Digital Foundry: Xbox Scorpio

As a PC gamer, still not super impressed. Definitely a nice console for the console gamers but my big problem with the Xbox brand is the games. There just aren't enough exclusives to justify the system if you have a PS4 and PC. After Scorpio, Microsoft should do everything in their power to increase their first party and exclusive output.
 
Shil Pencer said:
Just having the best place to play (talking console) Destiny 2, Star Wars Battlefront 2, Red Dead 2 makes this system worth it for me. Any 1st party titles is just icing on the cake
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The general market won't see it this way with Sony having exclusive marketing agreements with all three and (in some cases) exclusive content agreements.
 
djnewwest said:
I think a lot of people are underestimating the power of 3rd party games. Sony may have bought exclusive marketing for certain games, but I think the next step is Microsoft going for exclusive 4k asset and resolution patches that can only be possible on Scorpio.

For example while Sony may have a exclusive marketing deal with Red Dead 2. Scorpio may have a an exclusive 4k/ whatever patch.

I guess we'll see, but Red Dead 2 or Cyberpunk 2077 on the Scorpio is going to be the best place to play it on.
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I'm fairly sure the best place to play Cyberpunk 2077 will be on a high end pc :p
 
Karak said:
Very cool reveal overall with some more data needed.
I am sitting in a developer group chat and the first takeaway from almost all of them was "Man I need to play Forza." lol
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Yeah doesn't surprise me. First thing I thought after the video ended was "Can't wait to play Forza 7"
 
gofreak said:
I think the issue there is that if it's relatively 'standard' dx12 stuff or driver level optimisations, it's the kind of thing - cpu draw call optimisation - that everyone has been working on and was already pretty lean afaik, at least in a console context. It's not clear how much 'more' this is, vs what's already in Polaris for example, or what it would mean overall for performance.
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It could be a decent win for indie devs, or for devs using less console optimised workflows. Likewise it might be useful to encourage developers into a directX workflow because with less overhead on console it is a reasonable option, and of course you then get easy PC versions out of it. This could be as much about overall MS ecosystem push for developers as it is pure performance increase
 
Interficium said:
The general market won't see it this way with Sony having exclusive marketing agreements with all three and (in some cases) exclusive content agreements.
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This isn't a product for the "general market".

It's for enthusiasts. Just like the PS4 Pro.

cripterion said:
I'm fairly sure the best place to play Cyberpunk 2077 will be on a high end pc :p
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The best play to play almost every game is on PC.

This is about consoles.
 
paulogy said:
The Hovis Method is the new Blast Processing. Don't worry about it. The rest of the specs are worth discussing though.
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hmm, once is a software solution the other is a manufacturing and engineering process for motherboards?

Isnt this how they keep the power lower than anticipated? i haven't seen anyone go "HOLY MOLY THAT PULLS A LOT OF ELECTRICITY!" yet.

everything in these articles are intriguing.
 
I was able to run Forza Apex at Xbox One settings at native 2160p at 60fps 16xaf on my GTX 970. Adding 4k textures is more a vram bandwidth thing so essentially until more is shown its still looking like 390X/GTX 980 performance which ties roughly in the amount spare as my 970 was able to do it.
 
I sure hope some people aren't expecting the world from MS when it comes to exclusives being announced at E3. Yes I can definitely understand that people would hope for a nice lineup of brand new games but we all know the reality right now and that is that MS only has so many studios and most of them are working on announced projects.

I'm not gonna claim i know all about it because I really don't, but I wouldn't expect a lot of brand new IP being announced at E3 this year. Hopefully next E3 we see a big improvement in that regard. Phil acknowledged that first party are crucial and they are working on it but they aren't wizards. Would love to be proven wrong on this though.

Right now I see Scorpio as THE system for the multiplatform games, the system for Gears, Halo, Forza, Crackdown, Sea of Thieves, State of Decay 2 and new game from Moon Studios and some indie games and for this year that's enough. If what Phil says holds true and they really improve their first party that's just fucking good news but we'll cross that bridge when we get there.
 
Enjoyed the article. Excited to see what's going to be at E3.

Looks like $499 or possibly the return of five hundred ninety nine us dollars. So many custom parts, long PCB traces with no shortcuts in RAM placement, and 12 GB of GDDR5.

Video didn't add anything and was unnecessary.

Whoever was in that video kept annoyingly waving his left hand as if he was some sort of dictator. John (dark10x) is probably the best presenter in DF with his collections of retro + game analysis videos.
 
Really liking the specs. A nice upgrade especially the Super sampling and the boost to other games by default.

The Forza photo looks promising. I hope we see footage soon.

I hope Microsoft have got a good line up to go with it. A new console has the chance to attract new consumers but hardware alone won't be the driving force behind sales.

I hope we get a reveal soon, dying to see it and hope its white or silver
 
The machine is beautifully engineered, right down to the state-of-the-art vapour cooling system that will keep that monster graphics processor cool. It's a far cry from Xbox One, Kinect and TVTVTV. It reminds us of the original Xbox and Xbox 360 - this is Microsoft throwing its considerable engineering resources at making the best possible games-playing machine. Xbox is back.
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http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-04-06-project-scorpio-explained

d0Wew1i.gif
 
Interficium said:
The general market won't see it this way with Sony having exclusive marketing agreements with all three and (in some cases) exclusive content agreements.
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I agree, but i do think Microsoft has a shot if its 399.99 and they hit up some Sega of the 90s marketing during every NFL game, which Microsoft already loves to do. It wont change the landscape immediately but i think the word will start to spread for the future
 
Gotta say I'm much more impressed by Scorpio than I expected to be. I don't have 4K and don't know when I might end up with it, but unlike the Pro this seems like it might be a worthy upgrade even without 4K. I feel like MS really put a lot of thought into this system-- like they've learnt a lot from the One's struggles. I really like how it even benefits 360 games.

That said, for me, they really need more games. Forza's good but.... hopefully MS has learned as much on that side of things as they did on the hardware.

This shows why competition is good. I am looking forward to seeing Sony's response, and E3 should get really interesting.
 
dcx4610 said:
As a PC gamer, still not super impressed. Definitely a nice console for the console gamers but my big problem with the Xbox brand is the games. There just aren't enough exclusives to justify the system if you have a PS4 and PC. After Scorpio, Microsoft should do everything in their power to increase their first party and exclusive output.
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I definitely agree that Microsoft needs to invest in a more diverse first-party lineup, but I don't think that lineup needs to be exclusive to Xbox consoles. Having their exclusives on both Xbox and Windows 10 means that they reach a wider audience.
 
The Futurist said:
This isn't a product for the "general market".

It's for enthusiasts. Just like the PS4 Pro.



The best play to play almost every game is on PC.

This is about consoles.
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I hear ya but in the specific case or MS they're almost kinda one and the same right now? Well at least that's what I get from MS strategy.
 
dcx4610 said:
As a PC gamer, still not super impressed. Definitely a nice console for the console gamers but my big problem with the Xbox brand is the games. There just aren't enough exclusives to justify the system if you have a PS4 and PC. After Scorpio, Microsoft should do everything in their power to increase their first party and exclusive output.
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And you shouldn't be. You are not the target consumer. Why do PC gamers want a reason to buy this? Do you hate money so much that you just want to spend it on something? It would essentially mean they stop Play Anywhere and in what world is this a good thing.
After manufacturing, shipping and retail cut they will make peanuts in profit on selling the console so it's not like Microsoft would care much.

You can buy their exclusives on PC. At a price that PC gamers usually don't pay and they don't need to give a 30% cut to a storefront. They are absolutely fine with that. If anything Microsoft needs to work on the store more to meet PC gamer standards rather than artificially trying to create a reason for PC gamers to buy this.
 
SenjutsuSage said:
Not at all. As I've said all along, that was just more high hopes, wanting Microsoft to go balls to the wall, but if what I'm reading pans out, there was never any need with the expertise they can bring to bear to go so far in the first place.

That customization related to the CPU, moving DX12 over to the GPU command processor sounds like a pretty great fucking idea, especially if the reported reduction in rendering overhead really ends up panning out as expected. This thing sounds like a beast. Something I tried to mention to people from the start was that I was never going to be angry or hugely disappointed if by some chance it didn't have Zen, because I was convinced that Microsoft would, as far as consoles are concerned, have a bit of a beast on their hands. What I didn't expect is that it would provide not just performance boost to all kinds of existing Xbox One titles automatically (well, I kinda did expect this to happen since it happens with xbox one s already), but I wasn't expecting automatic boosts to visuals also in the form of much improved anisotropic filtering.

Also, it's looking like expectations that this would perform up there with, or maybe even better than a 980 TI weren't so crazy after all. Hell, it's just one test, but according to DF they saw Scorpio more or less handling 4K 60FPS Ultra PC settings at the same level as a GTX 1070. Now obviously Forza is a unique case, but who honestly expected before this reveal that such a statement, forza or no, would ever actually be possible? I might have said it once or twice just being excited and silly, but for it to possibly turn out accurate? Well, we'll see.

Scorpio was always a guaranteed purchase for me with or without Zen. And judging by what we all read, there's a chance this may, with some of the things they did, end up fairly expensive. Zen really might have put it over the top. So if it means keeping it within a certain range, I'm fine with that. If by some miracle they were to announce this thing for $399.99 LOL. That'd be crazy, but I'm expecting higher.
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Glad you stayed level headed about it. You seemed pretty determined to force zen into Scorpio through sheer force of will for a while there lol.

Well, I'm fairly certain in the grand scheme, this thing won't be 980ti/1070 level for most games. But it looks great with Forza absolutely.

Price is going to be a big factor overshadowing E3 now. Not much longer to see where they stand with this 'premium' talk.
 
Socivol said:
I understand the target market for this but what confuses me is this seems like a complete new hardware generation versus what Sony did with the PS4 Pro which was clearly just an iteration. My question is are they planning for a new generation as well and if they are when because if I bought the Scorpio this year and in two years needed to buy a new console I would be pissed.
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It's the exact same thing Sony did with the Pro except better and with better hardware. All games released will play on the consoles, there is a unified OS and online multiplayer system. This is not a new gen at all. This is just an iteration. It is still an Xbox One.
 
Yo so for all those who bought almost every 3rd party multiplatform console title on PS4, what are y'all thinking?

I've always bought the better performing titles on their respective systems, and if it's on PC - always there.

Without much of an XBO library for this gen (but a huge BC collection), kind of torn about it all.
 
System is exactly what I wanted. Will make Xbox my primary console again. Plus I am excited about the features for 1080p screens.
 
I'm looking forward to Destiny 2 on this. The new hw plus ditching ps3/360 from the get go should provide a stunning upgrade over the first Destiny.
 
dreamfall said:
Yo so for all those who bought almost every 3rd party multiplatform console title on PS4, what are y'all thinking?

I've always bought the better performing titles on their respective systems, and if it's on PC - always there.

Without much of an XBO library for this gen (but a huge BC collection), kind of torn about it all.
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If you have a decent PC, what are you thinking about? Like you said, always on PC if it's there.
 
I really really want this. A lot of posters talking about it not being big enough of a jump over the ps4 pro are kind of missing the point. It's a massive upgrade on the Xbox one righting a lot of wrongs of the Xbox one launch.
 
BrownWalrus said:
This reminds me of when people said the Switch would be $199 for sure after it was confirmed that it would be using the Tegra X1 and not X2.

I'd be willing to bet good money that it will be $499. Patcher did not say "expect to pay premium price for a premium console" to mean that it will cost the same as as a PS4 Pro, which, in their eyes, is not "premium" like the Scorpio is.

I seriously don't understand how people can realistically expect $399. If it comes out at $449 I will be shocked.

Of course I'm hoping to eat crow on all this but I just don't see it.
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There's always a possibility it could be a bit more but I think MS will want to still keep it as low as they can, to surprise people at E3.

I mean using the older tech, prices have come down on Jaguar, Polaris and GDDR5 tech, and Sony got the Pro out for the same price as the original PS4, despite it being a lot more powerful, so I can see MS trying to get as close as they can to $399. I guess it will depend if they want Scorpio to sell fast or are taking a more laid back approach to it's sales, like Sony has with the Pro.

As for Switch, not everyone thought it would be that low.
 
dreamfall said:
Yo so for all those who bought almost every 3rd party multiplatform console title on PS4, what are y'all thinking?

I've always bought the better performing titles on their respective systems, and if it's on PC - always there.

Without much of an XBO library for this gen (but a huge BC collection), kind of torn about it all.
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Well I don't have any platform loyalty. 360 was my main console last gen, PS4 this gen so far, and now it will be Scorpio.

It's going to have substantially better 3rd party games. I can't say no to that.

I have a good gaming PC but frankly heavily dislike gaming on it so that's my 3rd choice.
 
Shil Pencer said:
It wont change the landscape immediately but i think the word will start to spread for the future
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I generally agree. The days of the "generation reset... anyone can win now!" are over, you can't rely on something like the six-to-seventh generation xbox-to-360, ps2-to-ps3 shakeup that ended up with Microsoft suddenly on top of the industry and Sony lagging behind, everything is going to be a long game now.
 
My issues

  • If you care enough to pay for the Scorpio (assuming $500+), don't you already care enough to buy a PC?
  • 3rd party "horsepower" tends to matter more when there's nothing else that matters (i.e. launch PS4). 3 years in, Sony and Nintendo are now selling on exclusive games and not performance. 3rd party horsepower matters even less if the game is also on PC.
  • What games does Microsoft have that will actually be BEST on the Scorpio given the PC versions will invariably be even better? Contrast with PS4 Pro which is still the best place to play a bunch of games since you can't get them elsewhere (Hell, even Switch can boast that).
  • PS4 Pro price drop almost inevitable when this launches
 
dreamfall said:
Yo so for all those who bought almost every 3rd party multiplatform console title on PS4, what are y'all thinking?

I've always bought the better performing titles on their respective systems, and if it's on PC - always there.

Without much of an XBO library for this gen (but a huge BC collection), kind of torn about it all.
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It's fairly easy to amass a large collection of older games on Xbox, if that's any help. The combo of Games With Gold (4 games per month), EA Access (an inexpensive large bundle 40+ of EAs 360 and Xbox One games), the occasional freebies, the regular sales, and the upcoming Game Pass (Microsoft's Netflix for gaming, over 100 games for a monthly subscription) will provide a lot of content at a low cost.
 
Kaako said:
I know it's probably a silly thing to say but if you're interested in buying a 4K TV, do consider saving up for OLEDs. Cause the picture quality/contrast is pure sex. Well worth it if you can find one on sale(ebay/local retailers/etc)
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I'm getting the Sony X900E 4k LED TV. I think I can get one for less than a grand in June. No doubt that LG's OLED sets are better. But first, I have a small living room, and 50" is really my max. If not for me, my wife already thinks our 40" Toshiba is too big.

But I can't justify two grand too buy a 55" TV. I may get one in the future, when OLED is more standard. Or I will skip it, just like I did plasma, if it fails to remain viable.

And while Rtings.com has LG's B6 as their #1 HDR gaming TV, the Sony X900E is second, for a lot less. And honestly, some of the budget HDR TVs are still really good sets for HDR gaming. But I am going to stick with finding a 120 Hz set when I upgrade.

But you can get great TV for $650-$800. Yeah, OLED is better. But the price will come down eventually.
 
The Hamburglar said:
ok just watched letterheads reveal video and I couldn't help cringe.

"Microsoft have done it again"

"blew me away"

"never seen anything like this before"

according to him the Scorpio gpu is 50% more powerful than the pro. As expected it is jaguar upclocked yet they are giving this some absurd name. All this talk of dx12 (again) inside the gpu, i'm suprised the cloud wasn't mentioned.

I probably sound a bit negative, just feel these mid gen refreshes are stupid. They managed to get a 3 year old game running from 1080p 60fps to 4k 60fps on a GPUthat is 5 times more powerful than the OG one.

Is this thing supposed to reverse their fortunes? how much does a new console cost to research, produce and ship? We've seen the ps4 out selling the pro still. With the scorpio costing even more i'm sure the xbone will outsell the scorpio as well.
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There's a reason they went to DF and Leadbetter and it's not because of his technical "expertise".
 
Just saw that it's getting a 1TB HDD.
If it's a premium console, they should just scrap that and only sell versions with 2TB and up. 1TB is not enough nowadays.
 
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