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[HStallion]

Can I say the metrinome is quite possibly one of the best item pick ups in the game. If you get a decent gun and build up your kills without switching a weapon or getting hit you can be one shotting enemies several floors down and doing massive damage to the bosses. With the regular AK 47 I cleared several floors without getting hit and was doing incredible amounts of damage by the end.

It requires you to be good at dodging when you first get it to build up your damage but once you get going and clear a few rooms you can destroy most enemies, even tough large ones, in a couple shots and usually before they get off more than one attack.

 

[spineduke]

Can I say the metrinome is quite possibly one of the best item pick ups in the game. If you get a decent gun and build up your kills without switching a weapon or getting hit you can be one shotting enemies several floors down and doing massive damage to the bosses. With the regular AK 47 I cleared several floors without getting hit and was doing incredible amounts of damage by the end.

It requires you to be good at dodging when you first get it to build up your damage but once you get going and clear a few rooms you can destroy most enemies, even tough large ones, in a couple shots and usually before they get off more than one attack.

incoming balance patch

 

[jim2point0]

First time getting this far...

Scattershot seems really good. But I LOVED the proton pack. Combined with electric bullets, that carried me through most of the rooms.

 

[Purkake4]

Proton Backpack OP, pls nerf.

 

[Out_Of_Ammo]

I still haven't seen the proton pack. Best I got was the fightsaber.

 

[Incendiary]

I still haven't seen the proton pack. Best I got was the fightsaber.

So far those two have been my favorite weapons by far. Proton Pack is the best for bosses while Fightsaber is just all around useful for everything. Eye of the Beholster is probably top five as well due to how useful the last shot is. AK-47 is no slouch either for a "basic" weapon - lots of ammo and pretty damn good stopping power.

I'm not a huge fan of any charge weapons. I have a habit of letting go of the charge and shooting in the direction I'm moving instead of the direction I want. Probably not as big an issue for KB/M though.

 

[Footos22]

Big bullets plus eye of the beholster last shot is amazing lol

 

[Out_Of_Ammo]

So far those two have been my favorite weapons by far. Proton Pack is the best for bosses while Fightsaber is just all around useful for everything. Eye of the Beholster is probably top five as well due to how useful the last shot is. AK-47 is no slouch either for a "basic" weapon - lots of ammo and pretty damn good stopping power.

I'm not a huge fan of any charge weapons. I have a habit of letting go of the charge and shooting in the direction I'm moving instead of the direction I want. Probably not as big an issue for KB/M though.

Yeah Eye of the Beholster is great too. One very good charge weapon I got a few times is the Crescent crossbow. The charged shot explodes in countless bullets. That thing clears rooms insanely quick and is also great for bosses. It was that weapon that made me kill Blockner and his goons with ease (and a little help from my pal the space turtle).


Just fought the Pillars for the second time, without a good weapon. I was doing so well, dodging all their shots and only getting hit 1 time while I entered with 2 hearts. I killed 3 pillars and suddenly he transforms and wrecks my shit... Fml I'll take the high priest anytime over those damn pillars. And I still haven't seen the wall.

 

[dralla]

Can you even dodge roll during the Pilot's Past? I remember trying to right-click during the fight and the ship did nothing. That attack pattern does look like it was made specifically for dodge rolling over, though. I watched a couple videos of the fight afterward and each time someone faced that attack pattern, they used a blank.

You can. I ended up beating the Pilot past. You have to dodge from far back like I thought, to get through that attack. All pasts are killed, whew. I had the dream combo of passive items. One that turns all chests into mimics and one that removes all mimics. So every chest in the game was unlocked.

 

[sqwarlock]

End of my best run so far. Getting closer and closer to the end each time.

Played a game of skill, got a rainbow chest.

Opened the chest and got these shinies.

But then I went into the Kill Pillars fight with 1 1/2 hearts.

 

[Gsnap]

Getting nothing but bows an charge guns in one run as the hunter. That's ok. I love always having to charge up one shot at a time.... ¬_¬

 

[Out_Of_Ammo]

Aaaargh, brought the TV all the way to floor 5 and died before I found the blacksmith. And to think I managed to beat the kill pillars with only being hit once. If only I would have had a good gun, the best one I got was the mailbox. But at least I got an achievement for killing a boss covered in glitter by using that I guess...

 

[HStallion]

Getting nothing but bows an charge guns in one run as the hunter. That's ok. I love always having to charge up one shot at a time.... ¬_¬

Some single shot guns can get crazy strong even if they dont start that way. I got the items that make the first and last shots stronger in a clip and was doing giant damage.

 

[Miker]

I wish the first chamber was more challenging but had some sort of free chest to balance it out, so that you could play with more of the arsenal. As it stands, if playing efficiently, chamber 1 is kinda circle strafe with peashooter simulator 2016. I don't necessarily mind, but I'm not great at the game, and so I feel like I'm not really playing with the best part of the game - the wacky weapons and items - until 5+ minutes into it every time.

 

[jim2point0]

Kill Pillars are harder than the dragun....

 

[dralla]

My game crashed after I beat the floor 5 boss just as I was going to floor 6 for the first time sigh

 

[Gsnap]

Some single shot guns can get crazy strong even if they dont start that way. I got the items that make the first and last shots stronger in a clip and was doing giant damage.

Yeah, I've had some runs with great single shot weapons. But this one wasn't. I wasn't getting enough passives to buff them. Just bow, after bow, after bow.

But it's good. Forces me to get better at the game. I was pretty good too. Got flawless on the first 2 boss, and got High Priest down to one or two hits from death before I died.

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

I swear to God every other run result in my getting no more than 1 key drop on the first 3 floors despite me rarely getting hit. I love the game, but the RNG component is the most frustrating I've seen in any Rougelike.

 

[Large Professor]

I got a black chest on the first floor (with super good weapons) three times in a row.

I almost feel it's some sort of algorithm to make the game easier at some point. Maybe because I haven't beat it yet despite numerous runs.

 

[Prodigal]

Game has frozen on me (PS4) twice today. Not sure what's going on but it's pissing me off.

 

[Santar]

I find it a bit worrying that they seem to be making the game easier and easier with each patch. Keys are more plentiful, a boss is made easier, and now even secret rooms are more easily found.

The game is supposed to be hard!
You're not supposed to find everything on one run. It's okay if you can't open a chest because you're out of keys or that you didn't find all secret rooms in a level.
That's the beauty of randomization, you never know what you're going to find!

It feels like they are diluting the game with all these changes to make it easier.
The more predictable and easy it gets the less fun it is to play, knowing that you sometimes won't have enough keys to open a chest makes it more fun when you actually do.

Just make a easy mode for the people who want the game easier, just don't call it easy mode because they won't like that Call it arcade mode or something.

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

I find it a bit worrying that they seem to be making the game easier and easier with each patch. Keys are more plentiful, a boss is made easier, and now even secret rooms are more easily found.

The game is supposed to be hard!
You're not supposed to find everything on one run. It's okay if you can't open a chest because you're out of keys or that you didn't find all secret rooms in a level.
That's the beauty of randomization, you never know what you're going to find!

Feels like they are diluting the game with all these changes to make it easier.
Just make a easy mode for the people who want the game easier, just don't call it easy mode because they won't like that Call it arcade mode or something.

Bullshit friend. It just means you get one guaranteed drop or shop key on the first floor. Further still, they removed a way to find secret rooms with your starter fun so they were easier to find before the patching began.

If the game is supposed to be hard they should buff enemies/bosses (I don't think the tank needed a nerf). Not being able to open chests because RNG fucks you over is frustrating, doesn't add any difficulty and makes going through the early levels tedious. There's no strategy with key use outside of if you brave the secret levels because you just end up opening the best chest on the floor. Blowing keys on locked rooms isn't worth the risk because you don't know what's inside.

They should add a keyless mode and call it "Mode for people who don't have time to waste on shitty RNG runs" I really don't want the game to be easier, I just want it to be more fun.

 

[Pestilence11]

Further still, they removed a way to find secret rooms with your starter fun so they were easier to find before the patching began.

PS4 version hasn't received a patch and starter guns don't reveal secret rooms so not sure where you're getting that.

 

[Parallax]

Question. Are bosses probe to special damage? I used the proton pack on cannonbalrog and his hp seemed to melt away.

I finally got the quad laser and then the fat bullets, and all i could do was quote the quad glacier line.

 

[mbpm1]

PS4 version hasn't received a patch and starter guns don't reveal secret rooms so not sure where you're getting that.

they do apparently. the shot effect is different even though there's no crack in the wall

 

[Pestilence11]

they do apparently. the shot effect is different even though there's no crack in the wall

Oh I stand corrected then. I always wondered if having a passive on your gun like electric bullets would be enough to reveal cracks but I never found that to be the case.

 

[Santar]

Bullshit friend. It just means you get one guaranteed drop or shop key on the first floor. Further still, they removed a way to find secret rooms with your starter fun so they were easier to find before the patching began.

If the game is supposed to be hard they should buff enemies/bosses (I don't think the tank needed a nerf). Not being able to open chests because RNG fucks you over is frustrating, doesn't add any difficulty and makes going through the early levels tedious. There's no strategy with key use outside of if you brave the secret levels because you just end up opening the best chest on the floor. Blowing keys on locked rooms isn't worth the risk because you don't know what's inside.

They should add a keyless mode and call it "Mode for people who don't have time to waste on shitty RNG runs" I really don't want the game to be easier, I just want it to be more fun.

It almost sounds like roguelikes/lites aren't your type of game.
The randomization is an integral part of the genre. For fans of roguelikes/lites the randdomization is a huge part of what makes them fun.

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

It almost sounds like roguelikes/lites aren't your type of game.
The randomization is an integral part of the genre. For fans of roguelikes/lites the randdomization is a huge part of what makes them fun.

Then I sure fucked up by putting hundreds of hours into a combination of Isaac, Necrodancer, Throne, Rogue Legacy, Convoy, Dungeon's of Dredmor, Splunky, Dwarf Fortress, Tales of Maj'Eyla, Sunless Sea, Darkest Dungeon etc...

I love rougelikes/lites and I think the RNG elements in Gungeon are the worst designed that I've ever seen. I'm only complaining about it here because I think the elements outside of the RNG balance are amazing.

 

[CHC]

I love rougelikes/lites and I think the RNG elements in Gungeon are the worst designed that I've ever seen. I'm only complaining about it here because I think the elements outside of the RNG balance are amazing.

I pretty much agree with you. I wouldn't say Gungeon has "the worst I've ever seen" or anything, but I think that in general RNG exists to facilitate interesting situations and choices, not to just corner you in a shitty situation where you can't do anything. Lately I think it's been OK but I'll definitely say that before the patch the key drops were just crap, much more often than not they just fucked you over and you couldn't do a thing about it. Having access to only two keys to reach the oubliette level is a fun choice because you have to give up chests to get there. Having access to only one key and there being fuck all you can do to get in there is just annoying.

Some randomness is great, but not when it's thoughtless and preventing you from making actual decisions.

You can take the argument in favor of RNG for the sake of RNG to the extreme by imagining EVERYTHING being random, and entering a room where you fall straight into a pit with no recourse, or it's a tiny 2x2 chamber with a Lead Maiden in it. That wouldn't be smart or interesting, it would just be dumb. So there's a limit, obviously.

 

[HStallion]

Has anyone just given up the gun eating chests? I've used them about 5 times and have never gotten a weapon I consider worth sacrificing two guns even when giving it really good guns.

 

[MassiveNights]

Got a thing for a master round.

Is that a thing? What does it do?

I've only been playing for a couple of hours so don't know what it is, but I managed to do the first chamber & boss without losing health (prob because of the sick Ghostbusters gun).

It felt pretty great regardless.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVR_kh1pfbY

 

[mbpm1]

Has anyone just given up the gun eating chests? I've used them about 5 times and have never gotten a weapon I consider worth sacrificing two guns even when giving it really good guns.

I thought you were supposed to give crap guns to it when you ran out of ammo/didn't feel they were worth keeping

 

[-MD-]

Got a thing for a master round.

Is that a thing? What does it do?

I've only been playing for a couple of hours so don't know what it is, but I managed to do the first chamber & boss without losing health (prob because of the sick Ghostbusters gun).

It felt pretty great regardless.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVR_kh1pfbY

You get a master round for defeating a boss without taking damage, it gives you an extra heart container that lasts until you die.

 

[MassiveNights]

You get a master round for defeating a boss without taking damage, it gives you an extra heart container that lasts until you die.

Nice!

 

[Megasoum]

How do you unlock the store on the left of the main door where you use your currency to unlock weapons?

 

[-MD-]

How do you unlock the store on the left of the main door where you use your currency to unlock weapons?

You'll come across that NPC eventually by just playing the game, once you talk to them the door will open up.

 

[Megasoum]

You'll come across that NPC eventually by just playing the game, once you talk to them the door will open up.

Ok cool thanks

 

[Skittles]

I find it a bit worrying that they seem to be making the game easier and easier with each patch. Keys are more plentiful, a boss is made easier, and now even secret rooms are more easily found.

The game is supposed to be hard!
You're not supposed to find everything on one run. It's okay if you can't open a chest because you're out of keys or that you didn't find all secret rooms in a level.
That's the beauty of randomization, you never know what you're going to find!

It feels like they are diluting the game with all these changes to make it easier.
The more predictable and easy it gets the less fun it is to play, knowing that you sometimes won't have enough keys to open a chest makes it more fun when you actually do.

Just make a easy mode for the people who want the game easier, just don't call it easy mode because they won't like that Call it arcade mode or something.

There's been literally one patch. Talk about hyperbole
thisisneogaf.gif

 

[Incendiary]

Has anyone just given up the gun eating chests? I've used them about 5 times and have never gotten a weapon I consider worth sacrificing two guns even when giving it really good guns.

I only use the gun eating chests when I have two crappy weapons - I've gotten a decent weapon out of it but I've never gotten any of the OP weapons so I don't expect that.

 

[AoM]

Made it to the 3rd floor for the first time, and almost beat the tank.

Getting better, but still pretty crap.

 

[Harbinger of War]

 

[Ozium]

There's been literally one patch. Talk about hyperbole
thisisneogaf.gif

Not counting minor bug fixes, there have been five (5) patches.

 

[Dingotech]

When are these 'easy' patches coming to PS4!

 

[Skittles]

Not counting minor bug fixes, there have been five (5) patches.

There's been one balance patch so far. Unless you count the one making secret rooms not obtuse as fuck and actually predictable like BOI

 

[septicore]

Playing as the

Spoiler

Robot

is hard. Can't reach chamber 5 with him like with other characters.

 

[Harbinger of War]

I think the Railgun might be the second best room-clearing gun in the game next to only the BSG. Absolute beast of a weapon. Takes a long time to get enough Hegemony credits to unlock it but it's worth the wait.

 

[spineduke]

It almost sounds like roguelikes/lites aren't your type of game.
The randomization is an integral part of the genre. For fans of roguelikes/lites the randdomization is a huge part of what makes them fun.

that's such a boilerplate response. noone is arguing against having randomization, but if you're not even given one key through any means, then you have a poorly designed game. all roguelites do randomization, but they do it while respecting the player. look at spelunky for a game that randomizes everything within certain boundaries so as not to irreversibly fuck the player over. the fact that the devs have addressed this in two separate patches means they agree with the people who have raised this time and time again.

 

[danowat]

I have to agree with the notion that the RNG in this game is just way heavy handed and hard on the player.

I love the game, I love the difficulty, but I have just been fucked over by the RNG way too many times.

I did 4 runs this morning two of them I didn't get a new gun until late in floor 3, I get that it's supposed to be difficult, but the game is about guns, so not getting one until your 15 minutes in just makes me not want to bother.

 

[Mistouze]

The table techs are the best thing in this game. Table tech rocket is hilarious.

Yep, instabuy when they come up in the shop.

RE RNG key drops : I've just accepted keys are bought, not dropped most of the time. Game gives you monde. Got to use it.

 

[Pestilence11]

Having access to only two keys to reach the

Spoiler

obliette

level is a fun choice because you have to give up chests to get there. Having access to only one key and there being fuck all you can do to get in there is just annoying.

Have to say I agree with this. Trying to get through

Spoiler

Oubliette

is a bitch with just the starting weapon, because just getting two keys to get in there on PS4 (no patch) can mean multiple quick restarts. I made it to the

Spoiler

Abbey

only once so far and was very ill-equipped.

For regular runs the key issue can be annoying too, but more manageable.