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February Wrasslin' |OT| WrassleGAF. In 2016.
- Thread starter FallingEdge
- Start date
My knowledge of the Lex Express era is pretty limited. I've yet to really dive into it.
TarpitCarnivore
Member
Previous to Austin was I think Brett and/or HBK.
Roman Reigns is basically comparable to Lex Luger and Big Daddy Cool Diesel. Two failed "face of the company" talents who didn't work because one was basically Neo Hogan and the other was pushed too soon. I guess to continue the comparison, Daniel Bryan was the closest thing we had to a Bret Hart that was more over and a better worker than either of them.
You are missing out. Especially on the interview with his bus driver...
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I dunno, outside of that horrible Springboard stunner move, I felt like he's kept up well with some of the more flippy indie guys that have come in.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Roman was always the breakout guy in the Shield. Always.
Bluekaveli
Member
Lex was over but at the same time, everyone was getting tired of the patriotic thing. It's why they grew sour on Khogan
Think of every face of the company since post-Hogan, there is always at least one failed top guy attempt, then the actual next top face is completely different from the previous one.
Hogan had two attempted replacements, Warrior and Luger. Bret ultimately was the real next guy.
Then Diesel as Bret's replacement, with HBK ultimately as the real next guy
Then arguably Rocky Maivia or HHH as HBK's replacement, that time is a bit muddled. Austin ultimately was the real next guy.
Then it's a special boom period where Rock is the top guy at the same time as Austin.
Then Orton as Rock/Austin's intended replacement, and Batista, but ultimately Cena was the real next guy.
Then they stopped looking for a next top guy and started looking for a number two guy behind Cena. They tried a lot of folks like Lashley over the years. Then they went with Del Rio and Sheamus, but Punk and Bryan ended up as the actual number two guys.
Reigns is the first time they've gone for a total new face of the company in a decade. So far...not good.
Hogan had two attempted replacements, Warrior and Luger. Bret ultimately was the real next guy.
Then Diesel as Bret's replacement, with HBK ultimately as the real next guy
Then arguably Rocky Maivia or HHH as HBK's replacement, that time is a bit muddled. Austin ultimately was the real next guy.
Then it's a special boom period where Rock is the top guy at the same time as Austin.
Then Orton as Rock/Austin's intended replacement, and Batista, but ultimately Cena was the real next guy.
Then they stopped looking for a next top guy and started looking for a number two guy behind Cena. They tried a lot of folks like Lashley over the years. Then they went with Del Rio and Sheamus, but Punk and Bryan ended up as the actual number two guys.
Reigns is the first time they've gone for a total new face of the company in a decade. So far...not good.
TarpitCarnivore
Member
Different crowds and time though. The crowds weren't nearly as "smarky" then they are now so it was still easy to eat up what the WWE was throwing at you. Luger also didn't originally come in as a face. He had that whole perfection angle initially. I don't think he really became a face until the whole Yokozuna thing and that was only because Yokozuna was a fantastic heel.
If you line up Roman's Shield run with Cena's US Champ run, Cena was many times the better performer, on the mic and in the ring.
Roman was over for sure, but even then there is a clear gap in talent level between the two.
Perspicacity
Banned
He was way more popular than early wrestling shorts Cena or pandering sports jersey rapper Cena, but for some reason it doesn't count because...?
Roman is a significantly better wrestler than Cena at that point in their career. Go back and watch some if you don't believe me.
There is no comparison to be made between Cena as a singles guy and Reigns as part of a three man group. If anything the bizarre truncated way Reigns' main roster career has been is a major contributor to his deficiencies now.
Never mind that Doctor of Thuganomics Cena was more popular than the Shield anyway.
Liquidsnake
Banned
IMHO
Roman is one heel turn away from becoming the biggest draw in WWE.
Cena will always be what ever it is that Cena is.
Roman is one heel turn away from becoming the biggest draw in WWE.
Cena will always be what ever it is that Cena is.
Yeah, but he doesn't move fluidly or naturally. And what's up with his terrible selling? Like, specifically when he's in a submission? Or that face he makes when he has someone in his fairly crappy STF?
I dunno. Maybe I'm misremembering. It's been a while.
A heel turn is not a magic fix all solution. It's not a guarantee of a Rocky Maivia > The Rock transformation.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Whether Roman was over in the Shield or not isn't that relevant right now because what the audience is objecting to at this point isn't the guy playing Roman Reigns, its that he's being forced in a world where audiences still subscribe to the theory that getting pushed should be a result of people liking you, not the opposite. Whether that has ever been true is a different story.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
I tweeted to Meltzer about that last point because I don't think so, but I also am not sure since I didn't follow WWE when Thuganomics was a thing. I didn't know how pervasive it was or what the genuine response was.
Watch the opening match of WrestleMania 20, and get your answer.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I don't think a heel turn would fix Reigns in the way you guys are imagining. It would fix him in terms of how popular he is right now, as a character, but I doubt it would stop anyone from booing him the second he did anything face-like.
When the Rock did it, it was because the ultra babyface character they assigned him was holding back his natural charisma, but I have yet to actually see anything like that from Roman. And hell, pretty much every thing we've heard from backstage stuff makes him sound like he's fucking clueless to begin with - Triple H had to lobby hard for the chair-beating angle and Roman's idea to protect his character was walking out of the Rumble under his own power (which made no fucken sense).
When the Rock did it, it was because the ultra babyface character they assigned him was holding back his natural charisma, but I have yet to actually see anything like that from Roman. And hell, pretty much every thing we've heard from backstage stuff makes him sound like he's fucking clueless to begin with - Triple H had to lobby hard for the chair-beating angle and Roman's idea to protect his character was walking out of the Rumble under his own power (which made no fucken sense).
Sure, but the fans want to boo the man so let them boo the man. Stop swimming upstream.
I've watched that Mania 20 match against Big Show quite a few times, and even if he's rough in the ring, the dude already knew exactly how to get that crowd heated up. His ring presence and timing was better than Reigns by a lot.
I think Reigns performs his move set way more smoothly than Cena did at that point in his career, but who gives a fuck when it's all just going through the motions with no flare and no passion.
Are... are you a lapsed fan too, brother?
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
You are a sick man.
Bluekaveli
Member
Roman reminds me so much of Diesel. People fell in love with Diesel because he looked good and was bsd ass. Same with Roman in The Shield. Now they've stripped away his cool factor, just like they did Diesel.
I don't understand your millennial hipster lingo, but you said you weren't following WWE during something-or-other...
I love Thuganomcis Cena. I missed out on it as I was lapsed during that point. Going back and watching it now, that shit was electric even if it was ludicrous.
This is an even better comparison than Luger.
Perspicacity
Banned
The reaction Roman gets at Mania XXX is significantly greater than Cena's at 20.
Was that a singles match? Was he asked to work a match by himself?
Hot tag reactions are NOT the same, ever if Roman did get some of the best reactions in those moments.
Didn't know roman had a single match at WM30, comparing the two is useless due to how they were booked.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
He should be the masked cody character again. Apex of his career.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I honestly just think the question of whether Roman was over in the Shield is totally irrelevant at this point. He's very clearly the opposite of over right now and he's not at the beginning of a Rocket Push - he's about to headline WrestleMania two years in a row.
Bluekaveli
Member
American Psycho Cody?, I love it
Stephen Amell will be starring in TMNT, surely Vince will keep Stardust around for one more cash-in.
And he went straight from the Shield into said Rocket Push. How can you be trying to have a "coronation" of a guy at two WMs in a row? It's like they keep delaying or repeating it til it gets the "correct" reaction but them delaying/repeating is just ensuring it's never, ever going to get the "correct" reaction.
It's not as though this WM 32 would be Reigns' offical entry into the top spot like WM 14 for Austin or WM 21 for Batista and Cena, he's already been the top guy for 13 months now. So what even is this main event?
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
All I'm saying is that I don't think the Cena comparisons are all that valid. There have been a lot more failures in creating "the new Hulk Hogan" than successes. Cena is a once in a lifetime talent, whether you want to admit it or not.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
The real reason why Roman's overness as part of The Shield is irrelevant is because every single thing roman was involved with from the breakup to WM 31 was dogshit.
spindashing
Banned
Once the Chain Gang stuff started, that was it for me.
slightconfuse
Banned
They had Lex slam yokozuna like Andre at mania 3. They went that deep
IT WAS A HIP TOSS
Perspicacity
Banned
It's an imperfect parallel to compare Cena's US title run with Roman as part of the Shield, I will grant you that. It is also totally unfair to act as if Roman did not exist as an individual prior to the spring of 2014.
It's incredibly insulting to diminish him as a person like that. I'm reticent to say it's racially motivated, but it's hard to ignore the history of wrestling fans marginalizing and mistreating non-white performers.
It's incredibly insulting to diminish him as a person like that. I'm reticent to say it's racially motivated, but it's hard to ignore the history of wrestling fans marginalizing and mistreating non-white performers.
Bluekaveli
Member
Yoko was running
Why is anyone supposed to take you seriously again?
I think the reason the comparison is made is because that was when both of them were singles competitors. Comparing Cena's US Title run to Roman in The Shield is a poor, in my opinion, because one guy was a singles wrestler while Roman was doing tag team stuff that was covering up his flaws a lot more.
Also, implying the Roman dislike is from racism? Get out of here with that hot garbage.