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Ghost in the Shell |OT| I was born in the sea of information
- Thread starter Trokil
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Hollywood still harboring that infatuation even after Dragon Ball The Movie and Speed Racer, huh?
Gordon Ramsay: "Get out. OUT!"
ultracal31
You don't get to bring friends.
show me your skeleton
Member
this is fucking insanity.
Ghost in the Shell doesn't seem popular enough to really warrant that kind of investment. Then again I can think of a handful of animes that would so who knows.
UnemployedVillain
Member
And thus we enter an age where more Asians are written out of scripts than even included in them. Honestly more people should be infuriated, and we need to stop using this "adaptation" bullshit as an excuse.
It's like if Chimamanda Adichie's "Americanah" was adapted and they changed it to a white woman living in South Africa and reminiscing about her American roots. It's ridiculous to the point of being offensive.
Pretty much, maybe if you are generous Kevin Hart?
Shit it had Omar from the wire in there to
Lights and Waves
Member
Are they though? When are we getting a Sailor Moon HBO series?
jack_package_200
Banned
This. I was actually baffled by Dreamworks wanting to produce a big budget "adaptation" of a cult anime film.
I suspect they are banking on the Scar Jo popularity. MCU is a huge earner and Lucy was abject shit but it made a lot of money.
Its all about turning a profit as much as humanly possible.
I predict that this movie will likely be okay but Beauty and the Beast is going to enter its third week #1 at the box office. I think GitS will underperform at the box office.
AmaterasuOni
Banned
I'm talking about Asian-American. There's really high profile African-American actresses. I really don't know any Asian-American actresses who can star a blockbuster action movie.
Narutoverse is already multicultural. It wouldn't be offensive to cast Naruto or Sakura as a white person. Sasuke on the other hand... then there'd be a problem.
God I wonder why. It's almost like they're not given a chance to do so!
Which is really weird considering how popular Donnie Yen flicks are as well as The Raid, both action films with Asian leads. You'd think people would be looking to groom their own homegrown Donnies and Ikos.
Sarcasm aside, if there is going to be a change, it has to come from the executive level. They are the gatekeepers, not the rank and file actors and actresses, script writers or sometimes even directors.
formasymphonic
Member
Basically yes. They think that they are properties that are untapped enough in the west that they can gain from expanding them, yet have enough of an existing fandom surrounding them that they can leverage.
- Death Note was in limbo for a while but is out soon after getting picked up by Netflix
- Naruto + Bleach already have movies that are officially greenlit
- Akira, Battle Angel Alita, Cowboy Bebop and a few others are names that have been thrown around but are all in various stages of "so what is actually happening with that?"
- Evangelion got killed off thanks to ADV trying to do some Harmony Gold type licensing bs iirc. (which may be for the best because I can only imagine how much hollywood would have butchered Eva).
Tbh my hopes are not high for most of them, but we'll see what lessons are learned after GitS...
Bebop could actually get a decent adaptation though. Where by decent I mean it won't lose anything going through the hollywood machine. Tiger and Bunny could work and a few others mostly because they aren't inherently japanese in their settings/plots/charcterisations.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
As long as theres no live-action One Piece movie I'm all up for live-action anime adaptations. At least I'd hope they learn mistakes but I doubt that'll happen.
Zoe
Member
They've already finished filming--currently in post-production.
Battle Angel is actually coming together. New director on board and a variety of actors have already been cast.
Edit: *sees above* They finished filming already?! Wow I totally missed that piece of info!
TheOnlyOneHeEverFeared
Member
I got to see it today! Liked it a lot.
AmaterasuOni
Banned
People keep saying the same thing over and over and I still haven't seen any names. Give me some Asian-American actresses who can star a 120 million dollar action movie.
And there's like over 100 million dollar difference between Raid and GitS. Small risk vs devastating risk.
Top executives want to cast people who can sell their way too expensive movies the best way. Today it's ScarJo, tomorrow it's someone new. Who ever is the next fetish and sex symbol will star the next hot flick. That is how it goes.
Zoe
Member
It's Robert Rodriguez--you know it was gonna be 90% CG anyway :lol
MugiwaraCole
Member
This is bullshit. People of color can't become household names without being given roles in the first place. It's the "you need experience to get a job" catch-22. If you truly believe Scarlett being white has nothing to do with it, I don't know what to tell you. White people aren't the only individuals that draw in moviegoers, and they aren't the only people capable of acting, so shut that shit down too.
These cries of "it isn't racism!" are depressing evidence of just how fucked we are. If it isn't a Klansman standing beside a burning cross, it's just us minorities making much ado about nothing and being told to settle down. And Scarlett doing a decent job in the role has jack shit to do with it. A Japanese actress would have been just as capable, if they'd bothered to fucking look for one. Asian actors can't even start low and build because they get passed over for TV roles like Iron Fist in favor of a white actor that can't fight, doesn't look the part, and only further perpetuates the harmful trope of the source material that we should really be trying to buck in 2017.
But we won't, cause "star power", that buzz phrase that Hollywood tosses around without even understanding it. Get Out just made over $100 million on the back of an actor most people had never even heard of. He's gonna have a role in Black Panther soon. Hidden Figures blew past expectations before that. Black folks used to be told the same thing Asian actors get told now, and we're only just now finding our footing in the industry. People want to see good movies, period. There's absolutely no reason you can't make a good movie that also gives someone beyond white folks a chance to shine.
"But, name names! Who could've starred in the role?" There's Japanese talent out there. It isn't our job to find them. It's Hollywood's. The fact that none exist that satisfy y'all's idiotic requirements is nobody's fault but Hollywood's. It's time they fucking fixed it.
Frozenprince
Banned
Name one and what was her last Marquee role
formasymphonic
Member
Turin Turambar
Member
Science Fiction Action flick with some built-in brand recognition, so why not?
Frozenprince
Banned
Explain Chris's Pratt, a physical comedy actor being cast to lead a $150M blockbuster. Explain Ryan Reynolds, a career low level romantic comedy actor. Chris Evans.
There aren't any who can because Hollywood says there aren't because there aren't any because Hollywood says there aren't.
It's bullshit. Marketing and savvy social media use and word of mouth sell films that aren't franchises, not stars. Not anymore.
More_Badass
Member
Does the popularity of the anime even matter? That investment isn't to make a faithful live-action anime for the fans. It's to make a crowd-pleasing sci-fi action movie. The name helps, for marketing, but most people probably arent seeing this because they're fans of the anime.
AmaterasuOni
Banned
Quick one: Naomie Harris. Really wonderful actress who is rising into Halle Berry-like stardom.
Star for an action movie? No way. And this is the main problem. There are only few actresses who can star a blockbuster action movie. It's not about color, it's about the skills (IMO).
MugiwaraCole
Member
Your opinion is wrong. Full stop. For reasons outlined by a number of people in this very thread already.
Making blockbusters in general is a crapshoot, no matter who you cast as the lead, but there are enough cases of relative unknowns being successful and familiar faces crashing and burning that that aspect of it is proven to not matter a lick.
Star power isn't some myth, names do get butts into seats. Get Out is a horror movie, and an exception (it also hasn't done the number a Ghost in The Shell movie would need to do). Hidden Figures had a fuck ton of star power, so I'm not sure what you are on about there. Finding a famous black American isn't hard, finding a famous Japanese-American is impossible because there aren't any. Very few studios would spend $110 million on a action movie without some A list actor headlining it. So I'm not going to blame paramount for picking Scarlo, but I am going to blame them and the rest of Hollywood for not giving more Asian Americans main roles in those mid sizes budget movies that allow talent to become famous, and later be picked to lead blockbusters. That's the main issue here
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Nah. And Naomie Harris has been around for DECADES now.
You're acting like there's some sort of serious pre-requisite for being the star of an action movie. There isn't.
That's what the training is for. Anyone can be a fucking action star. That's the whole point of Bruce Willis existing.
Now: Why is it that Bruce Willis gets to go from fucking MOONLIGHTING to Die Hard with no questions asked, but somehow there's a bar that women and minorities have to hit (a nebulous, constantly shifting bar, too) to justify even attempting to put them at the front of an action picture?
We occupy an area in which star power is nowhere near worth what it was when a lot of us grew up. Audiences don't really give a shit who is in the movie so much as they care about the movie's potential as a story/experience, and that potential being realized in the execution.
It's why Chris Pratt is a fucking superstar now. Because audiences didn't have a problem accepting him as Han Solo (mark III) in Guardians. The concept/branding sells a movie. The execution embeds it in the public consciousness.
You don't have to be famous first to impress people anymore. It's not how it works.
So why are opportunities to impress people still being artificially limited based on race & gender?
AmaterasuOni
Banned
These are male. Give me actresses who can star blockbuster action movies like I asked. The field is really narrow. Like only 5 or 6 women narrow.
It's not a racial issue, the problem is elsewhere.
This is something I do not buy at all. Stars sell at least about the minumum number of tickets in almost all marketed blockbusters. B-list actors are a risk to that minimum. It's always a win to cast the biggest star in a potential hit.
MugiwaraCole
Member
The myth of star power getting people into theaters has been long debunked, and if you can't accept that, again, I'm not sure what to tell you. But we're past that.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
The field is artificially narrowed. Nobody can give you actresses because they haven't seen them yet, because they haven't been given anywhere near the same number of chances white men have been given. You're not even acknowledging this reality. You're taking it as if this is somehow a meritorious thing. That the women in the industry have fallen short of some sort of ideal for "action star" that is an objectively placed bar, set where it is outside of inherent sexist and racist factors.
This is not the case, though.
We're really not though. A few exceptions here and there doesn't debunk anything. Star power is still important (maybe not as important as it once was, and hopefully one day it won't be at all), but you can't be serious in saying a $110 million movie would do the same numbers with or without an A list lead or supporting actor? Unless the source material / ip is the drawing factor (ie Super Hero movies), which for Ghost in The Shell it's not really
Doctor Decimate
Member
"those lazy Asians"
credit where it's due, i've never had that one lobbed at me before
credit where it's due, i've never had that one lobbed at me before
molnizzle
Member
...yeah. I can see how for this particular property they're trying to fall back on star power sex appeal. I don't plan on watching this film, but if I ever do I'll be the first to admit that it's at least partially to see ScarJo run around killing dudes in a skintight catsuit.
radios shipping overview
Member
To use a different analogy: you can't get your foot in the door when the people in charge are holding it closed.
The point is going over your head. Who would've thought that Chris Pratt would've been good in a blockbuster action movie until someone put him in one? The problem is that hollywood is willing to throw these million dollar blockbusters at white dudes but not at minorities or women, because for some reason minorities and women have to meet some nebulous qualification to even be considered.
See also Taylor Kitsch, Chris Pine, Sam Worthington, Armie Hammer, Jai Courtney, etc.
I think the cards were stacked against this movie, even ignoring the whitewashing aspect, due to the fact that it's based off an anime property. I feel people are much less resistant to reading a comic nowadays than watching an anime.
It's a property that marketing almost certainly was always going to have an issue with and add on top the fact that the source material is an anime...
It's a property that marketing almost certainly was always going to have an issue with and add on top the fact that the source material is an anime...
Mick Swagger
Member
My baby Taraji, Empire is one of the most watched shows on TV / Streaming Sites for the past what, 2-3 years?
Her popularity from Empire definitely helped springboard Hidden Figures a bit.
But again, why drop $120 million on a Ghost in the Shell movie? Like, you're so worried about recouping your investment that you think it's a good idea to whitewash the main character, isn't that a clue that maaaaaaybe investing in that IP wasn't smart in the first place? Basically what I'm saying is that, if you don't feel confident in an IP to sell itself, why even bother in the first place?
AmaterasuOni
Banned
You don't believe she will star big movies in the near future? Ok. I think she will be quite huge.
Like I said. I can't figure anyone out. Are there anyone who you can suggest?
I'm not the who needs to answer this, it's the movie industry. I'm just trying to tell that maybe the problem is not within the industry. Maybe the issue is that simple: there are no Asian-American actresses who can act enough to star a blockbuster action movie. There's no "star potential" in the current patch of Asian-American actresses. I'd think that Asian-American actresses are a minority within minority. There just aren't that many to start with.
These are expensive movies and the execs probably want to cast people who can at least act some. I wouldn't cast some b-lister to my 120 million movie.
I'm still looking for at least one name who can star this kind of project. I can't think of any. Who is the new Lucy Liu?
Bobby Roberts
Banned
The large majority of any audience for a potential blockbuster isn't reading the source material regardless what it is. People don't care if it's an Anime or a comic book, and most people who buy a ticket for a movie aren't doing that homework regardless. The successes are not coming because larger percentages of the audience for those films are familiarizing themselves with the source material.
The sales of comics themselves should put that notion to bed.
If the cards are stacked against the movie, people's reticence to do the research before walking up to the box-office is a pretty small stack.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
She's been doing this for decades now, man. She's not a "new face" or an up-and-comer. She's already established. The fact you regard her as a new face is part of the problem I'm trying to highlight for you.
Man what
UnemployedVillain
Member
Bingo bingo. It's a bullshit narrative. Unknown white dudes are given big roles all the fucking time. People need to stop going through their mental gymnastics routines to come up with explanations to avoid admitting the simple and blatantly obvious, simple fact that Hollywood is racist and sexist. It's tiring.
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