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[soultron]

Moe, not everyone wants a relationship. You'll meet one who does eventually. Chin up, carry on.

 

[`Moe Joe.]

cheers soultron.

I guess getting pushed aside for an imaginary dude just got to my ego.

 

[ecurbj]

Same reaction I had when I first read TK's post.

Anyway Grape, women play by the 80/20 rule. 80% personality and 20% looks, they is wonderful if you are a below-average to average looking dude. Looks aren't that important, as long as you look relatively clean and healthy, you're good on the 20%.

Thus, this leaves your personality and attitude. From what I read, you are a servely pessimesstic person. I used to have a similar outlook, you have to deconstruct yourself and rebuild to be a happier, outgoing dude. Some of the other posters have descrbe how to do this: talk to random people by asking the time or other small questions, go to the gym (this will release endorphins, which is the natural anti-depressants), start going to social clubs (internet, I'm sure someone will link you to a good site if you ask nicely) in Chicago (I believe you mention you lived near this city), pick up a hobby, or volunteer (if you help others, you'll feel good about yourself).

I had to break down my old persona, and build it to be happy and outgoing. I've gone a long way in the last few years from my anti-social self to an outgoing person with my lovely little quirks. I used to think I was unattractive, but I worked on it externally and internally, now I am super adorable and cute, and I fucking know it.

Also, work on that shiny smile and body posture. Yoga is a fantastic way on improving your spine and back posture, I used to have a "question mark" type posture, but over the months, I am nearly standing straight all the time. That's an easy one to improve on, don't complain about how you can't, I was in a bus accident, which injured my back, and I can do it. No complaints from you!

If you are happy with yourself, people will start socializing with you and become your friends. Don't even bother looking for a girl until you're happy with yourself.

I like this post! Just what I needed to hear !

 

[EXGN]

Like you said, you can't get a reaction without an action. That principle doesn't just apply to men. If I'm not picking up any signs they're interested in me they're not even a blip on my radar. Again, I'll chat and be my normal charming self, but I have no reason to continue things further because they didn't give me one. I just can't push myself onto someone like that.

It's partly because I have no interest in them until I feel like they're digging me. So I don't even want to push things further with them unless I'm picking up some signals. It's also partly on principle. If she expects a man to do everything for her, it tells me quite a bit about her character.

You can approach these relationships anyway you want, but a woman expecting a man to make a move isn't a negative character trait or at all indicative of the amount of effort she would put into a relationship. The social norm is for the man to be confident and aggressive and to push the relationship forward, while women either accept or reject the advances.

It isn't the girl's fault that society has drilled this behavior into her head. It's been like this for centuries - hell, even animals behave the same way.

 

[-ImaginaryInsider]

I'm wondering about the level of physicality too. Sex didn't have to happen in that bed since both of them are religious, but it shouldn't stop them from doing other stuff.

Kissed, held her, etc...nothing crazy.

I made sure to touch her, and to maintain open body language, but to be honest, she just never seemed comfortable in her body language, it always seemed like she was fighting with herself to become more open. The dates were romantic, but she snapped back into being uncomfortable the moment anyone else was around.

There were plenty of red flags, she was surrounded by an army of uber-close platonic male friends, she had one previous relationship lasting only 3 months, the rest seemed to be random makeout sessions that stemmed completely from alcohol...which I think is the only time she truly feels comfortable with men.

She asked if we could still be friends, I told her nope, but that she could mail my "Freaks and Geeks" dvd back to me.

I'm still too nice, and still think too much, but every girl I've talked to this year I've gotten better with and gone farther with, so it was good practice.

 

[TurboLibre]

You can approach these relationships anyway you want, but a woman expecting a man to make a move isn't a negative character trait or at all indicative of the amount of effort she would put into a relationship. The social norm is for the man to be confident and aggressive and to push the relationship forward, while women either accept or reject the advances.

It isn't the girl's fault that society has drilled this behavior into her head. It's been like this for centuries - hell, even animals behave the same way.

Telling me it's a mans role to do all the work in the relationship (or beginning stages anyway) is like telling me it's a womans role to cook and clean. It's not like I'm asking them to make all the moves either, all I'm asking for is some indication that they want me to ask them out. Some minor amount of effort to show they're interested, and not in just a "friendly" way. Apparently I'm asking for the world though.

 

[Loki]

To those in relationships but are not living with their S.O.: How much time (in terms of days per week where you see them for an extended period of time) do you spend with your S.O.? How long have you been together? Has the amount of time spent together increased, decreased, or remained the same over the course of your relationship?

 

[Live Free or Die]

Telling me it's a mans role to do all the work in the relationship (or beginning stages anyway) is like telling me it's a womans role to cook and clean. It's not like I'm asking them to make all the moves either, all I'm asking for is some indication that they want me to ask them out. Some minor amount of effort to show they're interested, and not in just a "friendly" way. Apparently I'm asking for the world though.

why wait for a sign? Just ask. if they say yes good if they say no move on.

 

[Oozinator]

I often hear girls giggling and talking loudly with men in neighbor apartments. I too wanna attend this kind of home parties where there are girls, how ?

I moved to a western country (Canada) less than a year ago and most home parties or dinners that I attended were male only (IT job colleagues), it makes me wanna be a few years younger and study at one of those universities with big campuses :'(

 

[Lone_Prodigy]

Telling me it's a mans role to do all the work in the relationship (or beginning stages anyway) is like telling me it's a womans role to cook and clean. It's not like I'm asking them to make all the moves either, all I'm asking for is some indication that they want me to ask them out. Some minor amount of effort to show they're interested, and not in just a "friendly" way. Apparently I'm asking for the world though.

Intense psycho-analysis can only get you so far. She's playing with her hair! She touched your arm! Her friends showed up but she barely paid any attention to them! And these are the blatant signs. Some girls are shy. Some are extremely subtle. Unless you're a mind reader or they explicitly say "so when are you going to ask me out?" you won't know if they're interested or not.

The best way to gauge interest is to ask. You don't fear rejection so why not do it? If they say yes, does that not imply interest?

 

[TurboLibre]

The best way to gauge interest is to ask. You don't fear rejection so why not do it? If they say yes, does that not imply interest?

I don't fear rejection, but it does suck. Especially when it's all you've known. A punch in the face isn't going to kill me, but I'll still try to avoid it when I can. Ya know? But again, I literally have no interest in them until I think they're digging me. Literally none. I'm not going to put myself out there for someone that may as well not exist.

 

[Aurora]

Tkawsome, your attitude is totally wrong. Yes, in an ideal world a girl would let us know when she's obviously interested, but this just doesn't happen. YOU have to make it happen. Assume she is already interested. Stop wasting time waiting for signals which just aren't going to appear.

 

[soultron]

tk, stop being so timid. If you can't handle rejection, how do you expect to handle a fight or a break up?

 

[Oozinator]

I don't fear rejection, but it does suck. Especially when it's all you've known. A punch in the face isn't going to kill me, but I'll still try to avoid it when I can. Ya know? But again, I literally have no interest in them until I think they're digging me. Literally none. I'm not going to put myself out there for someone that may as well not exist.

Yeah, rejection is not that bad when you know there are other open opportunities

 

[Atramental]

It's weird how one day I'm interested in a girl and the next day I couldn't care less about her.

 

[subversus]

tk, stop being so timid. If you can't handle rejection, how do you expect to handle a fight or a break up?

I don't know how it is for you, but I think rejection, a fight and break up have nothing in common. It's like talking about stones, carrots and airplanes.

 

[TurboLibre]

tk, stop being so timid. If you can't handle rejection, how do you expect to handle a fight or a break up?

Oh man, I know a lot of people who would laugh at the idea of me being timid. I'm far from that, I just can not push myself onto someone else. They're not so special that I have to "prove" myself to them. That's not to bad mouth women though, just that general attitude.

 

[soultron]

I don't know how it is for you, but I think rejection, a fight and break up have nothing in common. It's like talking about stones, carrots and airplanes.

All of them have a potential to inflict anguish if you let them.

 

[The Elite]

tk, stop being so timid. If you can't handle rejection, how do you expect to handle a fight or a break up?

I think I'm facing a break up soon.

Feels bad man.

 

[SpectreFire]

Is it weird for a guy to buy a girl a computer as a random present after a few dates (and declaring her his girlfriend)?

A girl I know was talking to a guy online for a few months and then met him in person, they went on a few dates, he paid for everything, and yesterday, she told me that when she asked him if they were exclusive, he said yes, and later showed up with a computer for her, and took her out to dinner.

The guy has money (mostly family money).

 

[-ImaginaryInsider]

I don't fear rejection, but it does suck. Especially when it's all you've known. A punch in the face isn't going to kill me, but I'll still try to avoid it when I can. Ya know? But again, I literally have no interest in them until I think they're digging me. Literally none. I'm not going to put myself out there for someone that may as well not exist.

I spent 26 years not asking, I got nothing for it.

I've spent the last 3 years asking, since then I've been on various dates, one long relationship and a few shorter ones. Even the girls that turn me down I've been able to chat up and make progress with...and outside of making people laugh, I have no real game.

It hurts getting rejected, it hurts getting dumped, but I'd rather try now than wake up in my 60's full of regret.

Edit: The more rejection you face, the less worried you are about it, therefore you get better and better talking to women.

 

[pompidu]

Is it weird for a guy to buy a girl a computer as a random present after a few dates (and declaring her his girlfriend)?

A girl I know was talking to a guy online for a few months and then met him in person, they went on a few dates, he paid for everything, and yesterday, she told me that when she asked him if they were exclusive, he said yes, and later showed up with a computer for her, and took her out to dinner.

The guy has money (mostly family money).

Wow. I want a new compooter. She's either a gold digger or is going to expect him to pay for everything here on out. Why is he spending so much money on an early relationship?

 

[Count Dookkake]

Is it weird for a guy to buy a girl a computer as a random present after a few dates (and declaring her his girlfriend)?

A girl I know was talking to a guy online for a few months and then met him in person, they went on a few dates, he paid for everything, and yesterday, she told me that when she asked him if they were exclusive, he said yes, and later showed up with a computer for her, and took her out to dinner.

The guy has money (mostly family money).

I would not trust that computer.

 

[SpectreFire]

Wow. I want a new compooter. She's either a gold digger or is going to expect him to pay for everything here on out. Why is he spending so much money on an early relationship?

Apparently he's the one insisting on paying for everything. He told her that he was going to keep paying for everything and buying her gifts and so she just has to live with it.

I'm assuming because he's rich.

 

[pompidu]

Apparently he's the one insisting on paying for everything. He told her that he was going to keep paying for everything and buying her gifts and so she just has to live with it.

I'm assuming because he's rich.

Well to answer the question it is weird. But why the hell is he going to pay for everything? Poor guy, his heart and wallet is going to be destroyed.

 

[Attackthebase]

It's weird how one day I'm interested in a girl and the next day I couldn't care less about her.

Not really. This is how I usually am in the dating field. I'll be interested one day, then the next I could give a flying fuck about her. A lot of girls, I simply aim to see if I can succeed at the challenge, then I drop them. I usually get bored with them pretty quickly.

 

[SpectreFire]

Well to answer the question it is weird. But why the hell is he going to pay for everything? Poor guy, his heart and wallet is going to be destroyed.

I'm thinking he's either trying to buy love, or show off. I think she's being a bit naive about the whole situation because she thinks its okay because he's treating her better than any of her other relationships have.

But honestly, to me, it just raises a whole bunch of red flags. You're supposed to attract your mates through you, not your money.

 

[soultron]

She can either be a decent person and turn him down, or she can teach him a lesson by breaking his heart and then saying, "Money can't buy my love. But thanks for all the free shit." I personally think he needs the latter. Any woman worth your time won't be bought. There's always someone with a higher bid, you feel me?

 

[SpectreFire]

She can either be a decent person and turn him down, or she can teach him a lesson by breaking his heart and then saying, "Money can't buy my love. But thanks for all the free shit." I personally think he needs the latter. Any woman worth your time won't be bought. There's always someone with a higher bid, you feel me?

I get that completely. i don't really care who she dates, it's her life and her choices. But she doesn't seem to feel like any of what he's doing is wrong or weird. She didn't plan on dating him, but when he said that they are exclusively dating, she said it just feels right.

I am wrong for thinking that he's likely going to turn out as a controlling douche bag? Also, a little more context, he's asian and she's white, and where I'm from, a lot of the asian kids with rich parents are spoiled douchebags. So there is precedent for some red flags.

 

[SuperAndroid17]

Success , got the girl's # at walgreens. Asked her out for desert , she said that sounds good . She grabbed a piece of paper and put her # on it.

She gets off at work at 11.

Texting guru's , whats my next step?

 

[reilo]

Success , got the girl's # at walgreens. Asked her out for desert , she said that sounds good . She grabbed a piece of paper and put her # on it.

She gets off at work at 11.

Texting guru's , whats my next step?

Make a plan for yourself to go some place cool, and invite her to join you tomorrow. You should still go (by yourself or with someone else) even if she has other plans and can't go after you talk to her.

 

[pompidu]

I get that completely. i don't really care who she dates, it's her life and her choices. But she doesn't seem to feel like any of what he's doing is wrong or weird. She didn't plan on dating him, but when he said that they are exclusively dating, she said it just feels right.

I am wrong for thinking that he's likely going to turn out as a controlling douche bag? Also, a little more context, he's asian and she's white, and where I'm from, a lot of the asian kids with rich parents are spoiled douchebags. So there is precedent for some red flags.

I would run and keep that money to myself. That's a really bad road to go down. Unless he doesn't mind giving money and just fooling around.

 

[pompidu]

Success , got the girl's # at walgreens. Asked her out for desert , she said that sounds good . She grabbed a piece of paper and put her # on it.

She gets off at work at 11.

Texting guru's , whats my next step?

DO NOT TXT OR CALL HER TONIGHT. You don't want to come off as desperate.

 

[ecurbj]

I get that completely. i don't really care who she dates, it's her life and her choices. But she doesn't seem to feel like any of what he's doing is wrong or weird. She didn't plan on dating him, but when he said that they are exclusively dating, she said it just feels right.

I am wrong for thinking that he's likely going to turn out as a controlling douche bag? Also, a little more context, he's asian and she's white, and where I'm from, a lot of the asian kids with rich parents are spoiled douchebags. So there is precedent for some red flags.

This is similar to my previous situation. I posted a few pages back. Glad I'm over it honestly. But this girl I liked to death began dating this guy (Asian). I guess he has money and all. Good job and I had her on Facebook and I watched the progression the two were making. I mean this guy was buying her stuff, taking her to special events, and even taking her outside the country.

Meanwhile she didn't want to declare anything with him. Because it's a "long distance relationship". So when he goes back to life Monday thru Friday. She suffers comfort wise because there is no comfort where he can come over and such. But when he has the chance to see her. He makes it up and does all those things. I believe she was introduced to him by a co worker of hers.

Glad I stepped away. If and when I see her. I'm not going to ignore her or anything. Mutual conversation is all that's needed. If shit sparks then let it happen. But we never told each other we like each other. I was so lazy to take advantage of the situation when she told her girlfriends and my cousin that she liked me. That was over a year ago.

Right now. I'm focus on letting go this social anxiety and building my confidence level. And these past few weeks have been awesome. Thanks to this thread, another forum that deals with social anxiety and even my own personal attempts of progression.

Religion, strict-goal mother, and social anxiety has hindered a lot of my life but I'm letting it go.

Feels good too.

 

[ecurbj]

Success , got the girl's # at walgreens. Asked her out for desert , she said that sounds good . She grabbed a piece of paper and put her # on it.

She gets off at work at 11.

Texting guru's , whats my next step?

You should of exchanged your number too. But then again. You didn't come off desperate. Just do not text her tonight. Give it a day or two.

 

[Fou-Lu]

If she specifically told him she gets off at 11 I think he should at the least send her a quick text. However, if he just knows that from prior knowledge, or whatever I agree to wait a day or two.

 

[Minamu]

Like everyone's favourite says, you don't have to agree with it, you just have to accept it. Women not showing their interest is really annoying sure, but you can't expect the world to change over night just because it's (incredibly) inconvenient. I don't like it any less than anyone else, but you gotta live with it.

 

[SuperAndroid17]

You should of exchanged your number too. But then again. You didn't come off desperate. Just do not text her tonight. Give it a day or two.

My time was limited, people were behind me waiting to check out shit.

SHE DOESNT EVEN KNOW MY NAME! ( crazy , i know) I got her # and name .

I don't think texting her tonight would make me come off desperate , its in context isnt it? I mean I'll see her tommorow cause I usually buy my drinks there. ( cheap )

 

[Lone_Prodigy]

I get that completely. i don't really care who she dates, it's her life and her choices. But she doesn't seem to feel like any of what he's doing is wrong or weird. She didn't plan on dating him, but when he said that they are exclusively dating, she said it just feels right.

I am wrong for thinking that he's likely going to turn out as a controlling douche bag? Also, a little more context, he's asian and she's white, and where I'm from, a lot of the asian kids with rich parents are spoiled douchebags. So there is precedent for some red flags.

I know some Asian guys like that. They spend thousands of dollars a month on their girlfriends. I think it's a waste of money, but if it works for both of them, then all the power to them.

 

[lawlohwhat]

My time was limited, people were behind me waiting to check out shit.

SHE DOESNT EVEN KNOW MY NAME! ( crazy , i know) I got her # and name .

I don't think texting her tonight would make me come off desperate , its in context isnt it? I mean I'll see her tommorow cause I usually buy my drinks there. ( cheap )

I don't think texting the same day is inherently bad, but there's no need to unless seeing her tonight was strongly implied when you saw her. You don't want to get caught in a cycle of reaching out and getting a delayed response, being forced to reach out again, etc. That's why it's good to give out your number instead of getting hers. Just don't have an extensive conversation when you do decide to communicate. You could tell her what you're up to and invite her to join you. If she's interested, she'll make time. Simple as that.

Nice work by the way!

 

[The Shadow]

Like you said, you can't get a reaction without an action. That principle doesn't just apply to men. If I'm not picking up any signs they're interested in me they're not even a blip on my radar. Again, I'll chat and be my normal charming self, but I have no reason to continue things further because they didn't give me one. I just can't push myself onto someone like that.

It's partly because I have no interest in them until I feel like they're digging me. So I don't even want to push things further with them unless I'm picking up some signals. It's also partly on principle. If she expects a man to do everything for her, it tells me quite a bit about her character.

So let's get to the bottom of things. What exactly is a "sign" to you? That they make kissy faces? They start rubbing their nipples? At what point to you tease apart interest from indifference?

Moreover, that second part is just flat out wrong. Principle? Really? The sexes have changed, sure, but there's still a sexual difference between males and females wherein the male takes the initiative in things. It's kind of the main reason why they want a confident, take-charge guy and not a wishy-washy flake.

You're really doing yourself a disservice by waiting for these signs. Why? Because your own mental state can cause you to ignore them for one. When I was younger, women would hint pretty openly that they wanted me to ask them out but I never did because I didn't pick up these signs. I only know recognize what was going on when I look back. More recently, one woman whom I'm now friends with was VERY interested in me when we first met. She showed absolutely no signs of that interest because of her own nervousness by her admission. I saw someone who was friendly, but completely indifferent beyond that.

You're missing out if you're waiting for a blinking neon sign, for various reasons.

 

[ecurbj]

So let's get to the bottom of things. What exactly is a "sign" to you? That they make kissy faces? They start rubbing their nipples? At what point to you tease apart interest from indifference?

Moreover, that second part is just flat out wrong. Principle? Really? The sexes have changed, sure, but there's still a sexual difference between males and females wherein the male takes the initiative in things. It's kind of the main reason why they want a confident, take-charge guy and not a wishy-washy flake.

You're really doing yourself a disservice by waiting for these signs. Why? Because your own mental state can cause you to ignore them for one. When I was younger, women would hint pretty openly that they wanted me to ask them out but I never did because I didn't pick up these signs. I only know recognize what was going on when I look back. More recently, one woman whom I'm now friends with was VERY interested in me when we first met. She showed absolutely no signs of that interest because of her own nervousness by her admission. I saw someone who was friendly, but completely indifferent beyond that.

You're missing out if you're waiting for a blinking neon sign, for various reasons.

LMFAO ! Shit ! Not going to lie but this is certainly me !! But I'm changing though . Being grown up around females my whole life (mom, 2 sisters). I was always taught that the females will come to you and I should look for signs of interest. So that's where I developed the thinking-to-much-into-signs trait came into place.

Letting that go, also !

 

[SRG01]

I know some Asian guys like that. They spend thousands of dollars a month on their girlfriends. I think it's a waste of money, but if it works for both of them, then all the power to them.

It's because gifting is a natural part of Asian culture and upbringing. I, too, find myself very "giving", but not in monetary way. Also, gifting is not necessarily a bad thing as long as it's moderate.

All of you should read up on the 5 languages of love and how each person communicates.

 

[TurboLibre]

So let's get to the bottom of things. What exactly is a "sign" to you? That they make kissy faces? They start rubbing their nipples? At what point to you tease apart interest from indifference?

Honestly, I'm not too sure. Maybe some sort of effort to get my attention, to let me know they enjoy my company, or hints that they would like to hang out sometime. If I'm expected to spell things out by making it clear I want to date them, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a couple hints to help get me there. It's all give and no take.

Moreover, that second part is just flat out wrong. Principle? Really? The sexes have changed, sure, but there's still a sexual difference between males and females wherein the male takes the initiative in things. It's kind of the main reason why they want a confident, take-charge guy and not a wishy-washy flake.

Because that attitude will persist in other aspects of their life. Claim it's a sexual difference, social norms or whatever, but I refuse to believe that a woman can't make a decision without being led by a man.

You're really doing yourself a disservice by waiting for these signs. Why? Because your own mental state can cause you to ignore them for one. When I was younger, women would hint pretty openly that they wanted me to ask them out but I never did because I didn't pick up these signs. I only know recognize what was going on when I look back. More recently, one woman whom I'm now friends with was VERY interested in me when we first met. She showed absolutely no signs of that interest because of her own nervousness by her admission. I saw someone who was friendly, but completely indifferent beyond that.

You're missing out if you're waiting for a blinking neon sign, for various reasons.

That is pretty much where I'm at. You're spot on. Still, if a woman is interested and just lets you slide because you didn't make a move, she couldn't have cared all that much to begin with. Right?

 

[Eggo]

Honestly, I'm not too sure. Maybe some sort of effort to get my attention, to let me know they enjoy my company, or hints that they would like to hang out sometime. If I'm expected to spell things out by making it clear I want to date them, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a couple hints to help get me there. It's all give and no take.



Because that attitude will persist in other aspects of their life. Claim it's a sexual difference, social norms or whatever, but I refuse to believe that a woman can't make a decision without being led by a man.



That is pretty much where I'm at. You're spot on. Still, if a woman is interested and just lets you slide because you didn't make a move, she couldn't have cared all that much to begin with. Right?

Your viewpoint here is unreasonable, and multiple people have said so. It's like you're being stubborn by performing a one man protest against the world that if sexes want equality, the woman should do her part too in the courting ritual. What are you trying to prove? That you're difficult? By your own admission, you have problems dating, so why don't you change some of the things you're doing wrong like having this expectation that girls have to show visible signs of interest before you flirt with them?

I lightly flirt with people all the time, even if I don't want it to go anywhere. It can make a person's day if you have a light, fun exchange. It gives them an avenue to express their interest, and you're not "putting yourself out there" because there is no expectation that you're trying to get anything other than making the other person smile.

 

[SuperAndroid17]

Turns out the walgreens girl had a crush on me. She would tell her coworkers " omg its the cute guy again! "

Co-workers kept telling her to go " for it " ( me ) every time I came in the store. Funny on how things turn out...

Confidence goes a long....way! " phew"

We've been texting each other , shes eager for me to take her out soon. Shes busy tommorow night and Im busy saturday cause I'm gonna watch the ufc with a bunch of dudes. I guess ill just settle with Sunday or so.

 

[Host Samurai]

GAF. I sent a girl flowers a week ago. Good response. Do I follow up now, crush it or wait for her?

 

[NeOak]

GAF. I sent a girl flowers a week ago. Good response. Do I follow up now, crush it or wait for her?

Its too vague. Give a little more detail.

 

[Host Samurai]

Its too vague. Give a little more detail.

Sent her flowers as an apology she responed and aparantly made her day, thought it was sweet and she appreciated it. I left it off pretty well. Would I come off as needy if I give her a ring?

 

[SpectreFire]

It's because gifting is a natural part of Asian culture and upbringing. I, too, find myself very "giving", but not in monetary way. Also, gifting is not necessarily a bad thing as long as it's moderate.

All of you should read up on the 5 languages of love and how each person communicates.

I would consider buying someone you just physically met a week ago a new computer a bit excessive.