-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Dota 2 |OT5| TECHIES!!!
- Thread starter Artanisix
- Start date
- Status
I have not seen these videos, what was so bad?
http://www.gfycat.com/EnlightenedExhaustedAvocet
watch this. http://www.twitch.tv/purgegamers/b/533550978?t=204m2s
made some very bad calls during the matches. Kept shifting the blame to his teammates rather than himself.
I'm on mobile so I can't see the twitch vod. Him pinging the trees tells me nothing without context.
Purge is good at explaining what a creep is. How does armor work? What is creep equilibrium? You can stack camps!!!?!?
These things are not intuitive to new players, that is where he shines. If you have played every hero more than once, he probably isn't the teacher for you.
You didnt see SS get hooked? If you watch the video, Purge tells SS that it was a lucky hook when in actual fact, SS went to the area in vision of the creeps
Personally I think he makes many bad calls. He also "coaches" every role when he doesn't really specialize in those roles. Maybe he is good in those roles but I highly doubt it.
Imp the Dimp
Member
lmao
His point is that positioning tips are going to be lost on newer players. Purge is good for people in their first 50 games or so, teaching them the basic principles of Dota, including some of which are unintuitive.
I'm not saying purge doesn't make mistakes, he clearly does.
What's more important is the overall message in a positive environment. Teaching someone to play dota can be very frustrating, and trying to teach someone something in a game that's going poorly or has a really wired situation is difficult.
I'm surprised people hit hooks at the mmr he coaches people in, even with targets standing still lol.
SteveWinwood
Member
Have you ever coached anyone in a live game? It's nearly impossible. No don't stand there! How did you miss like 5 of those last hits?! Well... you should enough gold to have your orchid by now... but you don't... so... now why are you standing there youre just going to di- see now you're dead. It's better have them read a few guides (like purges) and then tons of experience.
Purge is good at long form "don't rush battlefury on bounty hunter, buy regen!" type stuff for beginners. Stuff that people just have no clue what's going on.
Once you have a hundred games under your belt you can probably look elsewhere, but purges niche is that very beginning group.
Plus specifically for that gif the pudge could have been trying to hook the alch. Or what it looks like to me is if he was actually faster he wouldn't have been seen by the creeps that he might have been. Or it could be a random hook it's probably like 1k who knows what's going on in that pudges head.
Yeah, Purge clearly has his place in the Dota "curriculum" and I think he's pretty solid at it, but no further. The Purge to Merlini progression has been what many, including myself, have followed and I think it's probably good enough to get just about any new player from total bottom tier to the 3000 - 4000 mmr range, assuming you pay decent enough attention and retain the knowledge.
I believe the principles of Dota can be just read online, you don't need a coach for that. I'm pretty sure the SS has more than 50 games under his belt.
He was seen by the creeps yet purge kept telling him that it was a lucky hook and it wasn't his fault at all.
Watching the principles in action alongside a game and hearing the basic points as they specifically become relevant in a game scenario is probably going to be more valuable than just reading them. Even if Purge offers nothing beyond that, there's at least some value there.
Imp the Dimp
Member
LOVE Magnus. Such an exciting hero. Almost single-handedly won NAR the game but they look like throwing.
It also took him 12 seconds to move to that spot after the first ping. If he would have walked there right away he would not have been in vision lol.
Edit: and maybe telling him it was a lucky hook is just trying not to discourage the ss. It's much better than flaming him.
i played 9 or 10 solo que non ranked games yesterday and not only did i win most of them, i also had great teams in terms of people being nice and friendly
first game today ranked solo que - PA fails to farm, blinks into entire teams and doesn't farm free creep waves at towers then blames the entire team for losing and keep asking for wards when we had wards for the majority of the game
ranked fucking sucks
first game today ranked solo que - PA fails to farm, blinks into entire teams and doesn't farm free creep waves at towers then blames the entire team for losing and keep asking for wards when we had wards for the majority of the game
ranked fucking sucks
The_Hitcher89
Member
Cheers guys
Will check out the Dota Cinema stuff I think, just basically want to see what the Heroes can do so their abilities and strengths don't come as such a surprise
Bloodraider kept destroying me with a teleport move I didn't know how to prepare for yesterday :lol
Will check out the Dota Cinema stuff I think, just basically want to see what the Heroes can do so their abilities and strengths don't come as such a surprise
Bloodraider kept destroying me with a teleport move I didn't know how to prepare for yesterday :lol
Cheers guys
Will check out the Dota Cinema stuff I think, just basically want to see what the Heroes can do so their abilities and strengths don't come as such a surprise
Bloodraider kept destroying me with a teleport move I didn't know how to prepare for yesterday :lol
That's probably a blink dagger, it's a very strong item on batrider.
SteveWinwood
Member
Bloodseeker? Could have been blink, or maybe force staff.Cheers guys
Will check out the Dota Cinema stuff I think, just basically want to see what the Heroes can do so their abilities and strengths don't come as such a surprise
Bloodraider kept destroying me with a teleport move I didn't know how to prepare for yesterday :lol
Definitely read up on heroes. It will come from experience if you want to just brute force it through playing a lot if you hate reading.
Imp the Dimp
Member
NAR vs Mouz is a 10 out of 10 game. I'm on the edge of my fuckin seat.
Cheers guys
Will check out the Dota Cinema stuff I think, just basically want to see what the Heroes can do so their abilities and strengths don't come as such a surprise
Bloodraider kept destroying me with a teleport move I didn't know how to prepare for yesterday :lol
If items are suprising you maybe go read up on what they do?
Also in the Library tab in the game client you can watch vids of what every heroes spells do + a small description
So if you get totally rekt by a certian hero you can go read up on his skills and see why he seemed so powerful
NAR got rkt'ed though.
I knew that shit was gonna happen when I recommended his videos. Being an average player does not disqualify him from being really helpful.
His videos and guides are seriously really good for new players, please check his replay commentaries if you have the time:
Purge Replay Commentaries
He plays a hero, typically explains what their skills do, how their combos work, which items you might want to buy on them, how they are countered... all the good stuff you wish you new the first time you see that hero in a pub. If you're thinking you might want to try a new hero, check this playlist first it'll take you from 0 to 75% of what you need to know. The rest can only come from playing the game yourself.
Merlini is also a really good resource, but he doesn't have nearly as many videos, and he doesn't speak to the very first time beginner as much as purge does.
His videos and guides are seriously really good for new players, please check his replay commentaries if you have the time:
Purge Replay Commentaries
He plays a hero, typically explains what their skills do, how their combos work, which items you might want to buy on them, how they are countered... all the good stuff you wish you new the first time you see that hero in a pub. If you're thinking you might want to try a new hero, check this playlist first it'll take you from 0 to 75% of what you need to know. The rest can only come from playing the game yourself.
Merlini is also a really good resource, but he doesn't have nearly as many videos, and he doesn't speak to the very first time beginner as much as purge does.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
Reddit said:
some guy on Reddit said:
So is this a bug or intended?
Seems like a bug to me.
Not supper adept at it myself, but have a key for centering on your hero (I use space) and use tab to cycle through other units. That way you can tab to golem and then if you don't know where warlock is you just double-tap space to go back to him, and you can press space once to give commands to warlock.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
How do you guys bind your items? I'm thinking of changing it to alt+Q etc., but I heard Akke say in an interview that having to press 2 buttons to use any item isn't optimal, he said he only does it because he's used to it.
I'm using Space, Z, X, C, V, B, but it's not great.
I'm using Space, Z, X, C, V, B, but it's not great.
Gully State
Member
so I guess the immortal rares no longer come in their own boxes which explains why those boxes are now worth more than the item itself..
Wok
Member
I am using 1 2 3 4 5 6 and it is great.
That's close to what I use:
C, V, F, G, and 2 mouse buttons. I've considered adding in mousewheel up/down for my wand/mana boots/mek slots too.
It comes down to what you're used to and whats comfortable.
He's right. It's not optimal. You can really feel this when you're playing Tinker, which requires double the amount of key presses.
In League, they bind items to 1-7, which works, except you'll need to find some other place for your control groups.
The best thing to do, in my opinion, is to change keybinds on the fly to suit whatever hero you're playing, which is what RTZ does. Whatever bindings you choose, the most important thing is to make sure your fingers don't need to shift more than 1 row away from your spells. This is why you're not enjoying ZXCVB, it wastes too much movement in the fingers and the wrist and leads to sloppy inputs.
I have mine bound to 1, 2, 3, 4, Space and X. X is mapped to a button on my mouse. I usually put 'important' items (Mek, Blink, Force) into the Space slot because I find it the easiest to use. I've actually tried binding my items to Alt+Q, Alt+W, etc but I didn't like it at all and I often found myself accidentally pinging the map. I rarely play micro-heavy heroes anyway so I don't feel bad about not having control groups bound to the number keys. With illusion heroes I usually use unified orders or just use the binding for 'select all other units'. I've been thinking of using Z, X, C, V, B, but I don't know if I want to commit to adjusting to that.
I use 1 2 3 4 + two mouse thumb buttons. Tilde is hero select and I sometimes put control group on 1 and move item to X/C/V .
I use space for stop and I've gotten too used to it to switch I think.
T Y X Space B 6 (I've got my hero/courier on C/V)
Probably not optimal but it's what I'm used to by now.
For skills I use:
Q W E R
F and V for the extra skills some heroes have like Puck, Invoker and Rubick.
Alt + key skill for auto cast, very useful for some orbs like silencer (alt+w instead of right clicking it in the HUD)
For items (same grid disposition as in the HUD):
A S D
Z X C
Some items are always in the same spots for me, it helps a lot:
Magic Wand is Z, Blink is S, Force Staff D, BKB A, Treads or Phase boots on C, Sheepstick X.
F1 is center on hero, 1 is courier, 2-9 control groups.
T is attack move, G cancel, Space is leveling up skills.
For control groups, I use 2 for hero + everything else I control, 3 for all units I control except hero, then 3-4-5 etc for individual important creeps.
Also use extra stuff on mouse buttons for quick buying and putting items on courier. That way you can just Mouse4 to quick buy the items you need if you are in a situation where you need to spend your gold before you die.
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
My item slots are 1, 2, 3, mouse button 4, mouse button 5, space. Mouse buttons 4 and 5 are little buttons on the side on my mouse.
I usually put wand or mek on space for panic heals, 'aimed items' like urn of shadows or veil of discord on the mouse buttons for easy targeting, and the rest on the number keys.
EDIT: Also, z is 'select me', x is 'select everyone I control including me', and c is 'select everyone I control excluding me'. I fiddled with the hotkeys a lot since I'm still not entirely used to them and can still adapt, and this setup has been working for me.
I usually put wand or mek on space for panic heals, 'aimed items' like urn of shadows or veil of discord on the mouse buttons for easy targeting, and the rest on the number keys.
EDIT: Also, z is 'select me', x is 'select everyone I control including me', and c is 'select everyone I control excluding me'. I fiddled with the hotkeys a lot since I'm still not entirely used to them and can still adapt, and this setup has been working for me.
Space, Alt+Q, Alt+W, Alt+E, Alt+R etc.
I rest my thumb on the Spacebar and always put the most important item there for quick reactions. I like having the alt set up because the only thing I need to move to react is my thumb.
Spacebar is my "Well played" button.
It's not the best use of keyboard real estate but on my mechanical keyboard the spacebar is very sensitive, so it's better to say "Well played!" by accident than it is to pop BKB.
It's not the best use of keyboard real estate but on my mechanical keyboard the spacebar is very sensitive, so it's better to say "Well played!" by accident than it is to pop BKB.
Mine are kind of awkward because I use legacy keys, but:
Legacy Keys for Skills
1, 2, 3, 4, Z for Items (one slot has no hotkey)
Space for Courier
5 to Select Hero
6 to Select All Other Units
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
That happened to me a couple times, and it's always the 10 second one. It feels awful. I set spammable items such as any kind of boots on Space.
I think I'm going to change my items to 1 through 6, put control groups on Z through N, and center on hero on Space. Going to try it out and see how it is.
- Status