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Diablo III: Reaper of Souls |OT| Once again! The Sound of HAMMERS is GLORIOUS!
- Thread starter Yoshichan
- Start date
- Status
ha ha
Core - MSPD to cap, STR otherwise.
Offense - CDR and then whichever stat gives you the most damage (usually CC%).
Defense - AR and then +Armor%
Utility - Personally, I run Area Damage since it's +50% AoE Damage 20% of the time which adds up. After that is Resource Reduction.
My first HC character just had a VERY real wake-up call when she was walled in by a pack yesterday. There was arcane stuff everywhere, desecrator on the ground, and all three of her Dashing Strike charges simply failed to move past the wall. I escaped with NDE and potion on cooldown and about 10% of my life remaining.
I haven't logged onto her since.
Wickerbasket
Member
Well, who's it hurting?
It's not like this is a competitive game, you can't even trade the stuff you find.
I prefer to play alone mostly, but I can see why some people would enjoy it.
ItAintEasy
Member
http://www.twitch.tv/goodideagaming
This guy's stream is crakin me up man. He is talking a mile a minute and doing so much damage!
This guy's stream is crakin me up man. He is talking a mile a minute and doing so much damage!
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Round 2 (3?)! Go!!!
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
This is the argument that comes up over and over again. Who is it hurting? Well fuck it, who is it hurting if the game is completely P2W. If you do not want to play, fuck off. I'm sorry if I come across as overly aggressive, but this is the most asinine comment on game balance. I want D3 to last; okay? For the game to actually last it needs to be balanced. Is it really that difficult to understand?
Hey the game isn't competitive, fuck all, balance is out the window. Tell me you aren't serious. Please.
Who gives a shit if Wizards are the most efficient class, fuck it right? What a joke.
xDUMPWEEDx
Banned
I can assure you that D3 isn't going anywhere. This is a well established franchise with tons of hardcore fans. Just relax and don't worry what other people are doing.
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
Is this NeoGAF, did I miss a memo somewhere?
Hey don't worry about balance guys, its a well established franchise. Relax and don't worry about the imbalance. Tell me you are joking. Please.
Angelus Errare
Banned
Because we can.
Dark_castle
Junior Member
Can't believe I rolled this myself. Not too shabby.
Woah great weapon. Why can't I ever get some of these good legendaries? ;____;
Dark_castle
Junior Member
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Ke0-1817/hero/36093008
I am now a melee wizard. Oh god this is such fun.
This wand is fucking GAME.FUCKING.CHANGING! I just need Cindercoat now.
Also Arcane Dynamo makes this melee build purr like a fucking ferrari engine. Melee mob(s) for like 2 seconds, build 5 stacks, hit explosive blast, 10-15m crits everywhere, while that's on cooldown throw out a black hole and use Wave of Force w/ Heat Wave run which gives me 4-7m crits. Explosive Blast will be off cooldown, hit that again your arcane dynamo will be at 5 stacks, another 10-15m crits x 4.
Sooooo good.
Oh what the fucking shit is that. Where in the sanctuary do you people find these stuff!?
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
Cool story. Remind me in the future to ignore your rather ridiculous comments when it comes to game design.
NeoGAF, new day; Game design/balance fuck it, I can. Nice.
Against my better judgement I bought Reaper of Souls yesterday. Started a Crusader, because I didn't want to pick up my level 60 Witch Doctor after all these time. On the one hand I absolutely hate trudging through the first 4 acts again, on the other hand the loot and difficulty system are so much better. Currently level 40 in Act 3 and I have bumped up the difficulty to master. Thinking of trying Torment 1 as I´'m still doing pretty well. Will probably kick Azmodan's ass later today. Can't wait to start act 5. Hopefully I can level up to 60 pretty quickly.
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
Got this earlier.
I love how those annoying lasers now HEAL ME!
I love how those annoying lasers now HEAL ME!
Angelus Errare
Banned
Random guy on internet ignores my comments on game design that I made half heartedly. My life is forfeit! Anything but that random internet guy!
You're going to give yourself an aneurysm over something that's really not that big of a deal. The idea that the rest of us have to plead a case with you (Who are you exactly?) is laughable. So some people do bounty splitting, boo hoo. If Blizzard deems that it's hurting the game then they'll nerf it and people will move on to the next exploit, and the cycle will continue like it has...since vanilla. Though the fact they have only addressed the caches that was brought up from people who did bounty splitting leads me to believe it's low on their list of "shit to fix". If you really want it fixed plead YOUR case with Blizzard not on NeoGAF/Clan chat, because none of us really care nor are any of us going to change because you don't like it.
No one owes you an explanation for anything, the idea that you think you deserve one and that people in GAF clan are under some obligation to give you one is delusional as fuck. Do what you've been doing this entire time people in clan have been doing bounty splitting...ignore it and do your own thing. If/when blizzard nerfs cheer and then move on just like everyone else will.
Totally dropped out a chest doing T1 rifts! D: It's such a game changer, I've changed my entire itemization and loot acquirement because of it. Absolutely love it! Now if I could get a Dark Shade hat for those times I take too much damage, I'd be golden...and a cindercoat…and a Firebird source.
The most efficient way is to not play together in a multiplayer game.
It's splitting up work and increasing the difficulty for each individual player. Even without bounties, players can still do that if they wanted to. Why is this wrong again?
People doing split farming will result in Blizzard Nerfing Horadric cache legendary chances, and that is it. Then those NOT abusing the system will get hurt, usual business.
The "somthing can be abused? Sure, let us get to it" mentality is SO far away from what I usually imagine myself doing in a video game that it is not even funny. People artificially lengthen their reward loops by jumping ahead of the pack, and then, they will complain ahead of everyone else that BLIZZ, NOTHING DROPS FOR ME, BUHUUU, I AM STUCK ON T4
.
GG, I say. It will get nerfed, it has to. And it is not defensible. Just like goblin/tile/barrel /cellar farming was not fair (or even "fun") in early Inferno days.
And at the end of the day, stuff like this is why if you want competitive economy, you need to have a strict anti-abuse policy AND trading. D3 has none of these as of now. So whatever floats your boats, I guess.
The "somthing can be abused? Sure, let us get to it" mentality is SO far away from what I usually imagine myself doing in a video game that it is not even funny. People artificially lengthen their reward loops by jumping ahead of the pack, and then, they will complain ahead of everyone else that BLIZZ, NOTHING DROPS FOR ME, BUHUUU, I AM STUCK ON T4
.GG, I say. It will get nerfed, it has to. And it is not defensible. Just like goblin/tile/barrel /cellar farming was not fair (or even "fun") in early Inferno days.
And at the end of the day, stuff like this is why if you want competitive economy, you need to have a strict anti-abuse policy AND trading. D3 has none of these as of now. So whatever floats your boats, I guess.
UnluckyKate
Member
I'm looking at a monk holy dmg build. Are there weapons that add a % of holy dmg like the WKL for thunder, or Serkis axe for fire ?
jaundicejuice
Member
I had to google what split farming was since I had no idea what it was. It sounds rather similar to when I play in a public game with randoms. Some people just don't care about the group magic find bonus you gain by staying in proximity to the rest of your party. They just rush around the map madly, solo fight all of the elite mobs and open all of the chests, in short they're kind of fucking the group but also themselves.
I don't really understand how it undermines RoS or why it has to be nerfed, players who engage in this are kind of already screwing themselves by having each member of a party solo four of the five bounties. Sure they'll get a horadric cache and bloodstones faster but they decrease the odds they'll get better item drops from breakables, chests, trash and elite mobs by not staying in a group. It sounds like the only thing they're successfully farming is paragon exp. I imagine the highest difficulty people could do this quickly and efficiently in would be Torment 1 and the drop rates aren't all that fantastic.
I've gotten nothing but kruft items that I sell or beakdown, gems (which the game already drops copious amounts of) and riftstgone key pieces from horadric caches. I've done or 100 bounties, I haven't gotten one remarkable thing from ahoradric cache, I've spent all of my bloodstone shards and received one semi-decent legendary.
xDUMPWEEDx
Banned
I do enjoy the occasional normal mode bounty split run, but you can't get set items doing this.
T1 rifts are a lot more fun IMO, and just as rewarding due to awesome set bonuses. I WILL have that Immortal King's 4 piece bonus one of these days!
T1 rifts are a lot more fun IMO, and just as rewarding due to awesome set bonuses. I WILL have that Immortal King's 4 piece bonus one of these days!
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
I'm sorry I thought this was a message board where we discuss the nuances of game design and the issues that we have with them. Am I wrong? I'm asking the members of NA-GAF to justify why and how split-farming is conducive to good game design. If you that does not interest you, then kindly ignore my interjection.
I have spent the past few days in game with people attempting to justify why split-farming is not an issue. I'm merely asking that the conversation happen here, as it is better avenue to discuss the issue. Again, if you do not want to discuss this particular issue and how it effects the game as a whole, then I kindly ask that you ignore the discussion at hand.
Moff
Member
as someone whoy enjoys both, playing alone as well as playing in groups, I really enjoy split farming.
rifts are done together as a group, while bounties with split farming, its still a group effort, but everyone can do it by himself, is it weird that I enjoy that?
as I said a few times before, I think ROS' greatest strenght is diversity, and split bounties and the given possibility to do things by yourself, while contributing to a group effort, actually adds to that. I dont think its an exploit or an abuse.
rifts are done together as a group, while bounties with split farming, its still a group effort, but everyone can do it by himself, is it weird that I enjoy that?
as I said a few times before, I think ROS' greatest strenght is diversity, and split bounties and the given possibility to do things by yourself, while contributing to a group effort, actually adds to that. I dont think its an exploit or an abuse.
I'm not saying people shouldn't do it, it's up to the developers to balance the game but it's kinda nonsensical from a design perspective to have playing alone essentially be by far the most optimal solution. Instead of grouping being about skill synergy, it's about who can play the best by themselves.
It's kinda like how the magic find system made it so it was actually a bad idea to group up with how it was split among group members. It's not as fundamentally broken but it just promotes a gameplay style that I think most people who enjoy grouping would not enjoy.
Angelus Errare
Banned
People doing split farming will result in Blizzard Nerfing Horadric cache legendary chances, and that is it. Then those NOT abusing the system will get hurt, usual business.
The "somthing can be abused? Sure, let us get to it" mentality is SO far away from what I usually imagine myself doing in a video game that it is not even funny. People artificially lengthen their reward loops by jumping ahead of the pack, and then, they will complain ahead of everyone else that BLIZZ, NOTHING DROPS FOR ME, BUHUUU, I AM STUCK ON T4
GG, I say. It will get nerfed, it has to. And it is not defensible. Just like goblin/tile/barrel /cellar farming was not fair (or even "fun") in early Inferno days.
And at the end of the day, stuff like this is why if you want competitive economy, you need to have a strict anti-abuse policy AND trading. D3 has none of these as of now. So whatever floats your boats, I guess.
They won't nerf legendary drop rates across the board; there is no need to. At most all they have to do is lower the rate for legs to drop in normal. Because if anyone wanted to they can hoard their caches even without doing split farming. Even when I run with GAF members or solo (both), I usually save my caches until I have 10-20 then I open them. The end result is the same as people who do split farm, amass a shitload of caches and hopefully profit. Hell in fact yesterday I spent 2-3hrs with gaffers doing legitimate bounty runs and got about 25 caches before I decided to open mine. I've done non split runs on normal with GAF members just because we can one shot everything and to theorycraft.
If anything blizzard can just limit the amount of caches a person is allowed to carry...which would be dumb but whatever. Or alternatively significantly lower the chance for legs to drop from normal caches (which then becomes an issue of gated itemization which many people including a few who hate this whole split bounty business) are against.
Really you guys should just simply request that high geared people not be allowed to do normal bounties because really that's the crux of the problem for many of you.
I'd rather do rifts anyway (which is why I even bother with bounties...so I can amass a shitload of rift keys and don't have to do bounties for a while).
Let's say if everyone grouped together and cleared bounties together faster, does that mean they're also getting caches they're not entitled to because they did it faster than a person can do it solo?
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
What!? BS!
I should be able to get the rewards for something that I didn't do. I mean come on!
Oh wait, no one said that ever...
"The end result is the same as people who do split farm, amass a shitload of caches and hopefully profit."
The end result is not the same.
The difference is the amount of TIME it took you to get 20 caches when you are soloing vs split farming. It is exactly four times faster.
So assuming normal, 10 percent legendary chance, this is how this goes:
- You get 40 caches in X amount of time. You might find 3-4 legendaries in them, approximately.
- A split farming group member gets 160 caches in the same amount of time. They will open about 12-16 legendaries.
Same time spent!
Multiplayer has it rewards - it being monsters scaling not as much as player DPS is added to the pool, bonus to MF, etc- , but a clear multiplier as high as this is not that.
The abuse here is the fact that while the game is dynamically scaling, the cache rewards create an imbalance in this system. The caches were built by the devs without them thinking about its repercussions in multiplayer mode.
The end result is not the same.
The difference is the amount of TIME it took you to get 20 caches when you are soloing vs split farming. It is exactly four times faster.
So assuming normal, 10 percent legendary chance, this is how this goes:
- You get 40 caches in X amount of time. You might find 3-4 legendaries in them, approximately.
- A split farming group member gets 160 caches in the same amount of time. They will open about 12-16 legendaries.
Same time spent!
Multiplayer has it rewards - it being monsters scaling not as much as player DPS is added to the pool, bonus to MF, etc- , but a clear multiplier as high as this is not that.
The abuse here is the fact that while the game is dynamically scaling, the cache rewards create an imbalance in this system. The caches were built by the devs without them thinking about its repercussions in multiplayer mode.
Robin64
Member
No. You can't see the difference?
It's still gaining an advantage. The only difference is the efficiency. Play it at normal, have everyone group together and tackle a bounty in the same area. Then have everyone split up and search for the bounty (to increase efficiency and because you can one shot everything at normal, otherwise everyone is mostly spending time travelling). So is this okay in your terms?
Angelus Errare
Banned
The time spent can easily be offset by difficulty. I can get in a group with amazingly geared people, put the bounty on normal and we're still going to truck through the content faster than say if we did it on T1 by quite a bit. So even if we stayed in a group, we're still going to end up collecting more caches than lesser geared people at say T1. No matter what there is always going to be an efficiency advantage. So while one group who is "playing the game legit" as in they're running on T1 with their 250k damage gear; they're still going to come away with less caches per hour than team two who sticks together but plays it on normal in their 750k damage gear. Get rid of split bounty, cool they'll all just run together and come away with more caches per hour regardless. Sure it won't be 160 or some ridiculous number...but it's still going to be more than the average. You don't want that happening, ask Blizzard to lower the rate that legs drop on normal caches...but then you're just screwing people who play the game normally or whatever.
Hell when I do split bounties, we usually split into two groups and each group does an act...teamwork! And we're using that utterly useless magic find bonus! And sometimes we all jump in one a boss together!
Such teamwork
Such multiplayer
There is a difference from having a discussion, and demanding people give justification for their actions. You clearly have no intention of being swayed by anything people FOR split bounty has to say; this much is painstakingly clear. So at that point it's less of a discussion and more of "let me hear your side so I can tell you how wrong it is and how dumb you are for having that position". Your ridiculously overly aggressive attitude isn't going to attract anyone looking for a civil discussion on the matter...which is why no one has yet to seriously entertain you. You started the conversation in attack mode and people are responding with equal force.
You want a civil discussion, turn off angry douche mode and just maybe people will respond to you in a more calm manner. Alternatively you can continue in your current capacity and see how far that gets you.
Robin64
Member
Multiplayer should have an advantage, which is partly what the radius buff is for. Perhaps that should be stronger, I don't know.
But splitting up to tackle individual bounties entirely is more extreme than your example. Why don't I just get a cache when someone else in the guild clears a bounty in their game? I have done, after all, exactly the same as in a split game.
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
4 people grouping together on Normal < 4 people grouping together and going solo.
Kind of odd that you are the only one that has reacted in this manner, no?
So this get twisted and twisted while the fact remains: multiplayer was not balanced with Horadric Caches in mind. Can you at least admit/realize that? Or will you stick to the "all or nothing - if it IS an advantage, no advantage should be present OR anything is fair game" fallacy?
Moff
Member
mostly we do it act by act, so everyone does at least one bounty for the current act, everyone has contributed to the horadric chest of that act, is that ok for you?
I dont see it at all like you, I dont get 4 caches for free.
there are 5 horadric chests a game, 25 bounties need to be done for them. I did 6 or 7 even of the bountes, I contributed to the 5 caches, I didnt get them for free. I did my part.
would i be ok for you if it was just 1 huge cache for a whole game instead of 1 for each act?
just because its 5 caches instea of 1 big one doesnt mean I didnt work for them. its a group effor where I did my part.
Angelus Errare
Banned
And why shouldn't I? You've pretty much for the entire day both here and in clan chat have been calling people "fucking stupid" and "idiots" for engaging in split bounties. I have no obligations to be nice to you when you've done nothing but insult people because they choose to do split bounties. It's beyond annoying in clan chat; you pretty much bring clan chat to a halt with the insults and whining. Like dude, calm down and just play the game; those good for nothing bounty splitters will get theirs.
Pretty much what I do, get about 300-500 shards, empty my inventory and buy until I get a leg.
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