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[digdug2k]

I mean.... do you not get it? If not let me be crystal clear

GOP = trotted out and voted for their man except for 1m who couldn't stomach it

DEM = trotted out and voted for their woman except for the 6m who couldn't stomach it

So tell me some more about how much in shambles the GOP party is in and how Dems are fine and just need to suck it up.

No votes are owed. They're earned. And 6m voters sent a loud and clear message that their votes weren't earned. And if the DNC ignores it? They won't magically be earned in the mid terms or 2020 either.

"Bu bu bu- you'll simply let a racist take over!!?!?" I don't vote to keep the other guy out. I vote because my vote goes to someone I truly want in. I'm not going to play a fucking game of lesser of two evils. Another lesson to be learned here. No one will, and that's why she lost.

This analogy is dumb. The GOP trotted out to vote against Hillary because they didn't like her. They trot out even if they don't like their candidate. They trot out because they care about their platform more than they care about the person (also they're old).

EDIT: You have to admint there's some irony of the same people who bitched about old people saying "I've got mine. Fuck you." not bothering to turn out to vote for lgbt/mexican/blacks/etc. because "she's just not good enough for me".

 

[Isaac Otherworld]

Ugh "Pragmatism". That's a word I never want to hear again.

Hillary Clinton is a progressive who gets things done!

 

[Lowmelody]

There are still minorities in white, rural areas. Abandoning them for the sake of political expediency is not an answer.

It's clear that trump would have lost if we turned out like we needed to, we do not need racist bigots, we need to excite decent people. We need a fucking extreme left movement that categorically rejects racism and bigotry wholesale and makes no exceptions.

The last thing we need is some watered down milquetoast middle of the road shit. Humanity isn't politics and that is what is at stake. We can win without legitimizing and obfuscating hate because it's easy to do so.

"social issues" needs to be up front, center and in everyone's face, especially the rural white areas. That's how you excite the good people there and we need to show them the courage to stand up TO not run FROM bigotry.

 

[Makonero]

Hillary Clinton is a progressive who gets things done!

She definitely did that. All hope is done for the next four years

 

[Makonero]

There are still minorities in white, rural areas. Abandoning them for the sake of political expediency is not an answer.

It's clear that trump would have lost if we turned out like we needed to, we do not need racist bigots, we need to excite decent people. We need a fucking extreme left movement that categorically rejects racism and bigotry wholesale and makes no exceptions.

The last thing we need is some watered down milquetoast middle of the road shit. Humanity isn't politics and that is what is at stake. We can win without legitimizing and obfuscating hate because it's easy to do so.

"social issues" needs to be up front, center and in everyone's face, especially the rural white areas. That's how you excite the good people there and we need to show them the courage to stand up TO not run FROM bigotry.

But you can't galvanize a white rural blue collar worker by insinuating or outright calling him or her a racist deplorable. You can still support minorities while addressing concerns of the majority.

 

[Father_Brain]

No this election has also proven that the average voter, when confronted with two choices he/she doesn't like, simply won't vote.

That's not contradictory, because if voters thought in strictly ideological terms, they'd all willingly choose the lesser of two evils.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

There are still minorities in white, rural areas. Abandoning them for the sake of political expediency is not an answer.

It's clear that trump would have lost if we turned out like we needed to, we do not need racist bigots, we need to excite decent people. We need a fucking extreme left movement that categorically rejects racism and bigotry wholesale and makes no exceptions.

The last thing we need is some watered down milquetoast middle of the road shit. Humanity isn't politics and that is what is at stake. We can win without legitimizing and obfuscating hate because it's easy to do so.

"social issues" needs to be up front, center and in everyone's face, especially the rural white areas. That's how you excite the good people there and we need to show them the courage to stand up TO not run FROM bigotry.

Enough to win an election and not piss off whites that feel you are preaching to them when their #1 concern will be providing for their family? Because if not, the social agenda means fuck all because you've lost another election.

 

[XGRaViSmOrSX]

But you can't galvanize a white rural blue collar worker by insinuating or outright calling him or her a racist deplorable. You can still support minorities while addressing concerns of the majority.

Wasn't there a candidate running that was doing exactly that? Oh wait, no, he was losing the minority vote in the deep red states no one was winning as a democrat anyway, right? Fuck it, might as well go with the queen instead, after all it's her turn.

 

[blahness]

40 years off his life!? How long does Zach expect to live?

 

[Lowmelody]

But you can't galvanize a white rural blue collar worker by insinuating or outright calling him or her a racist deplorable. You can still support minorities while addressing concerns of the majority.

Are they racist? yes? if so fuck them

However

You wont reach the decent folk in those areas if you turn your message off. There are people in those areas just as sick of this shit as we are and we can talk to them without needing to suppress awareness of social issues to placate deplorable bigots in the area. that only makes things materially worse for every minority with the misfortune of living in an area packed with bigotry.

Filter them out and be unwavering and unyielding to white supremacy and it's political machinations. We need to give the decent folk in those places something to be excited about and latch on to.

 

[thepotatoman]

This analogy is dumb. The GOP trotted out to vote against Hillary because they didn't like her. They trot out even if they don't like their candidate. They trot out because they care about their platform more than they care about the person (also they're old).

For better or worse, democrats just aren't like the GOP in that way, and no ammount of wishing or nagging will change that fact.

 

[GSG Flash]

Zach is the hero we need, although his vitriol would be better directed at DWS. Don't get me wrong, Donna is toxic, but nowhere near as toxic as DWS. Donna is just a puppet in all of this, DWS is the one pulling the strings and she's the one actively destroying the party.

 

[SURGEdude]

No this election has also proven that the average voter, when confronted with two choices he/she doesn't like, simply won't vote.

Pretty much. And that leaves whichever side has the more enthusiastic rabid supporters.

Trump was like meth for the right, while Clinton is human Ambien.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

For better or worse, democrats just aren't like the GOP in that way, and no ammount of wishing or nagging will change that fact.

I'd say for worse. Because we get so hung up on one person, if they don't check every single box, we get discouraged and unmotivated to vote. Which leads to apathy and low turnout. Which leads to none of those checkboxes even having a shot of being implemented.

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

On the one hand, the democratic party definitely needs motivation to pick themselves back up.

On the other hand, I'm not sure that the head of the DNC that pushed Clinton is someone that anyone should be listening to.

 

[Damerman]

And some of them boo'ed him. The DNC will learn nothing of this loss.

For fucking real bro. That kind of fraternal solidarity is the same kind of bullshit that the police do in the face of police injustice. This shit has me fuming.

 

[Fox Mulder]

Call another DNC meeting, lock the doors, and burn the building down.

The established out of touch corporatists and clinton people destroyed all progress made the last 8 years because it was Hillary's turn.

They'll just push Kaine or some other loser next time.

 

[Damerman]

Anyone running a progressive campaign from now on is going to have to be very intelligent about disguising it. Whining about climate change (no matter how legitimate) is not the way to go.

What the fuck am i reading

 

[Mahadev]

UN-goddamned-believable

What's un-goddamned-believable is the liberal strategy of supposedly "caring" about social issues and not doing shit about their true causes, hell, most of the time making matters worse by voting for corrupt politicians like Clinton. Want to kill, absolutely eviscerate racism? Let me tell you first what won't work. Annoying virtue signaling facebook posts whining about it won't do shit, accusing people who didn't vote your party of choice all kind of shit won't do shit, being obsessed with identity politics won't do shit, hell, even browbeating actual racists usually doesn't do shit.

You know what works? Creating a healthy, educated middle class that lives in a stable society that supports them every time they stumble. Stupidity and hate breeds in poverty and uncertainty something that neoliberalism has spread all over the planet including first world countries. Democrats support the breeders of these social issues and then complain about them to feel good about themselves.

I'm wondering. What do you think you achieve by calling a poor, marginalized voter from Michigan that has been screwed by the system all his life and who wanted to vote for Trump to fuck with it a racist? Are you doing it to change his mind or are you doing it for yourself? Hint, it's the latter.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

That's worked out wonderfully for the Republican party.

Yeah, it clearly has. They now control the Presidency, the Senate, the House of Representatives, and the majority of state governments (both executive and legislative levels). They're going to hold the Supreme Court for decades to come. And that's all on the back of the Tea Party movement.

What's more, the Tea Party has normalized the fringe. The majority of Tea Party beliefs are now part of the mainstream Republican message. Not just that, but the media and the world at large largely accepts them as Republican views (and people still vote Republican). The party is now advocating for things today that it would have been unthinkable to hear major leaders in the party pushing for a decade ago; the sort of stuff that was coming from a House of Representative member from a small rural district, not the Senate Majority leader.

So if you think that the Tea Party should be a lesson against pushes for ideological purity, maybe you should rethink that. It's given the GOP more power than they've had since 1928. A similar left wing movement might not be as overwhelmingly successful, but it would clearly work better than the Third Way has been going recently. Running scared of anything remotely left leaning hasn't helped the Democrats at all. Energizing the base in 2018 would drive turnout way up, and it would also start the path towards normalizing those views that people currently think of as fringe. The tea party has massively shifted the Overton window. But two can play at that game.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

What the fuck am i reading

Taylor your message to people that want to hear it. Knowing your audience is like communication 101.

 

[Ponn]

Hillary Clinton is a progressive who gets things done!

Republicans hate her so much she actually unified them enough to get out and vote for a candidate that was literally tearing their party apart at the seams. Thats something.

 

[thepotatoman]

I'd say for worse. Because we get so hung up on one person, if they don't check every single box, we get discouraged and unmotivated to vote. Which leads to apathy and low turnout. Which leads to none of those checkboxes even having a shot of being implemented.

I don't disagree, but I've found trying to talk to the apathectic democrat voter into voting for someone they don't care about to be a fools errand. The answer is to give them a party to turn out for, not nag them into voting, even if you're right to.

And with the DNC in flux, now is the time to fix that.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

What's un-goddamned-believable is the liberal strategy of supposedly "caring" about social issues and not doing shit about their true causes, hell, most of the time making matters worse by voting for corrupt politicians like Clinton. Want to kill, absolutely eviscerate racism? Let me tell you first what won't work. Annoying virtue signaling facebook posts whining about it won't do shit, accusing people who didn't vote your party of choice all kind of shit won't do shit, being obsessed with identity politics won't do shit, hell, even browbeating actual racists usually doesn't do shit.

You know what works? Creating a healthy, educated middle class that lives in a stable society that supports them every time they stumble. Stupidity and hate breeds in poverty, and uncertainty something that neoliberalism has spread all over the planet including first world countries. Democrats support the breeders of these social issues and then complain about them to feel good about themselves.

I'm wondering. What do you think you achieve by calling a poor, marginalized voter from Michigan that has been screwed by the system all his life and who wanted to vote for Trump to fuck with it a racist? Are you doing it to change his mind or are you doing it for yourself? Hint, it's the latter.

I feel like shit voting for Clinton knowing what I know.

You're 100% right.

 

[Jarmel]

Yeah, it clearly has. They now control the Presidency, the Senate, the House of Representatives, and the majority of state governments (both executive and legislative levels). They're going to hold the Supreme Court for decades to come. And that's all on the back of the Tea Party movement.

What's more, the Tea Party has normalized the fringe. The majority of Tea Party beliefs are now part of the mainstream Republican message. Not just that, but the media and the world at large largely accepts them as Republican views (and people still vote Republican). The party is now advocating for things today that it would have been unthinkable to hear major leaders in the party pushing for a decade ago; the sort of stuff that was coming from a House of Representative member from a small rural district, not the Senate Majority leader.

So if you think that the Tea Party should be a lesson against pushes for ideological purity, maybe you should rethink that. It's given the GOP more power than they've had since 1928. A similar left wing movement might not be as overwhelmingly successful, but it would clearly work better than the Third Way has been going recently. Running scared of anything remotely left leaning hasn't helped the Democrats at all. Energizing the base in 2018 would drive turnout way up, and it would also start the path towards normalizing those views that people currently think of as fringe. The tea party has massively shifted the Overton window. But two can play at that game.

Yep, time to go full in on the Tea Party playbook. No more pandering to the moderates.

 

[Seventy70]

What's un-goddamned-believable is the liberal strategy of supposedly "caring" about social issues and not doing shit about their true causes, hell, most of the time making matters worse by voting for corrupt politicians like Clinton. Want to kill, absolutely eviscerate racism? Let me tell you first what won't work. Annoying virtue signaling facebook posts whining about it won't do shit, accusing people who didn't vote your party of choice all kind of shit won't do shit, being obsessed with identity politics won't do shit, hell, even browbeating actual racists usually doesn't do shit.

You know what works? Creating a healthy, educated middle class that lives in a stable society that supports them every time they stumble. Stupidity and hate breeds in poverty and uncertainty something that neoliberalism has spread all over the planet including first world countries. Democrats support the breeders of these social issues and then complain about them to feel good about themselves.

I'm wondering. What do you think you achieve by calling a poor, marginalized voter from Michigan that has been screwed by the system all his life and who wanted to vote for Trump to fuck with it a racist? Are you doing it to change his mind or are you doing it for yourself? Hint, it's the latter.

This is the truth. We need to be less knee jerk and more objective. It's the only way we are going to win and live in a better country.

 

[Henchmen21]

What the fuck am i reading

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=224037414&postcount=11

Yeah.... Wow.

 

[norm9]

Clinton isn't to blame. Her "supporters" are to blame for not coming out and voting. If a small percentage had come out, we wouldn't having this conversation. Dude wouldn't be bitching. Apathy is a real problem because it's so easy.

 

[Makonero]

Yeah, it clearly has. They now control the Presidency, the Senate, the House of Representatives, and the majority of state governments (both executive and legislative levels). They're going to hold the Supreme Court for decades to come. And that's all on the back of the Tea Party movement.

What's more, the Tea Party has normalized the fringe. The majority of Tea Party beliefs are now part of the mainstream Republican message. Not just that, but the media and the world at large largely accepts them as Republican views (and people still vote Republican). The party is now advocating for things today that it would have been unthinkable to hear major leaders in the party pushing for a decade ago; the sort of stuff that was coming from a House of Representative member from a small rural district, not the Senate Majority leader.

So if you think that the Tea Party should be a lesson against pushes for ideological purity, maybe you should rethink that. It's given the GOP more power than they've had since 1928. A similar left wing movement might not be as overwhelmingly successful, but it would clearly work better than the Third Way has been going recently. Running scared of anything remotely left leaning hasn't helped the Democrats at all. Energizing the base in 2018 would drive turnout way up, and it would also start the path towards normalizing those views that people currently think of as fringe. The tea party has massively shifted the Overton window. But two can play at that game.

100 fucking percent agreed.

What should we call our movement, I wonder? Occupy DNC?

Maybe... Muckrakers. Like in the 1900s. Expose the corruption on the right and left. Push for candidates who evoke change and actual hope.

 

[Lowmelody]

What's un-goddamned-believable is the liberal strategy of supposedly "caring" about social issues and not doing shit about their true causes, hell, most of the time making matters worse by voting for corrupt politicians like Clinton. Want to kill, absolutely eviscerate racism? Let me tell you first what won't work. Annoying virtue signaling facebook posts whining about it won't do shit, accusing people who didn't vote your party of choice all kind of shit won't do shit, being obsessed with identity politics won't do shit, hell, even browbeating actual racists usually doesn't do shit.

You know what works? Creating a healthy, educated middle class that lives in a stable society that supports them every time they stumble. Stupidity and hate breeds in poverty and uncertainty something that neoliberalism has spread all over the planet including first world countries. Democrats support the breeders of these social issues and then complain about them to feel good about themselves.

I'm wondering. What do you think you achieve by calling a poor, marginalized voter from Michigan that has been screwed by the system all his life and who wanted to vote for Trump to fuck with it a racist? Are you doing it to change his mind or are you doing it for yourself? Hint, it's the latter.

Stop treating minorities like a liability and show some spine, stick up to racists for fuck sake. I don't care if it's pragmatic to dance to their beat, we need to do better than whatever awful expectations you have to want to sweep such matters under the rug to maybe win a limp election or two.

 

[Neo C.]

2010 and 2014 should already be a wake up for the dems, but they ignored again and again the fact how corrupt their party leaders are.

It hurts so much. Michelle and Barack went so far for Hillary, and Biden put raw passion for the case of the dems, and we got nothing now.

 

[Makonero]

Clinton isn't to blame. Her "supporters" are to blame for not coming out and voting. If a small percentage had come out, we wouldn't having this conversation. Dude wouldn't be bitching. Apathy is a real problem because it's so easy.

Maybe take a step back and realize why there was apathy in the first place.

Hint: it's because Hillary was so damned unlikable and had no clear message, and absolutely no energy. Oh, and she refused to talk to blue collar voters because she thought they could be taken for granted.

 

[Future Foundation]

What's un-goddamned-believable is the liberal strategy of supposedly "caring" about social issues and not doing shit about their true causes, hell, most of the time making matters worse by voting for corrupt politicians like Clinton. Want to kill, absolutely eviscerate racism? Let me tell you first what won't work. Annoying virtue signaling facebook posts whining about it won't do shit, accusing people who didn't vote your party of choice all kind of shit won't do shit, being obsessed with identity politics won't do shit, hell, even browbeating actual racists usually doesn't do shit.

You know what works? Creating a healthy, educated middle class that lives in a stable society that supports them every time they stumble. Stupidity and hate breeds in poverty and uncertainty something that neoliberalism has spread all over the planet including first world countries. Democrats support the breeders of these social issues and then complain about them to feel good about themselves.

I'm wondering. What do you think you achieve by calling a poor, marginalized voter from Michigan that has been screwed by the system all his life and who wanted to vote for Trump to fuck with it a racist? Are you doing it to change his mind or are you doing it for yourself? Hint, it's the latter.

This is the truth. We need to be less knee jerk and more objective. It's the only way we are going to win and live in a better country.

100 fucking percent agreed.

What should we call our movement, I wonder? Occupy DNC?

Maybe... Muckrakers. Like in the 1900s. Expose the corruption on the right and left. Push for candidates who evoke change and actual hope.

I'm gonna quote someone else in this thread: what the fuck am I reading?

 

[Makonero]

I'm gonna quote someone else in this thread: what the fuck am I reading?

People trying to figure out a solution to the fact that democrats just lost the easiest election of their lives?

 

[Seventy70]

I'm gonna quote someone else in this thread: what the fuck am I reading?

Make an argument? I am terrified of this Trump presidency. What happened to "pragmatism"? Why did they choose Hillary over Bernie when Bernie's message appealed to a wider demographic? We need to secure our well being first and foremost no matter what it takes. A Trump presidency puts the lives of minorities at stake. I'd rather have been actually pragmatic and move from there. At least I wouldn't be sitting here fearing for my future.

 

[cheezcake]

Maybe take a step back and realize why there was apathy in the first place.

Hint: it's because Hillary was so damned unlikable and had no clear message, and absolutely no energy. Oh, and she refused to talk to blue collar voters because she thought they could be taken for granted.

It's astounding how many people don't seem to be willing to acknowledge this simple fact.

 

[norm9]

Maybe take a step back and realize why there was apathy in the first place.

Hint: it's because Hillary was so damned unlikable and had no clear message, and absolutely no energy. Oh, and she refused to talk to blue collar voters because she thought they could be taken for granted.

I refuse to believe the bolded. We're now at a stage where we're trying to find who to blame and obvuously she's the first and easiest choice to blame. She offered her positions. They were good positions and SHOULD be enough to get you to vote for her. If you couldn't be bothered to come out and pull the lever on her because she was unlikeable, didn't show enough emotion, too robotic, a career politician, didn't liker pantsuit, etc. That shit's superficial and shortsighted. Not everyone is Obama. That dude is a once in a lifetime guy. If you didn't vote, you were just lazy and didn't care. I don't even blame people for voting for trump at this point. Yeah, it's her job to make you want to vote; but if the future direction of the country wasn't enough to make you vote, I don't know what to say to you.

 

[cheezcake]

Make an argument? I am terrified of this Trump presidency. What happened to "pragmatism"? Why did they choose Hillary over Bernie when Bernie's message appealed to a wider demographic? We need to secure our well being first and foremost no matter what it takes. A Trump presidency puts the lives of minorities at stake. I'd rather have been actually pragmatic and move from there.

Tunnel vision.

It's not malicious, it's just that the DNC leadership and Clinton are hilariously out of touch with the American people. They really did think she was the best candidate, they really did think the blue wall was impenetrable. It's the product of nepotism and excessive pandering to donors.

 

[SneakersSO]

Hey, DNC - if you think you're going to win elections going forward without seriously shaking things up, you got another thing coming. But thats okay, keep handing the GOP their W's. This was your election to lose, and you blew it spectacularly.

 

[LoserMakesGood]

Clinton isn't to blame. Her "supporters" are to blame for not coming out and voting. If a small percentage had come out, we wouldn't having this conversation. Dude wouldn't be bitching. Apathy is a real problem because it's so easy.

This is also true. I just started a new job on monday and I swear to fucking god I am the only person there that voted. The only other person that voted filled out the rest but didn't vote for president. The rest didn't vote because they "didn't care" and "it won't really affect me much anyway" (We're all white in case that wasn't obvious). Thank god it didn't come up until the very end of the day, I was so heated I was about to start breaking shit.

It just blows my mind

Hey guys we don't want to take away your guns but we want to regulate it a little ok?
-You'll have to pry it from my cold dead hands!

Hey guys we want to take away rights from women and minorities and destroy the LGBTQ community kay?
-....eh...

 

[Future Foundation]

People trying to figure out a solution to the fact that democrats just lost the easiest election of their lives?

Make an argument? I am terrified of this Trump presidency. What happened to "pragmatism"? Why did they choose Hillary over Bernie when Bernie's message appealed to a wider demographic? We need to secure our well being first and foremost no matter what it takes. A Trump presidency puts the lives of minorities at stake. I'd rather have been actually pragmatic and move from there.

Really? Because it's reading like so much of the limp-ass trash I've been reading online (ironically, also on Facebook). Forgive me for not quite wanting to coddle and kumbaya with people who just chucked my black ass underneath the bus to, as Mahadev wrote, to "fuck with the system".

Eh, maybe it's my damn tunnel vision, eh cheezcake?

 

[Makonero]

I refuse to believe the bolded. We're now at a stage where we're trying to find who to blame and obvuously she's the first and easiest choice to blame. She offered her positions. They were good positions and SHOULD be enough to get you to vote for her. If you couldn't be bothered to come out and pull the lever on her because she was unlikeable, didn't show enough emotion, too robotic, a career politician, didn't liker pantsuit, etc. That shit's superficial and shortsighted. Not everyone is Obama. That dude is a once in a lifetime guy. If you didn't vote, you were just lazy and didn't care. I don't even blame people for voting for trump at this point. Yeah, it's her job to make you want to vote; but if the future direction of the country wasn't enough to make you vote, I don't know what to say to you.

Sorry. Voters stayed home because they didn't like her. Maybe they didn't have good reasons or they were shortsighted or whatever but they didn't show up. Her JOB was to get them to show up. No one owed her a damn thing and that showed on election night.

 

[BravesCountry]

WTF is this. Progressives did line up. I know I did. I swallowed my fears about Hillary's viability and her clear arrogance and voted like a good little liberal.

This fucking nightmare isn't the fault of the progressives, it's the fault of the entire team of people who thought Hillary was going to win against an actually challenging opponent like Rubio or Jeb. They thought they had it in the bag against Trump and I began to believe that too because of the polls and the constant reassurances from Hillary supporters.

They were shortsighted, arrogant, and put their own interests above that of the people and that is why they lost.

I was a slight lean for Sanders but I know I certainly fell in line, and started buying into the hype from polls etc. and looked the other way at the blatant mishandlings by the DNC. All of my progressive friends fell in line as well. I was assured by media and polls that she had it in the bag and was the better choice. Looking back I am ashamed that I couldn't think for myself or couldn't see the writing on the wall.

I did my best to explain to others why Hillary was a good candidate and not merely the lesser evil but it was a gargantuan effort and it was always just easier to trash Trump than to explain why she might be good which even her own campaign fell into the trap of. Hillary can be a great candidate if you take the time to dig through all the crap but that should have been the most glaring red flag because nobody really wants to wade through all that context and nuance. She wasn't inspiring and had no real message beyond continuing what Obama has done. I remember telling friends that her pragmatism was better and that Bernie would have been naive. What good does her pragmatism and incremental change get us if she can't get elected? The message of incremental change has just led us to the worst possible scenario of massive change in the other direction. It couldn't have gone any worse.

I've had to do a lot of introspection and self-reflection the past couple of days and had to get this off my chest. I certainly feel some responsibility for this outcome and will have to come to terms with that.

 

[UraMallas]

Love his enthusiasm, hopefully the DNC brings him and people like him into the fold.

They better have your attitude at the top or they aren't going to make it in 2020.

 

[BotoxAgent]

I refuse to believe the bolded. We're now at a stage where we're trying to find who to blame and obvuously she's the first and easiest choice to blame. She offered her positions. They were good positions and SHOULD be enough to get you to vote for her. If you couldn't be bothered to come out and pull the lever on her because she was unlikeable, didn't show enough emotion, too robotic, a career politician, didn't liker pantsuit, etc. That shit's superficial and shortsighted. Not everyone is Obama. That dude is a once in a lifetime guy. If you didn't vote, you were just lazy and didn't care. I don't even blame people for voting for trump at this point. Yeah, it's her job to make you want to vote; but if the future direction of the country wasn't enough to make you vote, I don't know what to say to you.

I agree for the most part. This is ultimately on us and the rest of the voting public. Hillary ran a poor campaign but democracy can only succeed if we all smartened up, sucked it up and voted for our nations collective interest.

 

[Henchmen21]

Really? Because it's reading like so much of the limp-ass trash I've been reading online (ironically, also on Facebook). Forgive me for not quite wanting to coddle and kumbaya with people who just chucked my black ass underneath the bus to, as Mahadev wrote, to "fuck with the system".

Eh, maybe it's my damn tunnel vision, eh cheezcake?

The only one who "threw your ass under the bus" was HRC.

 

[UraMallas]

I was a slight lean for Sanders but I know I certainly fell in line, and started buying into the hype from polls etc. and looked the other way at the blatant mishandlings by the DNC. All of my progressive friends fell in line as well. I was assured by media and polls that she had it in the bag and was the better choice. Looking back I am ashamed that I couldn't think for myself or couldn't see the writing on the wall.

I did my best to explain to others why Hillary was a good candidate and not merely the lesser evil but it was a gargantuan effort and it was always just easier to trash Trump than to explain why she might be good which even her own campaign fell into the trap of. Hillary can be a great candidate if you take the time to dig through all the crap but that should have been the most glaring red flag because nobody really wants to wade through all that context and nuance. She wasn't inspiring and had no real message beyond continuing what Obama has done. I remember telling friends that her pragmatism was better and that Bernie would have been naive. What good does her pragmatism and incremental change get us if she can't get elected? The message of incremental change has just led us to the worst possible scenario of massive change in the other direction. It couldn't have gone any worse.

I've had to do a lot of introspection and self-reflection the past couple of days and had to get this off my chest. I certainly feel some responsibility for this outcome and will have to come to terms with that.

Besides the part about being a Bernie supporter at the beginning - are you me? Look in the mirror. Do you look like my avatar??

 

[Makonero]

I agree for the most part. This is ultimately on us and the rest of the voting public. Hillary ran a poor campaign but democracy can only succeed if we all smartened up, sucked it up and voted for our nations collective interest.

America won't do that. They just proved it.

So find another way.

 

[Lowmelody]

The only one who "threw your ass under the bus" was HRC.

And every single last Trump supporter.

 

[norm9]

Sorry. Voters stayed home because they didn't like her. Maybe they didn't have good reasons or they were shortsighted or whatever but they didn't show up. Her JOB was to get them to show up. No one owed her a damn thing and that showed on election night.

I agree that nobody owes Hillary anything. That was also the narrative of the no more of the Bush/Clinton dynasty people. However, NOT voting is inexcusable to me.