions and then have a test environment that doesn't represent the real world very well to test those changes.

I've said it before, the people making these decisions play the data, not the game.

 

[E92 M3]

You guys are too salty. I like all the changes especially on the primary front where we will see even more variety in weapons. I am glad Hawkmoon, Suros, and slow rate pulses are getting buffs and TLW, Snipers and mida getting small nerfs. I wish they would have changed the Sunsinger Firebolts but still, i think they will make crucible have even more variety now.

It doesn't work like that. Forced diversification is a theory that's ultimately based on failure. Within the first 2 weeks, we will have the new top guns.

 

[Lnkn52]

I drink cold water, NERF ME!

 

[Trakan]

When did they say that? I heard increased zoom (i.e. less short range sniping), longer time to scope and less stability. Seems logical and measured.

Increased zoom ties into the range stat which is how accuracy is calculated.

Some terrible decisions with the balance changes.

• Nerfing TLW further and to make matters worse nerfing the perk that encourages you to use it how it's designed to be used.
• Not addressing the issue with snipers (ridiculous AA) but instead making changes to the ammo economy that won't amount to much
• Not changing Firebolts because they couldn't figure out how to. (easy answer have lower base firebolt damage with viking funeral equipped or at least don't show the ticks)

The most disturbing part though was watching their testers play and seeing they were terrible at the game. You can't balance you're game around just usage statistics and you can't balance it around a group that isn't representative of the avg. player.

This pretty much sums up how I feel. They're completely out of touch.

 

[Night_Knight]

.

 

[Frenden]

So dad it developed a gut, wears unstructured golf hats, and is thinking about buying a new grill if its wife will let it.

 

[LTWood12]

Couldn't nerf Sunsingers because the class is build around the DoT, immediately after talking about nerfing Thorn...which is built around the DoT.

It doesn't work like that. Forced diversification is a theory that's ultimately based on failure. Within the first 2 weeks, we will have the new top guns.

.
Preach it Trance.

 

[BlazeBreak]

Some terrible decisions with the balance changes.

• Nerfing TLW further and to make matters worse nerfing the perk that encourages you to use it how it's designed to be used.
• Not addressing the issue with snipers (ridiculous AA) but instead making changes to the ammo economy that won't amount to much
• Not changing Firebolts because they couldn't figure out how to. (easy answer have lower base firebolt damage with viking funeral equipped or at least don't show the ticks)

Those are mostly my bigger concerns, as well. TLW didn't need the nerf at all. It's usage was gonna decline a bit, anyway, since less people are going to be using it as their secondary alongside their primary 1KYS now.

Mida flinch/caliber nerf I can deal with if snipers are going to be less of a problem.

 

[Mindlog]

"ctrl +f Nightfall"
All I'm getting is a request to help with a Nightfall (which I could do later.) No changes mentioned?
1kys change is brilliant. All of those wonderful changes to make synth packs less effective on weapons I use the most is a great step forward.

PvP... Way to negatively effect the one genuinely mildly interesting raid weapon.

Oh wait. Full list of changes next week?
lol

Anyway. They all look like solid changes if all you wanted to do was change the lines on a chart. Well done.

 

[WhiskerFrisker]

I wonder if that means the Red Death will become the new flinch machine. That gun causes you to stagger so much, it made Mida users jealous.

 

[NCR Redslayer]

Also those fucking drop rates on stream.

 

[Pandora012]

"ctrl +f Nightfall"
All I'm getting is a request to help with a Nightfall (which I could do later.) No changes mentioned?
1kys change is brilliant. All of those wonderful changes to make synth packs less effective on weapons I use the most is a great step forward.

PvP... Way to negatively effect the one genuinely mildly interesting raid weapon.

Oh wait. Full list of changes next week?
lol

Anyway. They all look like solid changes if all you wanted to do was change the lines on a chart. Well done.

What? Do you not enjoy your 290 shells, weapons, and armor?

 

[BreezyLimbo]

.

 

[CLBridges]

Seems the Last word nerf was purely based around good players getting quick kills...in trials. Outside of trials I honestly rarely get killed by last word (c'mon Bungie). Overall, the changes look decent. But, I'll wait for patch notes and smarter people than me to number crunch before I give Bungie the shaq face on some of these changes.

 

[SpecX]

Too many small details I still need to get caught up on, but glad to see some change with snipers and Stormcallers.

 

[KINGofCRA5H]

Still trying to balance PvP and PvE in the same light, I see.

 

[Mass Appeal]

It doesn't work like that. Forced diversification is a theory that's ultimately based on failure. Within the first 2 weeks, we will have the new top guns.

So then we should not have forced diversification? I feel like other then the 1YS, years 2 crucible has been more diverse then year 1 which was all handcannons. Would you guys rather have them just buff everything and nerf nothing then?

 

[Slammin_Hammon]

So destiny is doom.

No. Some changes were positive and I'm not the type to say the sky is falling over balance updates. Those particular things though stood out as examples of how Bungie seems out of touch with their game and is missing the forest for the trees in terms of balancing at times.

 

[E92 M3]

Couldn't nerf Sunsingers because the class is build around the DoT, immediately after talking about nerfing Thorn...which is built around the DoT.


.
Preach it Trance.

I'm trying but it gets really tiring to be perpetually disappointed lol

good stuff

I warned about snipers getting nerfed too much. Bungie can't do it with a subtle touch.

So then we should not have forced diversification? I feel like other then the 1YS, years 2 crucible has been more diverse then year 1 which was all handcannons. Would you guys rather have them just buff everything and nerf nothing then?

Make more weapons viable, not nerf everything popular. During HoW people were using all sorts of primary guns - it was great. Crucible is very boring now compared to last year.

 

[Night_Knight]

.

 

[Zoso Achilles]

The last word is fine. This won't affect it at all. The change stops someone from being able to 2 shot kill, which was effectively random (since you had to hit hip fire head shots). The average kill time will not change. I think. Did anyone pull damage numbers from the stream?

 

[Pandora012]

I just had a horrible nightmare, in my dream I watched the stream and nothing changed.

I've got some good news for you. Things changed, just not in the best way. Yaay, Bungie!!!

 

[xplicitone]

I blame McLovin. It's all his fault!

Special ammo fix I can agree with. Nerf to duration of both Sunsinger and Stormcaller is good. Void Walker buff is good. Less ammo to carry is probably ok. They want people to use primary more so not getting more special until later is the best solution. I wonder if it's time for Trials or by round and time.

Sure go ahead and nerf shortgaze/ambush and snapshot, they are still super viable.

They hit some big points. Nerfing TLW hip fire is sad though and not fixing Firebolts but I can live with that versus hardcore nerfs everywhere.

 

[igordennis]

Wow they actually nerfed TLW again?

Wow

And firebolts stay the same?

...wow

 

[Night_Knight]

.

 

[Dez_]

The last word is fine. This won't affect it at all. The change stops someone from being able to 2 shot kill, which was effectively random (since you had to hit hip fire head shots). The average kill time will not change. I think. Did anyone pull damage numbers from the stream?

I thought I saw body shots at 50 each, less when further away. Not sure about the head shot damage.

 

[Zoso Achilles]

I thought I saw body shots at 50 each, less when further away. Not sure about the head shot damage.

Were they hip fire? That's what matters. It's currently 4 hip fire body shots to kill. If that doesn't change, we're good.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Wow they actually nerfed TLW again?

Wow

And firebolts stay the same?

...wow

Didn't you hear their solid reasoning? It's too hard to nerf firebolt. Because muh dots and muh shields.

 

[chur]

The last word is fine. This won't affect it at all. The change stops someone from being able to 2 shot kill, which was effectively random (since you had to hit hip fire head shots). The average kill time will not change. I think. Did anyone pull damage numbers from the stream?

I saw 45-50 body damage depending on range. 75 for headshots.

 

[Zoso Achilles]

I saw 45-50 body damage depending on range. 75 for headshots.

75 was ADS, I saw that one. We need to know hip fire damage.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Didn't you hear their solid reasoning? It's too hard to nerf firebolt. Because muh dots and muh shields.

Bungie is incompetent.

Because applying the exact same change from the Arc Bolt nerf would be waayyyyyy to hard.

 

[Mass Appeal]

I'm trying but it gets really tiring to be perpetually disappointed lol



I warned about snipers getting nerfed too much. Bungie can't do it with a subtle touch.



Make more weapons viable, not nerf everything popular. During HoW people were using all sorts of primary guns - it was great. Crucible is very boring now compared to last year.

We must have played different versions of crucible then. Hawkmoon, Thorn, TLW and Slow ROF pulses were all that dominated in the primary slot. Evreything else sucked...

 

[igordennis]

My future in continuing to play trials is uncertain if these are the changes Bungie felt the need to do.

Like you couldn't even fucking reduce firebolt's range? K

 

[Namikaze1]

Where's that gif of that guy clapping for a bit and then going all "what the fuck"?

That's pretty much me. Clapping at the Thorn nerf and going wtf on the lack of a Firebolt nerf.

 

[mehrmantrout]

One thing i'm excited about is to what Hawkmoons like, hopefully when I firebolt someone from distance bullets will hit to finish them off

 

[Kor of Memory]

We must have played different versions of crucible then. Hawkmoon, Thorn, TLW and Slow ROF pulses were all that dominated in the primary slot. Evreything else sucked...

Thorn
Hawkmoon
Last Word
Messenger
Spare Change
Red Death
No Land Beyond

Is still way more than

Last Word
MIDA
Nirwen
PDX-45
Doc

 

[Arrrammis]

Well, on the bright side, I no longer have to try to decide about how I'll distribute my time on Tueday between Destiny, The Division, and Dark Souls 3. With Bungie and Ubisoft/Massive both taking a collective crap on many parts of their player base with "balancing" and other changes, I am so ready to die over and over against some boss with an awesome, over the top mechanic.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Because applying the exact same change from the Arc Bolt nerf would be waayyyyyy to hard.

Alot of things for Bungie are hard. We should've seen the warning signs when Deej opened his mouth way back when.

Y'know, this makes me not even want to log in for the 3 'free' boxes they're going to have. They're just incompetent, and I shouldn't condone their buffoonery by logging in.

 

[SpecX]

We must have played different versions of crucible then. Hawkmoon, Thorn, TLW and Slow ROF pulses were all that dominated in the primary slot. Evreything else sucked...

Yep with sniping shotguns as a secondary and rockets with grenades and horseshoes.

 

[Pandora012]

Well, on the bright side, I no longer have to try to decide about how I'll distribute my time on Tueday between Destiny, The Division, and Dark Souls 3. With Bungie and Ubisoft/Massive both taking a collective crap on many parts of their player base with "balancing" and other changes, I am so ready to die over and over against some boss with an awesome, over the top mechanic.

The answer should have always been Dark Souls.

 

[WhiskerFrisker]

I'm trying but it gets really tiring to be perpetually disappointed lol


Make more weapons viable, not nerf everything popular. During HoW people were using all sorts of primary guns - it was great. Crucible is very boring now compared to last year.

 

[Inapplicable]

W A R L O C K B O Y Z

Hahaha suck it haters

Pretty much, my Stormcaller will live on, I don't use transcendence anyway.

Glad MIDA didn't get destroyed, disappointed that they didn't lower sniper rifle bodyshot damage but can live with it.