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DOTA 2 BETA 2 |OT10| Reborn
- Thread starter SteveWinwood
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shira
Member
Zai totally cheated, he had his soundproof headphones over his hoodie.
Ruins the soundproof seal
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
I think Godz and the camera guy caught on by game 5 and intentionally didn't mention or show IG doing rosh while Secret was fighting. There has to have been at least one play in the previous games that led them to believe the players were reacting to the crowd.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
Then let's just point out that he's factually wrong in that the game was over twice as long as he complained it was.
Anuxinamoon
Shaper Divine
I'f you're active around the map, a high shallow grave is best.
Dazzle is one of those heroes where your skill build can vary a lot depending on the game you find yourself into.
Sometimes you can just go with low level grave for a while, sometimes the range and cooldown reduction are very important earlier.
Dreams-Visions
Member
really depends on how the lane is developing and what the enemy is capable of. if they're not a threat to kill your carry, you're usually better going 4-1-1 so that you can get that stun online and go on the aggressive. If you're vs a solo offlaner like a Tide or something like that, that's your best approach (imo). If you need to be active around the map tp'ing in to save lives, something like 1-3-2 will allow you to do that more effectively. 1-1-4 if your carry/lane is under heavy pressure by like...idunno. like Undying or Kunkka or if you're supporting a melee carry vs double range or double stun and expect your carry to be chronically low. I don't know if most get the ult at 6. I get it at 7 or 8. or whenever we expect that we want to start pushing towers or defending towers.
Sgt.Pepper
Banned
I REALLY depends on the match honestly. If you are on the aggressive side, maxing poison and heal over grave seems far the better option.
If your match is too much on the defensive side, your team has enough disables or you just want to keep your team alive, you can go for 0-4-4-1 then stats. Kinda like how puppey went the last match against iG.
secrets stans are so aids, the lady gaga stans of dota 2
cape for a real team ho! #BLEEDBLUE
SteveWinwood
Member
There's a pause in the game I'm in right now so I thought I'd make a bit of an analytical post of this patch so far.
I'm currently playing Lion and one thing I've noticed when I've played Lion and other supports, is that this patch really does make support easier and more rewarding.
Probably the #1 reason I always avoided support is because if your team is behind, your life is like ten times harder than everyone else's on your team. Probably one of the biggest things that makes this easier is letting you buy wards one at a time. That shit is really a HUGE deal to supports, as with limited gold, going "Ugh, I gotta not have a TP for a bit so I can buy the wards" or vice versa really sucked, and now generally you can afford both TP and one ward, and pick up the other ward later. Generally you aren't going to be dropping two wards so quickly anyway, so you don't really need to buy both at once if you can't afford it.
The fact that assists will give you more gold in general over the last few patches is quite nice too, as you might actually be able to have something more than boots and a stick for most of the game.
Another thing I think is a pretty big deal, and this doesn't just affect supports, it affects everyone, but I think supports are impacted the most by this, is now buyback isn't so damn punished anymore, encouraging early-ish buybacks if you think it's necessary. In this game, we had a fight at T2 where I was the first one to die, however my team was still alive. I bought back, came in, and we got four people!
I'm definitely adjusting to support better now, I'm not sure if it's all due to the fact that support got easier over the patches, or that I'm just improving. Make no mistake, I do still like mid the best, but I think support is more bearable to me now and not something I'll run from like the plague anymore.
I'm currently playing Lion and one thing I've noticed when I've played Lion and other supports, is that this patch really does make support easier and more rewarding.
Probably the #1 reason I always avoided support is because if your team is behind, your life is like ten times harder than everyone else's on your team. Probably one of the biggest things that makes this easier is letting you buy wards one at a time. That shit is really a HUGE deal to supports, as with limited gold, going "Ugh, I gotta not have a TP for a bit so I can buy the wards" or vice versa really sucked, and now generally you can afford both TP and one ward, and pick up the other ward later. Generally you aren't going to be dropping two wards so quickly anyway, so you don't really need to buy both at once if you can't afford it.
The fact that assists will give you more gold in general over the last few patches is quite nice too, as you might actually be able to have something more than boots and a stick for most of the game.
Another thing I think is a pretty big deal, and this doesn't just affect supports, it affects everyone, but I think supports are impacted the most by this, is now buyback isn't so damn punished anymore, encouraging early-ish buybacks if you think it's necessary. In this game, we had a fight at T2 where I was the first one to die, however my team was still alive. I bought back, came in, and we got four people!
I'm definitely adjusting to support better now, I'm not sure if it's all due to the fact that support got easier over the patches, or that I'm just improving. Make no mistake, I do still like mid the best, but I think support is more bearable to me now and not something I'll run from like the plague anymore.
Yeeeeees join us
I consistently kept up wards, does that not count for anything or do I have to go 30/0/30 to count as "doing much"
Hot damn I suck at microing more than one unit. I never played RTS', and I've actively avoided playing heroes that rely on more than one unit since Dota 1. I've been randoming as of late... and I just randomed Chen, and then repicked into Meepo. I sucked horse shit in the beginning, but sort of got the hang of it towards the end of the game. Fortunately I had someone straight up carry the game while I stumbled my way through the character. I should do better the next time around...
placed less wards then radiant team even when your team was ahead in gold the entire team
did nothing to try to box out or interrupt the spiritbreaker from farming top
lowest hero damage
almost nil offensive movement
While I'm proud of you for winning a game, thinking that that victory has suddenly enlightened you towards the intricacies of support play or has made you a more developed player isn't really the case, and posting something like that is unwarranted at best.
did nothing to try to box out or interrupt the spiritbreaker from farming top
lowest hero damage
almost nil offensive movement
While I'm proud of you for winning a game, thinking that that victory has suddenly enlightened you towards the intricacies of support play or has made you a more developed player isn't really the case, and posting something like that is unwarranted at best.
Manus
Member
Eul's or Force Staff would probably been way better in that game than an Scepter.
Did you not see me kill him and Lesh with Slark? Did you not see me harassing him with right clicks?
I was playing 5 support, I mean wouldn't that be expected?
The smokes?
Constructive criticism is one thing, but you're just being an ass at this point. Sure, I didn't do everything perfectly, but to say I did "nothing" is an outright lie. I'm not goddamn puppey.
It's really sickening the way you sit here and just bully just because you can get away with it.
Sigismundo
Member
Speaking of support heroes how do I Visage properly? Should I just wait to get a Drow on my team to give me a safety net?
Yeah, I thought about Ghost Scepter too, but realized I wasn't getting focused by SB that much by the time I would get it and was like "nah, fuck it". Probably Euls was what I needed though,.
a legion commander tea
Constructive criticism is one thing, but you're just being an ass at this point. Sure, I didn't do everything perfectly, but to say I did "nothing" is an outright lie. I'm not goddamn puppey.
Woah, woah. Let's focus on the important part of his post:
Level 1, you push Q on the enemy and beat them up if you can get into a good position to not tank creeps. And when ever you have good Cell Phone Reception, push W on an enemy, especially once its maxed (Really, if you got a full charge Soul Assumption, just use it).
If you want level advice, value point in Grave Chill level 1, max Soul Assumption, and then decide if you need suitability or more aggression for maxing Grave Chill or Cloak next.
For the birds, don't get to caught up landing the stun, its hard and they are still good even if you can't. They put out a lot of damage fast but lose all their strength quickly, so once they have used all their +damage attacks, ether use their stone form, or micro them into the tree line.
Really, Visage does a ton of damage even if you aren't that great with him, you just gotta be aware of how his spells work.
Microing bird stuns is the same as microing Meepo poofs. Click where you want them to go, and then Q -> tab -> Q, although you'll want to space it out a bit for maximum stun time, or reposition a bird if they blinked away or something. Put both birds on one bind, don't bother with individual binds until you're gosupro.
1-3-1-1, Max W, max Q for offense, max E for defense.
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
How do I get paired with a Spanish-speaking 4 stack when my only selected language is English? IDK man.
last i checked 12<13
Listen dude, cuz i'll say it now.
I have nothing against you personally, nor as a player, but a poster its kind of atrocious. And the only reason I have nothing against you as a player is that I will never have the misfortune of having you autoselect mid on my team and end up losing the game.
Dota's a hard game, no one can deny that. Receiving only positive reinforcement and way to go dude you did it's and expecting to improve is stupid, and spinning any form of disagreement or criticism into 'cyber bullying' is childish behavior. I'm only taking the time of day to post because watching you struggle to break 3.5k has been nothing short of pitiable now. So when I see you doing things that are detrimental to your improvement as a player, I try to post things that would be helpful to any player trying to improve.
And no I'm not going into a full on analysis each time I critique you, because as that one Shadow Fiend Eul's argument showed, there's really no need.
Listen dude, cuz i'll say it now.
I have nothing against you personally, nor as a player, but a poster its kind of atrocious. And the only reason I have nothing against you as a player is that I will never have the misfortune of having you autoselect mid on my team and end up losing the game.
Dota's a hard game, no one can deny that. Receiving only positive reinforcement and way to go dude you did it's and expecting to improve is stupid, and spinning any form of disagreement or criticism into 'cyber bullying' is childish behavior. I'm only taking the time of day to post because watching you struggle to break 3.5k has been nothing short of pitiable now. So when I see you doing things that are detrimental to your improvement as a player, I try to post things that would be helpful to any player trying to improve.
And no I'm not going into a full on analysis each time I critique you, because as that one Shadow Fiend Eul's argument showed, there's really no need.
I like how Undying still has the 4th highest winrate even though his ult is bugged badly right now. It doesn't scale at all, it is ether max damage amp closer then 200 units, or 1% damage amp from 200 to 750.
Also, right now Razor's ult is super ineffective vs Undying, since it will just target zombies but can't kill them (since they have 2hp). It also will target Visage Familiars with super high priority (Don't know if it still kills them).
Oh, also, TIL Razor's ult targets units that have the lowest raw HP, not lowest percent HP. Makes since, but I always thought it targeted units with the most percent of HP missing.
Also, right now Razor's ult is super ineffective vs Undying, since it will just target zombies but can't kill them (since they have 2hp). It also will target Visage Familiars with super high priority (Don't know if it still kills them).
Oh, also, TIL Razor's ult targets units that have the lowest raw HP, not lowest percent HP. Makes since, but I always thought it targeted units with the most percent of HP missing.
NormalFish
Banned
While I don't really have issue with this post on the whole, the idea that all your posts in response to Hylian are always some sort of dota-specific criticism or disagreement is laughable. Your posts are even more disruptive to the flow of this thread lately than his.
I bought the wards off cooldown and the Viper on our team bought the thirteenth one, and given how long the game went on, that was mathmatecally all the wards buyable.
A lot of times you do post helpful stuff, and I have responded to it positively on numerous occaisons, then you just post stuff like "You were useless and did nothing", "Just do that holy shit ur bad", and the like. These things aren't helpful, and they're just you being an ass.
I have a hard time believing you have nothing against me because you lead the goddamn charge on making sure you just shit on every single thing I say, whether it's bad for the thread or not. I am amazed with the shit you get away with only because you're one of the best players in the thread.
You know why people don't like to take advice of "Holy shit you're useless do this instead", probably because you sound like a complete dick when you do that. Nobody's expecting "Hey dude you did awesome" all the time, but maybe just actually be fucking reasonable, more like "Try to be more aggressive zoning the offlaner, in some lanes you can not worry about stacking/pulling as much and zone the offlaner more instead." instead of "You were useless"
Sigismundo
Member
Thanks for the help.
Comparing birds to Meepo poofs seems like a good way to put it (I'm not terrible at Meepo micro and I can generally do better with him than I can with, say, Lone Druid)
kotlguy actually. all in good fun, he's a good host!
Monochromaticx
Member
Any youtube vods for game 5 of TS vs IG?
thats not even true and you know it.
And honestly I'm like the only person of this "overzealous mumblegaf group who's out to get you no matter what you do" that doesn't have you on ignore at this point. For almost as long as dota 2 has been out, players better than you (and there's a lot more than you think) have been trying to give you advice when you come to the thread, and you have actually absorbed very little of it. And while shitposting comes hand in hand with any community thread, and no one should actually give a shit about what gets posted here anyways, its the fact that this dance has been going on for over 4 years that annoys the thread residents.
Listen, Dota is hard. I've been playing this game since 2008 and I still have a lot to learn about this over-complicated, rage-inducing shit game. But to discredit my critique due to execution is suicidal for someone trying to improve from a 3.5k trench. If you actually want we can sit down and I will actually break apart every little mistake you make until you finally realize how many you make, but I doubt you'll take me up on this for your own pride's sake. Because frankly, that's how I learned dota. I kept asking better players, I kept playing with better players, and I took all the shit that will naturally come from doing so, because you don't improve from playing with the same skill bracket over and over.
I was hoping after that back-to-back beating I gave you mid you'd understand what I mean when I say things that are a little more on the harsh side, but that's not the case.
Now then, as for the game you posted:
1) Lowest kill involvement in the game
2) Second lowest denies in the game, which was due to the fact that you weren't confident in your positioning nor your ability to click the spiritbreaker, and spent a majority of the lane behind your slark.
3) Incredibly low farm for a support. One of the hardest aspects of support is creating farm space for yourself during lulls in the action, and even in a very one sided game you had very little last hits.
4) Many times you would have double impales lined up, or key hexes, and you would miss those. Some of the missed double impales were probably due to your unfamiliarity with the hero, as impale's true range is much longer than the hero click-point. However, that isn't to say that this isn't something to improve on, which was the whole point of my first post.
I could go on and on, but that's about all I have time for right now. Congrats on your +25, congrats on your newfound confidence in supporting, congrats congrats congrats.
This made me lol
Have to catch up because it was 3am here when game 3 started
About the ward thing, yeah, I was wrong about that. It felt like they were always on CD most of the game though.
I am trying my best here to absorb advice. I'm aware over the years I haven't been very good about that as my own stubbornness got in the way, and for that I apologize to everyone here.
I never "discredited" your critique, however I think you can agree that just like yelling at teammates in pub games, that kind of execution makes people less likely to listen to it. Dreams made a post on this exact subject a few weeks ago, which is basically my point: You can simply not be as ass about it, it really isn't that difficult, hell I have seen you do it plenty of times. Most of the time all you really seem to want to do is agitate me so you can throw me under a bus later with one of your "LOL R E K T" style posts.
Regarding the actual game itself, I appreciate that advice. I do have one question regarding that, and this is of course open to anyone, is pulling generally that important? The way you make it sound is like focus should be more on zoning and killing than pulling.
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