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Dota 2 |OT5| TECHIES!!!
- Thread starter Artanisix
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Artgerm finished his Windranger. He's going to draw more heroes, Earthshaker is next.
Rest of the work can be found here: http://steamcommunity.com/id/artgerm/myworkshopfiles/?section=merchandise&appid=570
Rest of the work can be found here: http://steamcommunity.com/id/artgerm/myworkshopfiles/?section=merchandise&appid=570
Captain Fish
Member
The poor itemization issue often prevents me from playing carry. I have a bunch of carries in my 10 hero thing, and in one game supports just refused to get force staffs or meks in exchange for shitty aghs rushes. Having a team without a single utility item is rough when the opposite team builds good items.
It's why I really like playing offlaner or mid, where I can have a big impact, but also build a utility item or two.
It's why I really like playing offlaner or mid, where I can have a big impact, but also build a utility item or two.
Oh no, what happened to her arms?
James seems like a pretty big dick
Spirit of Jazz
Banned
I think it's just that the losing streaks in the game the game are so savage due to the length of matches that people need some kind of excuse. When you're not considering how many games you've played total it seems pretty suspect when you get carries that have 5 deaths around the 10 minute mark 5 times in a row.
I remember when I was spamming CM in ranked and solo supporting with her, and I couldn't even get those utility items. I was buying courier, flying courier, wards, sentries, dust when needed (almost always) etc. And I had to pay for all this whilst my 4 teammates soaked up all the farm on the map with their core heroes, and I had to live off assist gold. And cus I was so squishy, I die in fights easily to AOE when trying to help. It's a hard life, having boots only 25 mins in, maybe an urn if I'm lucky. Since then I've started picking supports that can farm more easily.
I'm not sure I believe that.
Whenever I get ahead by a notable amount of wins to losses, I get game after game with HORRIBLE teammates, causing me to lose several in a row. If the opponents were actually better, I'd be able to realize that was what is happening, however that is NOT the case. I get team after team of people who are far below my skill level, which is evident by their actions. Examples are supports who don't actually support at all (no wards, no stacking, no pulling), carries that are just bad. I compare this to when I play support, I stack and pull the lane to keep it as close to our tower as I can, I stack ancients, I buy wards, dust and smokes. When I get a team with decent players, we win games.
This happens like clockwork, every time I get ahead. I still manage to keep more wins than losses, but I'm convinced that something is in place to attempt to make me lose games as I win more and more. When this happens, and I end up losing more games than I win for a week straight, I start to get normal teams again that are actually around my skill level.
It's not an excuse for bad play, it's not that I'm getting put against opponents that are at a high skill level.. it obviously matches me with people far lower than I should be rated. I rarely play ranked games as solo, so I can't comment on ranked. I only play those with a 5 man team.
Renoir
Member
Man.. see its shit like this that make me upset..
Play against axe, dude wreck chit up!!
Have axe on my team , dude dies to creeps..
You play with russians they all pull dendi plays...
i get russian scribles in caps on my screen
:<
Jex
Member
It's getting too real in here, man.
Theres nothing better than a raging voice chat Russian. Why is that good you ask? Cus Russian is a beautiful language, so hearing it spoken without knowing what profanities are being said allows me to just appreciate the sound.
That's his Schtick. He's always been a dick. It's partly why so many people like him, something something British humor.
Though he is pretty damn funny.
MrChocolate
Member
THIS SO MUCH!
Hate it when I get russians on my team. They pick support, won't buy wards, nothing, shit sucks.
Play against a few russians, bam, my team get stomped.
shiftplusone
Member
this is my fear
i was going to do like the 8 that I can bullshit my way through then reroll
but what if I get like chen and outworld destroyer
my life would be over
Artgerm finished his Windranger. He's going to draw more heroes, Earthshaker is next.
Rest of the work can be found here: http://steamcommunity.com/id/artgerm/myworkshopfiles/?section=merchandise&appid=570
ugh i love his stuff so much
If your the only support, steal farm. Seriously. Buying wards, dust etc by yourselves constantly gets very expensive.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
If only Russians were as good as the awesome Americans, they're always extremely skilled and well mannered....
Jex
Member
Let's not forget when the supports forgo Urn, Mech, Force Staff and Wards to get Aghs. Because it's just too good on Bane to pass up.
If you actually believe this then looooool. I'd advise you to post some games you consider to be examples of this so that people can watch and explain the real reason for the loss.
Edit: Oh and James humour is definitely British.
Source: I'm English. Insulting people is the best kind of humour, it just relies on them giving as good as they get.
ashecitism
Member
OD is so easy though. You literally can't lost mid unless you're against a Viper or Huskar
OD is easy thoughChen is good too, just grab the right creeps and micro.
Well there's my problem
Not sure why this is funny. I didn't realize you're the programmer who works for Valve who coded the match-making algorithms.
There's obviously something in the background causing this to happen. If it occurred occasionally, then I could understand, but it happens every time. When something happens all the time with the same trigger, there's obviously a reason for that happening. And it is definitely not being queued against more skilled opponents.
If it slowly matched me against better players, I wouldn't win 15 games in a row and then lose 10 in a row with obviously worse players on my team, then start givng me competent teammates again. There's nothing slow or subtle about that.
What I'm saying is that these people are not worse than you. Not by the amounts you describe anyway. Dreams made a good post on reasons they could be having a bad game. I've had games where I was 0-5-0 in the first 10 minutes, that doesn't mean I am suddenly way worse than my teammates in that game.
Edit: I really want to see these 15 game win steaks and 10 game loss streaks.
Yep its Valve, the only reason people are losing games is because valve coded it to be this way. C'mon man, you don't need to be a programmer to see how ridiculous this is. If forced 50 is a thing, then how come not everyone is 50%?
And why are some people lower then 50?
I'm at work right now, otherwise I'd look up my match history and show you.
I understand the reasoning behind match-making and the idea that you slowly get introduced to better players, causing your ratio to stay at a certain point. The problem is, in my experience, everything points to the system trying to force me to 50-50. I manage to stay above that, but when I get streaks of wins and losses, constantly and especially when I have more wins than losses in a row, that leads me to believe that the system is causing that to happen.
This same behavior was noticed by several friends who play, ranging from far below my skill level to above my skill level.
What's happening here is cognitive bias. You're mentally partitioning your games into loss streaks and win streaks and trying to draw some sort of conclusion regarding the underlying algorithm from that. Had both streaks been interwoven with an even sprinkling of wins and losses, you wouldn't think twice, despite the same results. But because you're intuiting these patterns, you think there is less randomness than there should be and clearly something up behind the scenes.
The idea that a series of wins and a series of losses is somehow intrinsically less random than one win for every loss is fallacious.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-hand_fallacy
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_fallacy
From what I understand, unranked matches are still ranked, so it can match-make correctly. Some people are probably good enough to get to the point where their hidden ranking matches them with competent players constantly. Some people are bad enough that they can't win matches, no matter the circumstances. It's really not rocket science. They obviously can't force all players to 50, all the time. I'm not at 50, but it sure seems like the system is attempting to lower my ratio on a constant basis.
People don't complain of a forced 50 in League of Legends.. Not surprisingly, I had far more wins than losses when I played LoL.
there are thousands of players above 50% win and thousands below. Winrate is very loosely tied to skill (there are exceptions), generally better players have higher winrates, and worse players have lower ones that's just how it is. Notice the loosely though, I've seen a few outlier cases where a 2k mmr player somehow has 54% win or a 49% player has 4k mmr. Though generally, yes, the guy with 60% win is a good player, and the dude with 45% win has some work to do.
there is no "forced" 50/50 where evil gaben notices your win streak and forces you to play with 200 mmr recent LoL converts to fuck up your day.
In all honesty, you probably noticed more wins in league because you're a better league player than dota player (comparatively) and win more lol? Have you considered that?
there is no "forced" 50/50 where evil gaben notices your win streak and forces you to play with 200 mmr recent LoL converts to fuck up your day.
In all honesty, you probably noticed more wins in league because you're a better league player than dota player (comparatively) and win more lol? Have you considered that?
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
Get rekt Liquid
What happens when two people equally as bad play against each other?
I'm not mentally partitioning anything. The evidence is clear. 10-20 wins in a row and then 5-10 losses in a row, constantly. If I manage to have a time frame where my win/loss ratio is relatively even, it stays constant until I have a win streak that puts me up by a large amount of games. Like clockwork, every time. How do you explain that, outside of being matched against better opponents, which is subjective, but really is not the case based on my experience.
Anyway, have to go to a meeting at work.. it has been fun debating.
Matchmaking creates teams where the average MMR of both teams is the same. As a result, the long-term trend is that players get roughly 50% winrate. That isn't forced 50, that's good matchmaking.
James is a dick but that was in response to LD's tweet : https://twitter.com/LDdota/status/466549766747615232
Tonight we agreed to kill the "white fluffy cat" first. #TI4EUHub #Hype
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