Umbasaborne
Banned
Not hard to believe when there is a development hell rumor about nearly every single one of their upcoming releases
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Ex-Halo Infinite developers criticise "incompetent leadership" at Microsoft
- Thread starter IbizaPocholo
- Start date
- Opinion Game Dev
clarky
Gold Member
Agreed. Immediately discredits anything this guy says.I call out how amazing the Multiplayer Leadership team was during development.
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Interfectum
Member
It's not just 343. I don't know how you can look at the state of Xbox right now and see anything but incompetence.
ToTTenTranz
Banned
The most definitive proof of major mismanagement you could find was Microsoft's output throughout the past 2 decades.
What these tweets are showing are the reasons for the mismanagement.
Who said they didn't, through their internal channels?
If you're talking about coming out to say this publicly then it could be that they were under a contract and yesterday they were fired.
Just a minor correction. Ori and Flight Sim aren't made by MS studios but are first party games.
Morrie’s wig shop
Member
I feel that Batman the animated series was green lit sometime after the box office success of the 1989 Batman movie. Then in 92 they released Batman Returns and then that same year the animated series came out for the first time and believe me the kids ate that shit up.
And now for the twist, amazingly in that same year (1992) Marvel releases X-Men the animated series the same year as the Batman animated series
And to my knowledge I think the Punisher is the only movie Marvel attempted before Brian Singers X-men trilogy.
And now for the twist, amazingly in that same year (1992) Marvel releases X-Men the animated series the same year as the Batman animated series
And to my knowledge I think the Punisher is the only movie Marvel attempted before Brian Singers X-men trilogy.
gothmog
Gold Member
It's probably both. Bonnie Ross is only a problem if she's enabled by having no accountability.
Most of the problems at Xbox come down to accountability.
Morrie’s wig shop
Member
I would think that it could fall under the whistle blowing act? Which would nullify any NDC.
But then again it could be why Bonnie Ross is no longer there. Who else has gone MIA from the top over the past year?
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Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
How Matt Booty has a job is beyond me.
What is his resume?
He worked on sound effects/design for games in the early 90s. Then designed a bunch of shit games at Midway like NFL Blitz and NBA Ballers before becoming President and CEO of midway after a bunch of executives left during their bankruptcy. He was in charge of product development during their bankruptcy.
Microsoft then hired him as studio head of their redmond team that made xbox live arcade games and windows phone games. He then got promoted during a restructure to take over all of microsoft's development.
In the last 8 years as head of Microsoft gaming...he's done essentially nothing
What is his resume?
He worked on sound effects/design for games in the early 90s. Then designed a bunch of shit games at Midway like NFL Blitz and NBA Ballers before becoming President and CEO of midway after a bunch of executives left during their bankruptcy. He was in charge of product development during their bankruptcy.
Microsoft then hired him as studio head of their redmond team that made xbox live arcade games and windows phone games. He then got promoted during a restructure to take over all of microsoft's development.
In the last 8 years as head of Microsoft gaming...he's done essentially nothing
kadab
Member
ToTTenTranz
Banned
The whistleblowing act is for illegal or grossly unethical practices.
Incompetence is neither of those.
Magic Carpet
Gold Member
As a Microsoft investor, I want the entire 343 shut down and all that money spent elsewhere.
I think it’s a white elephant. The series and the people involved have negatively impacted the brand of Xbox.
I don’t want to see another Halo anything for 3 more generations.
I think it’s a white elephant. The series and the people involved have negatively impacted the brand of Xbox.
I don’t want to see another Halo anything for 3 more generations.
Interfectum
Member
Phil and Matt's philosophy is to give developers time and money to make their "dream game." If you've ever managed people before you know full well what a ton of money and a fuzzy deadline does to them. All survival instinct is gone with those developers which is what a lot of creatives need to do their best work.
Morrie’s wig shop
Member
Your leadership needs accountability and a schedule to abide by.
I almost feel like Microsoft takes any criticism to heart and try to fix every specific criticism and it ends up being this chaotic scene of no accountability but hey it’s the cool development studio with no sense of direction just kick your feet up on the desk and this shit will make itself.
I’m only talking 343 here.
Morrie’s wig shop
Member
Unfortunately
Razvedka
Banned
Good engineering requires constraints. There must always be deadlines, requirements, etc.
These constraints don't need to be brutal or anything, but they do need to exist.
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ChorizoPicozo
Member
he can't even fake it.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
didn't knew Michael Cera was at MS.dont forget forget these.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Twitter is cancer after all
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
I don't know if that is their philosophy.
That's not what happened with Halo Infinite at least. I think they put a shit ton of pressures on their studios to deliver GOTY games on time, and then they realize the pressure hasn't worked out, the game isn't GOTY and then they're forced to delay to save some face.
This has resulted in two years of Xbox Series with very few releases and even the Xbox One didn't have a slew of hits and Booty has basically been in charge since the Xbox One days.
I think Booty went to Spencer who in turn went to Nadella and basically said, we don't have the studios to compete and if we want GamePass to be successful we need our own content. They told Nadella, they needed to buy studios with established track records for making good games and that had relationships with Microsoft especially when they were at their peak (360) best-selling games included CoD and Elders Scrolls.
Nadella, flush with revenue from O365 enterprise subscriptions who will do anything to expand subscription revenue bought the idea and nearly 80 billion dollars later, here we are.
Interfectum
Member
Wasn't Halo in development for like 6-7 years? And even after all that time the game was released massively unfinished? Seems to me that these devs are given way too much time and money to make these kinds of mistakes. MS owns more studios than Nintendo or Sony yet they basically skipped an entire year last year. Their biggest game for this year is one they bought half (or more) finished. What are all of these people working on and where is the urgency to ship some shit?
kuncol02
Banned
What exactly you expect them to do actually? Chain devs to desks? If they would not allow them to buy back their company they would left and create new studio with money that they had to pay MS.
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
Bungie wanted to not make halo
MS said keep making halo.
That's why they left. Bungie would have stayed if MS gave more creative freedom.
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
The Initiative leaks described similar phenomenon. They let them have complete freedom.
I think they're trying to over-correct from the late 360 / early Xbox One mistakes they made with their studios. Mandated Kinect games for Lionhead and Rare. They're probably trying to just let people make what they want, which is a good thing.
The problems at each studio will be different also. Each one has a different development system and culture. Naughty Dog doesn't make games in the exact same way that Sucker Punch does. It sounds like MS also does internal studio seminars to share knowledge between teams, so that's kind of the best they can do really. They need experienced directors, producers and studio heads. The people above that are mostly in charge of just giving them time and money, which they do.
U n i o n 0015
Member
It starts at the top.
Spencer has made some bets that so far haven't paid off (or they have, and my old school way of thinking is wrong). The hardware and GamePass are fantastic, but the content side--necessary to sell said hardware and GamePass subs--is incredibly lacking, especially when compared to Sony. It's not enough to have some great AA and indie games. You need those AAA, "catch the general public's attention" games.
I've yet to see evidence that all the studio acquisitions is going to be a strong play, especially since there's no product out in the marketplace. Plus, if the acquired studios are just going to be subject to how Microsoft manages studios, they'll soon become a shell of their former selves. And not pushing the content that the hardware and GamePass subs need.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Now MS gives their devs creative freedom and are now being accused of not tamping down on them enough. Doesn't look like they can win.
kuncol02
Banned
No one mandated Rare to make Kinect games.
https://www.destructoid.com/microsoft-didnt-push-for-kinect-development-rare-chose-it/
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
there is such a thing known as balance. not everything is black and white
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Who was the leadership at the Multiplayer Team.
Cuz it might be time to promote them.
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ThatStupidLion
Member
Poor upper management & leadership is a constantly recurring theme in every industry and prevalent at most companies.
I'm beginning to think that what comes off as poor upper management and leadership is actually just good business in the grand scheme. it's just "bad" for the lower 4/5ths (or whatever) of the company.....but theyre replaceable if they dont like it...
I'm beginning to think that what comes off as poor upper management and leadership is actually just good business in the grand scheme. it's just "bad" for the lower 4/5ths (or whatever) of the company.....but theyre replaceable if they dont like it...
The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Bungie went i dependant and made halo online hub.
gothmog
Gold Member
Nope. Guess its time to shut it all down. Absolutely no shades of gray between those black and white concepts of full accountability and no accountability.
diffusionx
Gold Member
What is that saying about success having many fathers but failure is an orphan? Obviously it is in the interests of the people who made these games to say that the fact that the games are shitty is not their fault. The truth is, a decade of nonstop failure and stumbling of the sort 343 had is a group effort.
The buck stops with Phil Spencer who kept Bonnie Ross on way too long (she should have been canned after Halo 5 released) but it’s failure all the way down.
The buck stops with Phil Spencer who kept Bonnie Ross on way too long (she should have been canned after Halo 5 released) but it’s failure all the way down.
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Topher
Identifies as young
I really have a hard time putting a lot of faith in people who trash their former employer. The issues surrounding Halo are well-known. Bonnie Ross lost her job due to those issues. There are no revelations here. So now we have a guy who has moved on and pointing fingers at those he left behind. It reeks of "look at me" twitter bullshit.
He is the "Former Senior Multiplayer Designer" at 343.
?
He is the "Former Senior Multiplayer Designer" at 343.
?
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Interfectum
Member
Or doesn't sound like MS has the culture to foster creative development. They swing hard one way and miss, then swing hard another way and miss. Maybe get some better managers in there.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Hopefully they toss Stinkles ass to the curb too. 343 stinks and needs major shakeups.
VAVA Mk2
Member
They left
LordOfChaos
Member
Firing 10,000 people and buying just short of 10,000, interesting lol
Really does hurt to see a favorite gaming franchise mismanaged this much...I wonder if they'll be releasing Infinite DLC at all now or if the game's just in maintenance mode, and if we'll ever get a satisfying end to the Master Chief saga, or give up and reboot years down the line. The end of Infinite was just potentially getting into the interesting stuff after prior years of mismanaging Halo. Real shame.
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yurinka
Member
As I remember the game started as a single player Xbox game but during development MS asked them to make it multiplayer and also to release it on PC. All this without giving them enough extra time to implement these things.
The top staff from PlayGround in charge of the recent Forza Horizon games left MS recently to create their own studio. So probably some people will be promoted and hired there. I don't expect this studio to be axed because they made the most successful and well reviewed recent MS games.
Ori is a 2nd party game (meaning, MS funded and published it but an external studio they don't own developed it).
But yes, even if we don't have numbers seems these games you mention did a good job at least in quality.
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Banjo64
cumsessed
yurinka
Member
Yes, it's true. Kamiya, being a Japanese won't publicly throw shit to a partner. But there he's highlighting that they had no idea about online multiplayer.
Lucifers Beard
Member
Yet Phil is getting awards for being a legend? It’s only so long before the cracks will start to appear. I think the guy comes across well and says mostly all the right things. Saying and doing are very different though.