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DOTA 2 BETA 2 |OT10| Reborn

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The pitch they made about how they want to change up mobas way back when was interesting

I don't think the game they made was that great, but I sort of appreciate the effort. I think they focused way too much on fixing the stuff that people complain about in mobas instead of focusing on making a game that's actually fun

Hearthstone took Magic and made it super stupid, which is why it's great. HOTS should've been that for mobas, but it's just watered down
People who hate MOBA's seem to like it, but I don't know if they'll just abandon it at some point. I don't see a lot of depth in this game, it's like brainless Dota or something.

I'll just wait for custom games to give me a fun relaxing alternative to Dota.
 
I really wanted to like HotS but the map-specific objectives are really annoying to me. But the game has so little else going on that if those didn't exist the whole thing would be pointless. So I dunno.
 
I really wanted to like HotS but the map-specific objectives are really annoying to me. But the game has so little else going on that if those didn't exist the whole thing would be pointless. So I dunno.
The problem with the map objectives is there's no ignoring them (except for early tributes). You have to go to them or you lose every time. Pushing when they're up is basically pointless/very difficult. And there's no veto option so you can't pass on a map you don't like.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
If the part of Lord Managers you enjoy the most is the team fighting, then HOTS will appeal to you. If team fighting is low on the list of things you enjoy, then HOTS will not appeal to you because it was designed to maximize team fighting.

Basically it's a Lord Manager for people who hate Lord Managers.
 

JC Sera

Member
I have caved and started downloading heroes of the storm

I feel like trash

also I just realised I'm gonna be doing a fnatic summary, not a team MY one
ashot_jugg.gif
 

iamblades

Member
Yeah, it's very similar to the League model. Awhile back they tried to introduce a new p2w feature called "runes" and pass it off as a new exciting gameplay addition! Basically you forked over cash for a bunch of extra hero passives, stats, and the like (LoL rune pages), but the community called them out on that garbage and they scrapped it.

I was hoping HOTS would be good and my blow off steam MOBA, but they took the whole casual/team/anti-snowballing thing way too far (at least when I played it about a year ago). The game tried so hard to eradicate every ounce of individual skill and move it into the AI, RNG, and your other players. Just couldn't take it seriously when I did the exact same damage, exact same everything as the 2-30 Illidan on the other team when I was 30-2.

Maybe that changed over the course of a year, but I somehow doubt it? It's pretty much the staple Blizzard formula for game development at this point.


Haven't played HoTS, but everything I saw of it has always look boring as shit and super slow paced, and by the time i got into the beta the shit monetization scheme was revealed and pretty much killed that game for me.

As for the bolded, I agree, at least considering how they have been promoting the game as an e-sport.

If you want to make a super simple, casual MMO, sure, there is certainly a market for that. But to claim that you are doing both that AND making a super competitive high level game, you are full of shit.


Also I find it moderately amusing that devs always try to minimize snowballs by making it harder to gain an advantage. It's like they don't understand that if you make it hard to gain an advantage, you are just making it even harder to turn around a disadvantage, so that the smallest advantage becomes insurmountable. I haven't seen data on snowball advantage in HoTS, but in league it is clear that for all their talk about being anti-snowball, they made a game even more snowbally than Dota(not surprising from a company that shit talks about 'burden of knowledge' and then makes it impossible to read what the other champs skills do in the game I guess).
 
I don't get the "moba for people who hate mobas" thing. The shit that people don't like about dota is what makes it good. Take it away and you just have brainless, low impact spell teams fights from minute one.
dac15_embarrass.gif
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
There are plenty of people who don't play DOTA because it's DOTA. That's the audience Blizzard is after!
 

shira

Member
Yea but why do people even want to play mobas at all? It seems like their time would be better spent playing or doing something else.

I see a lot of this for podcasters. Like games industry people. People with influence in the gaming world - like Garnett Lee. They want to stay hip and in-the-know. And this is just too hard for a 40 year old to deal with. You need mechanics, enclyopedic knowledge of 500 different rules, and no pausing.
 

W1SSY

Member
I just hope The International ends up on ESPN at some point so we can get yet another esports are not sports thread in the gaming side.
 

JC Sera

Member
looking at all these HotS characters the only one that interests me is Johanna

also I've never played a game with hero rotation before
its fucking weird, makes me feel like dota spoils me for choice
 
I see a lot of this for podcasters. Like games industry people. People with influence in the gaming world - like Garnett Lee. They want to stay hip and in-the-know. And this is just too hard for a 40 year old to deal with. You need mechanics, enclyopedic knowledge of 500 different rules, and no pausing.

Old people are the worst.
 

Hylian7

Member
I said something to this effect a while back, and might make a thread about it sometime, but here is a miniature version of this rant.

What are LoL and other games in the genre so scared of in general? Almost every facet of them seems like they are scared to actually go further. I mentioned the example of stuff like the 200-300 second CD on teleport, which is longer than most Dota ultimates, but a lot of CDs in LoL are like this too. Then there is the fact that everything gets nerfed rather than counters to it buffed or it a different aspect of it being needed. A Dota example of this is 6.83 to 6.84 Sniper. Shrapnel was broken and without question needed a nerf. However when nerfing it, the main idea of the skill needed to be retained. That would be area denial, damage, and a slow. With the 6.84 change, it still does these things. However he has to either predict enemy movement, or just pick areas to deny access to. This makes it not a hunting tool and it sticks to it's purpose.

LoL isn't the only game that does this either. Hell, I would say Heroes of the Storm is even more guilty of it than LoL is. Two significant examples from HotS are that brewmaster hero and the Lost Vikings. With the brewmaster, one of his heroic abilities (every hero has two, you choose one per mastich) is a split similar to the WC3 brew. However there is a HUGE difference: You can't control the pandas individually! They are stuck in the triangle formation with an ability that spreads them out, then they slowly go back in. I don't understand why they are afraid of having some micro on these things. I mean part of the audience for this game is the StarCraft audience. There are people that can handle this, and if they can't, learning some micro won't kill them.

Then there is Lost Vikings. This was a cool idea for a hero at first, but then you look deeper and see it is just three guys, that you can actually micro this time, however they all have passive abilities. So all it is is just to micro then and make them attack things. Why can't they each have at least one active ability? It seems like a good idea ruined by the fact that they are afraid of making it "too complicated".

Another one too is Abathur, and this one is even more unique. The closest Dota things I could compare it to are Nature's Prophet and Tinker, but after experimenting with it, I don't think it goes far enough. Why does the Locust have to be automatically controlled? Couldn't they at least give the option to control it, and if there is no input it just automatically goes down a lane? But nope, the only way to control it is with Symbiote, which leaves Abathur sitting there while you do that. The clone idea is also a cool one, and actually is probably the source of inspiration for Morphling Aghs, but again this doesn't really go far enough with the idea, as you lose control of Abathur while doing this. Again, cool idea, just not taken far enough.
 
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