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Fitness |OT8| Dad Bods, Bulge Swelfies, and Wait...Do you even lift bro?

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M

Miutsu

Member
ILoveBish said:
Depends if you're adapted or not.
Click to expand...

So is it 100% sure that if you are completely fat adapted, you won't burn muscle for longer periods of fasting?

Also, how often do you plan to do these 72 hr fasts, once a week? and what happens when you get to a very low % of body fat? where does the body get its energy then?
 
B

BumRush

Member
All I know is that cavemen ate every 3-4 days and their life expectancy was somewhere in the 20's at best. Be careful Bish.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
ILoveBish said:
Depends if you're adapted or not.
Click to expand...

I'd be interested in reading that, as I've seen no studies that back it up. I'd be very surprised though, because fasting for that length of time would force your body to be fat adapted anyway. Your carb stores couldn't possibly last.

What I have seen for certain are studies that state that fasting for that long causes muscle loss. I can't really argue fat adapted vs not, other than the point above.

Can't seem to find the original research right now, but was just reading this which mentions one of the issues when you start heading into seriously long fasted periods:

Only in prolonged fasting does protein catabolism become an issue. This happens when stored liver glycogen becomes depleted. In order to maintain blood glucose, conversion of amino acids into glucose must occur (DNG: de novo glucogenesis). This happens gradually and if amino acids are not available from food, protein must be taken from bodily stores such as muscle. Cahill looked at the contribution of amino acids to DNG after a 100 gram glucose load. He found that amino acids from muscle contributed 50% to glucose maintenance after 16 hours and almost 100% after 28 hours (when stored liver glycogen was fully depleted).
Click to expand...

Obviously in that circumstance fat isn't going to be of any use. Obviously completely irrelevant if pure weight loss is your goal... but at this stage of your transformation I'm assuming you're far more interested in body composition.
 
I

ILoveBish

Member
Miutsu said:
So is it 100% sure that if you are completely fat adapted, you won't burn muscle for longer periods of fasting?

Also, how often do you plan to do these 72 hr fasts, once a week? and what happens when you get to a very low % of body fat? where does the body get its energy then?
Click to expand...

I'm still doing research on all of it, a good qa I read is found here:

http://www.dietdoctor.com/intermittent-fasting-faq

As far as how often, I don't know myself. I'm going to do my first one and see how it goes. I considered doing it weekly but it is likely a very bad idea. Still more research to do.

Once you run out of fat, muscle is next I would assume. Oh what a happy day that will be to even have to be concerned with that.

BumRush said:
All I know is that cavemen ate every 3-4 days and their life expectancy was somewhere in the 20's at best. Be careful Bish.
Click to expand...

I'm way passed that already! We've made it!

Psychotext said:
I'd be interested in reading that, as I've seen no studies that back it up. I'd be very surprised though, because fasting for that length of time would force your body to be fat adapted anyway. Your carb stores couldn't possibly last.

What I have seen for certain are studies that state that fasting for that long causes muscle loss. I can't really argue fat adapted vs not, other than the point above.

Can't seem to find the original research right now, but was just reading this which mentions one of the issues when you start heading into seriously long fasted periods:



Obviously in that circumstance fat isn't going to be of any use.
Click to expand...

It's different when you use your fat for fuel vs carbs. Body will attack the fat first, that's what keto does.
 
mdsfx

mdsfx

Member
Is there any difference between a calorie deficit created by eating less vs one created by exercise? Does your body treat them any differently?

So an example would be eating 2000 calories a day with 500 burned during exercise vs eating 1500 calories a day and much less exercise.
 
M

mkenyon

Banned
mdsfx said:
Is there any difference between a calorie deficit created by eating less vs one created by exercise? Does your body treat them any differently?

So an example would be eating 2000 calories a day with 500 burned during exercise vs eating 1500 calories a day and much less exercise.
Click to expand...
I bet there's a lot of psuedoscience written on this :/

My best guess is probably not, and if so, then it's marginal and probably not worth talking about. The only thing I can think of is that when you have straight calorie deficits from under eating, your body does slow down cell reproduction (hence the longer life span from healthier telomeres on any animal who is at a consistent calorie deficit). When you get a deficit from exercise, I would imagine that would change slightly. Maybe not though.
 
A

Azulsky

Member
mdsfx said:
Is there any difference between a calorie deficit created by eating less vs one created by exercise? Does your body treat them any differently?

So an example would be eating 2000 calories a day with 500 burned during exercise vs eating 1500 calories a day and much less exercise.
Click to expand...

Weight loss with exercise seems to encourage the body to preserve lean body mass.
Exercise improves cardiovascular health, metabolism(insulin resistance/metabolic syndrome), bone density with resistance exercise, and general quality of life, etc

Eventually you are going to lose muscle over a long period of time with a light cut or over a short period of time with a heavy cut.

You need enough protein to replace what you are breaking down and enough glucose to fuel the repair process. You need fat for gluconeogenesis if you are out of carbohydrate fuel.
 
J

Joey Fox

Self-Actualized Member
I just replaced my ground beef supplier, going from $4.95 a pound to $2.79. I can also get ground pork for $1.79 a pound. Bulking is so much cheaper now than my old fast food diet.
 
C

Cooter

Lacks the power of instantaneous movement
Brolic Gaoler said:
Press is going bonkers. Not gonna post whole thing but I knocked out 190x10, 200x5, 210x5 and 145x10 in 15 min.

Wish I could say same about my squat, but I think prowler is making at take a hit, so not a big deal.




You don't, but you will!
Click to expand...

Holy shit at your 190x10! Nicely done sir.
 
M

Miutsu

Member
ILoveBish said:
I'm still doing research on all of it, a good qa I read is found here:

http://www.dietdoctor.com/intermittent-fasting-faq

As far as how often, I don't know myself. I'm going to do my first one and see how it goes. I considered doing it weekly but it is likely a very bad idea. Still more research to do.

Once you run out of fat, muscle is next I would assume. Oh what a happy day that will be to even have to be concerned with that.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that article! I started to read his multi part fasting articles and they are very insightful. I'm however still confused about the caloric intake in all of this.

Right now I'm doing daily 24 hr fasts, so eat once at around the same time every day, coupled with keto. Right now I'm trying to eat around 500 less calories of my supposed daily expenditure, but I wonder if that's really necessary or if eating to satiation would be enough, mind you satiation in keto tends to come at fewer cals than usual. How do you manage that?
 
B

BumRush

Member
Brolic Gaoler said:
Press is going bonkers. Not gonna post whole thing but I knocked out 190x10, 200x5, 210x5 and 145x10 in 15 min.

Wish I could say same about my squat, but I think prowler is making at take a hit, so not a big deal.
Click to expand...

I read this like 10 times and thought the media was going apeshit over your lifts. Then I realized you meant your OHP.

Um, did you just say 190 lbs for 10 reps!?!?
 
I

ILoveBish

Member
Miutsu said:
Thanks for that article! I started to read his multi part fasting articles and they are very insightful. I'm however still confused about the caloric intake in all of this.

Right now I'm doing daily 24 hr fasts, so eat once at around the same time every day, coupled with keto. Right now I'm trying to eat around 500 less calories of my supposed daily expenditure, but I wonder if that's really necessary or if eating to satiation would be enough, mind you satiation in keto tends to come at fewer cals than usual. How do you manage that?
Click to expand...

I don't leave it to chance. I need to know exactly how much I eat every day. I'm at a much larger deficit then you and I manage just fine. I'm also going to do 6 weeks of cutting followed by 4-7 days of eating at even. I've felt that the break was beneficial in many ways. This time I'm going to try to not get kicked out of keto. Will be difficult.
 
C

Cooter

Lacks the power of instantaneous movement
I did box squats for the first time today. Big fan. Definitely be adding them to my routine.
 
M

MrToughPants

Brian Burke punched my mom
Heaviest I've repped in a few months 405x8, back feesl pretty good. I believe I have some sciatica though... :(

Started bicycling dat dere
creatine
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Cooter said:
Holy shit at your 190x10! Nicely done sir.
Click to expand...

BumRush said:
I read this like 10 times and thought the media was going apeshit over your lifts. Then I realized you meant your OHP.

Um, did you just say 190 lbs for 10 reps!?!?
Click to expand...


Lol, yeah, but it's not that impressive when you figure I've done 240x5 and 225x7 before.

MrToughPants said:
Heaviest I've repped in a few months 405x8, back feesl pretty good. I believe I have some sciatica though... :(

Started bicycling dat dere
creatine
Click to expand...


That shit alone makes me glad I see a MT regularly.
 
S

steveovig

Member
Does anyone do strength ranges for something like a barbell curl? The way I have my split, I now have tomorrow as an bis/tris day because I have wanted to try it out for a while. I'm wondering if it will help to maybe throw 3-4 sets of low rep stuff in or just stick with lighter weight/heavy reps. I'm not super strong as is but my goals are aimed towards hypertrophy.
 
J

J. Bravo

Member
steveovig said:
Does anyone do strength ranges for something like a barbell curl? The way I have my split, I now have tomorrow as an bis/tris day because I have wanted to try it out for a while. I'm wondering if it will help to maybe throw 3-4 sets of low rep stuff in or just stick with lighter weight/heavy reps. I'm not super strong as is but my goals are aimed towards hypertrophy.
Click to expand...
For arms I just aim for the sickest pump possible. I figure when I do heavy rows or bench press, that's enough heavy work for arms.

Edit: heavy ohp as well.
 
I

ILoveBish

Member
Cooter said:
I went the conservative route. Besides, if you keep up these 2 week fasts of yours you could be 145 by then!
Click to expand...

Haha, fasting rocks! I expect to be at 209.9 or less by new years, and hopefully in the 190s by next year, but it depends on how low i need to go BF % wise to have the look i want to keep for the rest of my life.
 
S

steveovig

Member
J. Bravo said:
For arms I just aim for the sickest pump possible. I figure when I do heavy rows or bench press, that's enough heavy work for arms.

Edit: heavy ohp as well.
Click to expand...

Yea, that's what I was thinking. I already do heavy rows, heavy OHP, and heavy DB press (I can't stand BB bench).
 
N

Nelo Ice

Banned
So I was able to OHP just fine yesterday with my jammed finger. I think it's healing pretty well all things considered since I nearly have full range of motion with little discomfort. With that said I don't think it's healthy enough to deadlift tonight :(. I mean I might be able to but I don't want to risk it and have further recovery time. I'm thinking of either subbing it with something else or just doing squat day instead and hoping I'll be ok for deadlifts on Friday or Saturday at worst.
 
C

CherryWoodFuton

Member
steveovig said:
Does anyone do strength ranges for something like a barbell curl? The way I have my split, I now have tomorrow as an bis/tris day because I have wanted to try it out for a while. I'm wondering if it will help to maybe throw 3-4 sets of low rep stuff in or just stick with lighter weight/heavy reps. I'm not super strong as is but my goals are aimed towards hypertrophy.
Click to expand...
Weighted chin ups, barbell 21s, hammer curls and preacher curls all give a big ass bicep pumps

I usually do 5x10 of light/moderate weight
 
S

Szu

Member
Time for some progress/vanity shots.

The inspiration is my son's shirt. It reads "I think my Dad is Superman".

miAlYcN.jpg
Click to expand...

He also decided to show off his mini-guns.

ZGB6vl4.jpg

O8g7J7Z.jpg
Click to expand...
 
U

UpperCaseN

Member
Can someone tell me how much I should be benchpressing (or working up towards) plus how many sets and reps? How long in between?

My comfort level is 115 lbs, 3 sets 8 reps. I take like 2-3 minute breaks in-between sets because that's the only way I can get to 8 again; if I wait less, I run out of steam at like 5 reps. No spotter, I workout in my basement I need to be able to re-rack it still.

Yesterday on a whim I went to 125 lbs and decided on 3 sets 5 reps. It wasn't bad at all, I feel a little more sore than usual but I think I can go higher already at that pace.

I do not want to bulk up but my problem areas are flab on the belly and chest (32 year old male, 156 lbs). The reason for benchpressing is to shape the chest a bit
 
F

Faiz

Member
UpperCaseN said:
Can someone tell me how much I should be benchpressing (or working up towards) plus how many sets and reps? How long in between?

My comfort level is 115 lbs, 3 sets 8 reps. I take like 2-3 minute breaks in-between sets because that's the only way I can get to 8 again; if I wait less, I run out of steam at like 5 reps. No spotter, I workout in my basement I need to be able to re-rack it still.

Yesterday on a whim I went to 125 lbs and decided on 3 sets 5 reps. It wasn't bad at all, I feel a little more sore than usual but I think I can go higher already at that pace.

I do not want to bulk up but my problem areas are flab on the belly and chest (32 year old male, 156 lbs). The reason for benchpressing is to shape the chest a bit
Click to expand...

I was getting ready to write a bunch of stuff but I really think you might benefit from reading the OP. I think you have some misconceptions. A quick TL;DR version (but seriously read the OP still)

Don't just bench, get on a full body program
You won't get bulky accidentally, especially if your immediate goal is fat loss.
Benching just to shape the chest isn't going to do you much good. It sounds like you are attempting to spot reduce body fat which is a fallacy. Body composition is two things - body fat and muscle. Changing the way you look requires decreasing body fat and increasing muscle mass. The best way to do both is with a full body program, and fat loss is mostly accomplished in the kitchen.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Rest generally comes down to what you're trying to achieve. Don't take this as gospel... but this is one take on it:

Rest Time Between Sets: 20-60 seconds
Most Ideal For: Muscular endurance, metabolic training/circuit training, burning some additional calories.

Rest Time Between Sets: 1-2 minutes
Most Ideal For: Building muscle

Rest Time Between Sets: 2-3 minutes
Most Ideal For: Building muscle, increasing strength.

Rest Time Between Sets: 3-5 minutes
Most Ideal For: Strength and muscular power.
Click to expand...

I generally go for 2.5 mins on my main lifts. Less than a minute on accessories (my aims are mostly endurance and size).
 
U

UpperCaseN

Member
Faiz said:
I was getting ready to write a bunch of stuff but I really think you might benefit from reading the OP. I think you have some misconceptions. A quick TL;DR version (but seriously read the OP still)

Don't just bench, get on a full body program
You won't get bulky accidentally, especially if your immediate goal is fat loss.
Benching just to shape the chest isn't going to do you much good. It sounds like you are attempting to spot reduce body fat which is a fallacy. Body composition is two things - body fat and muscle. Changing the way you look requires decreasing body fat and increasing muscle mass. The best way to do both is with a full body program, and fat loss is mostly accomplished in the kitchen.
Click to expand...

I'll check out the OP, thanks. I am doing more than just benchpress, I alternate between Cardio and lifting days. On lifting days benchpress is just 1 of the exercises I do
 
R

Rayven_king

Member
Brolic Gaoler said:
Press is going bonkers. Not gonna post whole thing but I knocked out 190x10, 200x5, 210x5 and 145x10 in 15 min.

Wish I could say same about my squat, but I think prowler is making at take a hit, so not a big deal.




You don't, but you will!
Click to expand...

oh im really feeling it today, ive been fighting a losing battle to not laugh at anyone's jokes at the office :(
 
C

Cooter

Lacks the power of instantaneous movement
Cuteness overload Szu. I almost didn't recognize that massive arm with that cute boy eating up the spotlight. Almost...
 
S

Szu

Member
BumRush said:
Szu, looking diesel brother!!
Click to expand...

SeanR1221 said:
Szu gonna be the biggest, baddest dad at his kids school.

Him, Cooter and Brolic are the super dads. Dad bods!
Click to expand...

Thanks, guys.

Cooter said:
Cuteness overload Szu. I almost didn't recognize that massive arm with that cute boy eating up the spotlight. Almost...
Click to expand...

I have to maintain my arms because my kid is getting heavy and he moves. It's like trying to hold a 22lbs kettleball that kicks at you. That's a workout in itself.
 
M

MrOogieBoogie

BioShock Infinite is like playing some homeless guy's vivid imagination
Question about Greyskull LP: when should you reset exactly?

I understand that you reset by 10% when you fail to reach at least five reps on your final AMRAP set, but say you manage four reps. Should you attempt that same weight next workout without resetting if you thought you were having an off-day?
 
F

Faiz

Member
BTW guys, one of the Amazon deals today is a $25 Amazon card if you spend $75 on select Health and Personal care products.

One of the select products is ON Gold Standard Whey powder.
 
P

Pancakes

hot, steaming, as melted butter slips into the cracks, drizzled with sticky sweet syrup OH GOD
Faiz said:
BTW guys, one of the Amazon deals today is a $25 Amazon card if you spend $75 on select Health and Personal care products.

One of the select products is ON Gold Standard Whey powder.
Click to expand...

Yep, ordered another protein box and some protein bars from there.
 
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