Eh not outplayed, I was terrible as fuck all game long (was drinking quite a bit during the republican debate lol) just surprised that I made it out of there when more often than not I'd be dead as fuck (or not there to begin with, no chance of winning that fight alone)
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Dota 2 |OT11| $400 of Support and Passion
- Thread starter TUSR
- Start date
Eh not outplayed, I was terrible as fuck all game long (was drinking quite a bit during the republican debate lol) just surprised that I made it out of there when more often than not I'd be dead as fuck (or not there to begin with, no chance of winning that fight alone)
Imp the Dimp
Member
Gotta agree with Reddit that the current patch cycles are 1 to 1.5 months too long. I honestly wouldn't have minded seeing 6.85 2-3 weeks after TI5.
Dreams-Visions
Member
They used to do small tweaks in between big ones. I wonder what happened to those? Surely they could have dinged a few heroes over the last few months that have clearly been out of hand.
Shit, League does those kind of patches damn near every 3 weeks. Sometimes faster than that. I realize the Dota2 team is smaller, but again, they've done it in the past. I guess it doesn't matter since 6.85 is around the corner. I just hope there is a 6.85b, c and d along the way before 6.86.
Imp the Dimp
Member
There were b and c patches tbf
Sigismundo
Member
Why is Third Strike the greatest? I've never played.
^yeah, we've had the couple of "hotfixes" for 6.84 already. They weren't too far after 6.84's initial release I think.
^yeah, we've had the couple of "hotfixes" for 6.84 already. They weren't too far after 6.84's initial release I think.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Yea in May. Meanwhile, League has gotten 4 balance patches in the last 40 days.
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-515-notes
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-516-notes
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-517-notes
http://euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-518-notes
And I mean look at them. These aren't small changes. They're changes to dozens of heroes, items, interactions, core mechanics, bug fixes, etc. With heavy notes and commentary to boot.
Point that you seem to have missed is that there was a time when small patches came to Dota2 in a reasonable time frame and big patches came out maybe bi-monthly so that the whole process felt much more active and engaging. Big changes would come, QoL tweaks would come soon after...and not too far after that, we'd see another balance change followed by QoL tweaks and repeat. I don't think we've seen any noteworthy changes to heroes since mid May? It's mid September. In fact, September is closer to being over than starting. And surely it's not because anyone things the game has achieved a zen-like state of perfect balance. That's a fucking problem, and one I hope we see return to a more normal pace. 1 update every 30-60 days is good for me and good for the game. 4 months without even a minor patch is not.
So no, they don't need to do a significant patch every 2 weeks like League has been doing lately, but they can for damn sure do better than one every other SEASON.
Imp the Dimp
Member
Nobody claimed they did. In fact, people aren't too happy with how long patches remain these days. 5 months is easily 40 days too many.
Dreams-Visions
Member
I wouldn't. But someone had to go for the lowest of hanging fruit, I suppose.
Especially if it turned out like the shit show that Reborn has been. I'll take a piece of Honda Accord that works over new hotness that looks like a Ferrari but runs like a Yugo.
Shuggananas
Banned
forced meta is best meta
Dreams-Visions
Member
straw man rebuttal best rebuttal
reddit is right: 5 month cycle is too fucking long. create straw men to your hearts content. there's a reason that the last month of this thread are about shit other than Dota and 6.85 begging. weak misdirection and poorly-conceived arguments don't change that reality. hopefully volvo comes with 6.85 soon and improves the pace of updates. once every 2-3 months at least.
Shuggananas
Banned
huh
I think with TI5 you want a stable meta and since they just did the switch to source 2 they probably want to iron those kinks out before they introduce new ones with a big balance patch.
For the rest of the year, there's definetly room for a small update or 2 more than than they did recently.
For the rest of the year, there's definetly room for a small update or 2 more than than they did recently.
I'm okay with Dota not having that many balance patches per year. They usually do pretty well even after prolonged periods of time. Some of them do go on too long though, like 6.83 and 6.84 definitely have, but 6.82? Didn't really feel like that one went on too long.
Also dear Super Mario Maker creators: STOP FUCKING MAKING LEVELS OF "LOL SOME RANDOM BULLSHIT THAT YOU CAN'T SEE KILLED YOU!" like a fucking Thwomp that you can't see above you right at the start. Fuck that noise.
Also dear Super Mario Maker creators: STOP FUCKING MAKING LEVELS OF "LOL SOME RANDOM BULLSHIT THAT YOU CAN'T SEE KILLED YOU!" like a fucking Thwomp that you can't see above you right at the start. Fuck that noise.
thats the one thing i dont like about balancing
something will be strong at the beginning of the patch and then itll get numbers tweaked here and there and then it stops, but then about halfway into the patch's life the players discover something thats complete AIDS and i just have to deal with it until i get so fed up with the bullshit that i stop playing entirely
i dont really know what theyre supposed to be able to do about it though when they dont want to increase the amount of people working on the game so w/e
something will be strong at the beginning of the patch and then itll get numbers tweaked here and there and then it stops, but then about halfway into the patch's life the players discover something thats complete AIDS and i just have to deal with it until i get so fed up with the bullshit that i stop playing entirely
i dont really know what theyre supposed to be able to do about it though when they dont want to increase the amount of people working on the game so w/e
It's still generally pretty hard to say if something is OP just by reading patch notes. It usually takes a lot of play to figure out what's actually OP and what's not. Remember Centaur Aghs? That sounded kind of OP, notwithstanding the zombie bug, nobody even talks about it anymore. Alchemist giving everyone Aghs also sounded OP, yet no one gives a shit about that one either. The OP thing is Leshrac, and his changes are mainly just numbers.
Shuggananas
Banned
BH and tusk are also fucking stupid
Centaur aghs is strong but not OP as shit, if the hero was more meta he'd be OP imo because it's a really great upgrade
Alch was never meant to be good, only the omg factor made people go nuts. Just like LD's aghs.
Centaur aghs is strong but not OP as shit, if the hero was more meta he'd be OP imo because it's a really great upgrade
Alch was never meant to be good, only the omg factor made people go nuts. Just like LD's aghs.
Improve pace of updates and dota 2 in the same sentence, it feel like reading one of my post during the year following TI3.straw man rebuttal best rebuttal
reddit is right: 5 month cycle is too fucking long. create straw men to your hearts content. there's a reason that the last month of this thread are about shit other than Dota and 6.85 begging. weak misdirection and poorly-conceived arguments don't change that reality. hopefully volvo comes with 6.85 soon and improves the pace of updates. once every 2-3 months at least.
2 years later it seeems like we might still not have parity by TI6, and maybe only 2 balance patch between TI5 and TI6. ( one soon, and one for China new years event since it's their main target now )
Still waiting for some dota 1 hero made my expectation from Valve so low, one would say it's now abyssal.
The same meta for 2 different qualifier seem crazy to me. But I thought the same about having the same meta in TI qualifier and the main event, yet that just happened.
Shuggananas
Banned
I actually think the major system would mean patches more frequently
I had great PUB game yesterday 
In 5th minute Huskar left our team, we paused, waited like 5 minutes then we basically accepted the fact he's not coming back and the game became safe to leave.
Couple minutes later I left the game too, since 4v5 is a waste of time, but then I thought, I'm playing Leshrac, we got Slark and Witch Doctor - fuck it, let's try it! So I reconnect immediately and we play. Thank god WD
and Slark were quite good and we're playing on equal foot with opposing team - fuck, we even lead in kills but they push like 3 towers in space of 10 minutes - not much we can do here.
Then, like 15 minutes later Huskar is back! Hahaha, we're level 12, he's lvl3 but hey, it's still 5v5! And since that moment we've been playing even better and since we had OP Leshrac and Slark we won the game. Man, that was awesome
In 5th minute Huskar left our team, we paused, waited like 5 minutes then we basically accepted the fact he's not coming back and the game became safe to leave.Couple minutes later I left the game too, since 4v5 is a waste of time, but then I thought, I'm playing Leshrac, we got Slark and Witch Doctor - fuck it, let's try it! So I reconnect immediately and we play. Thank god WD
and Slark were quite good and we're playing on equal foot with opposing team - fuck, we even lead in kills but they push like 3 towers in space of 10 minutes - not much we can do here.
Then, like 15 minutes later Huskar is back! Hahaha, we're level 12, he's lvl3 but hey, it's still 5v5! And since that moment we've been playing even better and since we had OP Leshrac and Slark we won the game. Man, that was awesome
Wonderboy91
Member
Honestly I prefer dota's update cycle to league's incessant tweaking.
3 month is the sweet spot I think.
First month people experiment. Second, things begin to stabilise.
By the end of third month people look at dotabuff winrate and/or copy the pro scene top pick/ban. ( not everyone, but you get the idea )
And it would just work well with the major system.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
My last 2 games I've been pretty toxic.
Not in a flamey way, just given up and feeding away/presenting divine rapier to other team.
Not in a flamey way, just given up and feeding away/presenting divine rapier to other team.
Imp the Dimp
Member
4th and 5th month: Abusing and spamming OP heroes.
Troll Warlord was 100% p/b only towards the end of 6.83c if I remember correctly. Unlike Jugg and Axe, he was not nerfed in the b and c patches although he was arguably just as strong if not better.
6.83c Troll Warlord is IMO the strongest hero to actually not be nerfed within days or weeks (like release Warrunner, Earth Spirit, reworked Lancer) in pubs I have seen in almost 3 years of Dota. He was so ridiculous and the patch went on forever.
Shuggananas
Banned
slardar's aghs : can be cast on towers, slithereen crush applies ult
Shuggananas
Banned
Make it 5/10/15 or something on towers, sounds fine to me. That's about AC + desolator
shira
Member
tsunami643
Member
Shuggananas
Banned
giving him a good aghs could make him a good utility hero though
yes he has other problems that's for sure
Imp the Dimp
Member
Remove his bash and give him something that makes him farm faster. Or give his sprint some lifesteal or whatever. I feel like he's too YOLO of a position 1. In most (not all) cases, I prefer to have my off lane initate and create space, not my position 1. :/
My random thoughts regarding Slardar:
- His base strength and damage are too low
- His base move speed could be increased by 5
- Crunch could get a buff: remove the slow and give a miss chance to the targets (10/15/20/25 %)
- His ult should not be purgeable/dispelable
- I think Sprint shouldn't amp the damage you take, or at the very least shouldn't amp all the damage just a type.
- To counter my previous point the speed bonus shouldn't be as high as it is right now
I'd love to be able to play the hero as contrary to what many think he is not useless right now but there's never a situation where you think he is the best pick, there's always some other hero that can do what he does better.
- His base strength and damage are too low
- His base move speed could be increased by 5
- Crunch could get a buff: remove the slow and give a miss chance to the targets (10/15/20/25 %)
- His ult should not be purgeable/dispelable
- I think Sprint shouldn't amp the damage you take, or at the very least shouldn't amp all the damage just a type.
- To counter my previous point the speed bonus shouldn't be as high as it is right now
I'd love to be able to play the hero as contrary to what many think he is not useless right now but there's never a situation where you think he is the best pick, there's always some other hero that can do what he does better.
Slardar is a shit hero because he doesn't bring anything to a team
-25 minus armor is nice on paper so you can blow someone up fast but there are more than enough heroes to provide minus armor (and some of them do it an AoE or have to the potential to) that are actually useful for other things as well. The rest of his skills aren't any better.
How many games can you look back at and say "oh my god if they just had Slardar they would have totally won that game, all they needed is -25 armor!"
Monochromaticx
Member
I remember notail saying that slardar can be played as a support
He played Slardar support in Fnatic vs Navi in the XMG Captin's Draft finals
Na`Vi vs Fnatic: Grand Finals Game 4 - XMG Captains Draft Invitational
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
I thought I saw a counter though.Shame she doesn't have her counters anymore
Yup.
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