I disagree. I find them to be extremely well designed levels and fun as fuck.
You wanted two button controls for ascending and descending right?
You're outta your mind girl.
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Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze |OT| There's always money in the banana stand
- Thread starter Frolow
- Start date
I disagree. I find them to be extremely well designed levels and fun as fuck.
You wanted two button controls for ascending and descending right?
You're outta your mind girl.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
You might be having trouble with them, but functionally their design is fine. They require little to no trial-and-error play, and every hurdle/obstacle can be safely conquered on your first run. The stages are largely automated but balanced for predictive play. Getting a hang of the rocket's momentum is the main challenge.
I actually think they're easier than Returns rocket barrel stages, and have far fewer potential failstates from being in the wrong area at the wrong time. Returns' giant bat escape is a good example of rougher design, but it seems all pretty straight forward with Tropical Freeze.
EDIT: Really it all boils down to how balanced the predictive play in design is. I'd fucking hate both the minecart and rocket barrel stages if they emphasised trail-and-error play due to unfairly difficult predictable (or even unpredictable design) hurdle design. Like the game throwing split second decisions and poorly communicating the right time to jump/boost. I feel none of this is present. The design is smart enough that while driven by reflexes and predictive play, you've still given more than enough information to fully understand and respond to a challenge on your first time through.
I actually think they're easier than Returns rocket barrel stages, and have far fewer potential failstates from being in the wrong area at the wrong time. Returns' giant bat escape is a good example of rougher design, but it seems all pretty straight forward with Tropical Freeze.
EDIT: Really it all boils down to how balanced the predictive play in design is. I'd fucking hate both the minecart and rocket barrel stages if they emphasised trail-and-error play due to unfairly difficult predictable (or even unpredictable design) hurdle design. Like the game throwing split second decisions and poorly communicating the right time to jump/boost. I feel none of this is present. The design is smart enough that while driven by reflexes and predictive play, you've still given more than enough information to fully understand and respond to a challenge on your first time through.
D
Deleted member 125677
Unconfirmed Member
^^^Agree with the chicken eater. They even give you banana trails to follow.
Have you played Flappy Bird? I know you said you wanted two buttons to control the barrel.
Here is an example of how that would have felt
http://terrycavanaghgames.com/maverickbird/
Have you played Flappy Bird? I know you said you wanted two buttons to control the barrel.
Here is an example of how that would have felt
http://terrycavanaghgames.com/maverickbird/
mad love for Terry
Just finished it myself. Great game but that last boss took me a while to beat. It wasn't really the games fault because the patterns were fairly easy to recognize. mostly just that I suck. Great game though and hopefully Retro will release one more game to make it a trilogy. I feel like one more would be fine but after that it would be pushing it.
The Librarian
Banned
I disagree. I find the controls often too imprecise for the level design. I feel like I have to fight the game to control the rocket barrel, and I don't like that.
At least in Returns you had Super Kong that let you bypass these. I don't have that option here. I've died 50 or so times trying to beat World 6 rocket barrel. Just horrible, horrible game design. :/
BigEvilTurtle
Banned
It boils down to you not being able to grasp the controls, which is on you since a lot of people are disagreeing with you. I find the controls fun and intuitive.
D
Deleted member 125677
Unconfirmed Member
If I lived in your neighborhood, I could be your Super Kong
Oh jesus christ
The Librarian
Banned
I grasp the controls just fine. I find them frustrating. Intuitive, sure, but frustrating all the same.
BigEvilTurtle
Banned
So they're intuitive and you "grasp the controls just fine," yet they're bad design?
Uh huh.
Then how do you explain all the speed/perfect runs of stages in YT and people in general not having problems with the controls? Instead of fruitlessly blaming the game, you should study what you are doing and try something different. The controls are simple, but they have depth, which you should explore if you want to get better
I hate the rocket barrel levels too. They are terrible and filled with crazy attack areas where you just have to die over and over until you learn the unpredictable patterns of the obstacles. I disagree with the notion that the levels are predictable and beatable on a first try without getting extremely lucky. Also you can't always just follow the bananas.
The Librarian
Banned
50 lives gone and wasted ;(
TheSpaceBetween
Member
People like to blame a game when they are struggling instead of criticizing their own abilities. I was actually hoping the game would be a lot harder than it was, especially after DKCR. If one can't make it through a rocket barrel level with several crash guards, then I am sorry then one is just bad at them.
You could have quit out of the whole game before you died the last time and while you were still within the level. Then you can re load the whole game and get all your lives back.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
So that's what the game over screen looks like.
In almost all scenarios you can follow the bananas, and I firmly disagree that the levels are built unpredictably.
In almost all scenarios you can follow the bananas, and I firmly disagree that the levels are built unpredictably.
superpickleman
Member
At least now I know what the game over screen looks like. I like it.
The Librarian
Banned
Er, just because something's intuitive doesn't preclude it from being bad design. I think the controls are intuitive in that they're easy to understand, but that doesn't mean I find the execution up to par.
That's people being really good at the game and memorizing everything. I wholly recognize that I'm below average at this game, but that doesn't mean I can't criticize the controls. For my liking, they're not precise enough. Not that these scenarios are entirely comparable, but while I may not be bad at an FPS with weapon sway, I won't like that particular design because I feel like I have to fight the game to do what it wants me to do.
Thanks! I'll keep that in mind.
I hate you.
I won't be able to tell until I actually get my hands on this game, but I was able to beat some of the DKCR rocket barrel levels on the first try or two... are these are markedly harder or more unpredictable? It doesn't sound like it.
Certainly I did misunderstand the controls at first, so until I realized that I thought the rocket levels were stupidly hard.
Edit: At first I thought you had to tap the button rapidly to stay aloft. Why, I have no idea now.
Certainly I did misunderstand the controls at first, so until I realized that I thought the rocket levels were stupidly hard.
Edit: At first I thought you had to tap the button rapidly to stay aloft. Why, I have no idea now.
Baron von Loathsome
Member
Bog
Junior Ace
Nah it's the game's fault. Just when you learn the patterns, he throws a new, surprise attack at you that can auto-kill you. Then you have to trudge back and learn that one.
Nocturnowl
Member
Well in case anyone does need pointers for 6-4, I'll spoiler tag them here.
Thinking back World 5's rocket barrel was one of the strongest ones across both DK games for allowing you to see the more of the upcoming hazards, deku tree would like to say I'm a lucky man for getting through that and others on my first try but much like mine cart stages it's about being quickly reactive to what you see and spotting the signs in advance, it also helps in a few cases to consider that a number of obstacles will often hit in what you could call high, medium or low positions (especially in World 5's stage).
Blurry Flurry has perhaps some of the trickier hazards to immediately gauge in a rocket barrel stage, most notably the final section of snowballs where they all get launched up at the same time but at different heights.
Still there's paths plotted through these obstacles, it's not just lines of bananas that can set safe paths but also banana coins and bunches .
With the cannons that fire upwards midway through you can just stick to the bottom of the screen and play it safe, it was the bit immediately after where you descend through the compact shaft that got me the most on hard mode where you really need to grasp the rocket barrels momentum, that being the longer an uninterrupted descent the more acceleration you'll need to bring yourself back level.
The snowball section after this is actually really simple with two safe zones for each of the two segments highlighted by items, the latter of which includes a one up balloon.
And in case anyone needs pointers for the early section where it's mostly icicles and collapsing rocks you can tell which areas will break off as they're visually more detached from the actual scenery, the snow pursuing behind you is nothing more than a visual effect since of course you're always moving at the same speed therefore it can't catch up anyway.
Still there's paths plotted through these obstacles, it's not just lines of bananas that can set safe paths but also banana coins and bunches .
With the cannons that fire upwards midway through you can just stick to the bottom of the screen and play it safe, it was the bit immediately after where you descend through the compact shaft that got me the most on hard mode where you really need to grasp the rocket barrels momentum, that being the longer an uninterrupted descent the more acceleration you'll need to bring yourself back level.
The snowball section after this is actually really simple with two safe zones for each of the two segments highlighted by items, the latter of which includes a one up balloon.
And in case anyone needs pointers for the early section where it's mostly icicles and collapsing rocks you can tell which areas will break off as they're visually more detached from the actual scenery, the snow pursuing behind you is nothing more than a visual effect since of course you're always moving at the same speed therefore it can't catch up anyway.
Thinking back World 5's rocket barrel was one of the strongest ones across both DK games for allowing you to see the more of the upcoming hazards, deku tree would like to say I'm a lucky man for getting through that and others on my first try but much like mine cart stages it's about being quickly reactive to what you see and spotting the signs in advance, it also helps in a few cases to consider that a number of obstacles will often hit in what you could call high, medium or low positions (especially in World 5's stage).
StevePharma
Member
Man I can already tell
Seashore War
is going to be one of my favorite tracks this year. And Hotline Miami 2 isn't even out yet.
Wise destroyed it with this OST. Would be a proper shame if a full disc release would never come, but it's Nintendo and they probably don't care.
Seashore War
is going to be one of my favorite tracks this year. And Hotline Miami 2 isn't even out yet.
Wise destroyed it with this OST. Would be a proper shame if a full disc release would never come, but it's Nintendo and they probably don't care.
The Librarian
Banned
What's really killing me in 6-4 is the part where
.
it's almost a vertical takeoff in this type of orange tunnel
BigEvilTurtle
Banned
Is that Blurry Flurry? Yeah, see that's where I'm confused. I had literally no trouble with that one at all. I maybe crashed and died 3 times, max. There's definitely a skill difference, at least specifically in terms of the rocket barrel levels.
shiftplusone
Member
let me preface this by saying that Im not here to shit on this game or the thread or driveby troll
Okay then
I absolutely fucking HATE donkey kong country(ever since the snes one). the aesthetics, the character designs/models/personalities, the environments, the animals, the bananas and collectibles and everything but the music.
that said, I played DKCR enough that once I got past all the awfulness of those things and the stupid wiimote crap I ended up enjoying it (except I thought the boss fights were bad)
Is this one a refinement of DKCR that i'll find something there?
I don't even know if that's the question I'm wanting to ask.
help me gaf
Okay then
I absolutely fucking HATE donkey kong country(ever since the snes one). the aesthetics, the character designs/models/personalities, the environments, the animals, the bananas and collectibles and everything but the music.
that said, I played DKCR enough that once I got past all the awfulness of those things and the stupid wiimote crap I ended up enjoying it (except I thought the boss fights were bad)
Is this one a refinement of DKCR that i'll find something there?
I don't even know if that's the question I'm wanting to ask.
help me gaf
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Practically every track in world six is a massive change change to more consistently melodic, melancholic tunes.
It's a refinement/extension of Returns, yes. But it's still obviously Donkey Kong Country and that does not change.
...still, if other people are not taking 50 tries to pass it (not even close to that, actually)... it's hard to say it's the game design, no?
Nope, same here.
I've yet to play a rocket barrel level that took me more than 3 tries, and it was always my fault. The correct path is always telegraphed if you are paying attention.
Yeah that's why I can't tell if Dax is trolling. She's smarter than the average bear and this sort of response from her regarding a levels challenge and layout is very surprising. It's a copout excuse to me and she is much better than that.
dampflokfreund
Banned
Yeah, it fits really great to the overall theme of the world. I mean how would you feel if somebody would destroy and completely change your own home you lifed in for years?
dark_prinny
Banned
I agree very strongly. They're some of my favorite levels in these games.
BTW, my wife beat the final boss just a few minutes ago! Woo hoo!
You better beat that boss yourself Max. Don't pussy out on me.
The Librarian
Banned
That's fair, some people may not have any problem with Retro's execution, but that doesn't mean I can't call the game design bad if they're doing something I don't like. I was out of line calling it some of the worst game design I've ever seen, but after dying, at that point, 35+ times and dealing with controls I don't like, it's not hard to not see where that post is coming from.
I absolutely loved World 5, and was wondering if World 6 would top it.
All I have to say is WOW. Just three levels in, and I'm absolutely floored. The music for Homecoming Hijinx, Seashore War and Aquaduct Assault are simply magnificent. It's like the whole entire theme of the game changed in an instant. To me, it feels like you're on a grand journey to take back your island from those who took it, and the music reflects that greatly.
David Wise, you magnificent son of a bitch.
All I have to say is WOW. Just three levels in, and I'm absolutely floored. The music for Homecoming Hijinx, Seashore War and Aquaduct Assault are simply magnificent. It's like the whole entire theme of the game changed in an instant. To me, it feels like you're on a grand journey to take back your island from those who took it, and the music reflects that greatly.
David Wise, you magnificent son of a bitch.
The Librarian
Banned
Was it Squawks?! That damn parrot.
BigEvilTurtle
Banned
I can see where you're coming from, especially in such a frustrated state. I've often called Super Mario Bros. control design shit because it's slippery and caused me to die a lot (on my own account) even though that simply isn't true.
The Main Event
Member
Just completed Amiss Abyss and Irate Eight.
<---------my face while playing.
<---------my face while playing.
I like the fact you admitted you were out of line.
Don't see that every day. On a forum, on Facebook, in REAL FUCKING LIFE. Whatever.
Thread delivers .
