tommib
Member
I my case is not hate. More disappointment and uncertainty. I’m 100% certain it will make some games completely shine. Specially future ones.
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DF - Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart PS5 Pro vs PS5 Image Quality Face-Off
- Thread starter HeisenbergFX4
- Start date
XXL
Gold Member
We have seen many examples of it shining. Regardless of your opinion about this title.
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mansoor1980
Member
HeWhoWalks
Member
Glad someone finally called out some of that ReShade nonsense. A slight sharpening is one thing, but some of the presets I see look AWFUL!
RJMacready73
Simps for Amouranth
Same with all DF videos, put the 2 games running side by side and show us the differences sitting on a couch looking at 2 telly's, I bet you'd be hard pressed to spot them then
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Why are you comparing it to 12TF? PS5 is a 10TF console that generally beats the 12TF one
RDNA4 will be incorporating FSR4 which is AI based
twilo99
Gold Member
Right, which supposedly has nothing to do with PSSR
PSSR is not as good as DLSS, though it may get there. This has already been proven.
PSSR is similar to all other AI based upscaler. They all use the same training methodology and inputs. That’s why you can spoof FSR and XeSS into titles that support DLSS.
Even then you said “so if you are hoping to see PSSR level of quality form RDNA4 on PC you will be extremely disappointed”
You were making a qualitative comparison, and what you said simply won’t be true.
Not sure what you’re thinking saying that RDNA4 won’t have PSSR like upscaling (heck you can use XeSS on AMD cards right now and the delta between the hardware locked and agnostic version is pretty small these days)
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If you need to zoom in to see the difference, then you need glasses.
The Pro looks like it's all... vaseline smeared smooth?
Look at the gold part where he's standing, the gold looks detailed and textured on the base PS5, but on Pro it looks smooth like someone rubbed vaseline on it.
The same on the stone part he's standing on. You can see the texture of the stone on the base PS5.
Not a great showing for the PS5 Pro in my opinion...
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
You're mentioning different capabilities between GPUs and why they're limited, and somehow, in your opinion, PSSR, VRS, and the major GPU upgrade are minor in comparison. lol.
The fact of the matter is, that GPU upgrades are what's making that Quality / Fideitly mode hit that 60fps target. That's substantial and noticeable no matter how you slice it.
You have one example of Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth that looks terrible in performance mode yet it matches and even exceeds the fedinitly mode on base PS5. AI Upscaling is a major upgrade for a console that doesn't even support it. The DIFFERENCE is noticeable.
hinch7
Member
The specs are literally there for you to check. 8GB VRAM vs 12GB (nearly double memory bandwidth, 50% higher bus etc). Check Hardware Unboxed etc. There's so many Youtube video's covering this if not the numerous sub Reddit posts. Its nonsensical to compare a 4060 to 4070 and consoles. Just stop.
And the poor performance is on SE for Rebirth.
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Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
"Ultra realistic mod"
Oversharpened to hell, exposure cranked up above the max, saturated colors, and DOF so high you cannot see what’s in the background.
Joel Was Right
Gold Member
If you have to zoom in 3x, there’s no point.
Dibils2k
Member
this argument always makes me cringe, you realize these videos zoom in because youtube destroys any detail you might make out when looking at a non-zoomed image
zooming is used to demonstrate the difference easier for the viewer who might be on any kind of display watching any kind of resolution and even watching in 4K wont represent what you see natively thanks to compression
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
They do this all the time every new PC card and every graphics face-off. Now it's an issue.
Team Andromeda
Member
One expects more from an In-House team
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
What you're saying doesn't change the fact that you can see the performance difference in the PS5/PS5 Pro and the 4060/4070.
Your entire counter-argument is trying to minimize the performance difference between both consoles and it's not working. Just stop it. lol
The GPU difference alone is better and on top of that you include PSSR, VRS, higher RT, etc. Now that I mentioned rebirth, you blame performance on SE. Instead of going through hoops to minimize the difference, just admit there's a substantial difference in GPU performance.
If you keep trying to spin this, then I'm just going to post DF that mentions the performance difference.
hinch7
Member
I bet you're the type to judge performance metrics based on teraflops from different machines and vendors. Not spinning anything, its a nonsense comparison.
Check out Techpowerup and numerous videos covering the limitations of 8GB VRAM.
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ShakenG
Member
Not understanding this logic.. they have been doing these comparisons for a long time now. PC/PS5, Switch/PS4 etc .... why does it suddenly change with the Pro?
The PS5 pro has brought out some crazy reading.
Team Andromeda
I agree with you to a degree.. especially going forward.
But i never expected them to go back and support as many as they did. Maybe i should?
They obviously slapped on the bare minimum and called it a day.
F1 2024 looks more ambitious and kinda what i expect. Guess time will tell.
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HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
Madserb2023
Member
People are treating the PRO a bit more aggressively than with previous consoles but it is is likely down to price and being burnt. I want a PS5 Pro but that's more of a result of FOMO, however we never did get that 8k that was on the box, and we aren't really getting the quality mode at 60, you still are going to choose in some cases. I would still rather play Ratchet in the quality mode if that's the result.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Fake
Member
And you'll still complain.
Nah, will run flawess. Nothing beat Sony. Just look at the thread.
iamvin22
Industry Verified
I'm just saying, you can have earbuds on and he and his colleagues all said that the YouTube videos do absolutely no justice to what the pro is doing in person.
4 out of 5 cast members all retracted their claims and said they now seen significant changes to game changing differences.
It's just dumb to say you don't see the differences when the authors are telling you there are huge differences in the same video you are watching.
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
I definitely like a some sharpening. Always add some when I use 4K DLSS Quality or any game with TAA.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Some is good, over is bad.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
A little bit of TAA Sharpness is actually fantastic to remove the softness TAA adds to most games. I reckon most games use some kind of built in sharpening already.
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
He probably would tell me I'm going over haha. I usually just leave it at 50%.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
It's about what I leave it at, as well. Same with motion blur, sometimes. Usually 50% if per object, off if not per object.
Madserb2023
Member
I don't agree with Alex at all. The performance RT mode looks closer to the Quality mode when it comes to detail. You can literally see more detail on the leaves especially on the base PS5. It's not imaginary detail. What's the point in a higher resolution if not to see more detail. Now Rebirth on the PS5 Pro looks a lot more detailed but funnily enough the base PS5 image is smoother, I mean blurrier on the base model. John even said it looked very CGI like on his plasma. Goal posts keep moving.
XXL
Gold Member
ShakenG
Member
Im reserving judgement on this till we get some newer games made with the pro from scratch and not just a tacked on update years later. I believe its still early days and we dont have enough to go off.
Old games updated are just a bonus for me.. not what i expect quality wise going forward.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
It's intellectual dishonesty. If you want to say that the differences are not enough to justify getting a Pro, then that is a valid personal opinion, but to say there are no differences at all. Stop.
King Dazzar
Member
The Pro is for you then.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
I know all about VRAM limitations. I owned an 8GB NVIDIA GPU for years. It's the main reason why I didn't rush to upgrade to a 30 series GPU. I also know AMD GPUs generally have more VRAM.
It's the reason why PS4 Pro struggles to use higher-resolution textures.
It's an issue for the Xbox Series S
DF performed comparisons with the PS5 and many other GPUs (including 4060) and pointed out the VRAM limitations.
I know all about VRAM, so telling me to look up TechpowerUp won't do anything.
You're downplaying and it's laughable.
Others at DF mentioned the upgrade and is not as insignificant as you're trying to portray. The truth is, it's a big upgrade.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
That's the most annoying part to me. To pretend that there's no difference. If we're discussing whether or not that difference is worth the price premium, whether we're talking high-end PC vs low-end or PS5 vs Pro, then that's one thing, but to sit there and act like they're the same doesn't even deserved to be entertained as a serious opinion.
Madserb2023
Member
This might be true but if I was to take a bet, it's unlikely that if we are not seeing the quality mode at 60 now with less demanding games then we aren't going to see it on more demanding games down the road. Not rational unless Insomniac are deliberately doing it.
King Dazzar
Member
I like some sharpening (reality creation on Sony TV's). But I want it done by the TV, so I can control how much I do or don't want.
They took out the sharpening pass completely though, fuck that
Fake
Member
My main problem with PRO is that they need to make a list of support games.
With luck PS6 will use AI from the box without the need of patch or 'list of supported' games. And with luck Sony will stop using PS4 games to benchmark their AI solution.
Really feel like all this AI threat to image quality is still experimental, don't you think?
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I always had it off thinking it would introduce some input lag. But when I was playing Helldivers 2 on my buddy's Sony (he has the same set I do) he had it on just a little and I did not notice any perceivable input lag (still in game mode), but the imagine looked a bit sharper for that game, especially considering that it is being upscaled from 1080p.
Might have to fiddle with it on mine later.
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Radical_3d
Member
The differences are so hard to see that now I can’t even see post about the differences. Use sharpening filter in your post, people.
Vick
Gold Member
It is good, just isn't smart at all knowing how people would take these comparisons.
Would never use consumer TV "Sharpness" processing even if paid, and TV processing in general of any kind should always stay at 0 on reference top gamma panels. You need a dedicated (and expensive) video processor like Lumagen Radiance (you can get one for €8.070) to get "good" sharpening, but at the cost of increased latency.
Ideal option is always to have a sharpness slider directly on the source, like you get on most PC games.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Interesting. Even if Sony has been using AI upscalers in their sets since 2013, and the newer ones even far exceed that?It is good, just isn't smart at all knowing how people would take these comparisons.
Would never use consumer TV "Sharpness" processing even if paid, and TV processing in general of any kind should always stay at 0 on reference top gamma panels. You need a dedicated (and expensive) video processor like Lumagen Radiance (you can get one for €8.070) to get "good" sharpening, but at the cost of increased latency.
Ideal option is always to have a sharpness slider directly on the source, like you get on most PC games.
Maybe I'll keep all the post processing TV settings off in game mode as I do now, and play with the sharpness in-game for HD2, since default it's set at 0.75.
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