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Diablo III: Reaper of Souls |OT| Once again! The Sound of HAMMERS is GLORIOUS!

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mostly we do it act by act, so everyone does at least one bounty for the current act, everyone has contributed to the horadric chest of that act, is that ok for you?

I dont see it at all like you, I dont get 4 caches for free.
there are 5 horadric chests a game, 25 bounties need to be done for them. I did 6 or 7 even of the bountes, I contributed to the 5 caches, I didnt get them for free. I did my part.
would i be ok for you if it was just 1 huge cache for a whole game instead of 1 for each act?
just because its 5 caches instea of 1 big one doesnt mean I didnt work for them. its a group effor where I did my part.

Would it be okay with you if I did the same % of 'work' that you did and reaped the same reward? If so would you even bother with split farming?

Basically if I cleared one act and received the reward for five. Talking solo here, I'm not split farming. Would this be acceptable game play, I cleared one act of bounties but received the reward for five.

In the end, this is a discussion of one thing and one thing only. Why do you split-farm? The answer is, it is the most efficient way to farm gear. Right?
 

Totakeke

Member
So this get twisted and twisted while the fact remains: multiplayer was not balanced with Horadric Caches in mind. Can you at least admit/realize that? Or will you stick to the "all or nothing - if it IS an advantage, no advantage should be present OR anything is fair game" fallacy?

You say not balanced, I say it's fair game. As long it doesn't end up the only thing people do in the game, then it's fine. People are farming core of arreat chests, people are farming for legendary materials. People are doing rifts for forgotten souls.

Plus I have not seen anything to implicate that this particular advantage gives people a lot more legendaries than other people. If anything it looks like the arreat runs are the best legendary/hour run now and that's a far more boring thing to do than split bounties.
 
I GOT Lv70 THUNDERFURY!

GHYYOnm.jpg


I feel right man... I feel right.

6Bi1868.gif

Grats Ice!
 
Haven't played the game in a couple of days after (admittedly binging for probably 35+ hours) the first few. Gotta say I'm not really feeling the Crusader anymore. Might "retire" her until the class is tweaked a bit.

Also might switch over to hardcore too, at least for a time, to keep things fresh. Or maybe level some other characters to 70 - just seemed a bit daunting at the moment.
 

gotoadgo

Member
This is the argument that comes up over and over again. Who is it hurting? Well fuck it, who is it hurting if the game is completely P2W. If you do not want to play, fuck off. I'm sorry if I come across as overly aggressive, but this is the most asinine comment on game balance. I want D3 to last; okay? For the game to actually last it needs to be balanced. Is it really that difficult to understand?

Hey the game isn't competitive, fuck all, balance is out the window. Tell me you aren't serious. Please.

Who gives a shit if Wizards are the most efficient class, fuck it right? What a joke.

Is this NeoGAF, did I miss a memo somewhere?

Hey don't worry about balance guys, its a well established franchise. Relax and don't worry about the imbalance. Tell me you are joking. Please.

Cool story. Remind me in the future to ignore your rather ridiculous comments when it comes to game design.

NeoGAF, new day; Game design/balance fuck it, I can. Nice.

I'm sorry I thought this was a message board where we discuss the nuances of game design and the issues that we have with them. Am I wrong? I'm asking the members of NA-GAF to justify why and how split-farming is conducive to good game design. If you that does not interest you, then kindly ignore my interjection.

I have spent the past few days in game with people attempting to justify why split-farming is not an issue. I'm merely asking that the conversation happen here, as it is better avenue to discuss the issue. Again, if you do not want to discuss this particular issue and how it effects the game as a whole, then I kindly ask that you ignore the discussion at hand.

Your aggressive tone is annoying and unwarranted. Why in the hell would anyone address you when you speak like this?
 
Haven't played the game in a couple of days after binging the first few. Gotta say I'm not really feeling the Crusader anymore. Might "retire" her until the class is tweaked a bit.

Also might switch over to hardcore too, at least for a time, to keep things fresh. Or maybe level some other characters to 70 - just seemed a bit daunting at the moment.

Yea I had to do the same. I got my crusader to 70; got some legs but I'm still not feeling the class. They're easily the most leg dependent class in the game atm.
 
Your aggressive tone is annoying and unwarranted. Why in the hell would anyone address you when you speak like this?

Well at least he lives up to his nick :p

On the subject: I think people should be allowed to play THEIR game the way THEY want to without having to explain to some random dude on a forum.
 

Moff

Member
In the end, this is a discussion of one thing and one thing only. Why do you split-farm? The answer is, it is the most efficient way to farm gear. Right?

as I explaind before, I do split farm because I enjoy diversity and like to do both, playing in a group and playing alone. and split farming makes playing alone an equally efficient way to farm gear. people work together for a group effort of 5 horadric caches by doing bounties themselves, they dont get anything for free.

I we talk about which might be more efficient or is the "most efficient", I cant say if I got more legs from caches or rifts, I have to admit my luck from caches was pretty low.
 
Yea I had to do the same. I got my crusader to 70; got some legs but I'm still not feeling the class. They're easily the most leg dependent class in the game atm.

I mean I have my Wizard too that I've played more and got to 70 first, so I figured I'd go back to the Crusader to mix it up since she's not as geared, but it just wasn't working for me within the first 5 minutes of touching it. The slow Wrath generation and movement speed (from Heavenly Strength) killed the fun real quick.
 

KuroNeeko

Member
Haven't played the game in a couple of days after (admittedly binging for probably 35+ hours) the first few. Gotta say I'm not really feeling the Crusader anymore. Might "retire" her until the class is tweaked a bit.

Also might switch over to hardcore too, at least for a time, to keep things fresh. Or maybe level some other characters to 70 - just seemed a bit daunting at the moment.

Hey CF, I play Hardcore on the US servers if you want to team up some time.

kuroMame#1491

Unfortunately, I don't have any characters over 30 yet. :/
 

Baliis

Member
as I explaind before, I do split farm because I enjoy diversity and like to do both, playing in a group and playing alone. and split farming makes playing alone an equally efficient way to farm gear. people work together for a group effort of 5 horadric caches by doing bounties themselves, they dont get anything for free.

But you are getting things for free, you aren't doing 75% of the bounties but still getting credit.
 
I mean I have my Wizard too that I've played more and got to 70 first, so I figured I'd go back to the Crusader to mix it up since she's not as geared, but it just wasn't working for me within the first 5 minutes of touching it. The slow Wrath generation and movement speed (from Heavenly Strength) killed the fun real quick.

Yea and unfortunately that doesn't really change much at higher levels. :(
 
thats like saying you didnt do 75% of the damage but are still getting the loot from the boss

Thats actually an excellent point.. lets say you do everything with 4 players. Means everyone does 25% of the damage to get 1 cache.

If you split up, you'll do 100% of the damage for 1.. or 25% for 4.. damn you maths
 

Won

Member
I only keep playing my Crusader because I got that Condemn sword right away. Otherwise I would have already shelfed it. But if Kadala continues to refuse to hand out legendary shields......

You say not balanced, I say it's fair game. As long it doesn't end up the only thing people do in the game, then it's fine. People are farming core of arreat chests, people are farming for legendary materials. People are doing rifts for forgotten souls.

Plus I have not seen anything to implicate that this particular advantage gives people a lot more legendaries than other people. If anything it looks like the arreat runs are the best legendary/hour run now and that's a far more boring thing to do than split bounties.

I'm pretty sure Blizzard has a close eye on Arreat too. That's a bad point to make. Ultimately they want a basic level of risk vs reward going on in this game and split farming kinda dodges this and even turns it upside down. That's gonna be a problem for Blizzard.

Personally I don't have that big of a problem with the concept of splitting up itself, but I do think Blizzard needs to look how the whole normal/hard/expert block of difficulties works in general at the moment. It's a bit...awkward.
 

The Cowboy

Member
Gotta love family members who know your gaming habits and like to surprise you, bought the game for myself yesterday online - got a package today with a boxed copy (they knew i was short of cash): LOL.
-
Man Rifts are fun, so many things come at you and its just great.
 
Thats actually an excellent point.. lets say you do everything with 4 players. Means everyone does 25% of the damage to get 1 cache.

If you split up, you'll do 100% of the damage for 1.. or 25% for 4.. damn you maths

It's more like (in a scenario where damage = effort and rewards are based on damage/effort) rather than doing 100% of the damage for 4, you're doing 25% of the damage but still getting 4. As someone said, you're switching it around.

you'll have to elaborate on that
in both you contribute ~25%, either damage or bounties, for a reward that everyone gets.

The difference is in this 25% damage scenario you're doing 1/4 of the damage but getting your reward and everyone elses.
 

Totakeke

Member
I'm pretty sure Blizzard has a close eye on Arreat too. That's a bad point to make. Ultimately they want a basic level of risk vs reward going on in this game and split farming kinda dodges this and even turns it upside down. That's gonna be a problem for Blizzard.

Personally I don't have that big of a problem with the concept of splitting up itself, but I do think Blizzard needs to look how the whole normal/hard/expert block of difficulties works in general at the moment. It's a bit...awkward.

You're saying it has to be nerfed, I'm saying it's okay. On the flip side if everything is balanced and nothing particularly stands out, then the game becomes boring because everything you do is the same.
 

Tunesmith

formerly "chigiri"
You guys should play without any movement speed boosts because it's unfair to others.


I can see Blizzard perhaps limiting how much completion credit you get for bounties completed in acts that you yourself are not in. E.g. you only get completion credit for bounties in the same act.

I can also see Blizzard limiting Normal mode's reward potential and upping Torment mode's potential to counter-act this "phenomena".

That will still allow people to split up but hamper "super-efficiency" by going gungho across the entire game at their leisure. Anything else in terms of restrictions would be counter-intuitive to the design of Adventure Mode where you can go and do whatever the hell you want in no particular order.

That said, I'm geared enough to do split farming in Torment, why shouldn't I be allowed to do that?
 
Well at least he lives up to his nick :p

On the subject: I think people should be allowed to play THEIR game the way THEY want to without having to explain to some random dude on a forum.

I'm not asking you to explain a single thing. Again, lets start from the beginning here.

I would honestly like to have a discussion on the rampant split farming that is occurring within NA-GAF and the game as a whole. A solid amount of our players would like to entertain the notion that split farming is some how not negatively effecting the game. Personally, I find it to be a cancerous blight; Blizzard really needs to nerf this and they need to do it fast. For all the individuals who thought that CotA, Mira, Cath 4, RA, etc. runs were some how 'bad' this is far far worse. Split farming is undermining the entirety of RoS in short order. So here it is, defenders of split farming; make your case.

Notice the key parts of what I said here.

A discussion that was and has been occurring within NA-GAF. Numerous players within the clan have stated over and over that split-farming is a completely acceptable mode of game play and that they see nothing wrong with it. Personally speaking I think that split-farming happens to be negatively effecting the game. What I'm trying to do here is move the discussion from the game to the message board. The reasoning for this is two-fold: First and foremost, I would like to see how the community at large feels about the issue. Second, is an attempt to move the discussion from the game to the message board. I think the discussion is better suited to this format than bantering back and forth in clan chat.

Could I have framed my original post in a better manner, yep. For that I do apologize, my bad.
 

Baliis

Member
you'll have to elaborate on that
in both you contribute ~25%, either damage or bounties, for a reward that everyone gets.

One is a group working together doing the same thing and all getting one reward. One is a group playing solo doing different things and each getting four rewards. Your example would be better if you did 0 damage and got 3 rewards.
 

Moff

Member
One is a group working together doing the same thing and all getting one reward. One is a group playing solo doing different things and each getting four rewards.
The difference is in this 25% damage scenario you're doing 1/4 of the damage but getting your reward and everyone elses.


thats the fault in your thinking.
the 5 caches as a whole are the "boss loot" in my example, think of it as one huge cache for 25 bounties and it makes sense.
because all 5 caches are the reward of the group effort.
 

Baliis

Member
thats the fault in your thinking.
the 5 caches as a whole are the "boss loot" in my example, think of it as one huge cache and it makes sense. because all 5 caches are the reward of the group effort, not a single one.

And they shouldn't be. You should only get credit for the bounty if you're there because otherwise it isn't a group effort. Why is that so hard to get?
 

SoulUnison

Banned
So I desperately wish I had 40 dollars, but I'm really intent on eating this month.
Somebody tell me all about how amazing Adventure Mode and how jealous I should be.
 

Label

The Amiga Brotherhood
I am not sure if I am having as much fun with the Crusader as I thought I would. I am tempted to go back to my Demon Hunter.

What class is everyone having the most fun with? I remember Witch Doctor being a blast. The only class I have not tried yet is the Wizard, maybe it is worth leveling that guy up.
 
And they shouldn't be. You should only get credit for the bounty if you're there because otherwise it isn't a group effort. Why is that so hard to get?

What he's suggesting is that if you follow that logic that you should ONLY get the reward for what you're directly involved in, you should also only get 1/4 of a legendary from a boss kill - not a whole one since you didn't contribute to 100% in killing the boss.
 

Baliis

Member
I am not sure if I am having as much fun with the Crusader as I thought I would. I am tempted to go back to my Demon Hunter.

What class is everyone having the most fun with? I remember Witch Doctor being a blast. The only class I have not tried yet is the Wizard, maybe it is worth leveling that guy up.

Wizard is pretty great, if not a bit OP right now. Tons of builds to choose from, lots of build changing legendaries, great defense and offensive options, plus some mobility.

What he's suggesting is that if you follow that logic that you should ONLY get the reward for what you're directly involved in, you should also only get 1/4 of a legendary from a boss kill - not a whole one since you didn't contribute to 100% in killing the boss.

Of course you don't contribute 100% though, that's the point of group play. To play as a group. The point is you still contributed to the boss. You are contributing 0 to the bounties everyone else is doing.

To be honest, I don't even really care that much about split farming, hell I just got done doing like 20 act II runs by splitting up. But I can recognize that it's bad design, especially the fact that it's most efficient to do it on the easiest difficulty. If they changed that, the problem would solve itself because you wouldn't be able to solo effectively in a four person game, it would force you to use your synergies to clear things in a reasonable time.
 

Kssio_Aug

Member
The most efficient way is to not play together in a multiplayer game.
Thats just not true! Split the team to do faster bounties IS to play together, it definitelty requires cooperation. Just play side-by-side does not mean anything... I had more fun and communication doing it than going at public games with rusher guys who dont even care to let you behind all the time, while you just "follow" him!

Also the Rifts would require the team to do it together. And the bounty itself will require that the splitted team comes together to help each other on whats remaining.

I am completely ok about someone prefer to not split the team, but saying that is not cooperative is pure bs!
 

Moff

Member
And they shouldn't be. You should only get credit for the bounty if you're there because otherwise it isn't a group effort. Why is that so hard to get?

ok, now your point changes to "but you arent there", but you did understand my 25% contribution point? is that correct? we are not getting "4 caches for free", have we agreed on that?

now, about not playing actually together, that is something I DO get, and understand, its certainly true.

but I like it.

as I said before, ROS' greatness, for me, is all about diversity, we no longer need to farm the same, most efficient spots over and over and over again, rifts and bounties force and reward us for doing and seeing all the different parts of the game. we can even do them in different difficulty levels, and the game rewards us appropriately, either with faster and more kills, but lower drop chances, or less and harder kills, but with higher drop chances, both is possible, you can do whatever you feel like, diversity is key.

and now comes my point, you can even choose to do it "alone", because some people like to kill monsters on their own for some time, the problem was its nowhere near as efficient as killing countless elite packs on torment in groups.
bounty splitting solves this, it allows people who like to play alone from time to time, to do this, play alone but be efficient at the same time as part of a group effort.
diversity is key.
 
ok, now your point changes to "but you arent there", but you did understand my 25% contribution point? is that correct? we are not getting "4 caches for free", have we agreed on that?

Of course you are getting caches for free. This is a joke right? Right.

Assuming you were the individual who solo'd Act 4; did you do a single thing to obtain the caches in Act 1, 2, or 3?

Did you?

Why not just allow me to solo Act 4 without a group and also get caches for Act 1, 2, and 3.?
 
stupid core of areat runs .. every time I'm about to give up on them another leg drops and reels me back in. Still not sure if it's faster than T1 Rift/Bounty
 

The Cowboy

Member
Are old items that you picked up before 2.0/RoS not added to the transforming system?, on my WD i had a L30ish Legendary helmet. Yet despite me still having it (i had it in my stash) and now putting in my backpack and even putting it on, it won't appear in the transformation section to use.
 

Baliis

Member
But you are getting things for free, you aren't doing 75% of the bounties but still getting credit.

no, your first answer to me was about getting things "for free", which is wrong. but I am glad we worked that out.

It's not wrong, but okay. "You aren't doing 75% of the bounties" is the same as saying "you aren't there".

The game encourages group players to not play together, and that's bad. This really isn't that hard.
 

Kssio_Aug

Member
Complain about nerfing the splitted bounties is almost asking to step back to the boring formula of farming the specific efficient location over and over again... that my friends, teamed or not, is tiring as hell.
 

MYE

Member
Are old items that you picked up before 2.0/RoS not added to the transforming system?, on my WD i had a L30ish Legendary helmet. Yet despite me still having it (i had it in my stash) and now putting in my backpack and even putting it on, it won't appear in the transformation section to use.
Legacy items (pre-patch) wont transform or reroll.
 
Complain about nerfing the splitted bounties is almost asking to step back to the boring formula of farming the specific efficient location over and iver again... that my friends, teamed or not, is tiring as hell.

No it really isn't.

Fixing what is most definitely a bug in the game does not mean you have to switch to chest farming. You could actually group up and tackle those bounties together or you could solo them if you desire.
 

Moff

Member
The game encourages group players to not play together, and that's bad. This really isn't that hard.

no, it makes both playing together as well as playing alone perfectly viable and efficient methods of farming gear, that offers diverstiy and is a good thing.

Of course you are getting caches for free. This is a joke right? Right.

Assuming you were the individual who solo'd Act 4; did you do a single thing to obtain the caches in Act 1, 2, or 3?

Did you?

Why not just allow me to solo Act 4 without a group and also get caches for Act 1, 2, and 3.?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=106639712&postcount=9599
 
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