Not blind hatred, more like hatred of it in pub games just because in pro games, the teams are generally organized and will capitalize on the advantages it gives you, in pubs it's usually "cool, you got a kill, alright back to afk farming until next Requiem"
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DOTA 2 |OT9| League of Ancients (6.84)
- Thread starter Teknopathetic
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Not blind hatred, more like hatred of it in pub games just because in pro games, the teams are generally organized and will capitalize on the advantages it gives you, in pubs it's usually "cool, you got a kill, alright back to afk farming until next Requiem"
Shuggananas
Banned
more like "OOPS I FAILED MY TIMING NOW IM DEAD XDDD Y U MaD ITS oNLY A GAME WHO CAErS"
Urn procs cold snap. Picking up the sage mask after phase boots is pretty common. You can then decide turn it into an urn, orchid or euls depending on your build.
shira
Member
lol ppd going in on Alliance on twitter
https://twitter.com/ppdDota/status/593457224095248385
He deleted a lot of shit too last night.
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
I think it will work great with the Doctor. Specially the considering the buff that kicks in once the ally is below 20% with Voodoo restoration.
It is a 60HP Regen + 250 instant heal + 160 Mana + 17 armor, and can be applied FOR THE WHOLE TEAM
In comparison, a Bottling Tethered Wisp gives you 200Hp aprox per charge
Witchdoctor has too strong of an aghs upgrade, I can't see guardian greaves replacing the current arcane boots/urn of shadows -> aghs -> bkb/ghost scepter build.
I think the heroes that can make the best use of the item are jakiro (deathball), dazzle (the <20% hp armor and regen buff gives you a little more time to recognize when an ally gets blown up grave him in time) and io (massive hp an mana refill to tethered ally).
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
Is the IHL a year round thing? I'd like to join but work has me busy until July
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I hope 84 is a little more welcoming to enchantress. Early ganks are like the highlight of every match I play with her and then past the 5 minute mark I sink into irrelevance. Was quite sad how fast this match went downhill after I got first blood on the pudge with a hellbear gank
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I hope 84 is a little more welcoming to enchantress. Early ganks are like the highlight of every match I play with her and then past the 5 minute mark I sink into irrelevance. Was quite sad how fast this match went downhill after I got first blood on the pudge with a hellbear gank
SteveWinwood
Member
farming is a strength of it though it let's you spam razes
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
Refresher and boots of travel recipes cost more :^).
It depends how noticeable the <20% hp protection aura is in practice. I can see it being really strong with huskar in particular.
shira
Member
I expect half of DotaGAF to be banned or 3 striked by the end of IHL2
It's an expensive item because it's an awesome one:
- Mek + Mana with 0 cost
- Armor aura
- Free platemail for everyone in 900AoE once anyone in it is below 20% HP (that's how I read it anyway)
And the most important part of the item:
- Purge of the user. Your no longer a silenced support that's useless during the whole team-fight.
Bottle does that pretty well, and generally you don't buy the Euls just to farm, you're mainly getting it for the Requiem pickoffs.
Shuggananas
Banned
20% is very low though, you won't use this bonus very often
The super bonus is only for people under 20%, not the others if one is below
The super bonus is only for people under 20%, not the others if one is below
Debatable. I have over 150 games as WD on my back and while I do get Aghs many times, this build could work when your team don't need yourself to deal damage but sustain + throwing casks. Specially during sieges / rosh. Also the build-up is great (unlike Aghs)
I rarely skill Maledict though, hence I dislike Urn. I think the skill falls off too hard, and when playing agaisnt skilled oponents you can never come into range or else you will be raped. Ghost scepter is a must (was, in 6.83 meta) although with a possible int carry meta it might not be neccesary anymore. Glimmering cape sounds dope on WD
SecretMoblin
Member
Enchant change will be so good early game. No more pressure to rush an inopportune gank before your centaur dies.
Vade
Member
It is a damn twitch meme, no one is telling hylian to kill himself or half the actual shit you will get blasted at you in a normal solo que game. If you cannot deal with little jests and taunts do you curl up in a ball and visit your happy place?
I get you want to look down on Hylian from your glass house but want to hide it,so you mask it with your holier than thou post about defending Hylian who is incapable of defending himself in your opinion. Hylian can defend himself just fine, if anything he should of been a defense attorney for his ability to defend crazy shit and would have been good at it.
So let Hylian fight his own battles and most of this shit is in jest, ie. Vade worst
slarder ever true
edit:
3 razes are 225 mana.
One bottle charge gives 70 mana total, 3 charges give 210 mana. Unless you only raze 3 times every 2 minutes you're gonna run out of mana pretty quickly and thats assuming you get runes.
ROFL, if it was a one off thing sure, but repeated targeting of someone regardless of whether they told you to stop or not is considered harassment. Stop trying to justify your shit.
The new boots are probably stronger than they appear. They looked mediocre to me too, but felt stronger in the games i played. Too bad Arcane are so bad on Huskar, because the item is just perfect for him, +20 armor on low hp and +20 regen on a 99% spell resist hero? Good luck killing that (lina agha ulti kappa). You probably won't have any damage though. I could try getting it after armlet because Satanic feel a bit clunky on an hero that has huge problems farming (even if satanic was buffed by 200 g this patch).
I think there are still better items for the value if you want to farm. You can always bottle crow, Basilius/Aquila exists. Euls seems kind of like a waste if you're getting it JUST for farming. Now if you're using that to farm and to Requiem people that's fine, but as a farm item it really isn't worth the cost or items lot.
My initial argument is that it isn't a good item for pubs. It's a great SF item if you have a organized team behind you.
Get cold snap and hit them, expert advice given by Anbokr. Won me game.
That argument does not make sense, Euls in theory is better in pubs because teams are not organized right like you said, so you can free farm with mana regen, fast movement speed, an escape mechanic and when ever you see some one solo farming you can just requiem their ass.
You know when people say you don't listen, this is one of them moments.
Stop ganging on hylian everyone is allowed to have their opinion.
but what im saying says otherwise. Pubs is all about who can econ the most, and being able to move quickly between lane and jungle camps and killing them for little cost to the state of your mana means that you will farm faster than almost any other hero. If you really wanna see how good euls SF is, watch some of KvH's SF games, and you'll learn a thing or two about the hero. Stop being delusional ffs its really getting annoying now.
its not just that. Spend 2.8k gold to have better uptime by going back less to your fountain since you can use your bottle for healing mostly. More movement speed, so less kiting, allows you not only to setup requiem, but also interrupt tps and purge off debuffs on you.
What the fuck are you even talking about dude?
It gets really irritating when a lot of posts come with a "You're just bad" attached to the end of them, or that being the entire post, which has happened A LOT in here. You say this then you just say "lol all the shit you say is crazy".
When you have people come in here with some long winded rant about how I should just give up captaining and shit like that, you know that it actually seems like a good chunk is serious. I do get tired of getting bullied, and I don't see an issue with others calling that out.
Is it really "delusional" if almost every single pub Euls SF I see loses because they end up doing absolutely nothing with it and could have gotten real damage items/BKB/Whatever instead, but basically sound like a squeaker toy when they right click?
I mean I get your point about the farm, I just think it seems like a really roundabout and strange way to do it if the point is farm, does that make sense?
Then again, won't this all go out the window in 6.84 since the Euls manacost went up so much?
I am listening, I just don't understand why other things aren't better here. You guys seem to equate listening = don't think about it and just accept it.
rakkadakka
Member
We might need to make a separate thread for people who want to give Hylian grief.
Esp with new patch coming and lots of other things we can talk about besides drama.
Esp with new patch coming and lots of other things we can talk about besides drama.
What other item provides better utility than eul's for a comparable price?
And I'm not disagreeing on that front, I just think it's not very good to pick up in a pub game because people don't capitalize on the pickoffs you make with it, and suddenly you're an item in the hole that you can't do as much with late game. It gives you mana regen and MS, so you can farm jungle efficient, I'm not discounting that, I'm just saying if that's ALL you're going to do, there are better items, and even then, what's your plan beyond "Farm with your Euls" to somehow win the game?
To name a few: Midas, Bottle, Basilius/Aquila, Blink (and this translates into being used for pickoffs too).
Ok since you want me to seriously dissect your defense, we'll use this SF one.
Your biggest gripe with Euls on SF is that it is only a 'pro game' item, ie it takes a team that is 'generally organized...that capitalize on the advantages it gives you' to be a good purchase.
Your main form of evidence to support this claim is purely anecdotal from 3.5k solo mm games, where an SF will use his euls combo to score a kill with Requiem, and then farm, as you represented by 'it's usually "cool, you got a kill, alright back to afk farming until next Requiem".
However, this is in fact partly why the item is so fantastic, in that it allows Shadow Fiend to solo pick a large majority of the hero pool, including almost all of his opposing mids, most carries, and even some strength heroes. This is because with Euls, Shadow Fiend is able to do 1080/1620/2160 damage with his ultimate. Not only will this allow you to get a large gold and exp lead over the opposing enemy threat due to the fact that you can solo kill them every 2 minutes or less, but it also creates a fear of SF into the enemy team. Fear in dota leads to playing from behind, which allows the other 4 heroes on your team to move freely as well, which means they can farm and gank more efficiently.
Aside from just the offensive power of the active, let's take a look at what Eul's scepter brings to Shadow Fiend. With Treads and Eul's, Shadow Fiend has 395 movement speed, which we can say is comfortably above average, and allows him to either chase down for autoattacks and razes, or barely escape ganks from everything but the fastest of heroes. At level 9 with just Euls for mana, Shadow Fiend increases his mana regen from 1.4 to 4.4, which means he is refunded a raze every 30 seconds. With proper rune coverage with bottle, Shadow Fiend can easily clear his lane, 2 camps, and as long as he maintains a rune every 2 minutes, he will never go oom this way.
The active on Eul's can also be used to disrupt combos and/or get out of gank situations. If for example a hero blinks on Shadow Fiend or a projectile is inbound, Eul's can be used either on the hero or on Shadow Fiend himself to avoid whatever damage would affect Shadow Fiend for the next 2.5 seconds. Eul's can also dispel runes such as haste or double damage.
And as I finished typing this you've changed your argument already, so I will address that as well. You're not an 'item in the hole' because you bought a Euls, because the extra farming potency and ganking power it grants you will not only increase your net worth faster, but it will also slow down the enemy's farming, even if you don't notice it. In fact, you're even more 'in the hole' with items like Midas or Blink, which offer you less farming speed than Eul's. There are NO better items for this cost that do all of this for Shadow Fiend. And if you're honestly discrediting being able to blink bkb euls ulti any non-bkb hero late game and instagib them, then I'm sorry but stick to playing Solitaire.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfMcTMQNGI0
watch this and educate yourself
Your biggest gripe with Euls on SF is that it is only a 'pro game' item, ie it takes a team that is 'generally organized...that capitalize
Your main form of evidence to support this claim is purely anecdotal from 3.5k solo mm games, where an SF will use his euls combo to score a kill with Requiem, and then farm, as you represented by 'it's usually "cool, you got a kill, alright back to afk farming until next Requiem".
However, this is in fact partly why the item is so fantastic, in that it allows Shadow Fiend to solo pick a large majority of the hero pool, including almost all of his opposing mids, most carries, and even some strength heroes. This is because with Euls, Shadow Fiend is able to do 1080/1620/2160 damage with his ultimate. Not only will this allow you to get a large gold and exp lead over the opposing enemy threat due to the fact that you can solo kill them every 2 minutes or less, but it also creates a fear of SF into the enemy team. Fear in dota leads to playing from behind, which allows the other 4 heroes on your team to move freely as well, which means they can farm and gank more efficiently.
Aside from just the offensive power of the active, let's take a look at what Eul's scepter brings to Shadow Fiend. With Treads and Eul's, Shadow Fiend has 395 movement speed, which we can say is comfortably above average, and allows him to either chase down for autoattacks and razes, or barely escape ganks from everything but the fastest of heroes. At level 9 with just Euls for mana, Shadow Fiend increases his mana regen from 1.4 to 4.4, which means he is refunded a raze every 30 seconds. With proper rune coverage with bottle, Shadow Fiend can easily clear his lane, 2 camps, and as long as he maintains a rune every 2 minutes, he will never go oom this way.
The active on Eul's can also be used to disrupt combos and/or get out of gank situations. If for example a hero blinks on Shadow Fiend or a projectile is inbound, Eul's can be used either on the hero or on Shadow Fiend himself to avoid whatever damage would affect Shadow Fiend for the next 2.5 seconds. Eul's can also dispel runes such as haste or double damage.
And as I finished typing this you've changed your argument already, so I will address that as well. You're not an 'item in the hole' because you bought a Euls, because the extra farming potency and ganking power it grants you will not only increase your net worth faster, but it will also slow down the enemy's farming, even if you don't notice it. In fact, you're even more 'in the hole' with items like Midas or Blink, which offer you less farming speed than Eul's. There are NO better items for this cost that do all of this for Shadow Fiend. And if you're honestly discrediting being able to blink bkb euls ulti any non-bkb hero late game and instagib them, then I'm sorry but stick to playing Solitaire.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfMcTMQNGI0
watch this and educate yourself
We have already told you. why are you not understanding why other things aren't better, we just posted our reason, just read them.
See the above, we think you don't think about it at all.
Bad players don't make items bad.
You think SF has weak right click? are you serious but forget that, he also has spells,
Requiem of Souls can deal up to a max of 1440/2160/2880 damage to a single unit, Eul;s sets this up, think about that 1440 DAMAGE that early is no joke.
Can't land the requiem? no problem euls them, sets up your razes and right clicks.
Shadowraze max of 975
Presence of the Dark Lord which Armor Reduction: 3/4/5/6
At this moment is the enemey thinking hahaha this bastard right clicks like the sound of a squeaker toy? no hes going to die.
Late game? 2880 DAMAGE. hm.
Then don't get a 2nd utility item like blink or bkb after eul's if you feel it gets in the way of your damage output.
Bottle, basi/aquila, blink certainly do not prove the same utility as eul's. Just for farming alone, bottle (as I pointed out earlier) is not sufficient for constant raze spam and neither are the other two. Is the mobility of blink alone better than +40ms and constant razes for farming?
Sure you get a Midas, not too familiar with that one on sf. I'd argue getting eul's in a good timing is more reliable than midas
For farming alone? It's hardly a horrible item.
1) you're not CK, SF isn't known for his poor farming speed
2) you have 72 free damage just from farming, I don't think one utility item is going to kill you.
Even for farming alone I think eul's easily gives much better results than the other options.
Thank you, that's all I ask is that you actually give logical explanations rather than just going "wtf ur bad if you don't think thats good". I can understand that given that explanation behind it.
Again, I do think about these things, now that you guys are explaining them better it makes more sense. I don't know why you guys think I don't.
However to be fair, BKB will take care of it, but I don't think that discounts it completely.
If you're just playing Farmville 2015 HD Edition, I think you could make a case for Midas Euls, but I'm not really too sure about that.
You know what else is
SF with Blink + Euls.
Yeah, I can totally agree with that, but you have to throw BKB in there or bad things will probably happen.
i mean im really not going to explain it everytime you do something wrong because it would be a huge waste of time. This was just used as an example to prove my point. You're wrong quite a few times and you're stubbornly wrong, to the point where even when multiple people tell you otherwise with an explanation, you won't accept it until it becomes a hold-your-hand explain everything post like I did. Get over yourself ffs and just take advice to heart.
And the fact that you couldn't differentiate real advice from trolling for so long that you ended up refuting all advice at all kind of says something but I won't go over that because its time for a nap
And the fact that you couldn't differentiate real advice from trolling for so long that you ended up refuting all advice at all kind of says something but I won't go over that because its time for a nap
And here we are back to insults already. Again you are basically saying "we are right you are wrong shut up end of story".
And about the real advice vs trolling, seriously dude? When we are in a state of Dota right now where heroes buy items very untraditional for that hero, it gets extremely hard to tell the difference. A prime example of this is OoV Puck, you/milk gave a logical explanation behind it after I initially said " lol you are trolling" I guarantee you if I had never heard of Euls or Mek SF, I would have easily thought that was trolling. Get off your high horse and maybe stop acting like you are just above everyone else
Dreams-Visions
Member
r u 65
fwiw - it's not a waste of time; it provides insight to people who may also be wondering but won't ask because they don't want to feel embarrassed or feel they won't get a meaningful answer. Not everyone has been playing this game for half a decade or more. the time is appreciated by someone somewhere when light can be shed. it's part of the reason why I offer explanation when the opportunity makes sense. then again, I enjoy helping people understand things so it's right up my alley.
Cyborgmatt
Member
It stopped working. Shrug.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Shuggananas
Banned
only old people, babies and spanish people are allowed to nap
D
Deleted member 77995
Unconfirmed Member
I used to take naps after work twice a week or so but they ended up killing my productivity in the evenings.
And speaking of sleep I need to stop sacrificing my sleep schedule just for that extra game or two of Dota every night. Games are super sloppy when everyone is tired
And speaking of sleep I need to stop sacrificing my sleep schedule just for that extra game or two of Dota every night. Games are super sloppy when everyone is tired
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