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[lmimmfn]

Has this ever proven to be legit or is it just a talking point on Twitter? Genuine question.

Yes it's known, plenty of info on the net about it. Disney has the best ESG score in the business and I think that says it all.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

Hey, guys. Been a couple days, has the conversation around this game gotten a little less batshit insane ye-

in this high fantasy world of magic and monsters it would not surprise me if someone wanted to get rid of her breasts and asked their paladin friend to slice them out and cauterise the wound. Sounds pretty bad ass tbh

 

[Bombolone]

So let me get this straight - they desperately want to pass as the opposite gender, to the point where they will pursue disfiguring surgeries as a means to conceal their birth gender and suppress their dysmorphia, yet they also want to show off the scars caused by said surgeries as some kind of point of pride?

The latter undermines the former you idiots. Everyone knows you were born something else if you constantly point it out.

They literally othered themselves, made the point they aren't actually woman by leaving out woman from the character creator.

And to the point about hoping or finding glee in people losing their jobs.
Business 101. Make a product that the customer will pay for.
You make a product that cost $$$ but only sell $. The studio closes down and people lose their jobs, their ability to feed family, pay bills etc.
Who is at fault? The business who doesn't want to allocate the correct budget for the size of audience. 'Owning the chuds'. Making things personal… It's a business.
I'm not buying cream of mushroom soup just to be charitable.

 

[laynelane]

They literally othered themselves, made the point they aren't actually woman by leaving out woman from the character creator.

I found this article:

Dragon Age: The Veilguard's Character Creator Was Strongly Inspired By The Sims 4

The Sims 4 is a big part of why Dragon Age: The Veilguard's character creator is pretty good this time around.

www.thegamer.com

"Character creators are extremely complex, and in many ways even more personal. It's so important that players feel they can be represented and feel pride in that representation as they go through the creation process," says Busche. "In particular, I remember we were struggling with some of our iconography, and we turned to each other and said 'how did The Sims 4 handle this?.'"

Unless the Sims 4 greatly restricts how female characters can be created, this statement is bullshit. This kind of dishonesty - ' oh, we're all about representation and everyone feeling included because we're so progressive and compassionate' vs. 'in reality we're going to tell you what you may or may not have if you are a woman gamer or choose to play as a woman character. No, we don't care about your input or about reality.' - this all too predictable falseness just has to stop. I genuinely hope more people, men and women, speak up about this. This kind of regressive mindset has no place in current society and it's funny how it took the 'activists' to bring back a truly shitty way of defining and representing women.

 

[Kotaro]

DA: Veilguards looks like it's going to underperform as well

Anecdote, from Amazon pre-order number:

for the best selling game of the year, EA College Football, this number said '5K bought' 6-weeks before release for PS5 version. It topped at 40K the week of its release

But DA: Veilguards numbers are well below that 6 weeks before release

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

"And upon this extremely large slab of rock I shall writ 10 commandments that our lord has handed dow— oh Jesus fuck that's a dudes head"

Shamelessly stolen from Reddit

What a disgusting disgrace BioWare has become.

 

[laynelane]

DA: Veilguards looks like it's going to underperform as well

Anecdote, from Amazon pre-order number:

for the best selling game of the year, EA College Football, this number said '5K bought' 6-weeks before release for PS5 version. It topped at 40K the week of its release

But DA: Veilguards numbers are well below that 6 weeks before release

My country (Canada) has 50+ for the standard edition and 100+ for the deluxe at this time. I've never paid attention to pre-order numbers before so I don't know how that stacks up against other releases, but it seems very low.

 

[Panajev2001a]

I don't understand how Bioware was given 100 million by EA to make a AAA RPG and this is what we got.

Is this another case where all the normal people were chased off by the crazies leading to an unreliable feedback loop? Who did they do their market research on? It makes no sense, especially after seeing the response. No one likes what they're selling here.

btw Veilguard has completely plummeted in the pre-order charts on Steam. Unless there's a huge turnaround at launch heads on gonna roll for this one.

It might keep getting worse as many young kids push for jobs with better life:work balance and/or much higher pay… people choosing the gaming industry with the normalised crunch and lower pay are more easily filled with outcasts.

So, well… there is that too.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Accurate representation.

Again, if you say less prominent gluteus music has a wider representation and better proportions:

 

[Cyberpunkd]

As others have mentioned you had the option for body scars before, some games even allowed you to move them. By making it a dedicated slider you are clearly bringing trans issues into a fantasy game. A discussion could be had whether that's appropriate.

 

[GymWolf]

So let me get this straight - they desperately want to pass as the opposite gender, to the point where they will pursue disfiguring surgeries as a means to conceal their birth gender and suppress their dysmorphia, yet they also want to show off the scars caused by said surgeries as some kind of point of pride?

The latter undermines the former you idiots. Everyone knows you were born something else if you constantly point it out.

With this game? Yeah good luck.

Some of these people just wanna feel like special creatures, they don't really want to be considered full real women\men, that's why they have special pronouns instead of just accepting the she\he.

 

[MMaRsu]

Source video:

Bro what in the everloving fuck is this trash???

 

[GymWolf]

"And upon this extremely large slab of rock I shall writ 10 commandments that our lord has handed dow— oh Jesus fuck that's a dudes head"

Shamelessly stolen from Reddit

What a disgusting disgrace BioWare has become.

That thing was too big to be called a forehead, Too big, too thick, too heavy, and too rough, it was more like a large hunk of meat.

 

[kikii]

Bro what in the everloving fuck is this trash???

go read replies

 

[Loboxxx]

In my opinion, the heroes in movies, games, and books need to be handsome, attractive, or charismatic because they represent the ideal that the viewer, player, or reader aspires to be.

I think it's fine to include options that represent all kinds of people in games, but this isn't The SIMS, it's not a life simulator, this is medieval fantasy. You shouldn't be aiming to represent a diverse society; it should be about heroes, villains, and fantastic creatures, and we all know these are idealized characters, which makes total sense.

Dragon Age, like many others in recent years, is making a mistake by following this path so strongly.

 

[LegendOfKage]

Has this ever proven to be legit or is it just a talking point on Twitter? Genuine question.

ESG scores are absolutely a thing, and their use to decide which is a "good company" and which is a "bad company" is probably a lot more absurd than you might expect. There are many examples in this twitter thread:

 

[RJMacready73]

As others have mentioned you had the option for body scars before, some games even allowed you to move them. By making it a dedicated slider you are clearly bringing trans issues into a fantasy game. A discussion could be had whether that's appropriate.

This.. all they had to do was make it so you can create a few different types of scars, rotate em and place em where your boobs used to be and hey presto the 6 people in the world who would actually fucking do this in the game are satisfied and you've scored your Woke points and nobody gets pissed off instead they make it a fucking toggable option lol thereby inserting their insane politics directly into the fucking game which young kids will play and now ask their parents "mummy what are top scars?" How the fuck did they think that's going to go over???

 

[GymWolf]

This.. all they had to do was make it so you can create a few different types of scars, rotate em and place em where your boobs used to be and hey presto the 6 people in the world who would actually fucking do this in the game are satisfied and you've scored your Woke points and nobody gets pissed off instead they make it a fucking toggable option lol thereby inserting their insane politics directly into the fucking game which young kids will play and now ask their parents "mummy what are top scars?" How the fuck did they think that's going to go over???

You don't score woke points for doing what everyone does, they had to separate themselves from the bunch and being even more inclusive.

 

[lmimmfn]

ESG scores are absolutely a thing, and their use to decide which is a "good company" and which is a "bad company" is probably a lot more absurd than you might expect. There are many examples in this twitter thread:

What makes matters worse is that if using a broker to invest money with they will ask if you would prefer to invest in green initiatives or equality companies etc. of course everyone would say yes and broker ends up investing in tobacco companies or big oil simply because of their high ESG scores.

Basically normal people are being scammed to invest in woke without even being aware of it.

 

[P:axMagellanic]

Christ, I thought these two were dwarfs lol.

 

[jason10mm]

In my opinion, the heroes in movies, games, and books need to be handsome, attractive, or charismatic because they represent the ideal that the viewer, player, or reader aspires to be.

I think it's fine to include options that represent all kinds of people in games, but this isn't The SIMS, it's not a life simulator, this is medieval fantasy. You shouldn't be aiming to represent a diverse society; it should be about heroes, villains, and fantastic creatures, and we all know these are idealized characters, which makes total sense.

Dragon Age, like many others in recent years, is making a mistake by following this path so strongly.

See, this is a masculine perspective. MEN (and boys) are fine playing with things that ARE NOT THEM, but are what THEY WANT TO BE and they are totally willing to modify things to achieve that whey want. Girls are the ones that project themselves into play and are the ones quack psychologists say need 1:1 visual representation, which is why you get silly shit like "blind barbie" or "wheelchair bound barbie" Dah fuck? Barbie is a chunk of plastic, you can pretend its blind or wheelchair bound with ANY barbie, at most you just need an accessory or 2, (or a barbie with even the most basic level or articulation to be able to sit down). Boys, on the other hand, would carve out the eyes of a doll so it will disfigured and blind, melt the feet off to make for a handicapped one, or just, you know, PRETEND.

So as we see more women (and feminized males) in the design space, their attitudes towards character and representation start to take sway and we see character design being less about how to make a limited but all badass range of options and going towards a smorgasbord of weak sauce choices that were only curated to make sure the "male gaze" couldn't exploit it.

 

[NickFire]

Where we at with this game? Still in the phase of cherry picked previewers intended to draw in the modern audience? Or have we gotten to whispers of failure while a few unhinged people lash out at the actual audience? Or have we crossed into sneaky hit pieces pretending all the failures were caused by some sort of toxicity that ignores the pink elephant with blue hair standing in the room?

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

Where we at with this game? Still in the phase of cherry picked previewers intended to draw in the modern audience? Or have we gotten to whispers of failure while a few unhinged people lash out at the actual audience? Or have we crossed into sneaky hit pieces pretending all the failures were caused by some sort of toxicity that ignores the pink elephant with blue hair standing in the room?

It's clearly a mediocre 60-70 game that wouldn't be talked about if not for the outlandish self-insert stuff pushed by its creators.

 

[digdug2]

I loved the Dragon Age games. The initial trailer for this one, while shiny, didn't really suck me in. And now with this craziness, I went from 'not interested' to 'fuck this game, and fuck BioWare'. I have no issue with people being happy and comfortable in their own skin, but adding this stuff into a high fantasy video game is ridiculous and stupid. Get your agendas and liberal nonsense out of here. Sweetbaby Jesus, I hope this game crashes and burns.

 

[Bombolone]

I found this article:

Dragon Age: The Veilguard's Character Creator Was Strongly Inspired By The Sims 4

The Sims 4 is a big part of why Dragon Age: The Veilguard's character creator is pretty good this time around.

www.thegamer.com

Unless the Sims 4 greatly restricts how female characters can be created, this statement is bullshit. This kind of dishonesty - ' oh, we're all about representation and everyone feeling included because we're so progressive and compassionate' vs. 'in reality we're going to tell you what you may or may not have if you are a woman gamer or choose to play as a woman character. No, we don't care about your input or about reality.' - this all too predictable falseness just has to stop. I genuinely hope more people, men and women, speak up about this. This kind of regressive mindset has no place in current society and it's funny how it took the 'activists' to bring back a truly shitty way of defining and representing women.

I think it would do a lot of good for the conversation around representation if the developer changed their stance on the character creator. Come out with a statement acknowledging that bodies come in many different shapes and sizes. Apologize for excluding 50% of the population (say you learned from the conversations being had in the community), allow Women the ability to create characters that more resemble them and move on.
At some point the companies have to acknowledge that they can't hold disdain for their customer base (majority men) which punishes woman (of certain proportions) as well. I think someone in Bioware/EA (at the top) who isn't so entrenched in their views, needs to have a conversation with the studio.

edit: Woman/Women error.

 

[Kacho]

DA: Veilguards looks like it's going to underperform as well

Anecdote, from Amazon pre-order number:

for the best selling game of the year, EA College Football, this number said '5K bought' 6-weeks before release for PS5 version. It topped at 40K the week of its release

But DA: Veilguards numbers are well below that 6 weeks before release

Pre-orders are lackluster on Steam as well. It was in the 80s on the top sellers list when previews dropped last week. Then it jumped to the 60s. Over the weekend it dropped out of the top 100. Now it's sitting at 94.

For comparison, Dragon Ball Sparkling Zero hasn't budged from the number 12 spot.

 

[Da1337Vinci]

I don't know if this was already show here. But here writers at Kotaku complain about the lack of breast sizes possible. Though they use kinda racism for why the dev didn't include it.

Link to article as achive

 

[laynelane]

I don't know if this was already show here. But here writers at Kotaku complain about the lack of breast sizes possible. Though they use kinda racism for why the dev didn't include it.

Link to article as achive

Even when it comes to an issue like this, Kotaku has to bring race into it - not enough virtue signal points if the issue is solely about women, I guess. Despite all that, there are a few interesting points. This is a good one:

And so I actually got really frustrated and kind of angry with the Dragon Age character creator because I'm sorry, like you should be allowed to have big breasts in a game. You should be able to have wide hips in a game. Because if you just throw that all out to not give bad actors the ability to do something, you're effectively just erasing us.

It address a big problem with the character creator while simultaneously making a good point against that 'male gaze' bullshit argument.

Edit: Forgot to add - I don't agree with the "bad actors" part of the comment. I'm assuming that's meant for men who want to make women with big boobs, butts, curves, etc. (the horror!!) But there's nothing wrong with a person creating the character they want. Generalizing millions of people you know nothing about (bad actors) and demonizing normal behavior just comes across as histrionic and foolish.

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

I just don't get why anyone would want this. If you're trans FTM then you believe you are or are supposed to be a male. Why would want to be trans in game instead of just male?

 

[Senua]

I don't know if this was already show here. But here writers at Kotaku complain about the lack of breast sizes possible. Though they use kinda racism for why the dev didn't include it.

Link to article as achive

Meh they have a point.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

Even when it comes to an issue like this, Kotaku has to bring race into it - not enough virtue signal points if the issue is solely about women, I guess.

Lol seriously. Like they couldn't just say "many, many women have larger breasts and butts than the character creator allows", instead they had to make it about "Black and brown women" being neglected.

I guess racism is a much more serious charge than bias against curvy women, but that is really stretching it.

 

[PeteBull]

Fixed.

Yup both male and female ones, male ones are even worse coz as guys they arent supposed to be delulu their whole life, they gotta stay on earth, or real world will punish them, badly =D

 

[PeteBull]

That thing was too big to be called a forehead, Too big, too thick, too heavy, and too rough, it was more like a large hunk of meat.

As a guy with Guts in my avatar pic:

 

[Kacho]

I just don't get why anyone would want this. If you're trans FTM then you believe you are or are supposed to be a male. Why would want to be trans in game instead of just male?

Yeah, it's really dumb and makes the obvious pandering harder to tolerate.

I've never been someone that roleplays myself in these games. I want to play the role of something I'm NOT... and my primary interest is in building my CLASS. Not fucking digital sex dolls. But whatever.

 

[Kacho]

Guys, what do you think Morrigan's sweat smells like?

 

[Facism]

I bet there is a dialog where you have "Bruh" as a choice.

Quote me on that.

Waiting for "yikes, yall," "nothingburger" and "am I the only one?"

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

All this "modernism" and the one they'll really experience is FAFO.

 

[Plague Doctor]

I firmly believe we as a species picked the wrong option in the end of ME3 and unlocked the shittiest, dumbest possible ending for BioWare.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

1. There's a difference between woke and progressive. Games like Spider-Man 2 and TLOU2 have stories with progressive themes. It's not just window dressing. Those games are about self-actualization and identity and having a place in the world, and therefore

2. Political or politically-tinged themes belong some places and not others. Where they fit, and are done well (TLOU2, Life is Strange, Death Stranding, Bioshock) the games are richer for it and tend to sell well. When they're hamfisted bullshit (Concord), we get annoyed and the games tend to bomb.

Put more simply - there's a difference between pronouns on a selection screen and Lev.

I agree with all of this aside from the mention of Spider-Man 2 next to TLOU2.

Spider-Man 2 was full of woke propagandizing BS. From the complete emasculation of Peter Parker, to the needless deaf girl segments, to Mary Jane being able to take down fucking roided uber criminals and even fucking symbiotes with her little tazer, I have no idea how someone can come away from that game thinking the game was made better by all that shit. It was overwhelmingly ruined by it all.

If by Spider-Man 2, you actually meant the Miles Morales spin-off game, then I'd fully agree with you. That game was progressive compared to SM2's on the nose woke BS.

 

[Zacfoldor]

Well...damn. This game is shit....

I don't know if they realized it but like they just made everyone I subscribe to on youtube rich if this game is even half as woke as its character creator. Actually I take that back. The character creator is enough.

I think they realized the community is going to Concord all these ultrawoke games way too late in the dev cycle and now we are in for some painful few years.

Unless this one really surprises me, day never.

 

[raduque]

This reminds me of that old Toyota Tacoma(?) World of Warcraft commercial

As for the new Dragon Age game... I think I'll skip it.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I'm not a DA gamer. But those of you who are, good luck gaffers.

 

[simpatico]

Is this true?

Bro got the Judy Alvarez romance in Cyberpunk and said yolo let's chop it off and shoot my shot.

 

[VictorVectors]

Purple Pre Pubescent Stock Plummet

 

[rkofan87]

I am sure the game is thoroughly mediocre based off what I played. I went about halfway through DA Origins on 360 and remember having a lot more fun, think I romanced the blonde chick lol. But publishers care about sales & review scores and Inquisition did pretty good on both of those fronts. From what I remember on forums it was seen as at least better than DAII haha.

what was the hate for da2 do to or was it just mid?
never got into the da games at all tried dao on ps3 it was a ps + game and it was ugly as sin might give it shot on xbox sx at some point.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Gonna pick this game up when it's in the bargain bin, where it deserves to be. Imagine paying $70 for this mess.

 

[Saturn Dragon]

Too much purple. Is it a reset era game?

 

[Dazraell]

what was the hate for da2 do to or was it just mid?
never got into the da games at all tried dao on ps3 it was a ps + game and it was ugly as sin might give it shot on xbox sx at some point.

Well, after Origins EA decided to quickly release a sequel. DA2 was rushed and launched like year and a half after Origins. It had plenty of issues like tons of recycled environments (one cave layout used for literally each cave present in game, each house in a city had same interior, etc), game took place in a single city and its surroundings so scope wasn't as epic as in Origins, they changed artstyle and made game more ugly, story wasn't that good either, and combat was dumbed down in favor to making it more action-oriented. It just wasn't a good game

 

[Superkewl]

Gonna pick this game up when it's in the bargain bin, where it deserves to be. Imagine paying $70 for this mess.

I cant even imagine paying bargain bin prices for this.

 

[raduque]

Insecure feminists in top positions + DEI consultants + Toxic Positivity echo chambers = Modern Western AAA games industry.

Once they lose enough money the Industry will hopefully course correct.

The problem is that The Message is the only reason these people exist and do what they do, and they will push The Message at all costs, no matter how much money or how many developers or publishers they burn through. The Industry sees the massively vocal massively minor minority on X/tumblr/imgur/deviantart crying about wanting more representation (despite the fact that representation is STUPID.) so they think it's what will make money, despite the fact that there's like 50 people across all these platforms in the entire world that will buy a game.