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Giant Bomb #17 | Baby Dan Wyckert

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mnz

Unconfirmed Member
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That's an 8 year old game. What went wrong in that person's life? Sometimes idiots like that put things into perspective.

Fun fact, though: the 2nd Future game actually got a 5/5 on GB and Vinny wrote the review!
 
One of the Witcher 3's greatest triumphs is that it didn't forget what happened in previous games. With HoS's inclusion of Shani, I can say this honestly. There's references and callbacks to previous games sprinkled throughout everything, and uncovering or seeing these references is just such a joy to see. It's like CDPR made this game for fans of the entire series, which feels rare in this era.
MGS V is Destiny 1.0 levels of head scratchingly bad and repetitive design.

Destiny might have had more story though.



BUT AT LEAST THE SHOOTING FEELS GOOD IN BOTH!

MGSV reminds me a bit of Shadow of Mordor in that it makes a good first impression, but is soon (or in MGSV's case, eventually) revealed to be a hollow, empty shell of a game.
 

tuxfool

Banned
I feel like the storytelling is enough though. Most of the quests generally tell nice little side stories. Not all of them are great but most of them are worthwhile. To me that's more interesting than grinding through stuff to grind for experience and loot.

I compare that to some of the trash in Skyrim and Inquisition and it's so much better.

Also the random question marks are full of little details, either a small story to them, or some kind of environmental story telling that is much more interesting than a chest in the middle of nowhere.

People that are only exploring for the purposes of loot, or powering through these things à la Ass Creed, are just going to miss these touches.
 
The face melting is the most unfair of the Unity criticisms. If I remember right it was only in the PC version and it was something fixed in the launch patch which wasn't even that big in comparison to most games.
 
MGSV would have been vastly improved if it had the nemesis system a-la Shadow of Mordor. That shit was the best part of that game.

also yeah let's talk about undertale instead. it's the best game this year, after all.
 

danm999

Member
For GotY in a year when titles became tedious before they ended I'm only willing to accept games that I could be arsed to finish and also remember finishing. The list currently consists of Undertale, Ori and the Blind Forest, Until Dawn and Contradiction. Cities: Skylines is the exception to the rule.

I need some serious East Coast filibusters unless most of the crew play Undertale before the end of the year and see that it's obviously GotY.

I remember finishing Cities Skyline.

I was playing and noticed my city suddenly dropped 2,000 people in population. I was very confused and then saw that my hydro-electric dam had apparently caused a river to divert onto one of my main residential districts. I had no save games so six hours of work was gone.
 

danm999

Member
The face melting is the most unfair of the Unity criticisms. If I remember right it was only in the PC version and it was something fixed in the launch patch which wasn't even that big in comparison to most games.

There's still weird stuff in there.

I was playing it this weekend finally to be ready for Syndicate and when I got to the scene where
Arno and Elise discover Mirabeau dead only his clothes were appearing, so it was like they were reacting with shock to a pop in bug.

Honestly it was my favourite story beat.
 

tuxfool

Banned
Yeah, the sidequests are what make the world interesting. I didn't touch the question marks at all after the beginning of the game because I knew that it would drive me nuts if I went after every single one. But there are so many quests, on Skellige in particular, that do a tremendous job of storytelling and worldbuilding. One in particular that sticks out in my memory is the one where you have to deal with a village's "forest god" and their old traditions and stuff.

My favorite too. It has the perfect mood and the effect is magnified by the isolation and landscape of Skellige.
 

daydream

Banned
jank club in full force

i guess they should embrace that jank then instead of having it be an occasional consequence of antiquated mechanics, be it ai, combat, climbing or whatever

this is the eigth game but the game's certainly not reflecting the level of refinement you'd expect at this point
 

Lingitiz

Member
early impressions aren't so hot, all the major mechanics seems to be the same (aka not improved)

ai certainly didn't get an upgrade

Oh my god. Everything about AC just looks so clunky and bad.

Also another thing Dan's saying about MGSV is that it kept him going for so long because of the appeal of the later equipment. I never got that vibe at all though. You can pretty much coast your way through most of the missions once you have a decent rocket launcher for bosses and the stun SMG. From there I felt zero desire to waste my time grinding out research prereqs for more things that I'd only be using on pointless repeat missions.

It's seriously strange they the game is so beloved by them. But then again they did give that repetitive and storyless mess Shadow of Mordor GOTY. Hopefully Halo, Fallout, or Just Cause can help make an argument later this year too.
 
i guess they should embrace that jank then instead of having it be an occasional consequence of antiquated mechanics, be it ai, combat, climbing or whatever

jank is what makes these uninspired sequels worth playing if you still play them, because they're fucking identical otherwise

Syndicate is getting ready to be even worse than usual, which is just an amazing idea.
 

yami4ct

Member
Yeah, as I said, the hatred a lot of people have for MGSV combined with people thinking that they're not giving Witcher 3 a fair chance is gonna be a delightful combo.

As long as Destiny get's DQed for being just an expansion pack, I'm cool with whatever wins GOTY. I will be really, really sad if (when) Life is Strange doesn't even get a mention.
 
Speaking of jank.

I can get a good deal on Fallout 4 and I am tempted to go day 1 on it and play it when it is at its most raw and busted.

Seems like good share button use.
 

yami4ct

Member
Oh my god. Everything about AC just looks so clunky and bad.

Also another thing Dan's saying about MGSV is that it kept him going for so long because of the appeal of the later equipment. I never got that vibe at all though. You can pretty much coast your way through most of the missions once you have a decent rocket launcher for bosses and the stun SMG. From there I felt zero desire to waste my time grinding out research prereqs for more things that I'd only be using on pointless repeat missions.

It's seriously strange they the game is so beloved by them. But then again they did give that repetitive and storyless mess Shadow of Mordor GOTY.

Learning AI patterns, planning meticulous routes, Tranq Sniping all the dudes I can and sneaking through the rest with the trainq pistol is a pattern I always had an absolute blast with. Did not dig the non-stealth weaponry at all.
 

danm999

Member
Learning AI patterns, playing meticulous routes, Tranq Sniping all the dudes I can and sneaking through the rest with the trainq pistol is a pattern I always had an absolute blast with. Did not dig the non-stealth weaponry at all.

The worst thing is going back to Unity and trying to use its stealth mechanics after the glory of MGSV.

Worst of all, lots of AC stuff binds a fail state to being spotted, whereas MGSV is content to let you go rambo when you fuck up.

Also I don't know if this was posted in here but Fobwashed still out there doing the lord's work.

https://youtu.be/9hM44zP4BHM
 

tuxfool

Banned
The worst thing is going back to Unity and trying to use its stealth mechanics after the glory of MGSV.

Worst of all, lots of AC stuff binds a fail state to being spotted, whereas MGSV is content to let you go rambo when you fuck up.

I'm willing to cut AC some slack here because technically MGSV isn't really doing the city thing (nor the open world thing).

All these complex mechanics and routines are occurring in a level (missions are instanced areas) without non-combative npcs or much of anything else. The scripting they do on the multi part objectives is wonderful, but it very much draws inspiration from linear games.

The end result in AC isn't as satisfying but the things MGSV does well are many times harder to do in the context of AC.
 

danm999

Member
I'm willing to cut AC some slack here because technically MGSV isn't really doing the city thing (nor the open world thing).

All these complex mechanics and routines are occurring in a level (missions are instanced areas) without non-combative npcs or much of anything else. The scripting they do on the multi part objectives is wonderful, but it very much draws inspiration from linear games.

The end result in AC isn't as satisfying but the things MGSV does well are many times harder to do in the context of AC.

They really shouldn't be designing missions that way then I feel. But mission design that is at odds with the tools they give you isn't new in the series I guess.
 
I don't remember Unity having that many fail states, and they made it so that if you failed an eavesdropping mission it'd turn into a chase and you could just tackle them for the info.
 

danm999

Member
I don't remember Unity having that many fail states, and they made it so that if you failed an eavesdropping mission it'd turn into a chase and you could just tackle them for the info.

There are definitely tail missions which will force you back to a checkpoint if you get spotted. It's infuriating.
 
Mario Maker is a great game, and will likely be in their top 3 for GOTY. But I wonder where it would stand if they weren't so popular and able to get tens of thousands of plays on their levels. They get to watch live streams, get tons of likes and other cool stuff for their levels. Would be interesting to see what they think if they didn't have twitter to pimp out their levels.

Still a good game, and this is Giant Bomb's GOTY so it's doesn't matter if they take that into consideration.
 

danm999

Member
Ah, I never get caught doing those so it's not something I would have run into. Stick to cover and the roofs and such.

The one I'm thinking of forces you inside of a building and the cover is sparse and Eagle Vision has this weird mechanic to it where it turns off after a few seconds.

I miss D-Dog.

The saving grace is that the AI is dumb as rocks so even when the person you're tailing sees your genocide pile of elminate guards they're like "Hmm. Weird" and keep walking.
 
D-Dog being mentioned brings me back to the thought that MGS V isn't actually that great a stealth game. You're just given tons of options that all completely break the game and make it impossible to fail. D dog just flat out shows where everyone is, Quiet can easily take out entire bases on her own, and so on. There's no balance at all and despite the enemies adjusting to headshots at first it just stops after a certain point.

Which is fine on its own, as like with Blood Money or Assassin's Creed it's on you to not use weapons that completely break the challenge but I don't know. None of the areas are interesting and guard patrol systems aren't that advanced. They just shine the flashlight for a few seconds and fuck off.
 

WreckTheLaw

Giant Bomb Japanimation Correspondent
Absolutely. Before CCA ruined him, Char is legitimately one of the most interesting villains/anti-heroes I've seen in a mecha show. Bright Noa has a really good arc as well, as does Sayla. Outside of UC, it gets a bit murkier. G has some fun characters, but it's way sillier. Wing's cast is god awful. SEED has some good stuff, but it quickly ruins them. Turn A is amazing in general. Outside of that, it's pretty standard.

If you go to the more serious OVA stuff, 08th MS Team and War in the Pocket are awesome for character work. Both those are on the ground stories about grunt units and they tell pretty interesting war stories. I also think all the characters in The Origin manage are super well drawn and interesting, much more so than they were in the original series.

Cosign this whole post.
 
D-Dog being mentioned brings me back to the thought that MGS V isn't actually that great a stealth game. You're just given tons of options that all completely break the game and make it impossible to fail. D dog just flat out shows where everyone is, Quiet can easily take out entire bases on her own, and so on. There's no balance at all and despite the enemies adjusting to headshots at first it just stops after a certain point.

Which is fine on its own, as like with Blood Money or Assassin's Creed it's on you to not use weapons that completely break the challenge but I don't know. None of the areas are interesting and guard patrol systems aren't that advanced. They just shine the flashlight for a few seconds and fuck off.

This is one of the biggest recurring problems with stealth action games. Batman and Watch Dogs have this issue too. Either it's way too easy to just go loud and destroy everyone, or there's one or two moves that are way better than everything else.

The Last of Us is one of the few games that avoided it by making resources so scarce that you have to use everything you have available to you.
 
Absolutely. Before CCA ruined him, Char is legitimately one of the most interesting villains/anti-heroes I've seen in a mecha show. Bright Noa has a really good arc as well, as does Sayla. Outside of UC, it gets a bit murkier. G has some fun characters, but it's way sillier. Wing's cast is god awful. SEED has some good stuff, but it quickly ruins them. Turn A is amazing in general. Outside of that, it's pretty standard.

If you go to the more serious OVA stuff, 08th MS Team and War in the Pocket are awesome for character work. Both those are on the ground stories about grunt units and they tell pretty interesting war stories. I also think all the characters in The Origin manga are super well drawn and interesting, much more so than they were in the original series.

I won't sit here and defend Wing. But Zechs ramming his leo into wing and parachuting out puts him in another league to the rest.
 

Jintor

Member
This is one of the biggest recurring problems with stealth action games. Batman and Watch Dogs have this issue too. Either it's way too easy to just go loud and destroy everyone, or there's one or two moves that are way better than everything else.

The Last of Us is one of the few games that avoided it by making resources so scarce that you have to use everything you have available to you.

I don't think bats had that big a problem, in predator rooms you'd almost always get gunned down in a matter of seconds if you weren't at least considerate of who to target first and sightlines etc.
 
Syndicate releasing this coming week is kind of a shocker. This might be the first year an AC game snuck up on me.

I read "Syndicate" and my first thought was excitement that the Syndicate shooter was getting a current gen port. Only realized it was AC after I read past that. It's probably not good marketing if the first thing that comes to mind when I hear Syndicate is a nearly 4 year old game.
 

yami4ct

Member
Where does the Taken King fit, though? It's more than a DLC, but less than a game.

It's an expansion pack in the traditional sense. It fits in with DLC far more than as a full new game. It certainly should not qualify as a full game in the official GOTY list stuff. Totally fine for personal lists, though. It also could easily make Destiny 2015's 2014 GOTY.
 
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