• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Gamespot - Star Wars Outlaws Feels Mediocre With A Protagonist Who's Way Too Strong 💪 (Mary Sue Alert)

T4keD0wN

Member
Kay handles a blaster just about as well as any other third-person shooter protagonist, and much like her peers in the action genre
Cynthia Bailey What GIF by Real housewives of Atlanta

I wonder if the author realizes that he is the one controlling those characters or if he thinks that the characters on screen are real?
The shooting is fine but pales in comparison to Battlefront II, for example. The ship combat is unremarkable, especially on the heels of Squadrons.
Those were some reasonable expectations for a sci-fi Assassins Creed game, lmao.

Sounds like all of the big issues he had were self-inflicted, potentially solved in the settings menu and by not playing the way he actively dislikes.
 
Last edited:

Chuck Berry

Gold Member
There's a gif in which the MC hits a stormtrooper with BARE HANDS in his helmet and knocks him out. That's a perfect example of the kind of turd they have made with this game.

To make a game like Uncharted in the Star Wars universe feasible you need great writers, something Ubisoft lacks.

The thing is, it’s already been done. Twice. The Jedi games are all we need for now imo. The only thing Outlaws will have over Survivor is the install size.

This just seems like your garden variety, lifeless, by the numbers Ubi dreck with a Star Wars paint coat. Just like Avatar.

But that Saints Row ‘22 comparison man…christ.

Christ.
 
Last edited:

Ozzie666

Member
Did Ubisoft work with Lucas/Disney to make this game and character canon like Jedi Survivor etc?
Can we expect this protag to pop in Mandorlian ..
 
okay: today i read an article by a full-grown adult complaining that a game, set in an all-ages accessible movie trilogy that was inspired in large part by '40's flash gordon serials, isn't realistic/challenging enough? I mean, imagine making a game as ludicrously, shamelessly imaginary as its source material?...

man, this guy must just despise ratchet & clank games...
 

EDMIX

Writes a lot, says very little
okay: today i read an article by a full-grown adult complaining that a game, set in an all-ages accessible movie trilogy that was inspired in large part by '40's flash gordon serials, isn't realistic/challenging enough? I mean, imagine making a game as ludicrously, shamelessly imaginary as its source material?...

man, this guy must just despise ratchet & clank games...

lol pretty much.

I don't even get the whole thing of ignoring the difficulty settings.

The way I see it, if they made it a souls type game, folks would just cry about Ubisoft is copying lol
 
I was really digging it until I saw gameplay sections like this. Popular media has created this absurd idea that a girl can curbstomp a man twice her size and strength with just training and technique - and maybe, possible!

But some random outlaw chick bodying trained soldiers 11 years after TLOU Joel had to use Old-Man-Strength to straight-up strangle dudes?

Yeah, no. Breaks the illusion. Shame, as the rest of the game looks pretty great to me.
If your going to make a game with a strong female protagonist that kicks ass, then you have to do it right....character design plays a big part and should make the combat direction look believable.


2751a63dd6473658045f5a795d558e19e25e567c.gif
 

ByWatterson

Member
If your going to make a game with a strong female protagonist that kicks ass, then you have to do it right....character design plays a big part and should make the combat direction look believable.


2751a63dd6473658045f5a795d558e19e25e567c.gif

Yeah. Abby gets shit, but the game shows her skinny, hints at her crazy gym routine, etc. And she still has to fight-fight.

The girl in Outlaws is a tiny thing one-shotting from behind guys in armor. It's silly.
 
Maybe Division 1 but not d2 ...also, where is the fun in two shotting enemies in a looter/rpg shooter?
Yeah I know it was mostly a joke, and I don't totally disagree with this, but it does lead to some very frustrating and lame situations. If an enemy decides you rush you it's basically a death because it's impossible to out DPS them unless you are way over leveled.

Honestly don't get me started because I've thought a lot about why does it feel normal to smack an enemy 50 times with a sword to kill them but not normal to shoot them with 2 magazines of ammo. I don't have an answer, but I've thought a lot about it lol
 

Radical_3d

Member
Justin Timberlake What GIF


So the author decided to base half the article’s title on an assumption? Despite having the Ubisoft rep STANDING RIGHT NEXT TO THEM and could have easily asked, “hey, what difficulty and accessibility settings did you put this on?”

Frustrated Here We Go GIF by Sesame Street


I almost suspect they thought to ask the rep, but knew that would kill an angle for the clickbait.….
Everyone knows the difficulty is toned down in these events. After all you can’t have Polygon the whole 20 minutes demo stuck in the first jump. But this is also a Ubisoft game, every protagonist feels too competent and gameplay too bland. Nothing new here even if they touch a notch the difficulty.
 

Ozriel

M$FT
I was really digging it until I saw gameplay sections like this. Popular media has created this absurd idea that a girl can curbstomp a man twice her size and strength with just training and technique - and maybe, possible!

But some random outlaw chick bodying trained soldiers 11 years after TLOU Joel had to use Old-Man-Strength to straight-up strangle dudes?

Yeah, no. Breaks the illusion. Shame, as the rest of the game looks pretty great to me.

Nate Drake is an adventurer that somehow manages to mow down hundreds of trained and experience mercenaries. Don’t see anyone complaining about that.

Ubisoft took it a bit too far with some of the melee attacks (backhanding stormtroopers with bare knuckles to knock them out makes no sense), but it’s nothing new for games to make you suspend belief.
 

Fess

Member
What I played feels like an amalgamation of different features and mechanics borrowed from other games that do those things better, all while masquerading as a Star Wars game without actually embodying the themes and storylines of Star Wars.
Spot on what it looked like.
In the in-house infiltration segment it looked like a Naughty Dog game, but without Naughty Dog polish and action set pieces. And the main protagonist seemed like Han Solo as a woman without humour and with some tiny furry thing as companion instead of Chewie.

It’s a big budget Star Wars game. As a Star Wars fan I should be excited. But I’m not. For me it stumbles similar to the new Zelda game with Zelda instead or Link and furniture instead of sword and shield.

In a wellknown IP, don’t change things just to be different. Iconic things aren’t meant to be replaced.

Tbh I would probably be excited if the main protagonist was replaced to Han Solo and the little critter was replaced to Chewie. But it still needs to be polished up to ND standards when trying to copy ND.
 

kruis

Exposing the sinister cartel of retailers who allow companies to pay for advertising space.
Why make it with a new unknown character that absolutely nobody cares about!

I have zero interest in this and I love star wars.

My guess is that Ubisoft wanted to save money on the licensing costs.
 

wipeout364

Member
Nate Drake is an adventurer that somehow manages to mow down hundreds of trained and experience mercenaries. Don’t see anyone complaining ab

Ubisoft took it a bit too far with some of the melee attacks (backhanding stormtroopers with bare knuckles to knock them out makes no sense), but it’s nothing new for games to make you suspend belief.
You said it yourself it’s the force multiplier effect of the firearms. But once you start talking straight on hand to hand combat it starts to be seem weird.

Honestly though if it was Nathan Drake coming behind a stormtrooper with the headgear on I would think it was just as stupid that he choked/knocked them out by hitting a helmet designed for protection against concussive effects. I don’t know why they didn’t give her a shock device or something.
 

CamHostage

Member
Nate Drake is an adventurer that somehow manages to mow down hundreds of trained and experience mercenaries. Don’t see anyone complaining about that.

Ubisoft took it a bit too far with some of the melee attacks (backhanding stormtroopers with bare knuckles to knock them out makes no sense), but it’s nothing new for games to make you suspend belief.

Hey man, sometimes questions just don't come to mind. Like, sure, the guy in the Darth Vader suit was a 6'6" bodybuilder, but when the blonde kid from Corvette Summer took him on in a lasersword kendo battle (twice, and before that, Vader fought a senior citizen beardyguy, which he won in a forfeit,), surely nothing there in the size discrepancy rubbed against our sense of reality.


f05dbd6d2af2fddfe73574af01a51c74.jpg
 

Doczu

Member
I mean...that literally just sounds like most games.


Was she suppose to be weak? I mean, what would be the point to limit what the character can do? How the fuck would that be appealing?


I'm sorry man, this shit sounds so fucking fake and forced its not even funny. One might as well copy and paste this shit about any damn game. Be like "way too strong, Kratos literally killed a god, like WTF, TOO STRONG 0/10" lol

Of all the things to complain about, this simply isn't it. This isn't a souls game, this IP isn't even know for any of that and the general idea of what they are going for is an action game with light comedy ala Star Wars vibes. I don't think anything even remotely suggested that this was suppose to be some hard title or something or hardcore simulation. Her fighting hordes of enemies is expected in a fake game about Star Wars, a fictional thing...

That is like crying that in a James Bond game, 1 punch knock a dude out lol (Yea....like in the films and stuff, craaaazzzzy right?)

Still a day 1. I don't even know if I'll even bother with other modes, hardmode is fun and all, but I just want to go thru it the first time for fun and to hear the story and if the game moves me enough, I might do a hardmode run like after or something, but I just don't like this IP enough to act as if it MUUUUUST be this souls thing, what I like from the IP is simply the atmosphere, story, core concepts and this game seems to be hitting all of those well enough for me.
Look at the

nznKZ7U.png
 

DaciaJC

Gold Member
I mean...that literally just sounds like most games.


Was she suppose to be weak? I mean, what would be the point to limit what the character can do? How the fuck would that be appealing?


I'm sorry man, this shit sounds so fucking fake and forced its not even funny. One might as well copy and paste this shit about any damn game. Be like "way too strong, Kratos literally killed a god, like WTF, TOO STRONG 0/10" lol

Of all the things to complain about, this simply isn't it. This isn't a souls game, this IP isn't even know for any of that and the general idea of what they are going for is an action game with light comedy ala Star Wars vibes. I don't think anything even remotely suggested that this was suppose to be some hard title or something or hardcore simulation. Her fighting hordes of enemies is expected in a fake game about Star Wars, a fictional thing...

That is like crying that in a James Bond game, 1 punch knock a dude out lol (Yea....like in the films and stuff, craaaazzzzy right?)

Still a day 1. I don't even know if I'll even bother with other modes, hardmode is fun and all, but I just want to go thru it the first time for fun and to hear the story and if the game moves me enough, I might do a hardmode run like after or something, but I just don't like this IP enough to act as if it MUUUUUST be this souls thing, what I like from the IP is simply the atmosphere, story, core concepts and this game seems to be hitting all of those well enough for me.

I don't know the background of this game or the character, but the article makes it sound like yes, she's supposed to be more so reliant on her outlaw instincts to get out of tough spots rather than effortlessly blasting through a horde of stormtroopers.

Aside from simply feeling dull to play, this actively gets in the way of Kay's characterization as a scrappy scoundrel and smuggler. If anything, playing as Kay should feel more like how Han Solo accomplished problems in the original Star Wars trilogy--you take your shot when you can but you're far better off running away when the blaster bolts start flying.

This seems like just another case of ludonarrative dissonance, where the gameplay isn't concordant with the story or characterization.
 

CamHostage

Member
Honestly though if it was Nathan Drake coming behind a stormtrooper with the headgear on I would think it was just as stupid that he choked/knocked them out by hitting a helmet designed for protection against concussive effects. I don’t know why they didn’t give her a shock device or something.

It's a flawed conceptualization of an action beat, no matter the character, I do agree with that, and I like your shock buzzer idea. I don't know if maybe there was some story beat reason for not having a shocker (if the character is captured and disarmed, for instance, what would be their takedown method without it?) or if they just didn't think of that option, or if they just liked the visceral feel of '30s blackjack action chops.

...In general though, I would remind us that these are stormtroopers. They walk the galaxy so that there is somebody to kill. Nothing about their armor has ever saved one from a shot at any known blaster setting. Generally they don't have any camouflaging color to their battlefield uniforms except when they get to wear black to sit in a spaceship cockpit. (The Snowtroopers seem to have gotten lucky that the Empire went with more white suits, but by the First Order's reign, the snow soldiers toss on a big red epaulette to break up that white-on-white environment blending.) This is Tupperwear armor. The idea that we're seeing Stormtroopers brought down by violent actions but arguing, "Hey, that's not realistic, he's got a helmet on!", I think that's missing the point of the design and purpose of Stormtroopers. They are made to die.

(*On a side note too, just the very idea that there's a magic button in your head and one swift blow from behind puts you right to sleep for several minutes, often only to be woken with a splash of water to the face, that always has been Hollywood flimflam since the Chaplin era. Yeah, it can black you out, but it's not some light-attack sleep-inducing trick; you're fucking somebody up if you're hitting them with concussive coma force. Not much need to argue about whether a female of this stature could be strong enough to accomplish or if only a toughguy is capable of some 3 Stooges conk-to-the-noggin shenanigans.)
 
Last edited:

Zathalus

Member
Isn’t the difficulty for these press events always dialed down though? Some of the game journalists are not know for their gaming acumen.

Even so, knowing Ubisoft the game probably won’t be bad but rather extremely mediocre.
 

Agent_4Seven

Tears of Nintendo
I mean, I watched ~30 gameplay from a few weaks ago and gameplay and combat-wise it's really nothing special, groundbreaking or amazing.
It's a mishmash of gameplay ideas from everything Ubisoft did since SC Conviction + a sprinkle of Uncharted and Respawn's Jedi series.
Is it bad? Fuck no, but it sure as shit won't win any awards or to be something special for you to remember for years to come.
 

SHA

Member
Too Human is like that and I spent most of my time playing that game, if these sites can't understand what the consumers really want, instead, they want us to keep talking about masterpieces as a way to justify their whole existence, that way of thinking is so outdated, the consumers know what they want already.
 

cormack12

Gold Member
He was in the room with the rep, why didn't he just ask about the difficulty stuff instead of writing this guessing shit.
 

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Videogame protagonist is too strong?
Thats a new one for me.


Maybe shes got a chip in her chin and shes taking it out on anyone and everyone.
VrOgFTh.gif
 

Majormaxxx

Member
If your going to make a game with a strong female protagonist that kicks ass, then you have to do it right....character design plays a big part and should make the combat direction look believable.


2751a63dd6473658045f5a795d558e19e25e567c.gif
You can have a strong female character without trying to make her look like a man. Strength of character is much more impressive than a steroid body.
 

EDMIX

Writes a lot, says very little
I don't know the background of this game or the character, but the article makes it sound like yes, she's supposed to be more so reliant on her outlaw instincts to get out of tough spots rather than effortlessly blasting through a horde of stormtroopers.



This seems like just another case of ludonarrative dissonance, where the gameplay isn't concordant with the story or characterization.

yea ok....this is also action based video game based on a IP known for those types of wild concepts. So....yea, blasting thru hordes of stormtroopers....sorta like the fucking actual film series its based off of. All this sounds like is they are following that action concept, this isn't a simulation and I don't recall the publisher ever making any statements about this game suppose to be based on some real life statistical thing or something

So being an "Outlaw" they are very much having that, "effortlessly blasting thru a horde of stormtroopers" based on that idea anyway.

Thats like playing Red Dead Redemption and acting shocked someone is mowing thru hordes of people or something and then be like " wow, I mean he is suppose to be reliant on is cowboy wits to get out of tough spots" as if you didn't just fucking read the game is about lawless outlaws lol Sooo I don't think they mean "Outlaw" the way you might think, I think they mean any thing goes, this is a action game, fake, over the top annnnnnd not real.

You know, like 99.9% of the games in this genre, I can't even think of 1 game in this genre by the way where you can't mow thru hordes of people in some action type way. So I would say in regards to gameplay, her breaking the law, stealing things, killing and running away in a ship to then sell those stolen things on the black market support that narrative just fine. So yea, the things she is doing, support that story and character from what I've seen. I don't even get how someone hears "Outlaw" and the first thing you are assuming from a video game is thats the person that can't mow thru hordes of enemies? lol

When has that term in a game ever supported that idea btw?

What game would best fit what you are referring to that would even make sense to this IP?
 

SJRB

Gold Member
Someone post that gif of her slapping a stormtrooper on the back of the helmet, knocking him out.
 

Gojiira

Member
Its 2024 if Star Wars doesnt have a Mary Sue of Diverse Ethnic Origin who dont need no man I’d be very,very surprised.
Still gotta hand it to them, at least their calling it out as the shallow Ubi Trash that keeps getting pumped out.
Also a Star Wars game starring a Smuggler…And they just HAD to make a ugly DEI character…Not making a game centred around the most famous Smuggler in Star Wars and his Wookie friend…What a stupid decision
 
You can have a strong female character without trying to make her look like a man. Strength of character is much more impressive than a steroid body.

Are you intimidated by the strong body woman? Poor you. Say what you want about Abby, but at least I never felt like she was a Mary Sue when I played tlou2. Actually her gameplay segments were the best and I genuinely felt like a bad-ass because you know, punching someone as her or chocking to death felt genuine. Star Wars Outlaws tho? lmao that is is dumb ass shit.
 

CGNoire

Member
I'm confused on that too. We do know that there are a number of difficulty settings in Star Wars Outlaws, but most seem to be for accessibility tuning to bring down frustrations, rather than piling on challenge; I don't think we know yet what it does if you want the game to honestly test your skills?

Personally, I find most of these types of hero action shooters to be really loose in "challenge", that they can rarely add enough mechanics to vary the game and are too hung up in the cinematic action and "brutal combat" to be thrilling as "games". They're "interactive experiences" in a natural world, with puzzles and navigation challenges and fun visual setpieces splashed about plus some general combat systems like punching or shooting added for familiarity of those seeking what they consider action, but by their very nature they struggle to have distinct challenges where mastery of technique rewards players. You can make enemies spongier to bullets, you can make a hero die easier from damage, but you have to do more than just what's normal if you want challenging gameplay. (Usually quicker kill rates just make a game more frustrating, not fun.) I'm not a total fan of Vanquish, but you can look at that and go, Oh right, these games could have some flavor to them if the heroes ever realized they were in a videogame!



Uh, sweatshirt, I think the word you're looking for is "sweetie" or "sweety".

And crank about whatnot if you will, but what's going on here is not really because it's a female character. This is just what happens when action is designed around setpiece settings and thrill-the-fans cinematic events rather than mechanics and challenge. This character can do everything imaginable at the push of a context-sensitive button; a game needs shades of techniques or limitations on capabilities, it needs failure conditions and rewards on skill or tactics. From the previews, none of this was evident (or active on that difficulty level,) which you get in a game rushed for visual and cinematic value and bulletpoint design without the fundamentals of gameplay built in. (Swarms of enemies at various intensity levels in graduated failure states, for example, reads great on a fact sheet, but if all the enemies can be easily dispatched with bog-standard gunplay, the feature doesn't feature.) That goes for whatever character or franchise you use. She doesn't have "Mary Sue" powers; she does nothing special or exemplary (aside from having Nix go grab guns.) It's just that the game has not developed (or not shown it to have been integrated) anything to confound those basic hero actions.
Nailed it. Such an annoying issue with these games.
 

Majormaxxx

Member
Are you intimidated by the strong body woman? Poor you. Say what you want about Abby, but at least I never felt like she was a Mary Sue when I played tlou2. Actually her gameplay segments were the best and I genuinely felt like a bad-ass because you know, punching someone as her or chocking to death felt genuine. Star Wars Outlaws tho? lmao that is is dumb ass shit.
Why would I be intimidated? I've been training for 23 years so I appreciate physical fitness. That said, I stand by what I said. The laziest way to make a strong female character is to roid her up and make her speak in a gruff voice or yell.
 
Top Bottom